The consciousness of our universe

The definition of an Organism, is any living thing capable of response to stimuli, reproduction, growth and development, and maintenance of homeostasis as a stable whole.

Our universe does all of these things. The consciousness of our universe is responsible for the form and purpose that all matter assumes The Earth's resonant frequencies are a result of its form. These frequencies are responsible for biological rhythms such as menstrual and circadian cycles as well as behavioral and emotional patterns. The frequencies are then picked up by the flora and fauna which are biological instruments that respond to the wave patterns. The wave patterns resonate in the cranial structure of our head and converge in the center of our brain which is where we find the pineal gland.

The pineal gland is believed in many cultures to be the spiritual third eye responsible for intuition. Descartes called it "The Seat of the Soul" where mind and body meet. Each individual cell in our body receives an electromagnetic impulse from our central nervous system. They receive the very same impulse that was disseminated to every biological instrument from the Earth. An explanation of our conscious universe has been attempted by religion, science, and philosophy. The neglect of biological nature from any organism causes illness... A divorce from nature, exile from Eden, confounding of tongues, they're all symptoms, not of a biblical God or Deity but the true self. The greatest and only treat to ourselves is a loss of self, the death of our divinity. As we bare through history with oceans of information, yet barely a drop of wisdom, we have to understand how we lost our self.

[edit on 30-3-2009 by manbearpig]

Great post. so far...just from the read at top really. Need to watch the videos but won't ge to all of them today. How long are they?

My attention span goes after about 20 minutes but I love movies and anything that keeps me interested so I may be able to fit in an hour.

Will check back later but thanks for the post.

reply to post by manbearpig

The definition of an Organism, is any living thing capable of response to stimuli, reproduction, growth and development, and maintenance of homeostasis as a stable whole.

Our universe does all of these things. The consciousness of our universe is responsible for the form and purpose that all matter assumes...

How did you get from an organism to a conscious organism? Did you just close your eyes and jump?

You are assuming the thing you're trying to prove: that the universe is conscious.

The rest of your post is the usual superstitious farrago of Third Eyes and 'vibrations'.

There is nothing scientific about this 'theory'. Why is it stinking up this forum? It should be in the Skunk Works.

reply to post by Astyanax


Last time I checked, the current theory for matter, was energy, vibrating at varying levels, cymatics is an interesting subject to look into and you may understand what people are talking about when they refer to 'vibrations'.

Ever stood next to a speaker in a concert, feels like your stomachs dancing with you?

That aside, I personally believe that the universe is conscious, although I have no way to prove it and I have found very little 'evidence' to suggest so, to me, it just seems to fit.

To understand whether the universe is conscious, we have to understand what consciousness is, at this point, we don't even know if our consciousness is manifested by our brain (or mind) or externally. I personally believe it's externally, the brain being an anchor, I think there was an interesting paper by a guy called LaPierre, it was fascinating from what I remember.

So in the nicest possible way, go clutter up the other boards with your inccesant complaining and allow the discussion to continue.

EMM

reply to post by ElectroMagnetic Multivers

Perhaps the universe is conscious, though it would have to be a very slow consciousness, since its operations would be limited to lightspeed and the universe is very big.

But that isn't the point. The point is that the OP offers no valid argument for its assertion. That's very annoying. And to expect people to sit down and watch video after video to make their case is to try their patience and goodwill too far.

As for vibrations, well, there are vibrations and vibrations. What do these vibrations have to do with consciousness? Are they supposed to be the thoughts of the universe? How do we know that? How does the existence of vibrations presuppose an integral, universal consciousness?

The idea that the universe is conscious in some way is hardly new, but there are serious objections against it: the universe does not appear to need to be conscious, and shows no sign of it either. I have already mentioned the temporal difficulty - I suppose you could pile supposition upon supposition and argue some kind of faster-than-light method of getting information from A to B - invoke quantum entanglement or some such effect - but then phut go your vibrations, which are extended in spacetime and don't do spooky action at a distance.

Other objections:

If the universe is conscious, why is it so full of catastrophic events? On any scale you want from the quantum to the cosmic, the universe is full of things crashing into each other or just exploding of their own accord.

If the universe is conscious, why does it not make itself known to us? Is it conscious, but too stupid to frame a message its children can understand? Writing HI THERE! in supernova letters across thirty degrees of azimuth in the night sky can't be that hard, can it? Or does it have some secret, exalted (and very slow) mission of its own that demands it hide itself from us?

See, it's fun to discuss the possibility that (1) the universe is an organism (Spinoza thought so; in fact he thought it was God) and (2) the universe is a conscious organism (Liebniz thought so; he thought it was God, too, but in a different way). I'm certainly up for it. But let's have a credible proposition to begin with.

I've stood beside a few bass bins. I'm a musician, I push air around for fun.

