Prison Scandle (Contains Graphic Material)

It makes me sick of what I hear on the news and message boards of what people say. My view is this, once you read the rest of this post you will get the idea. Detailed information;

I. Who forgot what happned to Jessica Lynch and the other members? Jessica Lynch wasn't only torchered, but she was raped. Not the mention this is right for the iraqis to do this! and this is NOT embarrsing

II. Also, remember on the news about 1 month ago or more, when Americans were burned then hanged, driven thought town on the back of the car by a rope, then hanged from a bridge and hit by sticks? Remember anyone? Showing there dog tags? Not the mention this is right for the iraqis to do this! and this is NOT embarrsing

Heres a video for this link:

Torture Video (GRAPHIC)

News Source



III. Yet, other civilians can be tortured from different countries, Japenese, British, and many others, but not the mention this is right for the iraqis to do this!

IV. 9-11, Not only was Iraq found as helping binladen before, pictures of towers buring in a palace, and people selling goods on the streets of bin laden in Iraq. not the mention this is right for the iraqis to do this![/

V. 9-11, I lost a family member in the Twin towers, my uncle was the one who got taken away from me. Now its only me and my aunt now, because my father died when I was 4 and I lived with my uncle until 2001. Not only did I give him presents for fathers day, he was my father. Coming from people behind there computers on this board, who disagree with me, POST YOUR COMMENTS, my rebuttle will be 10x better then yours who "think" there right because there hippies, you don't know what they did to the innocent.




As ME, I stand behind the presidents Ideas, if you dont then get the # out

[Edited on 8-5-2004 by Laxpla]

[Edited on 9-5-2004 by John bull 1]

Originally posted by Laxpla
I. Who forgot what happned to Jessica Lynch and the other members? Jessica Lynch wasn't only torchered, but she was raped. Not the mention this is right for the iraqis to do this! and this is NOT embarrsing

She wasn't raped and the whole Jessica Lynch hero story was debunked as fake. Get your facts straight before wasting my time. Thanks in advance.

As I say, 10x Better, www.nydailynews.com...

Sorry, Must I post this, Her book she wrote.

www.usatoday.com...

[Edited on 8-5-2004 by Laxpla]

- just read that and think about the language used:

Best selling author Rick Bragg tells Lynch's story for her, often using her own words. Thankfully, she has no memory of the rape.

In it, America's most famous G.I. - for the first time since her dramatic rescue on April 1 - dispels some of the mystery surrounding the blistering battle that resulted in her capture, her treatment by the Iraqis in a hellish hospital, and the searing pain that is her constant companion.

A pretty, blond 20-year-old from the hollers of West Virginia, Lynch knew what could happen to her if she fell into Iraqi hands. A female pilot captured in the Persian Gulf War had been raped.

"Everyone knew what Saddam's soldiers did to women captives," Bragg wrote. "In [Lynch's] worst nightmares, she stood alone in that desert as the trucks of her own army pulled away."

and you might want to read that:

news.bbc.co.uk...

The Pentagon initially put out the story that Private Lynch - a slight woman who was just 19 at the time - had been wounded by Iraqi gunfire but had kept fighting until her ammunition ran out.

But she told Sawyer that she was just in the wrong place at the wrong time, and that her gun had jammed during the chaos.

"I'm not about to take credit for something I didn't do," she said.

"I did not shoot - not a round, nothing. I went down praying to my knees - that's the last thing I remember."

Initial reports also suggested that Miss Lynch had been abused after she came round in the hospital. She says that again was untrue - there was no mistreatment, and one nurse used to sing to her.

While it is tragic that a beloved one died, you shouldn't just eat what you get by the newspapers.

Just as what is moral, fair, and honorable differ from what is legal, in this matter, right differs from what is expected to what occurs.

Now, America placed those kids in harms way, every last one of them on both sides. And the world expected those American kids to 'play' on the moral high ground. America expected the same. It failed.

We, Americans that is, expected the world to surrender to our vastly superior thugist overwhelming military might, whimper to whatever government is in pace at the moment, and come under our wing for salvation. These people didn't.

With the Hawkish ideas that were being propagated here, and abroad, and under the given conditions those kids had no obligation to act on moral high ground. Neither did the Iraqi and neither did.

Wait?!

This is beginning to sound like I'm talking about war.

