Latest crop circle, August 16th 2009. This one is a beauty! And scary...

Originally posted by symmetricAvenger
i take it your a god person?

No merely a Viceroy... haven't reached Godhood yet, though someone once told me 'Zorgon' was an Ancient god

So how about they just write "Hi we are your neighbors from Alpha Centauri" and leave a Galactic phone number

What is an alien??

Dunno... ask those who believe Aliens are making the circles... they might be able to answer that for you

[edit on 27-8-2009 by zorgon]

"Hey Bobby-Joe! You stand right there and i'll grab the other end of this rope and make a half circle. Then you just come around and do the same, Ok?"

Yeah, totally complex design that had to be made from extra-terrestrials.

Originally posted by trueforger
It has no ground reports just pictures of combine destruction/harvest.Last one,and at a time when the unusual features must be looked at up close to see,just shorn.

Then blame the crop-circle investigators, according to the Crop Circle Connector page, although we do not have an exact date for the harvest, there was an 11 days difference between the time this circle was found and the update of the page that shows it's destruction.

Also, you can see by this last photo that the crop had already changed colour to a darker hue, so, while completely ignorant about these things, I think that is another clue that it had reached the time for being harvested.

How do the humans-are-doing- these crew explain this?

I don't know if I understand what you mean, but it has been explained several times that these things (and this circle is a good example) are extremely easy to draw with a rope and some sticks, there's nothing "out of this world" in these drawings.

PS: seeing the discovery dates of the circles (that we cannot know if they are the first day that they were visible), we can see that they were already slowing down in their appearance.

2009-08-02 - Morgans Hill, Nr Bishop Cannings, Wiltshire.
2009-08-03 - Silbury Hill (2), Nr Avebury, Wiltshire.
2009-08-03 - Rollright Stone Circle, nr Chipping Norton. Oxfordshire.
2009-08-06 - Windmill Hill, Nr Avebury Trusloe, Wiltshire.
2009-08-08 - South Field (2), Nr Alton Priors, Wiltshire.
2009-08-09 - West Overton, nr Lockeridge, Wiltshire.
2009-08-09 - Bishop Sutton, nr New Alresford, Hampshire.
2009-08-10 - Woodborough Hill, Nr Alton Barnes, Wiltshire.
2009-08-12 - Wayland's Smithy Long Barrow (2), nr Odstone Hill, Oxfordshire.
2009-08-16 - Tidcombe, nr Burbage, Wiltshire.

PPS: there is one thing that is called "ephemeral art", you can see some here.

reply to post by ArMaP

Ephemeral art like painting on sidewalks are small-ish works.The CC of this thread is hundreds of times larger in scope than a one of those.So my question revolves around the putative profit motive.If there is some crew whose game is making these for fun and profit,wtf?A huge work is completed only to be destroyed the same day?How now?Was there a screw up of some sort?Or was this part of the plan to further mystify?
Makes no sense.Do you have a rational,non argumentative explanation for this question?Did they hit the wrong field?Not pay the farmer?Farm communitys are close knit,if a profit were being made you can bet everyone has heard about it and how to do it and who to call.Yet mystery remains intact.Explain it.

Originally posted by trueforger
Ephemeral art like painting on sidewalks are small-ish works.The CC of this thread is hundreds of times larger in scope than a one of those.

Art is not measured by its size, size is irrelevant.

So my question revolves around the putative profit motive.If there is some crew whose game is making these for fun and profit,wtf?A huge work is completed only to be destroyed the same day?How now?Was there a screw up of some sort?Or was this part of the plan to further mystify?

On the same day? Are you talking about the circle from the OP? Do you have any reference to the date in which it was destroyed?

And I don't think that those that make the circles are the same that profit by the circles' existence, I don't see those two behaviours as compatible in the same person or even team, only if it is a two team organisation, with one team making the circles and the other organising visits and selling DVDs.

PS: what do you mean by "non argumentative"?

reply to post by JayinAR


I didn't think of it like that, but i just saw numerical patterns, and nothing to do with finding the hypotenuse of a triangle...

