IIG's investigation of the Billy Meier HOAX

I think we've all had enough of the Meier HOAX... This thread is turning into yet another failed attempt at disproving facts (IIG's research and DEBUNKING) with junk science, hearsay and B.S.

Enough...

Thread closed and headed for the trash bin where it belongs..

Springer...







Updated...

The thread contains valuable information and has been restored for public view, with title modification and closed status.




[edit on 5-6-2009 by Springer]

This truly is an interesting subject,
I have spent many many hours investigating this case.

At first, I thought the case was a joke, then for the longest time, I didn't know if it was real or the greatest hoax in history. After seeing IIG's investigation I once again thought it was the greatest hoax in history. Now, I am not sure again. IIG did a great job on their investigation compared to other people like Karl Koff or whatever his name is, but there are still many unanswered questions.
I agree that some information of his looks like disinformation, the fact that he states that he is a reincarnation of jesus may be a bit stretched for me. It is very possible that he could be working for the CIA, or brainwashed by the CIA and a disinformation project, or even that the Pleadians could be lying to him and really be the Befath for example, to you Meier investigators. Evidence to bash that is though that Meier always is anti NWO and anti CIA. Although he does support the 500 million person theory, even though in my thoughts, that theory does make sense. To those who disagree, you are wrong. We all deserve a proper standard of living, nobody on this earth should be starving, lacking food, shelter, water, clothes, or the ability to live comfortably to some respect.

Here are a couple of questions for people who want to debunk him.

a) how come his photos are so much better than IIG's photo's?? He does have only one arm right?

b) how did he predict 9/11, the world trade centers collapsing, george bush becoming president, and much more?? I even remembering him saying that Obama would become president, months before he won the election on contact notes?

c) How did Meier get photos of space shuttle outside our atmosphere which was USA craft which was not known to be in space until later? How did he get such good photos of these?

I am still a skeptic searching for the truth.

What do you people think of "creation" opposed to "religion"

wow enjoyed reading each members post[except few]..may be this is what plejaren want to happen....if no evidence

there wub be no discussions, no fun.....



WEDDINGCAKE[headache] UFO


if you observe the front side edge of the craft facing the camera its blurry,and then the middle protuberances are less

blurry and then follow the edge of the craft going to the back of the craft is sharp or in focus[as the van too]....

check this out too

www.theyfly.com...

-----------------------------------------------------

METAL SAMPLES:


plejaren ET'S gave meier 3 different kinds of metal samples of 7 different stages they use to make their spacecraft.
we have sample states 3,4,5.

stage 3 : mostly lead with impurities.

stage 4 : nearly equal parts of silver,copper and lead

stage 5 : silver,copper,nickel,gold,magnesium and other trace elements.

IN "Contact - An Investigation Into the Extraterrestrial Experiences of Eduard Billy Meier (1978) UFO"



at 32:15[1:38:02] preliminary tests of metals were done in Swiss metallurgical laboratory Eidgenossische Materialprufungs und Versuchsanstalt in Zurich.
at 32:15 we see the graph of the test showing copper and silver spikes......the readings on the machine wud be that of "stage 4" so it reads copper,silver....


32:57[out of 1:38:02] we see the narrator says "later analysis of OTHER fragments also reveal small amounts of

THULIUM"

other fragments are also analysed and they found Rhenium,Thulium[rare earth element]....


you can find more data in the
contact 45 ,feb 26,1976

Please not this rubbish again

Please not this rubbish again

in iigwest website....regarding damage to ozone layer

www.iigwest.com...


[1]

New York Times, 6 September 1974 [NYT1]
"The potential depletion of the ozone layer by nuclear explosions is a new, accidental discovery that arms control

officials believe adds an awesome element to the destructive effects of a nuclear war."

answer :

i agree the information that bromine gas and other gases cause damage to ozone layer and cause holes to develop was published in 1974.

plejaren didnot say that they knew about this before the earth scientists did.They did say that the earth scientists,experts in the field already do know about this.....

read here in 7 th contact,25 February 1975.....

