The Three Clinchers for Proof of Alien Life

What I was getting at was that the drawings and stories of The Wandjinas is located to one small tribe located in the Kimberly.

Also, as you can see The Wandjinas are drawn in a specific way (for reasons unknown) But we can assume if other tribes saw these same beings, they would look similar.

Yes,and in the other drawings(taking into account different cultures and the artistic style and ability)the creatures look remarkably similar,close enough that for the in similarities you can account for those by the passing down of stories and memory.There are also stories all over the world of strange creatures like the Wandjinas,for example the Dogon tribe in Africa talk of the "Nommos" from Sirius,Native American legend of "star brothers",etc.

reply to post by JacobNH


Thanks it would be helpful to all.Here is some more info about a 95 shuttle encounter.

On Oct. 21, 1995, at 2:05 a.m. EST, NASA mission STS-73 aboard Space Shuttle Columbia apparently encountered a UFO in space. As viewed on cable television transmissions from the mission, a female astronaut is clearly heard saying, "We have an unidentified flying object." This is then followed by nearly 15 minutes of silence, while a female astronaut (either Kathryn Thornton, Payload Commander or Catherine (Cady) Coleman, Mission Specialist) is shown in lab view by the camera.

A call to the public information office at Goddard Space Flight Center, Greenbelt, Maryland, elicited the response that no one in that office was aware of any such comments made during the course of the STS-73 mission. ORTK Board Member Don Ratsch (who taped the relevant transmission) has written his Congressman and Senators to find out more about the circumstances of this revealing quote. He reports having made no progress thus far in this effort. A copy of the tape was also forwarded to a researcher in Houston to be shown to personnel at the Johnson Space Flight Center.

artgomperz.com

The transmission can be heard in my op video.

sts-29 march 1989

Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 18:51:37 -0800
From: [email protected] (Donald Ratsch)
Subject: Re: NASA WAV file
To: [email protected] (Brian Zeiler)

Brian, yes I have the full story on that. The details was carried on
the July 1989 issue of the MUFON Journal. Briefly I recorded some of
the radio broadcast via my audio scanner from the space shuttle
Discovery through WA3NAN, the club station of the Goddard Amateur Radio
Club at Greenbelt, Md, transmitting on 147.450 MHZ. It is a
retransmission from the NASA Select original. I heard what I thought
was one of the male astronauts saying, "Houston, Discovery, we still
have the alien spacecraft under observance". Well I was pretty excited
and got in touch with Walt Andrus of MUFON and Vince Dipietro (Mars
Face Fame) who is employed at Goddard Space Flight Center who I later
handed over the tape to have a voice print analysis performed to
compare the target voice to the astronauts' voices that were aboard
during that mission. The result of the analysis showed that a few
positive hits on Astronaut Bagian (the physician on board) but not
enough hits to say he was the one who said the target words. So the
results were inconclusive. Later a check showed there was no target
voice on the original NASA Select audio.

About a year after that, I was again monitoring the audio from another
NASA mission via my scanner and I heard that voice again, saying something
similar to the target voice a year earlier. However on this mission, all the
astronauts were different compared to the other one. This led me to conclude
that unfortunately, the target voice was a hoax probably from an amateur
radio operator. Jim Oberg emailed me some time ago and asked me about
that case and I told him what I just told you.

That's an email from the person that recorded the Nasa transmission Source.

Here's a page about Incan Geometry, they weren't stupid.

And here's Monkey Magic. He's magic. He could ride on a cloud, and was expelled from heaven for urinating on Buddha's hand after screwing up guarding the sacred peach garden.

Originally posted by jkrog08
Really?For real?A little harsh,expected though.
Like I said, debunkers when faced with insurmountable proof will resort to "nope not true,hoax........this one guy on this blog site said it was a hoax."NASA said the transmission didn't exist,they are clearly heard using the same protocol as in other "encounter events" such as switching to a secure line.I will refer you to the 95 incident with another shuttle,was that a hoax as well?You know as well as I this video to this day as not been discredited and has been run through analysis.

I don't know anything about this recording. I just mentioned Isaac Koi (THE Isaac Koi, ATS member?) seems to endorse the hoax explanation. Maybe he did some basic checking, like mailing the guy who did the recording.


[edit on 2009-4-4 by nablator]

Yea I am aware of the email,however he did not have enough evidence to say it was for sure a hoax.

Straight after the transmission it is alledged by another radio enthusiast Mr. Oechsler that NASA instructed the crew to switch frequencies to a secure mode.

ufoseek.com

This from two different people.Do you not think NASA would try all it could to make it seem like a hoax?

According to Bob, he and his colleagues have found that the transmission matches up with NASA tapes except that there is a "blank space" in the tape where the above transmission occurred. (Possibly bleached out?)

So did NASA perpetrate in this hoax as well?
book-of-thoth.com

Not only is there this Discovery tape but others from Gemini 7,Apollo 12,STS 73(I suggest you listen to that where the female astronaut says "We have a Unidentified Flying Object",then silence as secure lines are used.)

[edit on 4/4/2009 by jkrog08]

reply to post by jkrog08


Those figures do not look like representations of the same thing as in the Australian drawings.

They look like the representation of human beings and other creatures that look like human beings but have some small differences, but they could also be human beings that had something that made them different, or even if they were not really different, a difference in ranking, for example, could be represented that way.