My apologies,

G

Mommie! He started it! Boo hoo!!

Sure, but read this

"The scars on Lynch's battered body and the medical records indicate she was anally raped, and "fill in the blanks of what Jessi lived through on the morning"

A pretty, blond 20-year-old from the hollers of West Virginia, Lynch knew what could happen to her if she fell into Iraqi hands. A female pilot captured in the Persian Gulf War had been raped.

"Everyone knew what Saddam's soldiers did to women captives," Bragg wrote. "In [Lynch's] worst nightmares, she stood alone in that desert as the trucks of her own army pulled away."

Jessica lynch, I forgot about that. That was funny, first a wrong turn. Next a jammed gun. Next a hospital bed and pretty good care according to the doctors and nurses who worked the hospital. A couple of failed attempts to drive her back to the americans. Then a daring rescue with no enemy troops in the hospital but plenty of cameras,hah. One of the funniest stories of the war.
Oh yeah, I forget to mention the rape that no doctor can find evidence of upon examination, no rapist to be found , no rape victim without amnesia to remember it ever happened.

Originally posted by Laxpla
It makes me sick of what I hear on the news and message boards of what people say. My view is this, once you read the rest of this post you will get the idea. Detailed information;

I. Who forgot what happned to Jessica Lynch and the other members? Jessica Lynch wasn't only torchered, but she was raped. Not the mention this is right for the iraqis to do this! and this is NOT embarrsing

Her story was debunked.
The military itself says she got her injuries from a car crash. They said she was raped but she doesn't remember being raped so they tried to explain it away, saying she must have amnesia. The doctor who treated her after the accident saw no signs of rape.

Dr Shwail said he saw no signs of rape. "The thought did not cross my mind. Her injuries were consistent with severe trauma, a car crash, nothing else. Her clothes were not torn, her boots had not been removed. There is no way [she could have been raped]."

Afterwards, Private Lynch was transferred to another Nasiriyah hospital, where Dr Mahdi Khafazji operated on her fractured right femur.

He cleaned her body before surgery and found no signs of sexual assault. "I examined her very carefully," he said at his clinic.

"I cleaned her body, including her genitalia. She had no sign of raping or sodomising."


smh.com.au

II. Also, remember on the news about 1 month ago or more, when Americans were burned then hanged, driven thought town on the back of the car by a rope, then hanged from a bridge and hit by sticks? Remember anyone? Showing there dog tags? Not the mention this is right for the iraqis to do this! and this is NOT embarrsing

And did that go unpunished?
NO.

Now, the US military itself estimates that 600 Iraqis have been killed so far during the fighting in the Iraqi town, where many of Falluja's 300,000 civilians have been caught in the middle of a ring of US soldiers, and where fierce fighting still rages...
...The fighting in Falluja started when the US sent 2,000 troops in response to the killing and abuse of the bodies of four US security guards, outsourced casualties of an often privatised war.
Guardian

III. Yet, other civilians can be tortured from different countries, Japenese, British, and many others, but not the mention this is right for the iraqis to do this!

Iraqi civil and religious leaders have condemned the kidnappings and called for the hostages to be released but their appeals seem to have had little impact on some militants intent on testing the will of US allies.

Yahoo

IV. 9-11, Not only was Iraq found as helping binladen before, pictures of towers buring in a palace, and people selling goods on the streets of bin laden in Iraq. not the mention this is right for the iraqis to do this!

V. 9-11, I lost a family member in the Twin towers, my uncle was the one who got taken away from me. Now its only me and my aunt now, because my father died when I was 4 and I lived with my uncle until 2001. Not only did I give him presents for fathers day, he was my father. Coming from people behind there computers on this board, who disagree with me, POST YOUR COMMENTS, my rebuttle will be 10x better then yours who "think" there right because there hippies, you don't know what they did to the innocent.

I don't think the citizens of Iraq were responsible for that anymore than citizens of the US were responsible for the Madrid bombings.

[Edited on 8-5-2004 by AceOfBase]

Not everyone can learn to evaluate their information sources effectively. Go easy on poor young Einstein.


* I decided to edit the first para out, it was a little harsh and anally retentive. *

[Edited on 8-5-2004 by MaskedAvatar]

Laxpla,

Your uncle sounds like a good man. You obviously love him and your aunt very much. Do you really think he would want anyone tortured in his name? Especially anyone innocent? If you yourself did such a thing, could you face him and say, "Uncle, I tortured this person in your name. They haven't had a trial, and I can't be sure they were guilty, but I did it in revenge."

