America Has Lost its Influence and Prestige Around the World.

Originally posted by jokei

Yeah, I think it is gonna be the fall of Rome again, Empires based on decadence are bound to fail.

True but unlike other Empires of the past the US is not going to shrivel up and disappear. When Rome and Great Britain's empires folded there was a shrinking do to the land that was "Taken" the US did not hold territory but rather had business and commerce connections and still does and it will continue. What will be different is from now on it will simply have to compete.

Originally posted by Dermo

Its not that bad not being top dog

There is part of the misconception.

The US wont lose it's status as "a world leader" we just wont be "THE world Leader" or "Top dog" anymore. Rather we will have to make room for a couple of others at the top, as you state a bipolar or even a tripolar world.

As the numbers start to break down it will end up being a tripolar world with the US, EU and China calling the shots. However if we are to believe the rumors of a North American Union then things would swing back into the North American hemispheres realm of dominance.

If they were to combine THE US, Canada and Mexico that would swing the balance back. The combined Raw material, manpower and advanced technology of the US and Canada mixed with other raw materials from Mexico and her large cheap labor force would make an amazing combination.


Somehow I don't doubt TPTB haven't figured that one out yet.
Stay tuned on the

North American Union and the Amero!

Originally posted by SLAYER69
If they were to combine THE US, Canada and Mexico that would swing the balance back. The combined Raw material, manpower and advanced technology of the US and Canada mixed with other raw materials from Mexico and her large cheap labor force would make an amazing combination.

I wouldn't wish for that without looking at the way the similar situation played out with the eastern EU states.. Cheap labour meant outsourcing to another section of the same economy.. but outsourcing is still outsourcing and has removed the jobs from the original member state or area.

At the same time, the laws in the richer member stares forbid cheap labour as part of workers rights so eastern europeans were removing massive amounts of money from wealthier areas of the EU and transferring it bact to the East.. while this sped up the development of the east exponentially, the western countries needed to rely more on social policies and welfare for those who had lost their jobs to Eastern workers and to outsourcing.

The funny thing about it is that many western europeans are now heading east in search of work and are beginning to implement their own social policies. Funny how that works lol.

Anyway.. If mexican immigration became legal in the US, a similar situation would most definitely arise IMO. Maybe it wouldn't hurt so much in a few years but right now it would kill the US and especially Canada.

reply to post by Dermo


I'm not sure exactly how familiar you are with the present situation here in the states. We already have a large Mexican population in the States. Both Legal and illegal. If the borders were to be removed then in theory there would be no need to for more migration north than we already have. Second the EU really would be hurting if it wasn't for Germany's contributions. I understand about the eastern states and labor. But in the end it will balance out in time for the Greater good of the whole.

reply to post by SLAYER69



Lol, yea, we are lucky Germany's economy started purring in the past few years or else the EURO and EU would be in serious trouble with this recession... especially since the UK is the US of europe during this disaster.. no offence

I know a bit about the US/Mexican thing.. Iv a few friends living in LA..

If these illegal immigrants are made legal, wont that mean they will have to be paid minimum wage? Is there much in the difference? If so, thats the extra amount that will be leaving the US in the direction of mexico at a much larger scale..

Just a thought.

reply to post by SLAYER69




If you keep innovative and creating new leading sectors such a nano- biotechnology [which i think will be] you should be fine as world power[hegemon]..The same thing happened in the 90's when people thought Japan was the new world economy/power..then you American youngsters showed up with the IT thing..
It has always been the hegemon which came with the new leading sectors, when the Dutch Republic of the Zeven Provinces ruled the world seas as a hegemon controlling spice trade, the British came a long with this textile thing and then they took over.Then came the industrial revolution which eventually ushered Germany and America as industrial new powers and so on...

...Immanuel Wallerstein sees 150 year long cycles matching the Spooner/Braudel logistic cycle, with the Dutch from 1618-1815 the British from 1815 to 1945 , and the United States after that...

Herman M. Schwartz " States versus Markets"

I still love you yanks [and your beautifull country] for who you are no matter what power you project..

*Looking at the flag of that picture*

But Shell remains our company!...











[edit on 4-6-2009 by Foppezao]

reply to post by Foppezao


The US will still be a world player.
We aint going anywhere.

I can't speak for all of us but...

I'm actually looking forward to the future personally. I have a feeling and it is reflected in many of the views I see everyday. The US is in the prosses of major change. For many "Change" is painful. People also tend to fear the unknown. It's all a case of perspective really...

Many around the world see this as the "END" of America.

