20 Reasons to Abandon Christianity

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


I get it !!! Your so busy judging others with your face buried in books, you don't have time to look around you and see the beauty and miracles that surround you every day.

Originally posted by jon1
It just reads like a load of rubbish written by someone who has never known christ and is out to riddicule the christian faith.

You must really find something else to do with your time rather than try to bash christianity. Its been around a long time and will be long after you are gone.

You've met Christ

If you'd met him I'm sure he'd have explained that his actual name is Yeshua, not Jesus (and not Christ, Christ is a title meaning Anointed One), and that what's in the 4 surviving Gospels was written long after his life and filtered by the early Catholics under Constantine.

The OP has some good points but most Christians are just ordinary good people, its those in charge of the religion, tele-evangelists and rich preachers (and those who used to be in charge of it, the Romans and Catholics with their wonderful genocides/forced conversions/crusades/inquisitions) who are the ones to watch out for...

The way I see it religion and belief is too necessary to the human psyche to just abandon all at once. Hundreds of years of programming have to be cleansed first...

Originally posted by Vasilis Azoth

Originally posted by Jmurman
You're delusional, and obviously have something against Christianity...so be it.

I am a Christian am offended by your post...however you have the right to say what you want, as do I.

What offended you?

Was it because you recognized that those 20 points are basically true?

Vas

More likely they found it offensive due to the vindictiveness of the OP's Post, which attacks a deeply held Faith, and Religion, through an obvious lack of understanding, which is brought about due to hatred and complete disdain.

If you do not agree with a Religion, then do not practice it, but do not preach against it either. Preaching against something which you do not understand, only presents ignorance, and railing against a set Religion is tantamount to spiteful and hate-filled speech.

Originally posted by jon1
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

And your problem my friend is that you read to much.
I know that Jesus is real, not through faith alone but by what he has done in my life, through all the answered prayers and i'm not talking about trivial ones either.
i'm talking about using the gifts of the spirit given to us by God as and when needed.

There are so many things that you don't know about or could even comprehend happening in Gods kingdome. I't a shame you have chosen the path that you have because you are missing out on so much.
There's a whole different world out there that you don't know about, but that is your choice and because you don't know that you will try, but will be unsuccesful in your little ploy to bring people to your way of thinking.

And I could and would say the same thing to you my friend. There is so much you are missing out on in the broader universe and the inherent wisdom in all human beings like the power to manifest things into reality that has been stolen from you because you can only tap into that through a complex set of beliefs open to manipulation and exploitation.

You like so many people have faith in the imagined breathed to life through shared acceptance that creates a validation...but no faith in yourself to accept that your own inherent powers are your sole responsibility that you prefer to remain unnacountable for by imagining they flow from some mythical pagan entity instead of you.

The mysteries of the universe are endless the bible and your religion is a closed book, fraught with closed circular logic, designed to defeat you from ever recognizing not only your true potential but even who you truly are.

Believe me I have a lot more empathy for you and cause for it, than you could possibly understand based on your current belief system and philospophes.

Originally posted by sickofitall2012
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

I get it !!! Your so busy judging others with your face buried in books, you don't have time to look around you and see the beauty and miracles that surround you every day.

You funny! I live in Miami surrounded by azure waters, green tropical palms, beautiful breezes, sights and sounds.

They didn't dump me here off a Gray Hound because I couldn't afford the fare somewhere else my friend.

In fact there is a legal nude beach less than a mile from my house. I see beauty, trust me!

Don't mistake the abuses of organized religion to be the defining criteria of Christianity.

The Devil did his best work while hiding behind the Cross in organized religion. There never would have been a Catholic Church, except for a desire by evil to control others, and then maintain that control by perpetuating ignorance. Same thing for Islam. Evil devices. How do you know?

According to the Word, by their works.

If I were to condense down the contents of the Old Testament to one word, it would be, "obedience."

The New Testament? "Grace" through emulation.

And no one, but no one on earth, can come between a person and his God. No matter what they say, no matter how hard they try to place themselves in the chain of command.

How do you know?

By THEIR works.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


my screen name reflects how sick I am of humans believing how superior they are. We are only here because GOD allows us to be.

Originally posted by sickofitall2012
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

my screen name reflects how sick I am of humans believing how superior they are. We are only here because GOD allows us to be.

