Americans have no guts.

The drums were beating when the troops went into Iraq. Every one, even the opponents were so enraptured with American military might.

But America's military might doesn't mean a thing, since the people lack the political will to enforce it. People are shouting for the troops to come home---why? because they've been routed? No: because they have succeeded at a cost of a 1000 of their own, with low civilian casualties. The troops have tortured others because they cannot control themselves.

The troops will return home because Americans now demand it. And the Islamic world will consider it a surrender.

You will see then see terror on an unprecedented scale.

You train people in how to treat you. We are training militants that we have no resolve, that they can win by being more commited that we are.

We are teaching them that we are sickened by our own misdeeds, but not by theirs.

It is a lesson that they are learning very quickly.

Stop generalizing. It all depends on the individual.

Where does it end though, if nobody is willing to end it, Dr. ?

Violence begets violence. It's a vicious circle that will never stop, because as in "real" life, nobody will EVER say "You're right, I was a major asshole, forgive me. Peace out".

dr_strangecraft do you know anything? That ws a very stupid post.

We want them to return because the sacrifice isnt worth the prize.

Democratic Iraq, nor thier oil and subservience, in the minds of Americans, is not worth the price.

Democracy in the middle east is near impossible.

Our dedication, once faced with the facts, is no longer to building a democratic Iraq, which we see now as fallacy.

So dont gimmie this # about having no guts. Were there a real threat and a real prize to win, wed not balk from continuing.

But Americans are waking up to the fact Iraq, like Vietnam, is not worth the price being paid.

ahem! let me get into my comic book guy voice from the simpsons....



"MOST IGNORANT THREAD EVER!"


thank you, that is all, now back to your regular stereotyping generalizing comment slinging...

"now back to your regular stereotyping generalizing comment slinging... "

I'm a Canadian, I live in my igloo, listening to Anne Murray, waiting for the Royal Canadian Mounted Police to deliver my weekly supply of beer. And, YES, I play hockey, throw curling stones on occasion.

Btw, got your sarcasm PM.



[Edited on 14-5-2004 by intrepid]

Originally posted by KayEm
Where does it end though, if nobody is willing to end it, Dr. ?

When terrorists stop using their violent acts to attack other people, that's when. You cannot win against a group of people that want to destroy what the western world stands for , together with the different religions that there are, by not minding what they do and turning a blind eye for 9/11s, 3/11s and other terrorist acts.

Islamic extremists want Islam to rule the world and they are willing to use violent acts as they have demonstrated for over a thousand years. Either they change their view allowing for the existance of other religions or the world will have to change them by force.

If you show submission to these extremists, they will use it to further their goal, submission and waiting for more 9/11s and 3/11s is not an option imo.

I will withhold all anti-america sentiment, but i agree that if america pull out it will be seen as a victory to the Islamic Extremists, but if they stay it will inflame Islamic Extremist and cause more terrorists to rise from the rubble... and lets face it this 'War on Terror' either was is going to cause more terrorism than its preventing...

I knew i couldnt hold out saying something against the USA... i did my best though

Originally posted by Muaddib

When terrorists stop using their violent acts to attack other people, that's when.

Ok. I understand your point of view, Muaddib. But still, do you understand that violence does absolutely NOTHING except beget MORE violence ? It's natures law. It is not negotiable.

Yes, I agree just as much as the next person that the events of late are especially horrific (I won't even watch that video, just reading about it is enough). I know these guys are barbaric and that what they did is barbaric and I don't recommend rolling over and making nice just to see things end, because I don't believe they would respect THAT either. But there has to be another way, other then continuing the carnage. What that way is isn't clear but it's all I have at the moment.

It is just the retarded wussy queer democrats that want to bring the troops home and leave Iraq in anarchy.

Dont worry there are plenty of rock solid red blooded republicans who will put up a fight and stand up to these savages here in the great USofA.


Kicking Saddam out was a great thing we did though I have to admit that now our stradegy seems to be non-existant. Maybe we should let the countries supplying the infidels that we wont tolerate it.

jrod "Kicking Saddam out was a great thing we did"
Oh really, Iraq isnt a peacful country its worse than when Saddam was in power.

Well if some arab countries wouldnt be so anti-american and help us set up leadership there we wouldn't have that problem now would we.

Is an arab nation going to step up to the plate and help the Iraqi people out or what?

These people hate america too much to see the good they could have if they would just be civilized.

The Arab nations can handle situations themselves ,the reason why Iraq is why it is now is because of the coallition forces occupying their land if the coallition forces leave i am sure it will be sorted out quickly and peacefully.

Things you'll never hear:-

Donald Rumsfeld: "You're right, I was a major (c), forgive me. Peace out".

Dean of Oxford University: "And we award the honorary degree for English to George W. Bush."

All-Father: "I'm not the Messiah."

Conflicts:-

The Title Match
USA vs. China.
Winner: China

The Long-Awaited Grudge Match
Haliburton vs. human decency.
Winner: Haliburton, apparently.

Fight To The Death
Dubya vs. Pretzel.
Winner: Pretzel

Three-Way Thriller
Judaism vs. Christianity vs. Islam.
Winner: Me.

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Croonie show.

Originally posted by drunk
The Arab nations can handle situations themselves ,the reason why Iraq is why it is now is because of the coallition forces occupying their land if the coallition forces leave i am sure it will be sorted out quickly and peacefully.

Quickly and peacefully? Quickly and PEACEFULLY? This is one of those situations where I can't tell you are being sarcastic because we are speaking over the internet right?

As for the topic at hand, I do agree that America is not as willing to take losses as it should be. There are those of us out there that actually understand, that no matter how bad it might be/sound, death is a part of war. It doesn't make it right, but it is a part of the package. What Americans must understand is that people that are killed now are preventing deaths in the future.

[Edited on 14-5-2004 by American Mad Man]

O.K maybe not quickly but peacefully and no i aint being sarcastic the longer the coallition forces are in Iraq the longer it will take to restore order.

Well then what action should be taken? I mean, you say we should pull out right? Don't you think more Iraqis will die if we pull out then if we stay? And wouldn't you agree that Iraq would become a haven for terrorist operations if we pull out? What about rebuilding their country? If we pull out, for the next 100 years we will be hearing about how America failed the Iraqi people, which will only incite more anti-american and anti-west thought. We are gunna take losses if we stay, I do concede that. And yes, Iraqi's and other muslims will continue to dislike us. That is a given. But what about the consequences (spl? sorry, I have had a bit of the booz myself tonight) of pulling out?

Drunk, you are ignoring the history of terrorism up to today.

Kayem, then what are we to do, open our arms and let the Islamic extremists kill us and destroy western civilization as they want until islam rules the world?

Not an option imo.

You cannot stop a bunch of people that want to kill everything that represents western civilization with peace.

If we pull out now, Iraq will destroy itself. Think of it: there is no real government. Do you realize how many groups will want to lead the country? They'll continue to fight for it, thus continuing the war.

Bush got us into this mess, and personally, I think he should figure a way out before he's done being President. I don't think leaving them in June is going to solve anything. All it will do is change the local target from US Troops to whoever we appoint as leaders.

Our world is f'd up. How to solve? Leave it. Seeing as how that's not going to happen anytime soon, I think we're kinda screwed for a while.