140 Dead in Muslim Riots - Western China

reply to post by SLAYER69


A picture says more than a thousand words, indeed, so many believe this, this is why people like you are mislead with certain pictures. At least one of your pictures were showing Nepalese police handling rioters buddy (hint: the first pic of your last post). Same tactic the Uygur separatists are using nowadays. Funny how this picture is used all over again, when the pic clearly show the face of a non-Chinese in uniform maybe you have seen too few Chinese in your lifetime?

And a lady being executed? C'mon, you have verified for maybe WHY? Of course, there is always a chance she was innocent and put on the deathrow, but for the same money she might have been a mass murder of a whole family. We can debate about whether or not the death penalty should be here or not of course, but who really cares if you merely want to show a picture of an "innocent" woman being executed by "evil" Chinese soldiers.

As for the last picture that was a picture of last year's Lahsa RIOT, where the police was merely forming a defensive line, what do you want to say about that? This particular picture had been discussed many times over in other threads and forums.

Beneath the ever-famous guy holding up tanks of 1989 picture is a black/white picture? Why black and white, maybe it was of ages old, and could be as well an accident or one of the results the Chinese disastrous historic black pages when Mao was ruling? And what's the use of bringing up that particular article? To show that there is as much propaganda and lies in China as in the West? That is kinda old news, innit? The Tiananmen event is a tragedy that happened like two decades ago, so how long you guys want to selectively stick to the past and start to really look ahead of the road?

Anyhow, I think we have kinda finished our discussion when you are merely avoiding my comments and replies about China at all by bringing up FAKE picture/age-old pictures, and pictures which you most likely have no clue of the sources and what actually happened. Or simply failed in doing your own due diligence and therefore is apparently merely repeating what your MSM and Government want you to think about China. It only shows that you are defying the debate and merely want to show "third" eyes some graphic and exciting picture to maintain and spread your opinion on the "Evil China"-doctrine.

Ah the "Evil China"-doctrine..... (Ps. before you accuse me again, I NEVER EVER said it is a utopia in China, and that we are WORKING ON the thousands of issues inhouse).


[edit on 10-7-2009 by yiersan]

reply to post by SR


Totally AGREE with you, nothing is simply black and white in this world. This new test of a melting pot of socialism, nationalism, capitalism and Chinese culture, muah, is it THE answer? muah, time will tell I think.

[edit on 10-7-2009 by yiersan]

Originally posted by yiersan
maybe you have seen too few Chinese in your lifetime?

No not at all I was born and raised in Los Angeles. I have many Chinese American friends. The vast majority of them are loyal, hard working and respectful people. Well almost all of them like with the any race they have their trouble makers. We know this in America because we practically have some of every race on the planet as citizens. You do know we have millions of those don't you?

And a lady being executed? C'mon, you have verified for maybe WHY? Of course, there is always a chance she was innocent and put on the deathrow, but for the same money she might have been a mass murder of a whole family. We can debate about whether or not the death penalty should be here or not of course, but who really cares if you merely want to show a picture of an "innocent" woman being executed by "evil" Chinese soldiers.

I never said they were "EVIL" You keep trying to put words in my mouth.
How do you know if the lady was executed? Do you know something we don't?

Beneath the ever-famous guy holding up tanks of 1989 picture is a black/white picture? Why black and white, maybe it was of ages old, and could be as well an accident or one of the results the Chinese disastrous historic black pages when Mao was ruling?

Just letting the less educated know more about "modern China" as you call it be shown. You did say "Modern China" and mentioned the past 200 years didnt you?

Anyhow, I think we have kinda finished our discussion when you are merely avoiding my comments and replies about China at all by bringing up FAKE picture/age-old pictures, and pictures which you most likely have no clue of the sources and what actually happened.

Are you trying to say the Tienanmen Square massacre never happened and that they are fake?

Ah the "Evil China"-doctrine.....

I really wish you would stop trying to put words in my mouth. I never said that China or the Chinese troops were "EVIL"

But...

If people get that perspective because of the actions of the single party monolithic communist government that you are defending well then I cant help that now can I?