Look my friend you have pretty much proved every point I have made about Christians not tollerating not being tollerated.

You have accused me of being abused as a child, warped and overly judgemental, blind and a whole host of other unseemly things to validate your own perspectives because you refuse to tolerate other people who have their own oppinion based on valid things to them...

You put me on your respected foe list and you have pretty much just made your posts about personal attacks and baiting others which is why I will now be putting you on ignore.

Have a nice life and good luck waiting for that trumpet to sound!

Here's my opinion on the whole matter. I agree that Christianity and all other organized religions have their faults. I don't really understand blind faith, but who am I to say it's bad.

Ultimately, we don't know the "truth" one way or another. So anybody who claims to "know" and faults others is only doing a disservice to themselves and those around them. I feel this is where so much conflict arises. People think they know, so they in turn judge those who have different beliefs. This applies to both believers and non-believers.

When will we learn to accept our own fallibilities and admit that we just don't know? Can we not accept someone having different beliefs? Everybody has different life experiences that justify why they think the way they do. Can you say they're stupid because they don't see the world from the same vantage point as you? I suppose you can, but I think making such a claim is pretentious and limits the mind from experiencing new possibilities.

I encourage discussing topics, but I try to avoid claiming that my perspective is any better than someone else's.

Good points Doope.

I'll admit iv'e read only about half of this thread, but its all i need to make the very important point that either side is trying to make.

Taking shots at God and jesus lowers christianities solace that they feel while pondering the ideas of these beings.

Defending christianity and its beliefs only furthers the inevitable breakdown of an institution that has indeed been a source of misery for humanity for a long time. Not to mention holding back scientific progress, and possibly raising the rate of crime a generation later through restricting abortion (read freakonomics if you dont get that)

The point is. You don't need any religion to feel a connection with the unity of existance that many label "god". That's a big problem with religion is that people have a strong longing and need to feel as if they are part of the over-all oneness of the universe again. Christianity exploits that by saying god has rules that you must obey if you want to become part of that oness again and its cruel.

Let's not even mention that it can be proven in many ways that Jesus is nothing but a solar diety and can be associated to over a dozen similar ressurected saviors. Even if you wanted to believe that jesus was indeed a real person it becomes tedious when you realize that the evidence against it, and the lack of secular history there-of is staggering.

-THE POINT-
You don't need to create a group or institution to support your beliefs, If the god you believe in exists, everyone belongs to the same group, and creating another group is basically mocking him.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Gross!!! I would not want to see naked sweaty people with sand up places I'd rather not mention.
I'm so glad you see nature, but please, I'm not trying to convert you or anything, I just want you to feel that immense love in your heart, so just do me a favor and look at nature and the universe, I mean really look long and hard. Look deeply into an animals eyes and see the innocence ,purity, and unconditional love.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


I spent 47 years exploring life before i met God and believe me, life is so much more rewarding now.
I could give many testemonies to how God has changed peoples live's for the better and through prayer i have seen many miracles happen. these i know are not from the power within me, but from the power of God.
I would love to explain why i know that but this is not the place to do it.
But, each to our own i suppose.

Originally posted by dooper
Don't mistake the abuses of organized religion to be the defining criteria of Christianity.

The very text upon which the organised religion of Christianity is based , is littered with abhorrent acts . It set a rather nasty set of precedences for any organisation to follow.



[edit on 1-5-2009 by UmbraSumus]

If you want to feel the oneness an love of it all, meditate, it'll get you alot closer to the oneness than religion.

Originally posted by dooper
Don't mistake the abuses of organized religion to be the defining criteria of Christianity.

The Devil did his best work while hiding behind the Cross in organized religion. There never would have been a Catholic Church, except for a desire by evil to control others, and then maintain that control by perpetuating ignorance. Same thing for Islam. Evil devices. How do you know?

According to the Word, by their works.

If I were to condense down the contents of the Old Testament to one word, it would be, "obedience."

The New Testament? "Grace" through emulation.

And no one, but no one on earth, can come between a person and his God. No matter what they say, no matter how hard they try to place themselves in the chain of command.

How do you know?

By THEIR works.

Lol the devil did it!

HAhahahahaha, oh man what a good laugh I got from this post and this coming from a self-ascribed Christian Mystic.