"Recent researchers and scientists of different nations have progressed so far in their cognitions,that THEY HAVE RECOGNISED the destructive work of different chemicals and especially the bromine onthe ozone belt,and want to
evalute this in their irresponsible delusion for might for war-technical purposes.THEY HAVE ALREADY invented basic ideas for building missile bodies,whose destructive and death bringing substances wil be bromides."

[2] also it was mentioned

"I find it suspicious that the newspaper article[New York Times, 28 February 1975] and Meier's Contact Notes[7th Contact, 25 February 1975] both mention Dr. Michael McElroy. Why would Semjase encourage Meier to report the information to a person who already knew it? I have to wonder if Meier was attempting to make it appear that he had told McElroy about the danger who had in turn told the newspapers...."

answer:

there is nothing suspicious here...

in all the articles mentioned

New York Times, 17 October 1974 [NYT2]
Science, 25 October 1974 [Sci1] and
including Dr. Michael McElroy,New York Times, 28 February 1975 [NYT3]

it was never mentioned that the "hole in the ozone layer moves"..may be this is the reason why semjase encouraged meier to report to Dr. Michael McElroy.

read here in 7 th contact,25 February 1975.....

"such a hole is only able to close itself again,which process may take hundreds of years,if no further destructive

substances invade.An additional factor that comes into effect is that the ozone layer has a CERTAIN MOVEMENT &

IS WANDERING.A hole would not only destroy a well defined region,but it wander nearly uncontrollably and also

destroy other regions.This is the fact which is NOT YET KNOWN to the scientists."

i think the hole will also move along with the earth as the earth spins because the atmosphere is pulled by the earth's

gravity and is tightly held to the surface.and definitely be considered to spin in synchronisation with the earth..

looks like we have to concentrate on the pulication of information regarding the "movements & fluctuations of ozone hole" in any newspaper before 25 febraury,1975.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/0fa656451e54.jpg[/atsimg]


[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/a38bcb09feff.jpg[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/15dced13b67d.jpg[/atsimg]

regarding the optical anamolies about the wedding cake[headache] ufo....
here is the excerpt from pp. 24, 26 of Stevens' Message from the Pleiades, vol. 1:

"The lower side of the disc seemed to vibrate as though it were alive. It looked like little waves running continuously in and through the underside of the ship, by which the skin appeared damaged and old, nearly like a washing board. These waves seemed to be irregular and kind of inconsistent, but very peculiar and of energetic character. Solid matter seemed to dissolve in the radiation of these waves. The truck looked like it was suddenly enveloped in heat-waves. I could not see it clearly, and besides this it seemed much farther away than the UFO which hovered only 50 meters behind it in the air. Still it seemed like the object was in the foreground and the truck much more behind it, which in fact was not the case."

also somewhere quetzal mentioned that the wcufo emits a radiation waves upto around 400-500 metres length...as we are completely ignorant about the mechanics and the workings of the crafts properties and its optical effects....
Most of the video taken of this ship was destroyed by the radiation effects of the craft itself. Billy claimed to have finally built a lead casing around the camera (a SABA brand video camera) to shield it from the magnetic radiation in order to film this.
so from in the above 3 pics,we can assume that the anamolies are occured due to the radiation effect causing light to bend and diffract....


[edit on 25-10-2009 by mahigitam]

IIGWEST claimed MARCEL VOGEL didnot do spectral analysis to find the elemental composition of the metal specimen.

BUT THEY ARE ABSOLUTELY WRONG...


here below is the The Preliminary Investigation Report
by Wendelle Stevens,copyrighted 1982,1981,1980,1979,1978.
page 432....
only requirement necessary is for the observer to have "eyes"...

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/files/7b74507a8ec099e1.jpg[/atsimg]

my request to IIGWEST is to do a more thorough investigation rather than careless one.
we have to ask ourself,there is no proof of fakery but we have many many ideas,opinions,assumptions of how he did it....if this case is true,then the persons who stood by the case as a hoax will have to feel guilty for the rest of their lives...The man billy meier forget about case being a hoax or true..but what hes trying to do is to bring true peace to earth and the only persons in the middle of peace and us humans is irrational people....


