Disturbing News about Swine Flu

reply to post by Haydn_17


Just looked on Google maps/terrain. Certainly looks like a large portion of your area is grave sites, with a small factory.

I'm so sorry to hear this- for you, mostly- and for the rest of us.

It's not unlike the mass burials in the Black Death that have been identified.

Please stay well and try to stay positive- my heart (and many others) are with you

Please excuse my ignorance, but what exactly are the symptoms of Swine Flu? I had flu twice towards the end of last year and again in January of this year. Could i have caught it? Does this mean i am a carrier? Will i ever know? What's the chances of getting flu 3 times on the trot in such a space of of time? I spose on average i get a bad bought of flu once a year or every 18 months or so.
I don't think there is any point loosing sleep over it. My first thoughts were more people drop dead with heart attact in one week than catch bird flu! Of course i am no expert, but at the end of the day local councils do tend to get over excited about things. Don't forget they have their own language called Council jargon and if you can understand that then good on ya! They should be more worried about the challenges this winter is going to bring as well as bird flu. But councils think they know it all and what is best for everyone. We will see. My council are more interested in bringing in enforcement officers to fine people to keep them poor, then have the audacity to blame people for the ills of the town. Infact my council hasn't got a good bone in it's body! So don't read too much into things love, just live your life and be HAPPY!

reply to post by operation mindcrime


The 8 million you're referring to aren't flu shots, those are the Tamiflu stockpiles for 1/3 of the Dutch popultation. The 34 million flu shots have been ordered but are yet to be developed. That ammount equals upto 2 shots per person.

Originally posted by Haydn_17
reply to post by DraconianKing

 

What proof do you expect? And i doubt the local council made the decision. Im not going to change what i have said, i was told this and thats that.

You can't win can you mate!

If you'd have kept quiet for now, and waited to tell this say...a month into the bodies piling up and the news coming out on the telly, that 'city councils have ordered that because of the danger of spread of further virus and disease, all council incinerator sites are to be used for incinerating bodies of virus victims', everyone would of then cired..'Why the hell didn't you tell us earlier?!'

So you can't win.

In fact, being a UK citizen, and fairly familiar with councils (my father worked for a large one for nearly 40 years), i see nothing out of the ordinary or sinister about this at all.

It's perfectly understandable to be honest.

Noone is saying that 'park keepers' are going to be using these exclusively. They *may* be used to supplement the normal cremotoria should the need arise.

As an overflow of sorts.

Cheers to the OP for the heads up.

Originally posted by Sam60
reply to post by spikey

 

I don't agree there is any sort of concensus it will mutate into a much more serious or "deadly" disease during the winter.

Fine..that's your prerogative.

Whatever you agree with or not is immaterial frankly. Flu does mutate frequently, that's why a 'vaccine' has to be tailored and restructured virtually every year, because of mutations.

If you don't agree there's a consensus for expecting a mutation in this 'swine' flu, i'm curious as to exactly why you take this position?

reply to post by spikey


Thanks, i don't know what people expect me to provide. Im just passing on the infomation my dad told me.

reply to post by happinness



If you have caught flu, let's say strain A1...if you recover, you'll have immunity against flu strain A1.

If flu strain A2 comes your way, you can catch that too, as A2 is different to A1. If you recover from A2, you now have immunity against A1 and A2.

If either of these mutates (and they do... a lot) into flu strain A3, you can get that too, as A3 is now a new 'mutated' strain to which you have no immunity (immune to only A1 and A2, NOT A3)..and so on.

Just as if you were to be infected by 'swine flu' now in it's 'milder' form (NON mutated), you will have immunity against that particular strain. If the 'swine flu' mutates (as many in the health services expect it too when the colder weather arrives) you will not be immune from whatever the resulting mutated strain of 'swine flu' will be.

My advice...

If people start dropping like flies...stay indoors, do NOT open the door for anyone or anything (except emergencies obviously), and isolate you and your families from all outside human contact.