Originally posted by Astyanax
reply to post by ElectroMagnetic Multivers

 

Perhaps the universe is conscious, though it would have to be a very slow consciousness, since its operations would be limited to lightspeed and the universe is very big.

From our current perspective, true, although I believe light speed is a limitation of man, and not the universe. Apparently light moves through a medium of caesium gas at 300 times the speed of light, the light pulse is seen leaving, before it is seen entering.

But that isn't the point. The point is that the OP offers no valid argument for its assertion. That's very annoying. And to expect people to sit down and watch video after video to make their case is to try their patience and goodwill too far.

OK, again, true, I wasn't bothered about what you said, more about how you said it. The argument is in the videos, the OP was just bringing attention to it but I also agree, he should have offered his own thoughts and perspective of the idea, not just someone else's.

As for vibrations, well, there are vibrations and vibrations. What do these vibrations have to do with consciousness? Are they supposed to be the thoughts of the universe? How do we know that? How does the existence of vibrations presuppose an integral, universal consciousness?

The vibrations themself are an effect, the cause being the energy in which the vibrations travel, depending on the vibrations the physical world we know is constructed, something like concrete vibrates fast, or water, vibrates slower.

The way I see it, our concsiousness is just like this energy, it vibrates in such a way that we can't percieve it as a physical manifestation. I see it as a light bulb, the 'soul' is the filament, the immediate glow of the bulb is the physical body and the ambient light gven off by the light is the aura, these are all part of our consciousness, it's how it's see's itself in this 'physical' world.

This isn't fact, or proof and I don't offer it as such, this is how I percieve it, its how I contemplate something I don't know.

The idea that the universe is conscious in some way is hardly new, but there are serious objections against it: the universe does not appear to need to be conscious, and shows no sign of it either.

A grain of sand cannot comprehend the beauty and scale of this world.

I have already mentioned the temporal difficulty - I suppose you could pile supposition upon supposition and argue some kind of faster-than-light method of getting information from A to B - invoke quantum entanglement or some such effect - but then phut go your vibrations, which are extended in spacetime and don't do spooky action at a distance.

Assuming time and space matters to a being that IS a universe, again though, just throwing some ideas around, it's how you get the grey matter working.

Other objections:

If the universe is conscious, why is it so full of catastrophic events? On any scale you want from the quantum to the cosmic, the universe is full of things crashing into each other or just exploding of their own accord.

When we look on the quantum scale, it is absolute chaos, yet when we zoom out, the random events and chaos somehow birth order.

If you have an itch, odds are you have just killed or at least uprooted thousands/millions of cells/bacteria.

The insignificance of these events in the grand scale of things, what if our entire civilization was wiped out? How do you think that would effect the universe?

Is death really so bad? Afterall, in our most basic form we are energy and from what we have seen so far, it is impossible to destroy, we can only transform it. If our consciousness is not created by the brain, then the body itself is merely a vessel for our time here, we then move on to our next experience.

If the universe is conscious, why does it not make itself known to us? Is it conscious, but too stupid to frame a message its children can understand? Writing HI THERE! in supernova letters across thirty degrees of azimuth in the night sky can't be that hard, can it? Or does it have some secret, exalted (and very slow) mission of its own that demands it hide itself from us?

Fantastic question and one I have tried to comprehend the answer to for a while. Personally, it's a matter of belief, we will never know. For you, the simple answer could be that it isn't and I totally understand why you would say that, for a while, I did. For me personally, it's about experience, there was a thread about it not too long ago, you should read it, it is an interesting philosophy to think about.

The easiest way I have found to explain it is 'Can a omnipotent, universal consciousness know individuality? is that a form of individuality in itself?'I think it's a quest for experience, all manner of exprience's, no matter what they are, good, bad, evil, benevolent.

www.abovetopsecret.com...'

See, it's fun to discuss the possibility that (1) the universe is an organism (Spinoza thought so; in fact he thought it was God)

BINGO! That is the closest ting I have found to God, the culmination of everything, does it have to be conscious? No, do I think it is? Yes.

and (2) the universe is a conscious organism (Liebniz thought so; he thought it was God, too, but in a different way). I'm certainly up for it. But let's have a credible proposition to begin with.

The idea itself is a credible proposition, at least to me, you may percieve it differently, but then again, is that not the beauty of individuality, the purpose of experience.

I've stood beside a few bass bins. I'm a musician, I push air around for fun.

Cymatics opens up this possibility, sound (or rather vibrations) effecting physical matter.

EMM

p.s sorry if I sounded disrespectful before, it just annoys me when people brush these things off without considering their own idea on the subject, no one else's ideas will ever sound right to you, at least not completely.

Originally posted by LucidDreamer85
How long are they?

My attention span goes after about 20 minutes but I love movies and anything that keeps me interested so I may be able to fit in an hour.

