A Brief Perspective On The UFO Phenomena

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Seeing the increasing volume of disorganization, hoaxes, exaggerated stories, and over all influx of “questionable” material getting mainstream attention throughout ufology I figured I would add somewhat of a personal perspective on the ongoing UFO Epic, for whatever it is worth. As we all know ufology is the study of the UFO phenomena, this is a very broad field that ranges from abductions to simple witness reports of lights in the sky. I say this because I would firstly like to convey to people that to consider the study of UFOs ridiculous because say the whole “GFL” (Galactic Federation of Light for those not aware) incident last fall, the Isaac-CARET Drone hoax, the whole “Reptilian” conspiracy(which may or may not be true) and countless others is simply ridiculous upon itself. That is like saying because some ancient scientist thought the Earth was flat we should not listen to modern science today. There is something obviously happening here, there ARE things that are seen in the sky that no one can explain currently, there ARE events that have happened, like Shag Harbor that simply defy a logical explanation at his point. There are COUNTLESS Blue Book files on at least 2000 cases from the late 40’s to late 60’s that to this day are still unexplained, not to mention the many after the sixties continuing today.

Why did I open this thread with that paragraph? Well I opened it with that as somewhat of my attempt to help ‘buffer’ the legitimate ufological studies from the nonsense that floods the field and gives it its bad name. I feel now is a critical time in ufology and I want to do my part to make it clearly known that this IS a REAL field of study and there really IS something REAL to study. I want to make it known that it is ridiculous to disregard ufology because of a few “bad apples”. Now that that is out of the way I want to continue with the point of this thread.

The Many Levels of “Believers and Skeptics”

• Psuedoskeptics: These persons are not skeptics, they are simply individuals that will attempt to discredit ANYTHING for ANY REASON for their OWN PURPOSE. Likely because they can not shift their paradigm or take the “ego shock” that would obviously come with the disclosure of ET life. There people have no desire to truthfully investigate UFOs and related phenomena and should be discarded AS SOON as discovered.

• True Ufologist: These are the true members of ufology. Those that use the scientific method and logic to dissect cases. A true ufologist will remain skeptical until the evidence outweighs common knowledge. Persons in this category will always remain neutral until presented with non-debatable facts in either direction (for or against a legit UFO case). Persons in this category may appear as skeptics at times and believers at others. This is because their opinions vary, depending on the case and strength of evidence presented. A true ufologist will always remain open, even in the smallest percentage, to any alternate possibilities, regardless of the result.

• Pseudobeleivers: These are the individuals at the opposite end of the spectrum from the pseduoskeptics . They are just like pseudoskeptics except they fanatically and erroneously believe anything, regardless of the evidence against it. These, like pseudoskeptics, will also try to force there beliefs on you. It is like saying you are either with me or against me, this again is analogous with religious fanaticism and is zealot-like. Like their counterparts on the other side, this group believes blindly in something that is thought to be false, or has been proven to be false. They continue to belief anyways because not to would be paradigm shattering , as well as ego destroying for many. This is not where one wants to fall into, the middle region (True Ufologist) is where one wants to fall into.

There is many levels in-between those three, it is only human to lean towards on side or the other. But the closer you are to the middle the better off you are in my humble opinion.



Related Threads
Debunking Pseudoskepticism: Common Fallacies
UFOs: Lets cut the crap already
The Dark Side of “Conspiracy Theory”
Skeptics and Believers don’t exist