This means stocking up on at least 6 months worth of non perishable foods. Long shelf life stuff. And try to store the basics like food, water, at least 1 litre PP/PD, lightling (candles, torches, batteries etc), medical supplies, and so on.

If things don't get too bad, what have you lost? Not a lot.
Bit of time and effort, a small amount of money. What would you lose, if you didn't have any supplies and you need them? A lot more.

Originally posted by Haydn_17
reply to post by spikey

 

Thanks, i don't know what people expect me to provide. Im just passing on the infomation my dad told me.

I know it's hard, but try not to take it personally.

There are a lot of people on this site, that seem to think ATS is the 'ministry of arguments'. They come here to bicker and denounce, rather that to obtain or share info.

I had the same reaction when posting about UFO (truest sense of the words) i saw and reported here. Almost immediately, people were slagging it off and posting what they thought it probably was i saw.

Clever people eh?

Most of them live thousands of miles away from me, yet 'they' had a better idea that me on what i saw 10 minutes earlier! From where they are, not having seen what i did! Now that's clever eh?

So don't worry, there are lots of people who'll thank you for the info.

216.221.102.26...

"...In the United States the disease was first observed at Fort Riley, Kansas, United States, on "March 4, 1918,[29] and Queens, New York, on March 11, 1918. In August 1918, a more virulent strain appeared simultaneously in Brest, France, in Freetown, Sierra Leone, and in the U.S. at Boston, Massachusetts. The Allies of World War I came to call it the Spanish flu, primarily because the pandemic received greater press attention after it moved from France to Spain in November 1918. Spain was not involved in the war and had not imposed wartime censorship.[30]"
Source: Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. 1918 flu pandemic. Wikipedia

"However, a first wave of influenza appeared early in the spring of 1918 in Kansas and in military camps throughout the US."
Source: The Influenza Pandemic of 1918. Stanford

Today's H1N1 flu is descended from the 1918 H1N1 pandemic swine flu strain. Classical H1N1 has been endemic in hogs in the USA and Canada since 1930, at least, in a form relatively benign to people.

"The 1918 flu was an H1N1 flu ..."
Source: Reuters. October 6, 2005. Scientists recreate deadly spanish flu. ABC

"Viruses of the classical H1N1 lineage were virtually the exclusive cause of swine influenza (in the United States and Canada) from the time of their initial isolation in 1930 through 1998."
Source: Virus Res. 2002 May 10;85(2):199-210. The emergence of novel swine influenza viruses in North America. PMID: 12034486




So why not tell the truth?

Because what's really on the table is the profitability of large scale industrial animal husbandry, never mind international travel and other trade. Strategies for passive population reduction are also part of the play of course, but more as an opportunistic sidebar.

Industrial animal husbandry includes hog and poultry barns as well as cattle feedlots. Large scale operations crowd 10's of thousands of animals together, pump them full of antibiotics, antivirals and vaccines to keep them alive, and force-feed them for slaughter to provide meat for our tables.

The practice is defended as "efficient" and economically necessary. Unfortunately, such conditions virtually guarantee the creation of new, and often virulent, diseases. Far more reliably than laboratory petri dishes, industrial animal husbandry operations literally force microbes and viruses to mutate, thereby initiating and accelerating the evolutionary process and creating new diseases. These new diseases sometimes infect people.

The role industrial agricultural practices play in creating human diseases has been known for decades - long enough to determine that current practices are dangerously unsustainable.

However, food is an essential commodity - the market is better than guaranteed, and the profit margin can be amazing. So the world's ruling financiers started controlling our food supply early on, and went for large-scale high-profit industrial food production and animal husbandry.

The problems were clear by the 1970's. First came Rachel Carson's expose; then there was the other swine flu scare; Mad Cow destroyed Britain's cattle industry and devastated other nations' cattle producers too; and the bird flu crisis did the same to poultry producers in Asia. The writing has been on the wall for a good while.

The financiers created a strategy back-when to minimize their risk, and buy time to implement their plan: out with vertical integration, in with risk management. Clever opportunists that they are, the financiers divested their corporate holdings in food production, and focused on food processing and distribution.