Will check back later but thanks for the post.

Its about an hour and half, well worth the watch

first off asty the first poster not OP but first reply lets say is a idiot goof lol if your gunna tell someone off get your facts straight you ever take physics there are frequencies and vibrations everywhere and i am pretty sure it wouldn't be too suprised if they proved that we are all just a sequence of frequencies and vibrations being picked up in the perfect manor as to produce what we all see and hear and feel.

reply to post by AndreDC

Yes, well, thanks for your opinion on that.

So, is the universe conscious, or not? Might as well give us your opinion on that, too.

Originally posted by Astyanax
reply to post by ElectroMagnetic Multivers

 

If the universe is conscious, why does it not make itself known to us? Is it conscious, but too stupid to frame a message its children can understand? Writing HI THERE! in supernova letters across thirty degrees of azimuth in the night sky can't be that hard, can it? Or does it have some secret, exalted (and very slow) mission of its own that demands it hide itself from us?

‘Excuse me,’ said an ocean fish.
‘You are older than me, so can
you tell me where to find this
thing they call ocean?’

‘The ocean,’ said the older fish,
‘is the thing you are in now.’

‘Oh, this? But this is water.
What I’m seeking is an ocean,’
said the disappointed fish as he
swam away to search elsewhere..

I too believe the universe to be a intelligent conscious mind. However proving this is going to be difficult with the current state of affairs in science in regards that we still know very little about the big picture.

If we imagine a germ in our own body to be intelligent as us and went and studied the enviornment he was living in. It too will come to newtonian theory regarding on how our body works. But because he cant leave the body (like mankind cant leave our universe) can that germ say with all its data regarding our body in mathematical terms that he he living in a conscious living being?

The above analogy is very simple but i hope u get the idea. I have no problem with science even though our current understanding of the universe dosent seem to say that the universe is an intelligent mind. Saying that as we progress in our understanding of the universe it may turn out that there is some truth in that afterall as there is tantaslising data even at present that may suggest that but the evidence and lack of knowledge in regards to how human mind can influence what should otherwise be random happenings is still in its infancy. here is a link to this
www.fourmilab.ch...

[edit on 29-4-2009 by loner007]

[edit on 29-4-2009 by loner007]

It is actually easy to prove the universe has consciousness...

You only need to ask yourself 2 questions...

1: Are you a part of the universe?

2: Do you have consciousness?

I would answer YES to number ONE, I am a part of the universe. Then I would answer YES to number two, I do have consciousness.

What this means is, the universe does have consciousness, and I am a part of it, and so are you.

Originally posted by 0nce 0nce
It is actually easy to prove the universe has consciousness...

You only need to ask yourself 2 questions...

1: Are you a part of the universe?

2: Do you have consciousness?

I would answer YES to number ONE, I am a part of the universe. Then I would answer YES to number two, I do have consciousness.

What this means is, the universe does have consciousness, and I am a part of it, and so are you.

Then I could argue my house is conscious. Which is a silly proposition.

reply to post by 0nce 0nce

This I agree with. From an evolutionary perspective, the first sentient consciousness to open its eyes and look around it was, in a sense, the universe achieving consciousness.

However, as science lol points out, that consciousness can't be extrapolated to the whole of the universe except by means of some mystical or metaphysical - not scientific - connection between conscious beings and unconscious, brute matter. If those conscious beings then went on to alter the entire universe in some way by their presence, you could argue that the altered universe was a kind of extended phenotype of consciousness, perhaps. As far as we know, that has not happened in our universe.

Idealist philosophers would argue that consciousness creates the universe, but their position is that there is no significant reality outside the mind, and I'm sure that's not what the OP is getting at.

Nietzsche argued that the 'will to power' creates a genuine empirical reality. I'm sure he was wrong, but if he had been right, then the entire universe is the work of consciousness. That doesn't make it conscious in itself, though.

I must repeat that this topic has nothing to do with science or technology. It is at best philosophy, at worst 'spiritual'. Interesting to discuss, though.

Originally posted by science lol
Then I could argue my house is conscious. Which is a silly proposition.

It is only a silly proposition because you think you know everything.

If you think your house isn't conscious, then you can also argue that your feet and hands are not conscious, which is even more silly.

You think things need a "brain" in order to have consciousness, when you totally ignore exactly what a brain is.

Your brain is made of a giant collection of sub-atoms, nothing more. Your house is also made of a giant collection of the same sub-atoms, nothing more. In fact, the entire universe as a whole is made of a giant collection of sub-atoms, like a giant brain.

What you are claiming, is that the parts of your brain don't have consciousness, yet the entire brain does have consciousness.

It is the parts of the brain that give the whole brain consciousness. You are a part of the brain, and so is your house.

[edit on 30-4-2009 by 0nce 0nce]