[edit on 10-7-2009 by SLAYER69]

Originally posted by SLAYER69
Are you trying to say the Tienanmen Square massacre never happened and that they are fake?

Like-wise, don't put words in my mouth


Even after being informed that a picture is not showing Chinese forces you don't even comment on it or admit you made a blunder. Ah well. Your intention is clear now.


[edit on 10-7-2009 by yiersan]

Originally posted by yiersan

Originally posted by SLAYER69
Are you trying to say the Tienanmen Square massacre never happened and that they are fake?

Like-wise, don't put words in my mouth


Ps. Even after being informed that a picture is not showing Chinese forces you don't even comment on it or admit you made a blunder. Ah well.

Who said anything about him being in China? I was just showing how Tibet is not free...

Prove he's not Tibetan!



[edit on 10-7-2009 by SLAYER69]

reply to post by SLAYER69


Up to you to proof your pictures, I am only being nice to give you the chance to replace it. It does show how ignorant some people are. The sheeple just copy/paste what they see. Sigh.

Originally posted by yiersan
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

Up to you to proof your pictures, I am only being nice to give you the chance to replace it. It does show how ignorant some people are. The sheeple just copy/paste what they see. Sigh.

OK so now you have lowered yourself to more name calling. I wont bother lowering myself to that level. I like that picture I think I'll keep it up if you go back I don't make any claims as to where it's from nor what it is in reference to.

reply to post by SLAYER69


an accurate description of someone in a forum which is promoting "deny ignorance" is hardly to be considered name-calling ;-) this is merely confirmed again by your latest post

as the pictures are shown for a particular reason related with China, even though you know by now that particular picture would be miss-leading, but yet still not going to correct it, so your intention is extremely clear. Or you are too much having a "must win"-mentality, so could not stand it that you are for once obviously wrong and therefore can not take it as a grownup man/woman, so simply just ignore the reality by pretending you don't care and/or pretending to be "funny", ah well, none of my business anyhow how you want to act hmmmm, btw, ironically in this specific thread there was someone accusing another poster with a different viewpoint of trolling

[edit on 10-7-2009 by yiersan]

Originally posted by yiersan
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

Why we need a strong hard Central government?

Chinese Civilization was already old when the Egyptians began building pyramids. But the last 200 years have not gone well, what with two Opium Wars forcing China to import drugs, and Europeans seizing coastal ports as a step to complete colonial control, then the Boxer Rebellion, the collapse of the Manchu Dynasty, civil war, a brutal invasion and occupation by Japan, more civil war, then Communist consolidation and transformation of society, then Mao’s Cultural Revolution. Such events caused tens of millions of people to die. Thus, China’s recent history has good reasons why social order is a higher priority than individual rights. Race riots and rebellion cannot be tolerated.

Do you prefer anarchy and chaos in the country with over one fourth of the world population or rather a stable and developing with prospects for a better future for 1/4 of the world population?

[edit on 8-7-2009 by yiersan]

As one of the 1/4 world population you referred , I'm totally agree with you on the ethnic part of your post. However, about your Claim in the last part saying we Chinese really need sort of strong authoritarian?

What?

So you are actually saying that for the safety and well being of other 3/4 world population, A Strong autocratic government are required to keep all Chinese people from harassing others?

And by various measurement include block out twitter, facebook, youtube, by extended mind control and brainwash, by adopting full scale obscurantism?

There were Opium Wars because we had a highly centralized government in Qing Dynasty, there were culture revolution because a highly centralized government! Again! and what's next?!

reply to post by yiersan


You know, I'm sure we all fall into that trap of falling in line behind our country and not realizing when we seem "evil" to others, and of course, no one here has yet called your "country" evil yet. But when you do stuff like block Facebook, twitter, etc and block worldwide media..... (I'm sure generations of Chinese from now will sing songs about the great facebook ban ) but it's okay... we're helping our friends in country there with proxies and work arounds.. God freedom is nice - isn't it? .... it goes a long way toward making your suppression of the Tibetan people look a bit.... off-color?

Who knew?

Oppression of an entire people was deemed evil by logically thinking people a while back.