I am an aunt with no children of my own. I have had nephews and neices living with me for more than a dozen years. No matter what happens to me, I would never want them to damage themselves by torturing anyone in revenge. Hunt the criminals down, try them and punish them, yes. Torture them, no.

Two wrongs don't make a right. Not ever. The atrocities you mention are unforgiveable. I lost friends in 9/11. My husband and I lost our business because of it. Our employees, who are also our friends, lost their jobs because of it. Everyone suffered. People all over the world suffered. I want those responsible hunted down, tried, and punished.

Your uncle and every other victim of terrorist atrocities deserve justice, not revenge. Justice is a lot harder to give them, but they deserve every effort we have to make. It is our job, as survivors, to do more than grieve for them. They deserve a memorial of justice, not hate. They were killed by hate; I refuse to feed the thing that killed my friends.

In the case of every atrocity you mentioned, the criminals who did them deserve the most severe punishment. But I do not want to be like them. They are terrorists. They are criminals. They are scum. I don't want our country to be like them. Torture is unAmerican. Rule of law is American.

There is revenge. There is the law. They are two very different things. In the United States, we live by rule of law. There can be no exceptions. As soon as one exception is made, rule of law becomes rule of power. And that is what creates tyranny and injustice. That is what creates terrorism. We cannot preserve our country by violating the principles it was founded on. That will only corrupt it. It would be treason against our honored dead, because to abandon our principles would be taking on the ways of the terrorists who killed them.

I've said this before on ATS: Don't be what you hate. Don't practice what you condemn.

Honor your uncle's memory by keeping yourself someone he can always be proud of. Honor his memory by seeking justice, don't sully it by seeking revenge.

You know what, Glees post was the only one I really read with interest. Only civil point being made in this topic. Sorry for your lost Glee, I know its unAmerican to "torture" people, but if you ever saw "WindTalkers" You would know what it would be like if you where in George Washingtons dads spot, I forgot the dads name, but thats how I feel. I was intended to be a Radiologist, who takes X-rays in hospitals. But ever since 9-11 happened I want to join the Navy and be a SEAL. My uncles friend was a Recon, a he said that Seals could take out 10 recon w/ or w/o a gun. Now everyday after school, I work out, preparing, and paintball getting ready when Iam 18, knowing that when I step onto boot camp, I will be protecting America.

MaskedAvatar, please post your paragraph, I want to read it so I could respond.

[Edited on 8-5-2004 by Laxpla]

I have never heard where anyone said Lynch wasn't raped and abused except here. You people are really strange. You think she wasn't raped but, they said she was for what? A hero?
If you read what she says in her book its that she was raped but had no memory of it because she was unconscious.. Once she was in the hospital she was treated well.
[url=http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2003-11-06-lynch_x.htm]
Dunno why anyone would try to minimize what happened to her; sounds pretty sick to me.

Anything that you "think" may give aid and comfort to Bush is to be attacked. Truth is irrelevant.

Variable

She was unconscious for only three hours after the crash.
Do you think she was raped in that short of a time?
Even if she didn't remember the rape, wouldn't the pain of an anal rape still be there?

There is so much of the story that has fallen apart from the original allegations. Now everything has to be called into question. Jessica Lynch herself admitted that the military made false statements about her ordeal.

In her first public statements since her rescue in Iraq, Jessica Lynch criticized the military for exaggerating accounts of her rescue and re-casting her ordeal as a patriotic fable.

Guardian
NY Times

This is what happens when people use false propaganda.
It makes them lose credibility when the truth comes out.

Originally posted by Laxpla
You know what, Glees post was the only one I really read with interest. Only civil point being made in this topic. Sorry for your lost Glee, I know its unAmerican to "torture" people, but if you ever saw "WindTalkers" You would know what it would be like if you where in George Washingtons dads spot, I forgot the dads name, but thats how I feel. I was intended to be a Radiologist, who takes X-rays in hospitals. But ever since 9-11 happened I want to join the Navy and be a SEAL. My uncles friend was a Recon, a he said that Seals could take out 10 recon w/ or w/o a gun. Now everyday after school, I work out, preparing, and paintball getting ready when Iam 18, knowing that when I step onto boot camp, I will be protecting America.

