Japan panel wants 'first strikes' against enemies

reply to post by SLAYER69


Prove me wrong, slayer.

It is a fact, and it is happening.

Btw, what is your problem - can't people discuss things without crap from other people?

Originally posted by sy.gunson
reply to post by xoxo stacie

 

Stacie, Stacie, Stracie... so what are you saying ?

You honestly think USA is about to declare war on Japan.

Have you not thought it through. This is a challenge to USA. Not to North Korea. This is Japan saying to USA if you don't defend us like you promised to do in the Treaty of San Francisco then maybe we will just do it ourselves ?

Have you not figured it out yet Stacie that Japan is in effect accusing USA of breaching the Treaty of San Francisco ?

I think the question is exactly what are YOUR intentions here?
I NEVER SAID THAT........... YOU JUST DID
They want the right to defend themselves and are "ASKING" for it for cripes sake.

Originally posted by dragonridr
reply to post by xoxo stacie

 

Your not exactly right japan does have a defense force and and airforce and a navy and are quite capable of defending themselves from anyone in asia with the exception of maybe china. what there talking about is changing there charter which after ww 2 there defense force isn't allowed to attack unless fired upon. Which means that n korea could technically land troops in japan and as long as they dont shoot japan would have to sit there.Granted this is an over dramatization because of course they would say they were under attack by the act of them coming to shore but you kinda get the idea.

I did not say they "didn't" have a defense force and are not capable of "defending" themselves. But like you said, and what I was trying to get across. They have to wait till someone "comes to them and fires"....MY POINT that keeps getting skewed ;I guess I am not explaing myself to well is late here.

Originally posted by spellbound
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

Prove me wrong, slayer.

It is a fact, and it is happening.

Btw, what is your problem - can't people discuss things without crap from other people?

NO WRONG!

You made an accusation now prove YOUR point. Otherwise it's considered unwarranted fear mongering.

The burden of proof is on you my friend since you are the accuser.

reply to post by silo13


basically at the end of WWII Japan surrendered to the U.S. and it was an unconditional surrender. Japan had to agree to every condition set forth in the agreement and they could not ask for any changes in the surrender. if they violated the surrender then the U.S. and Japan would be at war with one another.

Even to this day Japan has to live within the conditions of that surrender.

if Japan wants to do ANYTHING that is prohibited in that Surrender agreement they have to seek permission from the U.S. to amend the surrender. IF they fail to get permission and violate the surrender then the surrender is void and either a new surrender has to be signed or face the possibility of war.

reply to post by sy.gunson


Do you even know what the Treaty of San Francisco is?

This treaty served officially to end World War II, to end formally Japan's position as an imperial power, and to allocate compensation to Allied civilians and former prisoners of war who had suffered Japanese war crimes. This treaty made extensive use of the UN Charter and the Universal Declaration of Human Rights to enunciate the Allies' goals.

see the Treaty of San Francisco Is the U.N. Peace treaty ending WWII and dealt with japans emperor, compensation for war crimes and dealt with Japans overseas territories.

that's it. it did not limit Japan's military or anything else.

That was different treaty signed the same year called The Treaty of Mutual Cooperation and Security between the United States and Japan.

The U.N. treaty is none binding! the treaties that have teeth and that ARE BINDING are the peace treaty that was signed between the U.S. and Japan that was signed on the deck of the USS. Missouri and The Treaty of Mutual Cooperation and Security between the United States and Japan.

If anything Japan is saying they feel the U.S. is not holding up their end of The Treaty of Mutual Cooperation and Security between the United States and Japan.

Just thought you might want to get your facts straight.

Bottom line is Japan can want a first strike option all they want But there are to many treaties that would have to be changed to allow that to happen and to many fears in Asia and the U.S. that if the Japanese had the option of first strike they would use it to pick up where they left off during WWII.

While every country can defend themselves by any means they see fit it is better if the Japanese were attacked first before they took action because then there wouldn't be any question that the action Japan took weren't necessary.

Apologies Stacie.

I misunderstood you.

reply to post by SLAYER69


Just check the number of Japanese migrating to NZ.

Also, I am not trying to get into a fight, just to warn people.

reply to post by spellbound


I dont need to they practically own Hawaii
So what? They pay taxes don't they?
Sounds like paranoia to me.

Originally posted by spellbound
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

Prove me wrong, slayer.