Fear not what is not real,never was and never will be.What is real,always was and cannot be destroyed.

"These are the links to Jim Dilettoso saying that the Wedding Cake UFO is a fake and that he was unaware that Michael

Horn was still using his 20+ year old analysis and presenting it as though it was recently done:
www.theparacast.com...
media.podcastingmanager.com... "

i listened to both of them....

" Jim Dilettoso saying that the Wedding Cake UFO is a fake "

Jim actually said there are two ways

1-subjective brain-mind-eye thing

2-Data model,which i havent done

that clearly says that he has not done any data processing of WCUFO ships and hes just letting out his opinion

according to wat he has seen & analysed many other UFO pics in his life(most of them are fake and are not at this

close distance from the camera to make a clearcut judgement)...

SO this clealry is not a healthy skepticsm sir...taking opinions rather than facts...

----------------------------------
IN that audio at 1:40:00 and 2:00:00,jim says he never said that those crafts are of paranormal nature...

i agree with him he never said that those were of EXTRATERRESTRIAL in nature,what he said was there was no evidence of

hoax...

i didnt find micheal horn saying anywhere that jim dilettoso anlaysed and found that these were of EXTRATERRESTRIAL

SPACECRAFTS..

--------------------------------
At 1:46:00

JIm says that the equipment he used at that time was almost same as the equipments used in present day

technology[MEDIA CYBERNETICS]..u will hear him say "fourier transforms are fourier transforms,histograms are

histograms".
he concludes that only the resolution and speed of the machine changed but the analysis procedure pretty much remained

the same...

so let ur pics be processed thru the same equipment as meiers...

-------------------------------
photo analysis document is for free at www.theyfly.com but not for $30 as the guys in the radio show says...seems they

really know nothing except bad mouthing,character assasination and laugh at anything that doesnt make sense to their

minds...

-------------------------------
also in the radio show,they say "BIlly said that he was the reincarnation of jesus"..

BIlly never said that he was the incarnation of jesus anywhere..if u can show me.try it...
this is misrepresenting facts and called disinformation..
--------------------------
my request:being in a respected position like independednt investigative group.u have the repsonsibilty sir,to pave

way for the world into light of knowledge and wisdom but not the way towards disinformation,character

assasinations,slandering....

hope u realise the weight of the situation and turn towards the true healthy skepticism...
wish u all the best


[edit on 5-11-2009 by mahigitam]

[edit on 5-11-2009 by mahigitam]

reply to post by TruthisJustice


a) He had help

b) Prove it. Produce a first edition copy of any of Meiers books that haven't been tampered with or altered, with a list of all his so called predictions.

c) Again prove it. Lets have th epic analysed to see how old it actually is.

"..He has produced hundreds of high resolution and very clear photographs of UFO's, as well as some terrific videos, all of which remain irreproducable to date(See the UFO duplication section).."

there is reproductions/duplications of the Billy Meier photos/videos , you may see this video, and see the other videos in the same channel in youtube :
www.youtube.com...

Originally posted by Springer
I think we've all had enough of the Meier HOAX... This thread is turning into yet another failed attempt at disproving facts (IIG's research and DEBUNKING) with junk science, hearsay and B.S.

Enough...

Thread closed and headed for the trash bin where it belongs..

Springer...

 

Updated...

The thread contains valuable information and has been restored for public view, with title modification and closed status.




[edit on 5-6-2009 by Springer]

I think the people supporting Meier in this thread make some valid points which have not yet been debunked. It would seem that ATS have made up their mind and don't want any kind of dialogue on the issue. Which is the whole point of ATS is it not?

Please Springer if you have any evidence that 100% proves the Meier case to be a fake then share it with us.

reply to post by Namaste1001

I already posted a link to a Youtube channel of a person who did duplicate Billy Meier's Videos and pictures,he also did duplicate the WC ship and the sound sample , Meier supportes best arguement is that no one did duplicate the Meier pics and videos since day one , well it's DONE , i personlly was giving the case the benifit of doubt until i saw the duplications . Now after reading this forum i really don't know what will convince the meier's beleivers such as Indigo_child that it's hoax. Perhaps they re waiting until Meier will admit it , i really don't think he will make himself look guilty after all this years .