Also I suggest you (skeptics) watch this UFO Hunters:The NASA Files show(it is an hour long but provides the most up to date analysis of Discovery and others).
Part One

Part Two

Part Three

Part Four

Part Five

reply to post by ArMaP


Good to debate with you again friend.I think you are ignoring the logical conclusions,there are countless cave paintings of humans...........these are not them.

reply to post by jkrog08


They look like humans, they were (supposedly) painted by humans, why is the logical conclusion "they were from other planet"?

reply to post by ArMaP


They don't look like humans,they look more like Greys than humans.Pictures of humans in caves have hair for one thing.You can't deny that these look strangely like Greys.

To all the skeptics:Obviously you will still attempt to debunk things that in mine and a lot of other peoples minds are obvious.It is okay,I welcome it,but to say that the evidence I provided is nonsense is go against your very ideology about looking at all the evidence.For any one of my three clinchers there is not one damning piece of evidence saying "not true".Of these three events you can not disprove all or one as a hoax or coincidence.The fact is is it is accounts like these that keep us(believers)going and what has shifted the mainstream public opinion on extraterrestrial life and interaction.At the very least and most skeptic you have to say that these three events combined,or any one for that matter is enough to pause for a moment,and at the very least continue trying to find the "universal smoking gun"

There is far better evidence out there, in my opinion.

The O'Hare incident.

The first sighting in the Phoenix incident.

The Battle of Los Angeles.

The '52 DC flyover.

reply to post by fooffstarr


There is a lot of evidence,I tried however to use evidence from three types of alien events:Abduction(the star map),History(The paintings and lines),and government(The transmission).Also in my opinion the star map is irrefutable.It doesn't matter what evidence I give some will not believe until they talk to an alien!

reply to post by jkrog08


I agree that the Nasa clips should clinch it. There you have it, trained astronauts admitting, not just to seeing a UFO, but to having an "Alien Space Craft" under observance. Unless some evidence comes out saying that that particular astronaut was some sort of jokester and was pulling Houston's leg (which I highly doubt)...

The Hill abductions are certainly intriguing but I'm not 100% convinced alien abductions are taking place...

Still, good thread, good effort, and hopefully one day we'll know the truth

I am anxious for more ATS members to offer their opinion here........We have seen from both sides,keep um coming,this is what this site is all about!

reply to post by jkrog08


I'm not going to debunk all of them

1. The Nazca lines, these can be made without using aircraft and just using
fixed lengths of string and a handful of people. The scale and dedication
to task is impressive. I believe that they believed there was life out there
and it was their way of trying show there was by making it visible from above.
The ancient art, not aliens just spirits. They also drew evil demons, doesn't
mean they existed, just how they envisioned them to be.
But we interpret them differently, big head, big eyes, must be a Alien.
If fact, it's not much different to how children draw their parents today,
stick figures with giant round heads and big eyes.

2. Don't have any answer for the star map

3. The discovery transmission, anything that can easily be described as
space junk, meteors, asteroids is not proof of anything

I am not a debunker but a believing skeptic...you have shown nor proven nothing. Nazca if reports are correct were made for training potential Shaman. If they could see the the design from the air during a Shamanic trance then they would move to the next figure. The sculptures...while very interesting and odd, are being interpreted through biased eyes of something in pop-myth we already know. You cannot assume that even with the level of ingenuity the ancestors had that it is a sign of alien influence. Did they make scults in the shapes of planes?...yes...do things on walls look like they could be greys...yes...but you have to look at things from a different perspective. Not from a 21st century view. Before spaceflight are we saying that people in the 1890's and even earlier were contacted by aliens to be able to write thier science fiction novels?

All of this stuff is interesting but it's definitely not "nail in the coffin" proof that extra terrestrial life has been visiting our planet for thousands of years. The drawings can easily be explained as humans drawing other humans; poorly. They only make sense as proof of alien life if you're viewing it through the modern pop culture lense of the grey alien mythos.

Consider the gap in time from when these drawings were made and the emergence of our pop culture depiction of grey aliens. How can you account for thousands of years of these beings not being represented in even casual documentation?

It's a massive logical leap to look at an ancient cave painting of humanoid figures, which look vaguely like a modern pop culture icon and call that proof of alien life. It's interesting, but it's just not proof.

Your first clincher: They are definitely interesting, but I am sure you aware that they are very open to interpretation. They could be depictions of spirits or they be just works of art. I know with a post-hoc reading they do look like greys, but this could be mere coincidence. We need more evidence to corroborate they are greys. Are you familiar with any legends of these people that could refine the interpretations for us?

Second clincher: I have a problem with post-hypnosis memories, there is such a high chance they are false memories it is difficult to trust them. Moreover, I am bit skeptical of hypnosis in general. I have had a hypnotist tried to hypnotize me and they couldn't. When I told him I was not feeling any different and nor was I giving automatic memory recall, I was told hypnosis is just deep relaxation. I then told him, "I can do that at home" So im rather skeptical of these reports that people are hypnotized and then they reveal past-life memories, abductions etc

But the star map is pretty compelling. I am not sure though how likely it is to draw random dots and lines and match up with a star system. There are 100 billion stars in the galaxy and 800,000 stars are known by astronomers. If a computer looks for a match of some random dots and lines maybe it could find some connections. I don't know I am not an astronomer. So for me personally this case while compelling, doesn't clinch it for me.

Third Clincher: Now this is evidence. Hard evidence.

[edit on 4-4-2009 by Indigo_Child]

reply to post by Indigo_Child


Well put and reasonable,I appreciate your and all the other inputs.I too find the third clincher extreme and hard evidence,as well the star map.As Armap said earlier it is difficult interpreting other,ancient civilizations drawings from a modern view.There are mid-evil age paintings depicting UFOs however,so really for as long as we have had art we have had accounts of these agreeably strange things.