You silly Chinese w/ your silly little spy networks and your silly little attempts to hack us.

lol

Fix your internal problems in a peaceful way and people won't think you're evil.

mmmkay?

Cheers!

[edit on 15-7-2009 by mf_luder]

[edit on 15-7-2009 by mf_luder]

reply to post by mf_luder


Suppression, oppression, ethnic cleansing blablabla, the world is indeed full of hypocrisy and double standard, and most important selective believing what you read from what is presented to you. Isn't it amusing to see so many forming an opinion about a thing, a place, a event, a country and people while they did not even have first-hand experiences of ‘it". Simply because people like you and many others who on one hand says your MSM and government are lying and miss-leading you about all kinds of whatever topics you do have first-hand experiences with, but on the other hand if repeated enough times blindly believing what that same MSM and other channels are presenting to you, because the case seems to be "logic" and "making sense"? This all without the right due diligence and research, and simply start to cry out loud and criticize without being constructive to the horrible problem. Of course, a charming English-speaking Dalai Lama with a whole PR team and full financial support from the only superpower on Earth is more believable than those scary non-transparant "communists" who you can't even understand when they make a speech or give an interview. A story about some military killing some helpless minorities is of course more exciting than believing in stories about a violent minority group killing another ethnic group. Thank you for sharing your utterly useless opinion on this matter and your prejudiced opinion about people you never understood. Welcome to the Club of Ignorance.

[edit on 18-7-2009 by yiersan]

Originally posted by yiersan
reply to post by mf_luder

 

Suppression, oppression, ethnic cleansing blablabla, the world is indeed full of hypocrisy and double standard, and most important selective believing what you read from what is presented to you. Isn't it amusing to see so many forming an opinion about a thing, a place, a event, a country and people while they did not even have first-hand experiences of ‘it". Simply because people like you and many others who on one hand says your MSM and government are lying and miss-leading you about all kinds of whatever topics you do have first-hand experiences with, but on the other hand if repeated enough times blindly believing what that same MSM and other channels are presenting to you, because the case seems to be "logic" and "making sense"? This all without the right due diligence and research, and simply start to cry out loud and criticize without being constructive to the horrible problem. Of course, a charming English-speaking Dalai Lama with a whole PR team and full financial support from the only superpower on Earth is more believable than those scary non-transparant "communists" who you can't even understand when they make a speech or give an interview. A story about some military killing some helpless minorities is of course more exciting than believing in stories about a violent minority group killing another ethnic group. Thank you for sharing your utterly useless opinion on this matter and your prejudiced opinion about people you never understood. Welcome to the Club of Ignorance.

[edit on 18-7-2009 by yiersan]

Cute little rant.

It would have stood up on its own except for one fact you missed.

I don't watch the MSM.



Cheers!

The Club Of Ignorance

Originally posted by yiersan
Welcome to the Club of Ignorance.

The Club of Ignorance is populated by those who don't honor the AboveTopSecret.com Terms And Conditions Of Use.

Your opinions are quite welcome, as long as they are expressed courteously and with respect for the viewpoints of other members, even those who may strongly disagree with you.

Likewise, other ATSers are expected to treat you courteously, and respect your right to hold your own opinions.

Please resist the temptation to resort to ad hominem attacks, ALERT us to those that do, always speak freely on the issues, and help us Deny Ignorance.

reply to post by yiersan


Also,

Not really sure whether or not I was rolled up in the "ad hominem" attacks thing there...

Not trying to attack you directly, believe me. Nor am I prejudiced against any race of people.

What I am prejudiced against is the blatant refusal of people to acknowledge the rights of others.

You're right the MSM is full of garbage. That's why I don't pay any attention to it. However, when people on the ground are sending back first-hand accounts of atrocities being committed, it leads one to wonder who is or isn't telling the truth. Therefore, whether the people who were committing those atrocities were Chinese, Korean, American, Japanese, Indonesian, etc... it doesn't really matter in my mind. You are all human, regardless of your races. What does matter is the acts you commit as a group.

That's why people think others are evil. At least I would hope so.

Judge people on their actions, not their color or race.