Originally posted by elyaeno
Perhaps they re waiting until Meier will admit it

Even if that ever happened, there would still be those who would believe that he was confessing under duress, and that somebody "got to him."

I would simply like somebody to take the time and effort to gather up all the available materials, organize them as much as possible, scan them at the highest practical resolution and present them in a coherent format. Not just piecemeal like has been done since day one.

One would think that something like this, arguably one of the most important events in the history of mankind, would be documented a little better than an average company picnic or ordinary wedding. But I guess not.

I think it is good to have debunkers like this when it comes to peoples beliefs because it proves fraud.
People can get sucked in and then loose their money in important ways.
I love explanations like this because it is descriptive and informative and does provide explanations.

I don't like debunkers that come out with things that don't add up. Like saying certain photos of mars are rocks when the clearly seem not to be. When people debunk they need to be descriptive like this.

I know it is easy for debunkers to over shoot their effectiveness by describing with out clearly looking and analyzing.

When debunkers hit the nail on the head, it can be a life changer for people especially religions. Because people need guidance if it is based on true facts. They could be stuck in a religion that it's leaders don't want to give up their knowledge of false facts because they are making money and that is too hard to let go.

I am one to be amazed at the incredible information on ufo's out there. But things can really get serious when people put practically their whole life into something with out substance. It is SO important to have the facts. The roots of that belief system. Is it truly legit or not.

I was in a religion that I would of sworn that it was true, until I studied it's roots and wow it opened up a new interest in learning that what was told me simple didn't add up with all the information out there. And a feeling of being set free became apparent.

So I have to say kudos to debunkers when done the right way and not just off-the-cuff!

G'day folks

Consider this

1st Most debunkers here are upset Billy Meier has debunked them eh eh

2nd For others Plato's cave allegory would apply
www.mlahanas.de...

3rd you always get government trolls on ufo topics, you know anything ufoish gets that, they have software that allows them to be as many people as they want easily.

That reminds me, we all know Al Ciada cover ups, if you read into it Al Ciada did some Houdini tricks with the photos placing some dodgy ones amongst the many, they do all sorts of things to debunk Billy, they even spy on him etc.. think mate, Billy would be prime target numero uno

As we approach the dawn of the age of reason many people are at this level of evolution from Plato's cave:
We are chained to the belief that there are no alternatives. It is only when we are dragged up to the entrance of the cave that the light of day begins to blind us and hurt us. That is the struggle... to keep from seeing the truth.

Its not until you get to read the Spirit Teachings that YOU KNOW its the Truth and learn the primal forces of all knowledge and a lot more, you can sense the abilities of expression and DEPTH in Billy are out of this world, if you seek you will find, here is a good start, you will see
www.futureofmankind.co.uk...

if you just look at the ufo stuff its my honest opinion your not ready for the message/s anyway
the ufo's are nothing compared to what you learn, nothing

Proper meditation is important for humans, its how we connect to the Creation's energy/knowledge
ca.figu.org...

We are told the universe is sterile but for earth eh eh
as unimaginably old and immense the universe is they say microbes might (might) live on other planets eh eh
and they know otherwise, the Universe is WILD man, wilder than any forest

With trillions of galaxies and each galaxy trillions of planets over trillions of years old and countless space-time configurations and dimensions, even if each galaxy only had 1 star man race there must be many trillions of races in our space-time configuration and dimension alone.

