There are people with their own opinions are on ATS!!!

It does not matter if someone is a disinformation agent.
On this type of forum devoted to the intellectual exchange of ideas, all that identity politics is beside the point.
It does not matter who I am.
It does not matter why I say what I do.
It does not matter whether my biases and intellectual dishonesty are blatant or covert, innocent or conscious.
All that matters is whether the statements we type in here are factually correct, or not.
Factual correctness can be determined (according to each reader's varying standards of proof) without recourse to any of the above ad hominem hoo-hah...We are making claims and giving references, not trying to marry your sister...

reply to post by Frankidealist35


Thank you man Thank you!!! I have been coming to this site for over a year and haven't even been a member that long. There are a huge amount of paranoid people on here. I for one laugh at the amount of i am a patriot and if you don't support my idea you are a terrorist. If you support obama you must be blind which point blank tells me that they hate him and not for what he does period but hey intelligence for some people is a rare thing and having intelligence in office for once well that is rare. It is like people saying you are a witch because you look at the stars in the old times. Logical sane people say hey i respect your opinion i just don't like that one thing but hey i can see your point or vice versa. No more speed for you people. Just calm down and don't watch too many sci fi movies i say. Anyways i went on a tangent sorry. Good post for once i agree.

reply to post by Frankidealist35


i can totally see your point but todays governments, note i mention governments because its a global thing that includes every country on earth.
governments today & every since they existed have always been secretive & none trasparent i think this is largley about getting away with scams/frauds/expences/ & generaly hiding the rich such as tax havens with highly secretive swiss bank accounts.
but all this secrecy comes at a price like every thing els & that price is
9/11 was an inside job
jfk was murdered by the government
nasa never landed on the moon
obama is not a usa born citizen
fema camps are to kill every body
2012 disclosure
roswell ufo crash
tr3b government triangle craft
us presidents are picked by the powers that be, befor the public get to vote.
the nwo
swine flu comes from a government lab
et`s live at area 51
the list of complete distrust is a long one, & the public can not be blamed for the distrust or paranoia in any way as they have been lied to repeatedly for decades by governments.
at first government lies most likley lined the pockets of the rich as a priority but over the years things have grown complex & with it so have the lies the last big lie that was exposed as a lie was iraq weapons of mass destruction.
but i think ide agree over the years some of the other big lies are accepted as lies without proof not supprizingly.
the only certainty the public have is that the lie`ers will continue lie`ing as they always have because they the worlds governments are lie`ers.
& they the worlds governments do not have the puclics best interest at heart because they are lie`ers
& only have their greedy selves to blame for this mess.

reply to post by john124

Even 6 months ago topics were much more rational,

I must have missed that.

Are some of you having a nice good time? This thread does not address any real problems with ATS at all. One of the actual issues is this site getting more and more of a "double standard" forum, insofar causing some frustration and tension for members. On the one hand it steps up its decorum rules, but on the other hand and at the same time allows a "specific" part of its members to increasingly violate these rules.

Just one tiny example: OzWeatherman chimes in on page 1 of this thread and - in earnest - complains about being "branded" negatively after having started a thread titled "... is full of horse poo". Now, excuse me ....


[edit on 22-7-2009 by WonderfulWorld]

reply to post by Frankidealist35


Good post!

Your observation is quite clear. There are in fact a whole lotta ppl on ATS with all kinds of different opinions and yes, their OWN opinions!

I dont know why so many people accuse other people on ATS (but I can asure you that this is not the ONLY site where this kind of behavior occurs)

However, I do know a thing or 2 about behavoir and sorry when I generalise too much here but I made a little list:

1) There seems to be NO RESPECT for other one´s opinions by A LOT of ppl in here

2) It can be that there are a lot of very YOUNG people in here, that are more individualistic and can´t be bothered to take a effort to at least emphasise with those they don´t share views with.

3) Some people do not want to take an EFFORT to READ and reply according to ´good manners´, they are simply rude. Maybe because they were never nurtured into giving and receiving feedback?