.....oh and one more thing... I'm never going to stop being a smart aleck, so if it offends you or anyone else, let me know so I can not talk to you.....

[edit on 18-7-2009 by mf_luder]

Originally posted by mf_luder

You're right the MSM is full of garbage. That's why I don't pay any attention to it. However, when people on the ground are sending back first-hand accounts of atrocities being committed, it leads one to wonder who is or isn't telling the truth.

Question is where do you get the sources for these "first-hand accounts of atrocities"?

The root of this riot was the ethnic tensions, but the cause and start of this riot was the continuous fuel of rumors from so-called "first-hand accounts of atrocities" in the factory Guangdong toy's factory brawl.

Talking about ad homimem attacks, pretty ironic. Yes I was being offended by your first post, when you started to be belittling "silly Chinese".

You silly Chinese w/ your silly little spy networks and your silly little attempts to hack us.

lol

Especially when this so-called hacking etc has NOTHING to do with this whole thread at all. And the whole comment was simply out of air with the sole purpose of racial attacking "you silly Chinese" to be less advanced or developed or so than you.
It does figures though, that a "super moderator" would tick on my fingers instead of those generalizing and making belittling offending off-topic comments, she most likely did it without even trailing back the whole thread. Ah well, it is not that I do not know or remember how it felt to be a minority when I was in Europe Double-standards happen anywhere, ah well.

"Judge people by their actions", yes, I totally agree. Yet, not many people do this at all, despite what they say or claim. Simply because people will create an impression of certain issue and most of the people lack the patience in doing due diligence and research on the thing they created an opinion about. This is the danger of trusting too much on "first-hand accounts", eventually the mindset is way too often to selectively believe the person you have more sympathy for and seemingly more logically and seemingly more trustworthy than the opposite views or accounts.

[edit on 19-7-2009 by yiersan]

I just read a report that 10,000 protestors in this area have disappeared overnight....

I will have to locate a link to this....

More as I find it....

reply to post by Iblis


The "PC" misunderstandings regarding Islam continue. Apparently reading the Koran and its many calls to murder Jews and infidels (those who are not Muslim - a VERY great number of the people of the world) never crosses the 'mind' of many who write in this forum. I cannot understand the 'thinking' of these ones, except that they have a hatred for anyone whose beliefs are rooted in the God of Israel.

And since Allah is not Elohim, (Allah was the moon-god of Muhammed's father's clan; origianlly 'he' had three daughters represented by stars; this was reduced to one star in most national Muslim flags today; also note how many Muslim nations have large swords in their flags.symbols) this supports the spleen-venting so often encounterd here. You might also be interested in examining the name "Fatima" which is often associated with 'miracles' in various parts of the world-in Catholic as well as Muslim circles. Yes, Muslims believe in the Virgin Mary, and see Jesus as a prophet who did not die on the cross and was not God's son.

Islam does not offer "control" over anyone. It does call for jihad or war against the non-muslim world. Read it for yourself in the Koran.

In fact, there is no effort of 'control' over any group of people or thoughts except by governments. It is no wonder that the Bible consistenetly pictures the governments of the world as "beasts." Is the world out of control? Yes, but the "beasts" are, also.

what I find something strange is that it is always muslims who are in these kind of events everywhere something happens like this its with muslims.
nigeria , somalia, china in the past couple of weeks.
I wonder why that is .. then I haven't mentioned the attacks in Indonesia , pakistan and other places around the world.
only attacks in the news not of muslims terrorist where the attacks in spain the past days by the ETA .
But more than 90 percent of the riots, attacks and unrest is done by people hangin on to the islam.. and people say that they are peacefull.
I am not against people but I only wonder why it is that people hanging on that religious system are more in the news with violence.

further more I am not a Chinese so I have nothing to say about the internal affairs of that nation.
People who do interfere with the internal affairs are doing the same as what they appose.
That is .. mainly those people are saying that the USA has no bussiness interfering in the middle east and in other nations and that is one of the reasons people hate america and bush when he was in power.. but they are now doing the same as bush did interfering with the internal affairs of a foreign nation.