So Where are these Star Men? So Why dont they come and save my pretty ass?
We are on quarantine to stop our religions spreading the madness, even star men can be gullible, 2000 years ago ufo's, giants, dwarfs and many human types where here, its in folklore and art also skeletal remains.
Nobody is here to save you but you, nobody can save you but you, the reason we are in the material world is to evolve, you know its better to show someone how to feed themselves than it is to feed them, or else they get dependant and lack evolution, we get recommendations so we can help ourselves, what else do you want? free space ships so we can spread our madness?? can you imagine the fanatic Christians and mullahs etc.. getting loose on the cosmos? destruction would then be endless. OR facebook and twitter ;-)

The problem with science is: Science lacks spirit and you cant teach an expert anything also with science you have secret science and science for the masses

Some important Plejaren health tips:
Men are not men: let them know why
One of the reasons men are like girls and cant face truth is milk has female hormones so makes men think like a girl and soft body, try for 2 weeks only drink rice or oat milk you will see i dont lie
soy milk is bad also so dont drink it

Not only is milk from a LACTATING FEMALE cow the farmer also pumps the cow with FEMALE hormones
amino acids fix this if you stop drinking milk

meditate daily
20 mins walk/gardening on the grass barefoot per day, weather permitting
spirulina is needed for vitamins now as plants are grown in the same location with only chemicals
moringa oleifera for diabetes and countless other ailments

we are told all the races/cultures evolved from Africa, is this really possible?

If you are religious some of the things you can learn from Billy are we come from The Universe (The Creation) not one of the gods, the gods where men so was satan, they died and stayed dead, they are deceased. We re-incarnate we dont die and goto heaven or hell, Heaven and hell are not places they are inside us.

Our Spirit is The Creation

at the very least try this:
ca.figu.org...

listen to it in German here
ca.figu.org...

If its not your level thats OK with me, you can only lead a horse to water mate
ca.figu.org...

I have no affiliation with anyone i spent hours reading the thread and doing this post out of concern for my fellow man, especially my American mates who are without a great leader.

Say this with great force/energy in your mind/spirit: I ask my Spirit and The Creation to show The Truth to the Great Ones of Old In the United States of America so the Truth is shown to all the people.

May The Truth Set You FREE!!!

Salome
ilovebilly

G'day Folks

Some Plejaren/ Meier snippets i found interesting, from memory

man is not from the ape, skulls from apes where sanded to make it seem true, fame being the desire. Ask to see the skulls they wont show them as modern technology can detect the sanding
(try and get the skulls tested with modern equipment, you cant get near them)

yeti,sasqach,bunyip, abominable snowman etc.. exist, it is primitive man
a guy is filming them with night vision using sweet things honey etc.. as a lure, youtube

Loch Ness exists, Nessy

we know there are advanced mammals but claim no advanced plants, there are advanced plants here on earth, some plants also colonise space with seeds expelled by natural forces.

Some waste residue left by prehistoric atomic blasts may be found in
Monument Valley, Arizona, the Bakaa Valley in Lebanon, most of the West Australian Desert, and northwest of Cuenca, Ecuador, and there are more... Death Valley and Fire Valley near the city of Las Vegas is another witness to the past and timeless atomic insanity of the Earth human being. eastern slopes of the Andes a few dozen miles northeast of Cuenca, Ecuador. Sodom and Gomorra

science dosnt see this and its not that hard to detect: there are particles escaping every nuclear reactor that build up on the dark side of the planet and follow the darkness, ozone holes fluctuate from this, these particles just zip straight through any reactor wall

you are meant to live 1000 years, we dont even mature until 70, the aging and aggression genes where tinkered with in our past, the beings described in ancient greek texts lived, the gene for aging will be fixed soon, the animals/beings will be recreated

people as tall as 36 feet have lived on earth

do you really think Asian and Caucasian and American Indian et al evolved so fast from Africa

there are things that live in space, to have life evolve you mainly need a stable environment

there are beings called rods who visit earth in our dimension/time
google: ufo rods

plants give off ultraviolet light humans cant detect but insects and animals can

all the nuclear reactors on the planet can be shut down (meltdown) for years from (one) solar storm, fukushima was just power couldnt be provided to cooling systems, large solar storms would wipe out circuits at the manufacturing plants also e.g. generator manufacture. We havnt had them long but better learn soon