Real Americans have a subtle underlying thread running through all of us no matter Race, Religion, or Social Economic background. Many Americans think OK Here we go again. While silently thinking to ourselves. [OH GOODY another Challenge] Americans traditionally love a Good Fight, Competition, ETC.

Like it or not and lay blame where they may the US is headed towards a Green economy. It will take many years and there will be lots of "Whining" Arguing and plenty of bent and tweaked noses over the issues but in the end most Americans want off the fossil fuel crutch we have been on since the beginning. That way we can stop hemorrhaging our wealth to the middle east and in the near future to other Central Asian countries.

That's step one!

Step two will be to stop spending more of our wealth on top of the line weapon systems. Yes we will still maintain the most advanced military on Earth but not in the numbers to control a global Empire. The money and research and our talent can then be focused on advanced research and development for even more exotic technologies than the world has ever seen


In other words

You aint seen nothing yet.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by Reading

 

I'll try to make it down the list of replies when I can.

Reading where exactly are you from?
I'm just curious.

The UK

reply to post by Reading


Hey thanks. I just wanted to fill out the locations in my mind to keep an accurate track of where some people are from. You know to fill in the blanks.

Thanks again.

reply to post by SLAYER69


Well we lost all that when we stop been the manufactures of the world, now we are the biggest debtor of the world, so when you are a beggar of the world you are at the mercy of their wallets.

reply to post by marg6043


I found this rather interesting worlds largest "Exporters"



Germany $ 1,530,000,000,000
China $ 1,465,000,000,000
United States $ 1,377,000,000,000

So why aren't we screaming about Germany?

Source

It's the way of things for all empires yeah, we will have influence but it won't be overwhelming like has been in times past.What concerns me is when it becomes clear to the hardcore believers that the 21st century won't be a New American Century they will take a "If we are gonna go we are gonna take them with us." mindset and that will lead to disaster.

reply to post by SLAYER69


That is interesting I thought that China was number one followed by Japan, but that is new twist I wasn't expecting.

Still we buy most of our imports from China and Asian nations.

Who is Germany selling too.

reply to post by marg6043


I'm not sure I'll look into it and edit this post in a bit with an answer
stay tuned.

reply to post by SLAYER69


Very well put together and informative thread my friend!

I hope this gets more attention, what truth embedded in well put syntax and understanding of the current situation.

IMHO the US is simply repeating history, it always happens. We are the new Rome and now we are declining to the point where like Rome, we will have to institute a new form of government to try an d survive. The real question in my mind is will we repeat the failure of Rome and simply become a past influence on new countries or will we raise above and break the cycle? I do not know but I think something major is going to happen soon. IMO I believe that a one world government will happen no later than 2020 and is nessicary, I think the US will be the driving force behind this. The EU is currently pushing it somewhat but I think the US will really pick up on this and push it in the months and years to come. I hope for the best none the less.

reply to post by SLAYER69

If they were to combine THE US, Canada and Mexico that would swing the balance back. The combined Raw material, manpower and advanced technology of the US and Canada mixed with other raw materials from Mexico and her large cheap labor force would make an amazing combination.


Somehow I don't doubt TPTB haven't figured that one out yet.
Stay tuned on the

North American Union and the Amero!

I think it is coming soon, very soon. You can already see signs of it coming IMO.

No more replies? Now that is a conspiracy.

OH Well off into the abyss

reply to post by jkrog08
I have not heard much on the NAU front in about year perhaps they gonna lie low for awhile.

reply to post by mike dangerously


I wrote a post a few months back about the NAU it didn't do so hot. I'll rehash the information and post a newer updated thread on that possible scenario.

Originally posted by mike dangerously
It's the way of things for all empires yeah, we will have influence but it won't be overwhelming like has been in times past.What concerns me is when it becomes clear to the hardcore believers that the 21st century won't be a New American Century they will take a "If we are gonna go we are gonna take them with us." mindset and that will lead to disaster.

An important role for a hegemon is to play the lender of last resort or market of last resort[where countries can export their product too]..The paradox is, China has become the lender of last resort but the US is still the biggest market of last resort [for that same China], both roles or a hegemon are important during time of crisis..
I don't think the US has this mentality of "dragging them with us into the abyss". Look at the "City of London" which has always been the driving force behind the British empire, that district is still one of the most important and still powerfull places on earth..But i am afraid though that while American economic and monetary power is decreasing they have to rely more on their military might to enforce their will..Saddam switching to the Euro's is an example...

[edit on 7-6-2009 by Foppezao]