MaskedAvatar, please post your paragraph, I want to read it so I could respond.

[Edited on 8-5-2004 by Laxpla]

Laxpla,

I think it's wonderful that you have decided to join the military. It's an excellent and intelligent response to what happened to your family and to all of us. I'm sure you'll be a great SEAL. My exHusband worked with them off and on for nine years in Vietnam, and thought very highly of them. He was a great soldier, so I can't imagine a better recommendation. You have motivation and sound very dedicated to me. I'm sure your uncle would approve. I'm sure you will succeed.

And I appreciate you reading what I wrote. I hope you will think about it some more, as you work and wait to become a soldier. There are a lot of kinds of anger, Laxpla. Some kinds can help us do what is right and make the world a better place. Some kinds can deform us and make the world a worse place.

The kind of anger that led to 9/11 is ugly and destructive. It thirsts for revenge. This kind of anger is a natural immediate response to extreme injustice, to the murder or torture of someone we love. It is unthinking and unwise. If we don't master it, it masters us and leads us to do terrible things. I can feel some of this kind of anger in your postings. I know this kind of anger, Laxpla, because I have felt it, too.

But there is another kind of anger in your postings, as well. A more mature, righteous anger, which I think you have in abundance. This kind of anger is neither ugly nor destructive. It thirsts for justice and for right. It motivates us to protect what we love. It prevents us from doing terrible things, because it will always keep us from becoming the thing we hate.

The first, destructive anger tries to perpetuate itself and passes misery and sorrow on for generation after generation. The second, healthy anger tries to stop the misery and sorrow here and now.

When you are a soldier, and you are defending America, remember what it is you are defending. It is a place, yes. It is people, yes. But it is much more than that. It is a dream of democracy, of justice, of rule of law; a dream of a place where might does not make right, and power does not prevail over merit.

So often our government and our leaders betray this dream, sometimes we, the people, betray this dream, but the dream never dies. It is the chief legacy we Americans inherit from our ancestors. It is the chief legacy we leave to our children; it is the best legacy your uncle could leave you. It is up to you and the rest of America's children to grow up loving that dream, learning to understand it more every year of your life, and passing it on to your children before you die.

When you defend America, Laxpla, don't forget to defend it against all comers, even your fellow soldiers if they would attack the principles that are its foundation and strength.

May you grow as wise as you are intelligent and strong, when you come into the power of your full adulthood. If you must kill, may you do it in battle, in justice, or in self-defense, as a soldier should. And may you always resist the desire for revenge.

If Jessica Lynch was raped(just for arguments sake). Why does it have to be Iraqi's. Could of been the reason they went offf course was to have a little hanky panky and then got ambushed or caught.

Originally posted by ashley
If Jessica Lynch was raped(just for arguments sake). Why does it have to be Iraqi's. Could of been the reason they went offf course was to have a little hanky panky and then got ambushed or caught.

No no no! Iraqis rape everything they see and also kill little babies in Kuwait and after that they take the babies as lunch!!!
They are evil!!! ohoooo

I don't get why some people(not talking about you ashley!) eat the Jessica Lynch story like it is the truth. Come on people, it is proofed the US military tried to make this story sound like a fairy tale and the Iraqis did everything to return private Lynch in good condition, even risked their life for that.

In fact, you guys are the only sick people here because you name honourable and brave Iraqis who tried to help a wounded american soldier, rapists and question their version of the story.

But they are Iraqis...and we know what Iraqis do. They rape by nature...

Oh my, oh my.

Seems particularly sick to me that some people are willing to hijack Jessica Lynch's story so as to justify US torture and abuse.

She wasn't raped.The biography was unofficial.She doesn't make these claims herself and her injuries were consistant with an automobile accident.

BUT!

Some people won't listen.Some people will never accept the truth.Some people are brainwashed and conditioned.

Thank you John bull 1.

This thread demonstrates what happens when you get to them at a young age, and inspire them with action movies and guns and uniforms and propaganda to go and join the military to save America. But who will save it from itself.

It amazes me that anyone can still come to this site and still believe the bogus Jessica Lynch story.

The woman said herself she was used for propaganda purposes for Heaven's sake!

It just goes to show how people can be brain washed through the mainstream media and don't listen to the truth even when it's spat right in their face.