”UFO” Does Not Mean Alien

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This is probably one of the more “slippery slopes” in ufology and its perception by the public. Because the term “flying saucer” was coined and the immediate explanation was “little green men from Mars” ufology and UFOs are mainly though of as alien related. While this is the leading theory, and likely correct in my opinion, it should be firmly stated that a UFO is just what the acronym means: UNIDENTIFIED FLYING OBJECT, the same with USOs (UNIDENTIFIED SUBMERGED OBJECT). Now most of the time a UFO or USO (what little research there is on these) will turn out to be something prosaic like a natural event, hoax, or military/civilian craft. The remaining unexplained amount has still never been confirmed as alien(extraterrestrial). Although there is much evidence to support the alien theory, the truth is these unknowns could be still unknown or misunderstood natural events, time travelers, “Inner Earth Beings”, dimensional travelers, or some unknown animal (think "critter”). We just DON’T KNOW AT THIS POINT, all we have is probability based on the available evidence. It is a two edged sword really, while the whole “alien pilot” theory draws interest and attention to the field, and brings in money---At the same time that very benefit draws ridicule on the field since for some reason(although not near as much now) when anyone says “intelligent alien” it is funny and a quick laugh or scoff. This is likely due to the ever present Paradigm Shift/ Ego Destruction Fear. Everyone needs to remember this one thing, if nothing else

Ufology (the study of the UFO Phenomena) is only studying UFOs and trying to determine WHAT THEY ARE It should NEVER be stated that ufology has determined that UFOs are alien driven, that is simply not possible to say at this time. Ufology is NOT the study of alien piloted UFOs, it is the study of ALL THINGS UFO related, including, yes the infamous swamp gas,lol.

So again just remember UFO DOES NOT AUTOMATICALLY MEAN ALIEN.

Related Threads:
Request help identifying all govt. & civilian saucer-related projects!
The State of Ufology


What Is The Ideal ‘Team’ To Accurately Study UFOs???

Now anyone can research UFOs and technically call themselves “ufologist” as there is no official course for ufology in Universities. However it does help if one knows at least a little bit of some or all of the following disciplines before trying to state any ‘official’ opinion on this subject. Keep in mind that there are many ufologist that have advanced degrees (Stanton Freedman immediately comes to mind but there are many others as well). But if anything is to be done officially in any meaningful sense then it is my opinion that a correct team must be assembled; A team consisting of many advanced degree holders from a wide range of disciplines. The Condon Committee and the Robertson Panel have been really the only thing resembling an official investigatory team, and even they did not have the right people in many peoples opinions, including mine.

In my personal opinion there needs to be a government or civilian team put together that has a large panel of professional scientists from many fields of study to properly investigate this ongoing epic. Yes we already have civilian research organizations like MUFON and NUFORC among MANY others around the world. But those are not enough in my very humble opinion. They are underfunded, undermanned, and understaffed. Without ranting on about that issue let me now get to the ideal fields of study for a proper team to study this event:

Continued..


[edit on 7/27/2009 by jkrog08]

• Physics- Obvious reasons here

• Astronomy- Obvious reasons here as well

•Specialist in Orbital Mechanics and Celestial Mechanics- This is necessary because UFOs occur in space too. Also it is necessary to try and understand how these things work in space compared to our technology, especially in the cases where it is obvious the UFO is mechanical.

• Cosmology- It is necessary to have some type of grasp of where these things may come from in the cosmos, this is to be used in addition with astronomy because cosmology is more theoretical in nature and deals with the Universe as a whole.

• Quantum Physics- Obvious reasons like understanding how they can travel so far if they are indeed alien, time travelers, or dimensional ‘hoppers’. Also it can help possibly develop efficient long range communication methods.

• Astrophysics- Obvious reasons

• Optical Physics- The team needs to be able to clearly define what is a hoax, prosaic object, or real.

• Psychology- The team needs to explore the possibility that psychological issues may be involved in many sightings, the possibility that some type of “mass delusion” is going on. Also they will be needed to offer an opinion of the psychological impact of first contact.

• Historian- So we can look the more ancient UFO cases, as well look over past events that involved massive paradigm change (like the rise of Christianity).

• Theoretical and Conventional Biologist- Obvious reasons

• Mathematician- Math is a universal language and likely the easiest way to communicate should there be no other apparent way. Also they could help in advanced physics problems.