But reading through the thread, a lot of people see a lot of numbers, so whos to say what is what... really.

reply to post by ArMaP

Argumenative as in saying,"irrelevent"
Not admitting that my point is at least somewhat valid by saying that to make your argument is well argumentative.Just sayin.Size and complexity and perfection of form add up to one hell of a mystery,not to be compared to a person's art when done to claim and photo themselves,hoping to pay for the art effort thereby.Without secrecy

.Just to make these HUGE efforts and then to rely on random spotting and then let it be photographed from the air,and thereby claimed as intellectual property by ANOTHER???What artist would ever do this!?! And risk their maybe not ever being reported,no one knows.Lotta claims.Mystery intact.

[edit on 28-8-2009 by trueforger]

Originally posted by trueforger
reply to post by ArMaP

 

.Just to make these HUGE efforts and then to rely on random spotting and then let it be photographed from the air,and thereby claimed as intellectual property by ANOTHER???What artist would ever do this!?! And risk their maybe not ever being reported,no one knows.Lotta claims.Mystery intact.

[edit on 28-8-2009 by trueforger]

It's quiet simple, circlemakers have stated in video's that when asked "how do the investigators find the circles so fast?" .... Well the very simple answer was "we tell them!"

reply to post by Wh00pS

Everything said by circlemakers is 'simple'.
That's why they are so easily dismissed as an actual source.

Originally posted by trueforgerif a profit were being made you can bet everyone has heard about it and how to do it and who to call.Yet mystery remains intact.Explain it.

Well everyone but you (and a few others ) doesn't know about the profit...

So as you ask I will explain it...

EXHIBIT A

Crop circles used to be the work of amateur pranksters. Now, flattening wheat fields is a lucrative commercial enterprise. Kate Burt meets the Circlemakers.

06 July 2004

Rod Dickinson clearly remembers the night he made his first crop circle. It was the summer of 1991, just months before the famous crop-circle hoaxing duo, Doug Bower and Dave Chorley, came out about their nocturnal wheat-flattening activities; a time when the nation was still gripped by the idea that aliens might feasibly have been parking up in fields at night, all over the southern English countryside.

"No one had really mooted the idea these things might have been man-made," says Dickinson, an artist, "as far as people were concerned, me included, there were definitely other possibilities; at least some unexplained natural phenomena. I was fascinated." So when a friend challenged Dickinson to join him in an illicit attempt to create their own crop circle, the pair found themselves on their knees in the middle of the night, with a not very elegant, not very round mess on their hands.

Thirteen years later, Dickinson has just completed what he estimates to be his 500th foray into the art of what's come to be known as "circle-making". This time, things were a little different. The medium was sand, not crops, and the ambitious formation replicated a photographic image that Dickinson and his circle-making partner, John Lundberg, 35, had spent several weeks translating into a series of co-ordinates on a computer-design programme. From this, they'd created complex numerical spreadsheets, filled with measurements, from which his team of 13 assistants worked. He'd also secured advance permission from the landowner; there was a four-strong BBC film crew to capture the work in progress; a helicopter booked so a photographer could capture the end result, and a PR. Oh yes and, this time, he and Lundberg got paid several thousand pounds for their efforts by the satellite channel UK TV Gold, who commissioned the piece to launch their new comedy season.

As to farmers 'collaboration'

But how does it feel to have a huge corporate logo slapped in the middle of your land? Very good, says a farmer paid £500 apiece for two fields to be used for Circlemakers' jobs. "If they'd been put in by an alien and I hadn't been paid, I'd have been hopping mad."

Cereal Entrepeneurs


Exhibit B

The Sunday Telegraph
The fellowship of the rings
By David Harrison
(Filed: 25/07/2004)

'It makes me chuckle sometimes," says John Lundberg, gazing across a wheat field in central England. "If somebody had said to me 10 years ago that today I'd be flying all over the world making crop circles for big companies and being paid for it, I'd have said they were mad."