Now food is produced, and animals are raised, on contract for the financiers' global corporate processors. Small farmers and independent producers line up for the contracts and their sliver of the pie, and they're holding the bag - if they don't deliver, they don't get paid. It's only a matter of time before it's gameover for the little guys.

But it's not gameover yet. The little guys are still protected by virtue of association, and their role as sidekicks.

International law protects global corporate industry, and overrides national laws. The relevant legal framework involves the interplay between corporate law and the WHO's 2005 International Health Regulations (IHR-2005).

Corporate law mandates that corporations protect profits over all other considerations, including civil rights, human rights and public health. In tandem, the WHO's IHR-2005 regulations specify "The purpose and scope of these Regulations are to ...control and provide a public health response to the international spread of disease in ways that are ...restricted to public health risks, and which avoid unnecessary interference with international traffic and trade." Huh?

So what happens when the appropriate public health response interferes with international traffic and trade? God forbid global corporate expansion?

Well, with respect to the H1N1 flu conflict, the legal argument is simple: "Even though the type A, strain H1N1 triple assortment clade flu virus evolved in the USA, the clade isolated in Mexico is ever so slightly different, so this one's not American. Don't even call it North American. Furthermore, the Mexican triple assortment clade of type A, strain H1N1 flu is being transmitted directly from person-to-person, not from pigs to people; therefor, it is not a swine flu anymore. Don't call it swine flu. The name hurts the pork industry. And don't tell anyone the truth about what's really going on because H1N1's spread can't be contained; it's too late to stop it and there's no point trying; therefor, providing accurate information to the public constitutes pointless and thereby "unnecessary interference with international traffic and trade," which is specifically prohibited under international law. In any event, overpopulation is a significant global issue - a major culling is in order and long overdue."

H1N1 swine flu probably will meet up with H5N1 bird flu or some other bug like SARS or AIDS, and maybe use pigs as a mixing vessel for re-assortment, or maybe not.

"Virologist Ruben Donis, chief of the molecular virology and vaccines branch at the CDC:
Q: What’s the newest part of this strain?
R.D.: Neuraminidase and the matrix are the newest to be seen in North America. They were not part of the team—I talk about flu virus as teams of genes. There are eight players. They have these two new players from Asia.
Q: It suggests a mixing of pigs from North America and Asia.
R.D.: One little detail we haven’t discussed is [that] these Midwestern viruses were exported to Asia. Korea and many countries import from the U.S. ...
But however it happens and wherever it jumps, this mild first wave likely will be followed in about 6 months by a deadly strain or clade."

Source: Science Insider. Exclusive Interview: CDC Head Virus Sleuth
ScienceInsider

Appears to me the possiblity the H1N1 Flu originated in US and possibly due to our mass Corporation Farming practices.

You all know that the Beef, Pig and Poultry Industries are hugh contributors to all our Presidential Campaigns and some of the biggest lobbyist in DC, like the rest of Corporate America the meat industry runs our country.

Man's greed coming back to bite him all in the name of profit.




[edit on 21-6-2009 by ofhumandescent]

reply to post by QBSneak000


Yup- and the MOD is hidden delightfully behind neolithic stone circles and peaceful farms.

We were blown away when in the UK---althought the Us isn't diffeerent- the largest number of ICBM sites are in the most lovely Maui valleys imaginable

Sounds about right to me .
I wonder what they're planning on doing about the smell?
You know all those bodies burning are going to leave quite the stench.

You'd think they'd donate the bodies to KFC, i hear they're running out of 'Chicken'... Or at least drain them for some more of Mcdonalds 'Secret Sauce'...

In any case, i reacon it's nothing to get in a fuss about, think about how many bodies we're burning each day from normal Flu. We just don't think about it as much since Cremation sounds just that little bit less brutal.

If true, that's pretty bad and drastic?