• *Religious Scholars- To review and offer the best insight on the potential religious aspects of first contact.

• Relevant Engineers- Obvious reasons

• *Relevant Electronic (computer) Engineers- There will likely be a need to decipher any possible transmissions, possibly having to be done by major re-writes or brand new computer operating protocol.

• Metaphysicist – Even though there is no actual accredited degree in this field the knowledge is useful. This is due to the potential mix of current religious and scientific aspects of reality one well versed in this field would be needed.

• Ethics- Yes, ethics. This is needed to oversee the board and make sure investigations are handled properly, as well any disclosure made as a result of said investigations.

• Sociologist- To study the social ramifications and influence.

• Evolutionist- Obvious reasons to complement the biologist.

• *Political Scientist- To judge the possible political impact of first contact or disclosure should anything be found.

• *Economist- To judge the potential economic impact should first contact or disclosure happen.

• Multiple “field agents” highly trained in chain of custody, the scientific method, and witness/ field investigations.

• Funding, funding, funding


• Obviously all in this team will need to be versed in all the good cases as well the hoax cases.


• The ultimate goal should be to try and achieve contact if possible and if it turns out UFOs are from an intelligent source. If this is not possible then the other obvious goal would be to properly document this event and come to the best scientific conclusion we can.

*Not needed unless a potential disclosure or first contact situation should arise.

Obviously that is quite the team, and given ten years I sure bet we would have some interesting and ACCEPTED theories about this phenomenon, with evidence to back it up. Either way this is what is needed if ufology is to take its rightful place as a legit science. But interestingly enough it would take all of us to come together and unify as one. Maybe that is a sign that we are not ready to know what UFOs are until we can do that.


What Can YOU Do???

You, me, anyone can do many things to help legitimatize, propagate, and strengthen the field of ufology.

• Be Objective! Remember that we must use the SCIENTIFIC METHOD to come to the most logical conclusion. A light in the sky is not automatically a “Pleadian surveillance drone”! I know it can be hard sometimes but we MUST do this if we want to ever get the “truth”.

• Help out whenever you can. Research some cases, make some threads on ATS about some good cases or other ufology related events that APPEAR LEGIT, please do not post hoaxes or obvious prosaic things. I know sometimes it is hard but always ask someone if you are unsure. I do not know all there is to know about ufology but you CAN u2u me if you are unsure, if I don’t know I will contact someone else and vice-versa. Donate to or join a UFO research organization, press your political leaders, get the word out on the streets. There are many good cases posted on ATS, print them or email them to people. Go out and research things outside of the internet if possible. Just do anything proactive that you can.

• LEARN, LEARN, AND LEARN: Try to brush up or learn of the classic cases and newer ones. Learn of the many techniques in ufology, learn whatever you can. At worst you gained some knowledge.

• Bias is NO GOOD: I know it is hard sometimes but always try to listen to other alternate explanations. Bickering between ourselves is circular and no good. Sometimes you meet people, like ‘pseudos’ that only detract from this field. MOVE ON, continue doing what you do.

• Remember—WE MUST UNIFY: If we are to progress this legitimate field of study and find the truth we all claim we want then we all NEED TO UNIFY AND SOONER, RATHER THAN LATER. The time is now, there is another UFO wave going on, technology is ever growing, and ufology is gaining more legitimacy and popularity. We MUST stop fighting between ourselves, we MUST stop making accusations like “disinfo agent”, “troll”, “close minded idiot”, “ignorant believer”, “ gullible fanatic”, and so on.

• UNIFY, UNFIY, AND UNIFY AGAIN: Only together can we really get to the REAL truth.

• SPREAD THE WORD: Defend legit ufology in public, do not be ashamed to go against the norm and appear “different”. I can not tell you how many people and places I plug ATS, ufology, and distribute cases. I am a young man with a decent bit of friends, friends you would not think would care and would laugh at you, hell even strangers you would think would---BUT they DON’T if you are sincere and know your stuff. Do not be shy to spread the word, give people credit before judging. A lot of people just do not know of the many solid cases in ufology and thus don’t think about it. Some do not care but can be swayed to get interested—JUST TRY.