4) FEAR: some people fear others opinions and want to discredit others opinions only to get rid of their own fear.

5) PURE LAZINESS: some people are just too lazy to do their homework they only want to be heard or drop a line here and there.

6) There are also people on ATS that do not know HOW engage a debat. So they simply do not know how to bring their own points of view into the limelight while tack´ling elegantly or with humor, the points of view of others.

7) There are people that are just BORED and stuck in the ATS-matrix somehow. They p*ss on other people´s parades (threads - comments) just to fulfill their anti/boredom needs.

8) There are also people that do not have a given capability to properly reply.

9) There are also those who simply do not give a p*ck about other´s opinions they just like the FIGHT.

10) And there are loads who just ´follow the leader´ of the day, because thaty´s far more easier then to THINK for yourself isn´t it?


It is not my intention to judge anyone nor accuse an individual in here, I´m only giving my own OPINION on the OP´s issue.

Think I like having my OWN opinion

This is old news. That kind of stuff has been going on for the three years that I have posted here. It's not likely to change.

I agree. I personally have been attacked constantly on here because I'm a marine and PROUD of it. I've had people say the rudest stuff to me just because of my views on the middle east. I've even had people u2u me saying they wished I died in iraq and that my sister who did die there deserved it.

Some of these people on here are cold and heartless.

Let me have my own opinions and lets all try to be civil.

I'm willing to bet 50 percent of ats are immature teenagers living at home that know nothing of the real world.

[edit on 21-7-2009 by jeasahtheseer]

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
This is old news. That kind of stuff has been going on for the three years that I have posted here. It's not likely to change.

Yeah. It's the internet. And it's free. The only places I've seen rational outweigh irrational is on sites with paid memberships...and it ATS did that, they'd lose a whole lot of their members. So it's staying insane.

reply to post by Frankidealist35


First of all...FANTASTIC THREAD !!
You hit spot on !!!

The reality is that the conspiracy "nuts" are so entrenched in their belief systems that when they find them threatened, they come up with an easy way out like most people do-They blame someone else.

Their beliefs border on religious zealotry and nothing you can say can sway them from their true path and if you put yourself between them and their path, you are the ENEMY...PERIOD. You must be WRONG PERIOD. You are probably EVIL PERIOD. You, at the very least must be part of the conspiracy PERIOD. Their egos are so wrapped up in their fantasies that they can't accept truth without destroying their own egocentric world.
SAD BUT TRUE.

GREAT THREAD
Starred and flagged BIG TIME !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Second Opinions

Majic's Law

"As an ATS discussion grows longer, the probability of a member being labeled a disinformation agent approaches 1."

(With apologies to Mike Godwin.)

Certainly, there is a problem with the poisoning of intelligent discussion with name-calling and other forms of personal attacks. It's nothing new and plagues all discussion boards to some extent.

In fact, I consider it the number one problem on ATS, which is why I'm always looking for ways to spread the word and encourage ATSers to do something about it. See Ad Hominem Attacks And You for more on that.

The underlying problem when it comes to courtesy is a lack of respect. In brief, people don't tend to hurl insults at people they respect.

It is also a matter of self-respect not to stoop to the use of insults. People who respect themselves behave respectably and so, ironically, bad behavior is more a sign of personal problems than anything else. If more people were aware of how transparent they are when they hurl epithets at others, I suspect we'd see less of it.

While it can reasonably be argued that some people are more deserving of respect than others, I contend that ALL ATSers deserve at least basic respect for having the good taste to participate here.

Hence my motto: Every Member Deserves Respect.

Of course, not everyone will agree with me on that, and despite the fact that courtesy is mandatory, there will always be some who consider it optional.

Since we're mods, not gods, we don't catch every violation, and not every perceived slight is necessarily actionable under the AboveTopSecret.com Terms And Conditions Of Use.