cold fusion is real google: Rossi cold fusion

there is no god equation, you have 2 the micro (quantum) and macro

our universe is one of trillions
our universe has a twin

all things are explained by nature

the Plejaren wrote Star Trek and Star Wars thats what its like, they are like us some good some bad some like us some not, we are meant to be like Captain Kirk with Spocks logic and No fear.
We learn from bad and good so have reverence and venerability for both, fear is good for nothing

the difference is they dont have religion, they know the Spirit stands outside of time, there is a continuity of the Spirit during every incarnation which bridges all times. All lifetimes of the Spirit are integrated by the Spirit in the endless NOW of Creation. Wisdom is carried forward to Creation as the Spirit Evolves.

Akashic records are true, its magnetic energy, meditation is howto access it
with meditation you also get energy

we need to be neutral with a slight positive bent for evolution as we can be negative and go backwards or be to positive and become megalomaniacs

we only work with half of science with NO Spirit knowledge:
here are a few mind/eye openers people wont know and i know you will realise are true, you know all things have an opposite right?

then why dont we here about bellow from science:
there is an opposite to black holes, repels
there is an opposite to suns: black suns that shine darkness!
there are opposites to explosions, with many repercussions for most science especially energy production

the peace symbol we use is upside down

Tunguska explosion in 1908 was quarantine measures (space craft self destructed)
Russians have found space ship parts and certain isotopes at ground zero, google it
space ship had a crew of 4000

life is about evolution, we are in the material world to evolve, we dont evolve in the spirit realms its done here, DNA/spirit evolution

we change our DNA with thoughts/spirit and tones

hair is a cosmic energy collector, google why indians where really used in ww2, the code talkers where really psychic they have more psy abilities until they cut their hair off in service

music can be damaging or good, you can sense it
try and use natural lighting when possible
Many white people are The Watchers spirits re-incarnating on earth, (i am white so too bad if you dont like that)

i know people are in Plato's cave and will be upset and i must respect that
its for those who are facing the light
i can post links to more info on these snippets, or just google it e.g. dna ageing gene found

Salome
ilovebilly

reply to post by canyouhandletruth


It amazes me that some people still believe this crap. Oh,
just in case you call me a disinfo agent, i have been into
the ufo subject for over 20 years, and i do belive many cases
defy explanation and need further investigation.

But how can that happen when the subject is full of
tbis crap? No wonder the subject is a joke, esp when
there are gullible people who believe this rubbish.

Some of meiers "evidence" is some of the worst i have
ever seen, esp his photos and footage, which are clerly
fake, and faked badly.

But the meier case is like a cult, and like any cult, its almost
impossible to debate with cult believers

I wish people would stop being so gullible and actally start
doing research on the ufo cases that deserve the attention.
Not this rubbish!

Hello Jay-morris,

When it comes to the Billy Meier/FIGU stuff there is an important point to remember. Their agents contact different Forums off and on through the year. I've seen "mahigitam" elswhere. The arguments over whether the evidence is true or not is really only for use as a mechanism by the "meier-trons" to attract an audience. For them it's not about proving anything one way or the other. It's all a smokescreen to introduce and promote the Billy/FIGU religion. In other words it's all an elaborate set-up designed to troll for unsuspecting and susceptible recruits. Asket Nera photo? They don't care. Dinosaur from a book? They don't care. Weddingcake UFO? They REALLY don't care! It's all designed as bait. They don't care if you prove it wrong. It's set up that way- has been for years.

And that's all it is to it folks; don't be duped by the ploy. Aryan Billy/Figu promotes a White Human Race superiority religion and I say this to help cut to the quick and help members to not get caught up in the usual diversionary tactics of proving or disproving a photo as a HOAX. To the FIGU and their moles that's not the true reason they are here.

Regards, hiflier

reply to post by hiflier


Hi

yes, i already know the this cult is dangous. But there are so
many gullible people out there who are completly brainwahed
by all this Your right, the evidence is so bad, its shocking. Its like
if you try and tell a muslim or a christian that their religon is bogus,
they will not listen, and its the same with this cult