I will no attempt to tear apart the 20 reasons with the utmost of pleasure.

1. Christianity is based on fear. HAhahah. I had more fear before I was a Christian. Now I have spiritual enlightenment and feel free as a bird. Fear comes from the mind and I have a god amount of thought/mind control to not allow such a thing into my being.

2. Christianity preys on the innocent. Who is innocent of what? Such a relative statement. IF there is innocence then I think new born babies and children are the closest to such a state.

3. Christianity is based on dishonesty. Actual the spiritual practice of no longer lying and being as honest and truthful as possible is one of the states all Christians thrive for, very few ever reach.

4. Christianity is extremely egocentric. Actually the deeper spiritual experiences in Xtianity have to do with Ego death and selflessness. Complete ego death leads to experiencing the omni-presence of God. Of course very few Christians have this.

5. Christianity breeds arrogance, a chosen-people mentality. See number 4 explanation. The difference in Xtians vs. Non-Xtians is the experience of God itself. No experience vs. experience. There is no difference in the two except for what is being experienced. No one is better than anyone else and the Xtian is supposed to practice complete and utter humbleness and humility making themselves and seeing themselves lower and smaller than anyone/anything else.

6. Christianity breeds authoritarianism. The correct form of Breeding is supposed to be of Love. You are now discussing religion, not the true inner Christianity. The only authority I can see would be in the case of a person Spiritually enlightened vs. not. Obviously the enlightened one will have a fuller angle/perspective from which to speak from having experienced both sides of the coin, vs. only 1 side.

7. Christianity is cruel. No, it teaches Love, ego death, peace, transcendence. You, my friend, are speaking of religion(something that invades a pure spiritual path and pollutes it)

8. Christianity is anti-intellectual, anti-scientific. After Spiritual enlightenment is when I got deeply into quantum mechanics. AT the same time, experiencing God is beyond the intellect. The mind is limited, God is not. You can't see the unlimited using a limited tool. Plus science just proves how intelligently everything is designed.

9. Christianity has a morbid, unhealthy preoccupation with sex. No, it simply says everything in moderation and out of Love. I've been in love with women and had one night stands. I promise you that the sex from being in love with the person and our hearts becoming one is MUCH MUCH better than a late night quickie. Plus over doing anything loses its beauty.

10. Christianity produces sexual misery. Actually it teaches you how to transcend lust, the mind, vices, and other things. misperception my friend.

11. Christianity has an exceedingly narrow, legalistic view of morality. Once you experience spiritual enlightenment, you then have the ability to reach a state of complete control over all aspects of yourself. That is reaching the ultimate moral ideal that exists and can be reached. Everything else is relative, but what I speak of is truth.

12. ...encourages acceptance of real evils while focusing on imaginary evils. You lost me on this one. One day you too will see that in the afterlife, or scientifically speaking in the next dimension, there is a vast area of souls and other spiritual beings and there is also battles fought the way they are here. Last laugh at death.

13. Christianity depreciates the natural world. Xtianity teaches that we have to take care of mother earth, appreciate her, and that God is visible through creation.

14. Christianity models hierarchical, authoritarian organization. No, thats religion. The only authority over us is God and God loves us. Simple. Just like when you have a child you will be their authority for a while, and when they get older and grow into adulthood, they will understand and love you and you won't have to be authoirty anymore because they will do right then. Most kids.

15. Christianity sanctions slavery. No, it was observing slavery in its day and commenting on it. Love your neighbhor as yourself.

16. Christianity is misogynistic. Teaches a soul is sexless. Body and sexes are earthly forms. we are here for a blink of an eye. Don't get used to it.

17. Christianity is homophobic. Jesus never commented on this and this is still up in the air. Personally I dont know. Do we see this in nature. Do we have hermaphrodites that are born in the real world. God loves everyone.

18. The Bible is not a reliable guide to Christ's teachings. There is enough there to guide you into spiritual enlightenment. If you want to go further in your direct experiences then you can go further into the teachngs of the desert fathers, christian mystics, and perhaps even some gnostic writings.

19. The Bible is riddled with contradictions. Everything is if thats what your looking for. But in God there are no contradictions. Why dont you follow that path according to what Jesus says then you will have enlightenment instead of hanging up your logic/reason on a contradiction. I was going to go into a park the other day and enjoy the sun. But because there were so many other parks I can go to, I decided just to stay home because I couldn't decide.