However, anyone who is concerned about the issue of courtesy on ATS can help by being courteous themselves and letting us know when there's trouble (via a post ALERT or complaint).

Yes, there's a problem, but there IS something all of us can do about it, and everyone who is willing to help can count on it being appreciated.

Good post, well said. I would like to add another thought that is somewhat related.

It doesn't matter if you *are* a CIA agent, or a government disinformation specialist, a Communist agitator, a media reporter or whatever. If I make a statement, it might be because I'm a member of some group, political party, conspiracy, etc. That only tells you *why* I said something. It says absolutely nothing about whether the statement is true.

We all need to forget our fantasies about who's saying things, and focus on the facts, whether what they're saying is supported by solid information. Does this guy offer support for his/her claims? If so, how credible are the facts, how believable is the Website or book or whatever.

Does someone claim certain facts because s/he's an X? Or is s/he an X, because s/he believes those facts? In either case, we need to check the facts, without dismissing these people as saying that just because they're an X.

People spreading disinfomation.I wounder who they can be.People been labeled as cia angents or chinese intellegence.Have not met any of them on here yet.Aliens watching this site.I guess aliens have better things to do than that.

reply to post by jeasahtheseer


You're a Marine? That's awesome. You're part of my second most favourite military force.

I've been accused of being a Mossad agent because I pointed out that President Ahmadinejad of Iran makes anti-semitic remarks all the time. I was also called a Zionist because I agreed with the accounts of UN Rapportuers, Amnesty International, other human rights organizations and even exiled Iranians that all say Iran abuses its people and uses outdated law to oppress them. Any time somebody has an opinion, with truth in it no less, that contradicts someone else's opinion they are quick to rely on name games and labeling.

jeasahtheseer, will you adopt my slogan of "Deny ignorance, not common sense"? I'm not obligating you to use it, its just something to point out.

reply to post by GORGANTHIUM


Its kind of an ego trip isn't it? Someone believes that a government organization would waste man-power to read something they wrote. Even aliens, why the hell would they look at this? They'd probably read a few posts then visit a homeless shelter in human form and note how all the ones smoking crack say the same stuff.

well said...so VERY well said

I give you star and my deepest respect

-Kyo

Originally posted by jimmyx
yup that's why i'm starting to go to the "science" boards more and more, there seems to be a higher degree of intelligence than on "recent posts"

Physorg.com had a pretty good board then dropped it. They really I think had no choice. There was no effective monitoring, along with the most idiotic posts. It seemed the whole point was to out insult someone, or everyone. I think there was an insurrection and the religous right took over at gun point, and I mean VERY HARD CORE.

Originally posted by jeasahtheseer
I agree. I personally have been attacked constantly on here because I'm a marine and PROUD of it. I've had people say the rudest stuff to me just because of my views on the middle east. I've even had people u2u me saying they wished I died in iraq and that my sister who did die there deserved it.

Those people are what's known as IGNORANT. Sorry but it's true. Our military should be HONORED and RESPECTED for the BRAVE SACRIFICES. I for one applaud you for putting EVERYTHING on the line to keep us FREE and preserve THE UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION.

If you'll notice in my signature it says the following:
If you don't want to stand behind our troops, would you at least stand in front of them ?
SUPPORT OUR TROOPS !!!!!

Although they have the right to their ignorant opinion, I have no use for them and consider them to be traitors ONLY because they refuse to stand behind and support those who have sacrificed and died for them. You can hate the government, you can hate the wars, but as far as I'm concerned, you ALWAYS support our troops !!!!!!!!!!!

:up
THANK YOU FOR YOUR SACRIFICES !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The Marine Corps site have forums are as bad as the worse of the threads here..... I am very hurt when I see Marines ganging up on and speaking in a derogatory manner about a combat veteran that is not a rabid right wing radical that doesn't approve of condemning Walter Cronkite to hell, going as far as calling him a Red....Esprit de Corps and Semper Fi ?.... What the hell is going on?..... The whole world has totally gone insane.