Obama gives terrorists/enemy combatants Miranda Rights

Another flip flop ... or .... another campaign promise broken? Either way -

Back to the campaign trail ... Remember when Obama said that terrorists/enemy combatants don't deserve Miranda Rights?
Weekly Standard

Obama quote from 2 months ago -

Now, do these folks deserve miranda rights? Do they deserve to be treated like a shoplifter down the block? Of course not."

And now we have Obama giving terrorists and enemy combatants this -

You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law. You have the right to speak to an attorney, and to have an attorney present during any questioning. If you cannot afford a lawyer, one will be provided for you at government expense.

Story Here
(and it's been on the TV news ... so this isn't the only source)

SO NOW THE AMERICAN TAXPAYER HAS TO PAY ATTORNEY FEES FOR ENEMY COMBATANTS WHO ARE PLOTTING TO DESTROY OUR COUNTRY .

more from The Weekly Standard


That's it. This guy is, as far as I'm concerned, an enemy agent.
Add it all up .... he's a freak'n covert enemy agent.
Then again ... he's not so 'covert' about it anymore, is he?


[edit on 6/11/2009 by FlyersFan]

Just another backpedal from Barry the Illusionist. So now Miranda applies to terrorists anywhere in the world? He is setting a disturbing precedent. I get the feeling he is pandering to his Muslim brethren.

I'm not so sure this is a bad thing.

Whenever i hear the term "Enemy combatant", do you know what the first thing that goes through my mind is? Terrorists? Nope. al quaeda? Nope.

ATS members. Thats what i think of first. Conspiracy theorists, anyone who speaks out against the administration or their actions.

Of course i do not believe that i, or any member of ATS is an enemy combatant, but that is what i think TPTB will come up with next.

So when they begin using the enemy combatant term to describe us...and they will, i'd like to think i had at least some rights until proven guilty.

We here people shouting all the time that suspected terrorists are detained, interrogated or worse without rights.

Innocent until proven guilty and all that.

If Obama's crime is to flip flop and give suspects rights now, i say thats a good thing, considering how many balls ups the intelligence agencies make these days.

Or am i reading this all wrong?

CX.

I think this is great! If we are going to be the shining example to the world, then we need to act as such. We need to extend a hand of humanity to everyone!

The big question is: will he now give those same rights to US Citizens!?!

There are so many loopholes through Patriot Act II that our own citizens are being denied these rights! Hopefully this is a whisper of the "change" he promised.

So I suppose that Bill of Rights - that list of inalienable rights that everybody has and that nobody can be granted or revoked only applies to American Citizens?

Same rights for everybody - innocent until proven guilty - I don't care what they're accused of. How about I accuse you of the same thing, wouldn't you want your rights?

reply to post by getreadyalready


I agree, as an outsider looking in, this is rather refreshing ... the rest of the world is rather tired of the heavy-handed tactics previously used.

America has not formerly declared war on anyone (I think) so surely different tactics should be used when dealing with detainees. I prefer the "innocent till proven guilty" thinking as opposed to "waterboard everyone with a suspicious accent" tactics.

So now enemy combatants/terrorists have more rights than the American citizen... because due to the Patriot Act American citizens can (and have) been arrested without due process.

Originally posted by jjkenobi
So now enemy combatants/terrorists have more rights than the American citizen... because due to the Patriot Act American citizens can (and have) been arrested without due process.

Easily fixed. Just criticize the government or join a movement. You Too can then be labeled a "terrorist" and viola!!! - Miranda Rights!

reply to post by jjkenobi


I'm not so sure either American, or international, citizens have all that many rights when you look at what the Patriot Act cites as a "terrorist."

Title VIII defines or redefines a number of terms. The terms "domestic terrorism" is already defined under 18 U.S.C. § 2331 and this was amended by section 802 of the Patriot Act to include mass destruction as well as assassination or kidnapping as a terrorist activity.[36] The definition encompasses activities that are "dangerous to human life that are a violation of the criminal laws of the United States or of any State" and are intended to "intimidate or coerce a civilian population", "influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion" or are undertaken "to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination, or kidnapping" while in the jurisdiction of the United States.[37]

en.wikipedia.org...

[edit on 11/6/2009 by Mirthful Me]

reply to post by MOFreemason


Well if the Patriot act lists those details of a terrorist, which an actual terrorist would DEFINITELY fit the description, how do they still get Miranda Rights?

reply to post by MOFreemason

threats made to kill or injure another person[45] breathing[83]

Well I think they wasted a lot of verbiage. It seems like these two cover just about everyone! It doesn't put any context around them, it just says "breathing!"

I guess if you are (1) breathing near a business owned by a (2) foreign entity, and you (3)threaten to poke someone in the eye, you have reached the 3-strike limit and will get life in prison!

Wait, you don't get 3-strikes, this is "terrorist" activity, so you just get detained and forgotten! No attorney, no visits, no judge or jury.

Originally posted by TXRabbit

Originally posted by jjkenobi
So now enemy combatants/terrorists have more rights than the American citizen... because due to the Patriot Act American citizens can (and have) been arrested without due process.