The rewards for the crop circle entrepreneurs are high and growing. The AMD job was the group's most lucrative so far. Mr Lundberg is unwilling to give precise details, but says the contract was worth "tens of thousands of pounds". The budget for the Big Brother campaign was estimated to be £250,000, and for Orange's Wiltshire project about £100,000. "We are doing well," Mr Lundberg said. "We are all earning a very healthy living from crop circles."

£100,000.

Hey Once Once... my company is down sizing... ya wanna go make some circles DANG

And what about the farmers?

Landowners are benefiting too, receiving payments - from the companies or circle-makers - for allowing their fields to be used for the work. The income easily covers the damage to crops, leaving farmers with a profit.

Richard Cowan, who farms 1,500 arable acres in Oxfordshire, has twice - last
year and in 2002 - allowed Mr Lundberg's company to make crop circles on his land for Orange. He was unwilling to say how much he was paid, but another farmer, in Wiltshire, said that the going rate was "at least £500 for each circle and sometimes much more". Mr Cowan said that the circles had caused him to him to lose about £200 worth of crop, giving him a "decent profit" from the deal.

He would be "unhappy" if people crept on to his land at night to make crop
circles - unless he was properly compensated. "Nobody wants damage to their crops, but the key thing is whether you are paid for it," he said. "I'm happy for my fields to be used as long as I know about it and I get compensation. I used to believe crop circles were made by aliens, but there's no money in aliens. It's much better this way."

Sunday Telegraph


Well now...

As any good gumshoe Detective will tell you... "Follow the money..."

So how much are those CD's? Maybe I need to start rethinking my free info policy... I see lawyers making $200.00 a pop searching for patents for people that I get free...

Yup I'm an idiot




Exhibit C


Crop Circle Tour 2009
July 19-25th
cost $1950 double occ. $2150 single(limited)

The tour fee does NOT include transportation from your home to England, snacks, and souvenirs and a couple of meals on your own(to be fully outlined). We are happy to make recommendations for travel arrangements and will give detailed information following booking for the tour.

We offer 1 group pick up from London Heathrow airport (only) the morning of Sunday, July 19th for $100 per person. We recommend this option.

Or you can take any railair bus link from Heathrow Airport to Reading Station that runs every 20 to 30 minutes and takes about 40 minutes to Reading. Then take the First Great Western train from Reading to Swindon; they are frequent and the journey takes 35 minutes. Prices vary from 15-30 UKSterling (roughly). We pick you up from Swindon for $30.

myogastudio.com...

One of several HUNDRED such tours

Exhibit D

Google - farmers admission fee for crop circles

1)
I personally know of farmers who have charged crop hoaxers a fee and then allowed ... I spoke to one farmer who had allowed crop circle artists to make five ...
Source

2)
We stopped and paid the farmer an admission fee of 50p (around 85 cents).

Important note..." Farmers harvest the grain from crop circles along with the rest of the grain in their fields. " So farmers do NOT lose the crop. The trams still scoop up the crushed grain

www.geocities.com...

Okay Now show me the TONS of ET evidence

reply to post by zorgon

Thank you for your effort.It wasn't convincing the last few times you posted either.Got anything other than these guys and their claims?Repeating the same old story doesn't make it any more believable.

Originally posted by trueforger
Just to make these HUGE efforts and then to rely on random spotting and then let it be photographed from the air,and thereby claimed as intellectual property by ANOTHER???

Claimed as intellectual property by who, the photographer?

If it's the photographer then it's only natural, the photo is his own art, not the one of the circle creator, in the same way that people take photos of other people or of anything else.

What artist would ever do this!?!

Many.
As strange as it may look, many artists make their creations and never look back at them, they are finished, the art becomes public and it should follow its own way.

Artists do not see those things in the same way most people do.

reply to post by ArMaP

I dunno.I'm an ARTISAN.I sign each piece I make with a stamp,called a cartouche.I make art but its useful as well.I have met hundreds in my field and we are all quirky to some degree.We are all egoists,imposing our will upon intractable stuff,we sign our efforts.I have NEVER seen a modern work(in my field) of any significance unsigned.Only exception is mistakes.No one makes pieces to be just left around for all to wonder at.Large effort requires materials and fuel.There is liability and zoning laws and all sorts of regulations.Ez answers are just that,simplistic.Like saying circles are ez to computo-draw,there's guys claiming to make 'em,one was caught once even,so they're ez to make.People do 'em alla time,etc.No vid?Mystery intact.
PS you look like Ian Punnet,related?