• BELIEVE: Do not give up or lose faith, all good things come in time. Always remember the ultimate goal here is for ALL MANKIND, not just YOU or ME.


Final Comments

In a way this is an urgent plea to all that I can reach on ATS that we need to UNIFY and get some ORGANIZATION and LEGITIMACY in ufology. We MUST stop the internal fighting and competition, it is like a cancer to ufology. It is also time that all of us, “amateur ufologist” or “pro” step up our game. It is time to make a push now, we all can do SOMETHING, regardless of our daily lives. Anything helps, remember that. We also must get the classic and top cases out to the masses. Like I said above, many just do not know about the cases. I am talking cases from the late forties to now---There are many, and this is why I-personally- am rehashing the classic cases from the 40’s on to today here on ATS. People do not realize how much evidence is within these cases and how a lot of them lead to a true unknown (and many lead to a strong ET hypothesis) conclusion, even by official government agencies and scientists.

I realize that people want something new and shocking, like a youtube video or skunk works type case. But we must remember that everything takes time and a lot of times the real world stuff is not as entertaining as Hollywood, well at least not yet! It is time to get professional about this, it is time to stop treating ufology like some freaky urban legend meant to scare us. This is a REAL phenomenon, we are just now getting to the point where we aren’t scoffed at much. Please let us not take a step back for every half step we take.~Justin

No comments on this? I was hoping to get some other views on this one guys.

My comment? Too long.... and teaching me to suck eggs a bit.

[edit on 27-7-2009 by Total Package]

reply to post by Total Package


LOL, thanks for the comment I guess..

Awesome! I think this is pretty important people, seriously. It tells you some important info about what people believe (Skeptics and Believers) and the different sciences. Explaining some scernario's, what organizations to trust for UFO reports, pretty cool. Hey could start a school mate, when you start raking in the millions Because with threads like these your going to get discovered by some major company or the government..lol..

Good thread. S and F.

[edit on Jul 27th 2009 by TheMythLives]

Originally posted by jkrog08
reply to post by Total Package

 

LOL, thanks for the comment I guess..

Not that I didn't agree with it Most of the views are the same as mine... just a bit too heavy reading at 12.09am at night

reply to post by Total Package


LOL, you know I thought about it before I posted it last night at like 3 AM I think,lol. Oh well, sometimes you just feel like something needs to get out. Those other threads linked are more in depth about some of the topics I hit on.


Reply to TML

Thanks, it is important IMO that people understand these things. A lot of times ufology looks like a bunch of "alien fanatics" to the outside world, this is not true. Also, like I said, everyone interested in this needs to unify and stop bickering among themselves.

reply to post by jkrog08


Yea, I'm ready to unify and find the truth, unfortunely their are alot of skeptics who are not as open as I am, unfortuantely...

heavy reading is not the problem but your point of discussion led us to no where. What are to argue and whats not. Listing all the possible profession for UFOlogy research related and then what? Its not wrong only that it has been directed to a wrong channel. This type of discussion are for those who are seriously involve in UFOlogy, Government, and other "big player" that have $$$ and manpower.

Thank you jkrog08, I think your perspective is a very helpful and important one. To me it seems that many (who could be called pseudobelievers by your terms) only separate between sceptics and those that are in the know. However, if you ask me, ufology is more hurt by the fanatic and credulous views of pseudobelievers than by sceptics who, the closer they are to the middle ground between closed minded scepticism and non-rational gullibility, only teach us not to jump into conclusions.

This means keeping an open mind towards the truly unexplainable cases in regards to their cause. To say that a disk in the sky is the vehicle of the Grays from Zeta Reticuli is not keeping an open mind, especially if you won't accept any other option. They could also be space critters, or self-organising and self-replicating electromagnetic fields (my speculative favourite), or just about anything our current state of knowledge is too narrow for us to explain.