Easily fixed. Just criticize the government or join a movement. You Too can then be labeled a "terrorist" and viola!!! - Miranda Rights!

Exellent Point!

I don't plan on being in that position but if I am I will claim to be a Muslim extremist and ask the ACLU to protect me.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
I think this is great! If we are going to be the shining example to the world, then we need to act as such. We need to extend a hand of humanity to everyone!

The big question is: will he now give those same rights to US Citizens!?!

There are so many loopholes through Patriot Act II that our own citizens are being denied these rights! Hopefully this is a whisper of the "change" he promised.

So you support ripping up the UNITED STATES constitution? I mean what good is the document many died to protect when your so willing to let NON-AMERICANS have the same rights???????? Pathetic

reply to post by rcwj75

So you support ripping up the UNITED STATES constitution? I mean what good is the document many died to protect when your so willing to let NON-AMERICANS have the same rights???????? Pathetic

How does that make any sense? It elevates our constitution to a higher level by applying our ideals in all our foreign dealings! If we believe what is in our constitution, and what is in our Declaration of Independence, then our rights extend to all humans.

We go into places like Iraq to "liberate" the people and stand up for human rights, so how can this damage our constitution in any possible way?!

Granted, I am not for our modern state of warfare, where we lose our own troops, because of the extraordinary efforts we take to protect civilians. We get grilled in the press for the few instances of collateral damage, while they drag the bodies of our troops through the streets!

Still, if we go into somewhere with the moral highground as our motivation, and we seek to win the hearts and minds of the people, install democratic governments, and spread our lifestyle abroad, then I think upholding our Constitutional rights and ideals is a terrific step in the right direction!

I just did a little more research and digging to find the ROOT of why President Obama quietly ordered high-level detainees to be administered their Miranda Rights.

The FBI and Justice Department plan to significantly expand their role in global counter-terrorism operations, part of a U.S. policy shift that will replace a CIA-dominated system of clandestine detentions and interrogations with one built around transparent investigations and prosecutions.

Under the "global justice" initiative, which has been in the works for several months, FBI agents will have a central role in overseas counter-terrorism cases.

The "global justice" initiative starts out with the premise that virtually all suspects will end up in a U.S. or foreign court of law.

That will be the case whether a suspected terrorist is captured on the battlefields of Iraq and Afghanistan, in the Philippine jungle or in a mosque in Nigeria, said one senior U.S. counter-terrorism official with knowledge of the initiative.
www.latimes.com...

A lawyer who has worked on detainee issues for the U.S. government offers this rationale for the Obama administration’s approach. “If the US is mirandizing certain suspects in Afghanistan, they’re likely doing it to ensure that the treatment of the suspect and the collection of information is done in a manner that will ensure the suspect can be prosecuted in a US court at some point in the future.”
www.weeklystandard.com...

This actually HELPS the United States, not hurts us. By allowing the FBI, working as a global law enforcement entity administering Miranda Rights to suspects, it would better ensure they would be prosecuted in a U.S. criminal court.

And...given the fact that the definition of a "domestic terrorist" and "international terrorist," as according to the Patriot Act is quite, quite subjective....there are a great many in the United States that may be deemed a "high-level detainee" soon.

Sure wish you'd have your Miranda Rights then, eh?!!?

[edit on 11-6-2009 by MOFreemason]

The new and improved Miranda Rights given to terrorists - (satire) - written by thepeoplescube.com...

You have the right to remain silent or, if you want, shout Allahu Akbar in a maniacal voice. Anything you say will be used against the United States by left-wing radical groups and the mainstream media. You have the right to use an ACLU attorney in bringing a frivolous lawsuit against the American government. If you cannot afford an attorney, the American taxpayers whom you haven't yet killed, will pay for one. If you do not understand these rights, you will be given a chance to sue us later for your failure to do so.

This is not an issue flyer... its required by law.

IF we are going to deal with terrorism the way most of the rest of the world deals with it... as a criminal activity... then that means that they will be given due process and that requires a reading of the Miranda rights...

Honestly it is no big deal.

Now... unlike bush minor who didn't declare war on anybody, just waged it, Obama could sidestep the Miranda rights by declaring war...

The question is on whom? A shadowy bunch of criminals?

Due process under law is the way to go.

Stop making an mountain out of a mole hill.

[edit on 11-6-2009 by grover]

Originally posted by grover
This is not an issue flyer... its required by law.

Since when is it required by law to give enemy combatants in the war field 'the right to an attorney paid for by US tax payers' and 'the right to be silent'??

Never.

reply to post by FlyersFan


Enemy combatants implies a declaration of war... we haven't declared war on anybody.

And even then enemy combatants have legal rights.

reply to post by FlyersFan


1) You do realize that estimates have as few as 1 in 4 GITMO detainees actually linked to terrorist activity, right? So yes, they should get rights.

2)They are being held and tried under american laws. So shouldn't they be subject to american rights?

3)If you are really concerned about your tax dollars, perhaps you ought to focus on the few TRILLION dollars being siphoned by the black budget that goes directly towards covert and clandestine ops.