[edit on 30-8-2009 by trueforger]

reply to post by trueforger

It's true, artists like to sign their work, but they also do it in a way that does not interfere with the art itself, and there are several examples of paintings, for example, that are not signed and for which we only have the experts' opinion that it's really a painting by that artist.

My sister sometimes forgets to sign their paintings.

And yes, easy answers (I suppose that by "ez" you mean "easy"), and you cannot get an easier answer than "aliens did it", can you? You probably noticed that those answers never give any other explanation to how they did it.

And, as strange as it may look, I find those drawings easier to do with a compass (or two sticks and a rope) and a ruler than on a computer, I make drawings like that much faster in a paper.

PS: what's a "Ian Punnet"? As far as I know I am not related to anyone with a foreign (not Portuguese) name.

Originally posted by Absum!
reply to post by Charismagic

 

You would think that after 6,000 failed attempts to get our attention these super evolved aliens would try another method of communication. Sheesh. They must think we are daft for not replying.

Love the design.

Do you think they are wandering around the barley fields on their own planet looking for our reply? Or are we supposed to mark up our own?

Originally posted by trueforgerRepeating the same old story doesn't make it any more believable.

Well repeating over and over that Aliens did it and giving interpretations that turn out wrong isn't doing your side much good either... and the fact that the Crop Circle Connectors about the only source for all these smells a little fishy

So until you show me ONE piece of proof that 'Aliens done it' I will hold that humans are pulling everyone's leg and making a good buck at it...

And I bet having a good laugh over a pint or three

reply to post by zorgon

Ha Ha ya better have a pint of WATER!You must have mussed it,but in my dozens of posts on this and related threads,I am the lone voice who is not in either the crop circle jerks nor the Aliens-done-it camp!I have offered many novel perspectives,bringing up facts and inspired notions of inquiry not having been brought up before or since.So go ALIENate someone else,it don't stick to me,zorgon barks up wrong tree.

reply to post by ArMaP

I am referring to professional artists and other crafts persons.People who are seriously committed to their Art,who put in constant thought about and effort producing major Works.With a progression,by the way,involving minute detail development in each work.If your sister,the forgetful painter,were to be putting ONE HUGE piece up for worldwide exhibition,you think an omission of her sign/sig would be merely overlooked?Really?And let whoever got to take the first photo take some sort of credit along with the intellectual property contained within the ownership of the photo image,as it goes in the art image world?(She may have composed and executed the work,but unsigned there would be no claim against the photo image holder.)Makes very little sense.Might happen.

The Ian Punnett question was a joke referring to your avatar being the very one used by the guest host on Coast to Coast AM,the largest late night radio show.Like saying,"Hey you're wearing my hat!"

reply to post by trueforger

My sister is a professional artist, both as painter and photographer, and she had some of her works in public exhibitions, one of those in Canada.

Before she sends the paintings to the exhibitions she looks to see if all the paintings are signed, and at least in one occasion it was my other sister that reminded the "forgetful painter" to sign one of her works.

And even if someone takes a photo of a painting, according to Portuguese law, they do not own the rights of the painting and neither they own the full rights of the photo unless they have the author's permission.

As an example (although not exactly the same thing), my sister made a drawing to be used on Port wine labels, and the copyright agreement was that the drawing could only be used on the labels and could only appear in photos that showed the label, the original drawing cannot be used for anything else and can not appear in exhibitions.

Van Gogh did not signed many of his paintings because it thought it arrogant on the part of the artist to make an art piece to show to the world and then put his name on it.

PS: if my avatar is the same he used then he stole it from me, although not signed, my avatar is a ArMaP creation.

reply to post by groingrinder

Methinks the farmer taking the harvester to the field before anyone else could examine it up close is all the message needed to stop 'em.Not Aliens.