20. Christianity borrowed its central myths and ceremonies from other ancient religions. Im guessing you saw zeitgeist, which borrows its concepts from a book that was completely discredited by the majority of serious scholars. On the other hand there are commonalities in all of the worlds spiritual paths, i.e. God, soul, us finding our way to God, changes, morals, Love, etc.

I think you have true Christianity mixed up with corrupted religion.

Is a gun good, bad, or neutral? When a robber has it? When a cop has it? When a 2 year old is playing with it unattended? When its sitting there behind a store shelf collecting dust.

Originally posted by jon1
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

I spent 47 years exploring life before i met God and believe me, life is so much more rewarding now.
I could give many testemonies to how God has changed peoples live's for the better and through prayer i have seen many miracles happen. these i know are not from the power within me, but from the power of God.
I would love to explain why i know that but this is not the place to do it.
But, each to our own i suppose.

Well, my friend let me put it to you this way, amongst my many interests in music. I play the drums, and I play Rock music. I don't like Country music. It hurts my ears!

I know there are a lot of people who like Country music, it doesn't offend my that they like it, it just offends me listening to it. I don't like the standard chord progressions the almost constant 2-4 timing, and well a lot of the lyrics in it might be speaking to some one's life but they aren't speaking to mine.

Now I know there are people who like both Rock and Country. I know this because a lot of the people who will come and watch and listen to my band perform will say, we love the rock you play, can you play some country too?

When we tell them no and they ask why, and they hear that is just me and not the rest of the band that is opposed to playing it then inevitibly I will get the old "let me tell you about today's country" or "You know it's very popular" or "You guys could get a lot more bookings" or "I know you are more than talented enough to play it".

Still puts me to sleep! Don't care, don't like it. Now all of a sudden I am a bad person! How could you really not like it, what would be the harm in playing one or two songs?

I know at this point it's not about that they are dying to hear some country music in a Rock Club...I know it's now about insecurity and a need for validation, that in the back of their mind that some perception has formed that I think they are subhuman because they like Country Music. I don't of course think they are subhuman just someone with particular and peculiar tastes. But in their mind it becomes a battle of good against evil, right against wrong, because they genuinely like it and they just don't understand why I won't like it too for their benefit.

They don't get that they are in a Rock Club, listening to a Rock Band and were promised no Country Music, and paid for no Country Music, they just get that someone doesn't like what they like, therefore...they must not be liked...and because they are so darn likeable and in their mind it is so darn great some evil agenda must be afoot.

Same thing is at play here. I can explain to people what I don't like about Country Music, it doesn't insult me if someone explains to me what they don't like about Rock Music. Not everyone was born to Rock!

I was.

Now for the record...no pun intended what I don't like about Christianity is this very same process...you can't tell Christians you don't like it and why...and actually speak to the things you don't like about it.

Invariably you are going to get...oh your evil...oh your Muslim...oh your Anti-Semetic...oh you were abused as a child...oh your dangerous...or your just a creep...etc., etc.,

In my original post I put very clearly and very succinctly what I didn't like most about Christianity.

No one has tried to defend that one particular assertion, or debate it's merritts, what they have tried to do is debate my merritts, my motivation, when I already have made that quite clear.

Just like with Country Music it isn't about what appeal does it have to me, it becomes about what appeal it has to them.

Just like with Country Music it's never about I have a right to not like it, it's always there has to be something wrong with me because I don't like it.

Despite the 'good' you get out of it, sometimes the price of something good is too high...kind of like playing a country bar all night for a big fat paycheck...the money is nice but the exercise in getting it is just too tedious and unpleasant, and you know on a even deeper level, some genuine Country band would love to have that paycheck, and some genuine Country fan would rather have an authentic Country band than a psuedo one. So yeah that paycheck might be nice but who suffers for it.

A lot of people suffer because of how Christianity has been imposed on them.

Half the threads I read that have to do with Swine Flu are "It's the Anti-Christ behind it".

Sure glad the Center for Disease Control and molecular biologists don't take that view.