I think people who study this subject grow in one way or another. A few past skeptics or disinformationists have been said to change their minds or um, occupation description. I guess a poll and survey here would be interesting.

I'm curious as to how much of this has already been done and accomplished over the past 50 years.

There must be descriptions of craft type and possible propulsion systems here somewhere.

We now have regressive hypnosis and functional MRIs to help determine more details and as to whether or not someone is telling the truth, delusional or has been manipulated in one form or another. Alleged physical proof in the media/internet would also be rejected by many. It seems really discouraging.

regression hypnosis:

www.chrononhotonthologos.com...

Once you test a subject and determine their information may be of value, than it might be likely to find any additional information on craft and species. Not to say these aren't screen or false memories that were implanted.


UFOs are also likely to be advanced military craft if we've been sucessful at reverse engineering and or helped by these unknowns. These could still be 'pieces of junk' compared to a more advanced craft.

How much has UFOLOGY advanced over the years that better defines what we may or may not have and be capable of?

[edit on 27-7-2009 by aleon1018]

reply to post by paragon_fx


There was more to it than the team outline. More over it was friendly advice on some important things that anyone who is interested in UFOs can choose to follow or not. I am by no means saying that my views are absolute, it is just my perspective on the ongoing UFO Epic.


reply to post by cnuum

Thank you jkrog08, I think your perspective is a very helpful and important one.

Thanks

To me it seems that many (who could be called pseudobelievers by your terms) only separate between sceptics and those that are in the know. However, if you ask me, ufology is more hurt by the fanatic and credulous views of pseudobelievers than by sceptics who, the closer they are to the middle ground between closed minded scepticism and non-rational gullibility, only teach us not to jump into conclusions.

I completely agree with you on that. While the pseudoskeptics hold back proper documentation of UFOs. The other side, the pseudbelievers, taints the field, gives it a bad name--Those are the ones that make a lot of people think " little green man" anytime someone says UFO. Now while obviously many people think (including me) that a lot of the true UFOs are alien piloted it is not certain by any means.

This means keeping an open mind towards the truly unexplainable cases in regards to their cause. To say that a disk in the sky is the vehicle of the Grays from Zeta Reticuli is not keeping an open mind, especially if you won't accept any other option. They could also be space critters, or self-organising and self-replicating electromagnetic fields (my speculative favourite), or just about anything our current state of knowledge is too narrow for us to explain.

Hem, not heard too much about the "self-replicating EM fields. Anyways, UFOs could be and likely is a combination of many factors.

reply to post by aleon1018

I think people who study this subject grow in one way or another. A few past skeptics or disinformationists have been said to change their minds or um, occupation description. I guess a poll and survey here would be interesting.

Life Is all about growing, I personally have grown quite a bit in understanding this phenomena, especially in the last 6-9 months,

I'm curious as to how much of this has already been done and accomplished over the past 50 years.

Well as is commonly known there have been official government research agencies like Blue Book, Condon, Robertson. But they never did all the in depth things that I believe are needed, and that was a long time ago--we know much more now.

There must be descriptions of craft type and possible propulsion systems here somewhere.

There are, but it is all considered speculative. What I think is needed is another "Blue Book" so to say, either civilian or government (although I am hesitant about that one). But more than just research and documentation there needs to be a very wide look at this by all kinds of fields IMO. Attempts can and need to be made to find out what these things are, not just stop at ''unknown''. If people were really serious about it then this would happen.