Is swine flu really that bad? the reason I ask this question is that people in the UK die of flu every single year anyway. I have not had the time to research the stats on deaths for all the strains of flu yet.

It seems the media has gone to town on this one, has it been over exaggerated to test our responses to a wide spread virus?

If it was Ebola I really would be panicking

I personally have never had flu so do not know how bad it is, when I was young my mum used to jokingly call me the carrier, everyone in the house used to be ill with colds etc.. I was usually ok. Although I used to get tonsilitis a lot, I now no longer use antibiotics I use other methods on the rare occassion I get it.

I have found this works for mosts colds, flu etc..well it has for my family
3000mg of vitamin c, spread throughout the day. Cups of hot water with squeezed lemon and a couple of spoons of honey, you can also add a teaspoon of cider vinegar. this has worked for all of us so far. It worked for my tonsitilitis which disappeared in two days

Looks like the OP was telling the truth:

www.birminghammail.net...

HEALTH chiefs have earmarked Midland sites for temporary morgues as they struggle to cope with the swine flu epidemic.

Several locations across Birmingham have been identified as suitable for makeshift mortuaries to store bodies if the pandemic leads to mass casualties...

Quite worrying to say the least.

This sounds like COBRA has been issuing contingency plans to the counties and the local governments are bringing those who may need to be seconded to key tasks in emergency situations who would not have been included for any past briefings associated with any past potentials.

One thing bothers me though.

Why does original poster think it's wise to post what his father was told, on the Internet?

Sounds like that 'boss' spoken of, may have broken the official secrets act, a lower level of it compelling discretion in matters of state emergency and contingencies thereof, if your dad didn't sign it before being spoken to about any of this then sorry but i don't believe it, if he did, he's also breaking the act.

Contingency plans for this sort of thing are not something people are encouraged to go around shouting about, this is local council employees, council officials and local government, so anything like mentioned in the post will come from COBRA.

If this is true, there are people in Worcestershire City Council who are not going to have an easy time of things because of contingency parameters being blabbed.

I don't actually think this is true, if it is, heads will be a rolling and quite right, Cobra, Civil Contingencies etc, all have a need for any who are made privy to elements of worse case scenario planning, to keep things to themselves to avoid panics and imaginations exaggerating everything.

What is outlined in Haydn_17s' post isn't some informal little chat, he's talking council employees and boss and emergency planning and as such the father and the boss as well as other workers have a social responsibility to be responsible let alone anything else.

I know many, especially on ATS, will say the public has a right to know everything.

Well i beg to differ, if they did, too many people couldn't handle the whole truth about many things were they to know, secrets are necessary, sometimes unfair maybe but when it's to protect society from panic and themselves i fully support the secrets act and people required to be discreet with what they are made privy.

[Apart from anything else, now Haydn_17, his family and by now likely his friends and so on so forth, are now all looking at a nightmare scenario in say 5 months onwards of bodies piling up in Worcestershire faster than can be disposed of, where if a little discretion and common sense were to be applied, surely it'd dictate that if one cared for their family, it would be a case of wanting to protect ones family from thinking about terrifying potentials, i may handle such concepts perfectly ok but can everybody else around me, is what i constantly ask myself, sounds like posters father may want to adopt similar manner of concern for those they care about, no offence.

I wouldn't want to scare my lad, that's for bloody certain!]


If people let out this sort of low level continegency planning, is it any wonder we live in a world of government secrets and very few can discern and/or perceive the truth and realities from outside.

No!

'Tis why i belive in the nature of secrets in the bigger picture(s), as much as i believe in being open and honest with people on any personal basis, some think they want to know truths, but were they to, it'd likely fry their minds attemping to cope with it all.

[edit on 21-6-2009 by DeltaPan]

The swine flu has mutated already found that out on website 'not another conspiracy' Also outbreak of bubonic plague in or near eygpt (also something to do with leaky vials at a military installation).

So who is going to have the jab then ? some folks believe half the jabs will be contaminated and then you die the other half will be ok (50/50 split might not be true) This is to reduce the population on a global scale... makes you think twice if you have the jab and you die they'll just say the jab wasn't up to scratch and provided you with no protection especially if it mutates again.