If you like Country Music, if you like Christianity, if you like Lima Beans well great, but it is morally wrong to insist everyone else like them too, to the point of imposition, and terribly arrogant to assume that just because you have found validation and happiness in it that it should or could legitimately do the same for everyone to the point that if you can't impose it on them, they are now a bad and dangerous person...

That my friend is why I do think Country Music...oops I mean Christianity is dangerous.

Please don't make me get in to what I think about Rap Music!

"18. The Bible is not a reliable guide to Christ's teachings "

Since one of the defiinitions of 'Christ" is 'the annointed one", doesn't #18 acknowledge the existence of a "Christ"? Just a thought.

One post mentioned an aversion to Christians "preaching" to everyone and said that justifies the attack on Christianity. I have been on this Earth for 45 years and have never been preached to, without first walking into a Church, where I knew such activity would occur.

Another, popular, argument calls for the removal of "In God We Trust" from US currency. Ever heard of checks, debit cards, credit cards, automatic bankdraft, etc.? Heck, one company advertises you can put whatever you want on their card. Maybe you should have one printed with "In Nothing I Trust".

While I will not discuss my personal beliefs, here, I will say that I totally respect the beliefs and non-beliefs of others. I will never try to convince anyone to follow my spiritual path and I will never understand the anger non-Christians display toward Christians. Non-believers and/or atheists verbally attacking Christians is akin to the disdain of Islam for all other religions.

It is interesting that I don't see an abundance of threads lambasting Islam.

[edit on 1-5-2009 by WTFover]

This is just what I believe, and have experienced.

Jesus message was about being born again, into this higher consciousness that is in Him. Jesus warned against the beliefs of religion. Jesus says about His church in these times: "You make me sick", (religion). Jesus spoke of a journey of death of self, (human nature, and conditioning), to become alive in His realm of higher consciousness and love. To bring things into manifestation through this higher consciousness, through Jesus, that will be used for what is right and good.

Our beliefs in life, our conditioning, is for people to believe that human nature, and our closed beliefs is all that there is. There is a higher awareness within our consciousness that so many have become blind to, and never knew existed, through those closed beliefs in being conditioned in life with its "self", which is our pains, fears, depression, pride, hate, (human nature). All these things keep us locked in thinking there is nothing that can be truly experienced in this higher consciousness, realm.

Jesus message was the death of this self. He says:"you are in this world, but not of it".

Religion put God in a box, so to say.

Many religious organizations have a lot to answer to for this belief that God is just words, and not a very spiritual life of a very much higher consciousness, and a very real relationship with Jesus, to know a love and peace beyond human comprehension.

The difference between a true Christian and a non-Christian whom knows of a higher awareness, is this:

With many non-Christians whom know of this higher consciousness, they may say its about self awareness. He says Christ awareness. Why is this important?

Because evil is also within that realm, and that evil imitates the things of God, to deceive you. There are many scary things that share that realm, and sometimes imitate even love.

Jesus said: The kingdom of God is within you. This is the higher consciousness we have become blind to. This is the VERY REAL relationship He offers through this higher consciousness, (being born again of the spirit), and it is very real. Its nothing to do with religion at all.

Jesus is the most incredible higher consciousness you can ever experience.

Anyway, that's what I have experienced!

Alright, I will tell you this:

Jesus Christ aka Yeshua aka Yohd He Vah Heh aka Messiah aka Elohim aka God or whatever one wants to call Him; once in human form, preaches love.

Alright, to the non-believer. Your "20 reasons to Abandon Christianity"
points out points you have problems with with the religion. One thing though, you are right there are certain things in the Bible that don't come too clearly or have a bit of "contradictions", but how in any way is this supposed to make one abandon Christianity? You just plain have a problem with it. Now I understand you disagree with God and the sort and it is the job of a Christian to spread the "Word of God", but I fail to see what is wrong with a person preaching about God? Absolutely nothing. How does "He loves us" offend anyone? It is simple. It shouldn't. Some just don't believe in God and feel the need to say that as well which isn't bad. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Realize that the people that are in fact Christians are actually yes, human. That means they have feelings just the same as you and get fired up sometimes. Is anyone perfect? Nope. Some people believe in God, some don't, but it is a Christians obligation to God to let everyone know He is alive. If you disagree, fine. Why flip out? If you believe there isn't a God and if He is indeed not real, then why bother flaming Him? Because other people believe and have faith in Him? I would call you rude.