This may seem to sound a bit crazy, but why is it there have not been any photos of UFO's taken by the HUBBLE telescope? Ufologists always speak of using all the latest tools to aid in their search or investigation of UFO's, so why is it that if these "craft" are being seen in the atmosphere, that they are NOT seen when leaving it? I know some people will argue that the pilots of these craft would deliberately avoid detection items. That would account for some but not all. Should there be ships flying through the galaxy, wouldn't you think that YEARS worth of scanning by a telescope would catch at least one? (accidentally)? So......why isn't hubble being used for this purpose? Could the photos being taken by HUBBLE be getting a thorough censorship before being released to the public? Astronauts have reported unusual sightings during routine orbits, so how could a device that has been orbiting us for years not show anything?
We are making every effort to LISTEN for aliens with SETI, so why aren't we just as diligent with visual pursuits? Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.

reply to post by circuitfxr


If any were captured they would likely be censored, not like there should be many anyways because Hubble could not see something that small at any distance, Hubble and all telescopes are meant to see large things very far away, not small things really close. So I do not think Hubble would be a good tool for observation of UFOs. Now if some ufologist could get a satellite of their own up there with optics made to image closer things in higher resolution then I think we would likely see some interesting things, of course if they weren't censored or covered up. Good question, that is my take on it.

reply to post by jkrog08


Thanks for responding.

I think it would be interesting to break these down into a single or seperate posts survey and ask people to star which ones they agree with. Maybe people here don't care much for surveys, but I think it depends on how it's asked. It seemed to work well for topics not too long ago.

reply to post by aleon1018


Well unfortunately many people don't care about this aspect of ufology, they only care about the god cases or the entertaining videos or cases. I just think it is important to keep in mind the true aspects of ufology, even for those just slightly interested.

And yes a poll would be interesting.

[edit on 7/27/2009 by jkrog08]

Originally posted by paragon_fxThis type of discussion are for those who are seriously involve in UFOlogy, Government, and other "big player" that have $$$ and manpower.

I would say THAT was the whole point of the post... many come here 'seeking the truth' but most of those just want someone to hand them an autographed print of an Alien The minute 'work' is involved... its off to youtube.

There are times when I have linked to document but if its not clipped into the post, or a picture pasted into the post, very few really follow the links.

Even worse, and you can see this in every thread... no one READS the threads... they give opinion o the OP and then usually leave the room not even waiting to see replies to their own question... and had they looked at the post just above theirs they would have had the answer. This has become worse lately and its frustrating..

So yeah this level of work is only for the serious

[edit on 27-7-2009 by zorgon]

reply to post by jkrog08


Couple points... That black text on dark gray... sorry I had to highlight it to read it

Your list of skills.

Sure that would be great, but its unlikely that one can get all that. Not without mega funding, and though it is possible to get funding its not easy.

Pegasus was originally set up for just such a reason... a place to gather skilled people of like mind to work as a team. We have after three years, managed to gather an impressive array of talent, but it is still spread out over many fields, mostly in the alternate energy 'department' which lives in the yahoo group.

Though we have many contributors, we still lack an official office and a staff that can sort data...

The old stuff is still the best... because it is less saturated wih hoaxes... the old timers involved in most of the best stories are all dying off now...

The new stuff is so full of hoaxes with ever kid having photoshop, video editors and a strong desire to be the best hoaxer on the block that the noise over signal ratio has all but buried any truth. That fact means investigators have to wade through 90% BS day after day.

So to even keep them interested will take more funding... because the joy of the hunt is diminished

Robert Bigelow was heavy into he UFO/Paranormal study, even still owns that famous UFO ranch. He even donated 4 million to the UNLV for a paranormal study class but later withdrew it because the focus was not what he expected. So funding is possible.

But to start a group when all the members are scattered all over the globe is next to impossible as it costs to much just to have a meeting even once a year... and networking online has limitations... because effectively you spend umpteen hours locked away in a dark office banging out on a keyboard.



The first step to funding is finding a professional fund raiser. We tried that with the Medieval venture in 2004 and had three money people die of heart attack shortly after... kinda knocked he wind out of our sails at the time... and I ended up locked away in my office banging out text for ATS