And to all those people who have flu a dozen times you probably never had it alot of people think a bad cold is flu...it is not.

Flu hurts, your head wants to explode , you are far too hot and you understand why the young and the elderly die from it. I had flu soooooo many times until I got the real thing....now I know the difference

scared angel xx

reply to post by tarifa37


Thanks for the link to back up my claim tarifa37.

The 2.5% mortality is speculation, as we are very early into the pandemic.

Here's a scary article detailing a study done by the Bank of England years ago, prophecising a pandemic.

My advice is to prepare NOW, keep your eye on Buenos Aires and watch this site: flutracker.rhizalabs.com...

For those who don't know what exponential means, here's a picture.

[edit on 21-6-2009 by PrisonerOfSociety]

There were some soccer games broadcast from Mexico that had no fans in the stands.

I wonder if there could be some football games played in the US with nobody in the stands. What about places like Disneyland and Disney World.

There are constant concerts everywhere. Will people who bought their tickets in advance will get a refund?

Prediction alert!! The next Super Bowl will be played in an empty stadium, no fans.

reply to post by QBSneak000


Why do yall group so many people into 1 group called "Government"? Only a select group of people really know anything and the rest of are just told what they need to know do work with their part...

Come on

OR HOW ABOUT EVERYONE JUST RUN AND EXERCISE... I never got sick for 7 years as long as I ran about 2x a week... or did some kind of cardio that keeps your Heart Rate high for long enough (depends on the person) but 45 minutes is always sufficient

Hey Atleast there are many benefits
1) Youll lose weight
2) youll get away from the paranoia site for a bit
3) youll be prepared to run if any of it is true

[edit on 21-6-2009 by rjmelter]

Rather than worrying about 'jabs'.

Healthy adults need to worry about making sure they eat plenty of fruit and veg for minerals and trace elements such as Zinc, which are necessary for creating the bodies own antigens.

High risk groups would have to worry anyway, nothing changes.

I could not care less about H1N1.

Just eat properly and as we pass through Autumn, make sure you eat more root veg, Parsnips, Turnips, Swedes, Carrots, etc.

What the body requires above our macro nutrient ranges, minerals and traces, are found in root veg and fruit, eat plenty and the flu will have a hard time with any otherwise healthy adult and don't allow yourself to get run down with sleeplessness etc.

Maybe if healthy people weren't so paranoid, there'd be enough antivirals for those high risk groups, who are just as likely to die from Asian flu than any mutated H1N1 variants.

It is annoying when full grown men and women who don't actually give a crap about anybody but themselves.

Otherwise fit and healthy, but demanding treatments just in case, when people with compromised immune responses etc, old and young, have a real need to take antivirals etc, but can't because the selfish healthy adults have depleted stocks.

While everybody is getting paranoid about a flu virus.

Perhaps they'd like to factor why peoples immune responses are weaker nowadays, in general.

Over fastidious personal and domestic hygiene and processed diets with little or no fresh veg and poisoning themselves with a poisonous drug called Alcohol by abusing it frequently so weakening the antigen levels in ones bloods so when something comes along they are less able to defend against it.

Bugs don't bother me, but i am a gardener and used to the dirt.

I don't get flu, i don't get food poisoning etc, i am not overly fussed with hygiene, except intimate of course, a little different that one, but generally, i don't worry about dirty, microbes, bugs and they don't bother me and i very much doubt H1N1 will come near me.


Strange that, ay!

This situation leads to all kinds of bizarre scenarios;

1. will the huge US prison population get the flu shots? Will they be mandatory?

2. what about the police? flu shots? or take their chances without?

3. what happens if hospital workers, school nurses, or doctors bug out?

4. keep the US/Mexico border open? (OMG)

5. what about Mexico City, the epicenter of the flu. Quarantine?

6. In the US, what will happen to NY city? Quarantine? Lockdown?