It is a fact, and it is happening.

Btw, what is your problem - can't people discuss things without crap from other people?

Not when its something stupid like Japan is going to take over the pacific what planet do you live on?Lets see piss off there number one trading partner United States number 3 Australia and take on China as well because you know china would be the first to put the brakes on Japan because china sees that area as there back yard. Wow guy please tell me your joking if not pay more attention to international politics and stop reading old newspapers from world war 2.

Originally posted by dragonridr

I can guarantee you it would not be the United States invading Did you know Japan and South Korea have a defense pact? if one or the other goes to war there is excellent odds they would both attack. Both hate North Korea.And as for china North Korea is a thorn in there side they backed them just to bloody the nose of the Americans,And have been trying to pull away ever since.If china truly cared about them they wouldn't be testing missiles China would have gave them missiles.Most new military hardware is purchased through Iran because Russia and China wont sell to them anymore been that way for at least a decade.

Oh I'm not saying the US will invade...but the principle holds. You don't want a conquering army invading your neighbor. China will take offense and 'liberate' North Korea.
By the way, it would be hard for the US to explain that they have nothing to do with a South-Korean/Japanese invasion of North Korea when both countries are protected by US troops.

China stays by Kim Yong Il's side as long as there are US and UN-troops in South Korea. I think the Chinese are wondering why they ever left. They could have forced NK to play nice.

And about the Chinese not supplying rockets...would you supply rockets to a madman when your within range of those rockets?

OK, watch China and see what happens.

That is all I am saying.

ok this is getting out of hand. no one needs to be bombing anyone for any reason. better idea- lets start getting rid of the nukes, bio and chem weapons, all countries participate 20% at a time. all countries need new leaders and governments that arent controlled by the shadows and elites, once that happens we actually CAN feed everyone and clothe EVERYONE and ditch ALL nukes ect ect. NK is desperate, not to mention most nations that are looking for nukes are doing so to protect themselves from the usa, or use it as a bargaining chip. i dont want another country getting the ol "first strike" idea in their heads its just a bad idea thats gonna end up killing hundreds of thousands.

reply to post by silo13


So, Japan knows exactly how to jumpstart their stagnating economy, huh?

Has this anything to do with the bad state of the japanese economy, lol, at the moment.

Just another excuse for thugs to take out people you do not like.

reply to post by paradox headache


So desperate they can afford nukes and missiles ?

Oh okay so you go and persuade Mr Kim Il-Jong to scrap all his nukes and missiles and then you will have my full and undivided attention.

To be honest I hope nothing comes out of it although I think NK knows exaclty what it is doing, enraging the west and knowing that they will do nothing. Japan is caught between a rock and a hard place, Russia and China would jump at the chance to intervene in the event of action by America or Japan, the middle east is up in flames, I agree with previous posters this does look like it did in 1939.

I agree with you On the Level

I don't want to see anything come of this either and in someways it's a stalemate anyway because without China using it's muscle nobody can stop NK

NK however does need stopping because it is deliberately proliferating nukes and ICBMs.

Originally posted by sy.gunson
reply to post by NathanNewZealand

 

BOMB North Korea, assassinate Robert Mugabe, invade Sudan and crush the genocide, execute every suspected terrorist, murderer, rapist and here's a message for anyONE who disagrees: YOU are the reason why the world is becoming the way it is.

Nathan mate... You're one scary dude. I thought they only let you out on weekends :?)





[edit on 26-5-2009 by sy.gunson]

Actually Nathan has made the most logical comment i have heard in this thread.
The fact is most people on ATS and in the western world are spineless left wing PC do gooders.

EDIT: To all the people who think(Americans) N Korea is Chinas "guard dog", i suggest you educate your selves. China hates N Korea just as much as any other country...

EDIT2: Also the people who think America would go to war with Japan, if the treaty from WW2 is broken should really get educated, its obvious there are many people in this thread who live in "cloud cookoo land"

[edit on 26-5-2009 by SKUNK2]

reply to post by SKUNK2

To all the people who think(Americans) N Korea is Chinas "guard dog", i suggest you educate your selves. China hates N Korea just as much as any other country...

If you've an opinion - well join the club.

If you've FACTS to back up your opinion I'm sure there are a number of people who'd like to know what they are and where to find them.

Thanks.