Thoughts on anti-psychotics

Anti-Psychotics stimulate the Pineal Gland, though not directly. Such a result is opening your doorway to the spirit world and hearing them, through auditory hallucinations. Most people dont want to believe in that so they peg it as psychosis. Im a medium- have been on Anti-Psychotics myself to help with bi-polarism, and have experienced the increase of auditory responses from spirits while on such drug and getting off of it. I was a medium before ever taking psychiatric drugs

reply to post by Majorion


Yes, they work.

They know what they do, but they don't know how they work.

The side effects are horrendous.

Potential Parkinson's like symptoms, potential Tardive Diskenisia are clear signs of BRAIN DAMAGE.

This is established that they can be potential side effects.

The fact is, the doctors say they work. They say they know what they do. They say they don't know how they work.

Clearly, if they don't know how they work, at the very least they are disregarding the health of the mental health patients, and at worst they are experimenting on humans. Mentally ill people are being treated as less than human by having to submit to involuntary medical testing in many cases.

This is an outrage.

Once again.

This is a crime against humanity.

This has to stop.

As I previously wrote, I could give you alcohol for confidence and sleep. That does not mean it isn't an horrendously bad thing to do.

Doctors used to recommend smoking for asthma patients!

The medical profession, the pharmaceutical profession, and the tobacco industries, as well as government, need to be held accountable.

Statistics show that people prescribed neuroleptics will smoke at a rate greatly exceeding the general populace. This has been explained to me by mental health workers.

The medications lower available dopamine.

Nicotine raises available dopamine. It is a stimulant.

This medication, apart from being human experimentation, is helping the tobacco companies. Just like the medical profession did in regards to asthma and smoking!

This is wrong. Clearly and plainly wrong.

And still, children can get prescriptions for amphetamines based drugs!

Which is known to be neurotoxic!

Which can lead to them having to be on neuroleptics later in life!

Now think about that.

Amphetamines are a stimulant. More dopamine in the brain.

Brain damage can occur.

Neuroleptics are introduced. Lowers available dopamine.

Many people on neuroleptics are smokers. Smoking raises dopamine.

The tobacco company part might be a coincidence. However they have been in with the medicos in the past.

The facts are though that:

Brain damaging chemicals are given to people, often against their will, by people claiming to be helping their brains. This has also been done in secret with government assistance.

This is an outrage!

This has to stop.

[edit on 20-3-2009 by randomnumbergenerator]

Originally posted by randomnumbergenerator
The side effects are horrendous

I can see that you're very passionate about this subject, perhaps someone you know has suffered from these medications?.. anyways, my take is this... it's true that there are possibly dangerous side-effects.. but consider the alternative, someone who needs this medication but doesn't take it may actually commit suicide, or go into even deeper depression, or hurt other people, or at least continue to be agonized by their disorder.. sure.. the risk is always there with these drugs, but as I mentioned before.. Olanzapine is the best.. it has the least side effects, and is the best for long-term.. weight-gain is the prominent down-side.. but it works wonders I assure you.

Peace

Yes it has been established that they work.

It has also been established that they stop working, are addictive, cause brain damage and a tolerance develops.

How it works is what needs to be addressed. It is either unknown or withheld because it is damaging to those involved in the business.

Human experimentation is happening. Or perhaps torture.

Some psychiatrists have a history of human experimentation. Government does. Big pharma do too. Look at lobotomies! They used to drive spikes in to the brain to 'cure' people by turning them in to vegetables.

This is wrong. It is human experimentation.

It has to stop.

There is no excuse for this.

Government (at the very least for allowing it), big pharma and the psychiatric profession have to be held accountable.

They admit they don't know why it works! They only know it binds to receptors in the brain. AND IT CAUSES BRAIN DAMAGE. Documented! Parkinsons like symptoms and Tardive Diskinesia!

That is brain damage.

They are knowingly causing brain damage.

Something has to be done.

This is literally a crime against humanity.



[edit on 20-3-2009 by randomnumbergenerator]

*warning: this is my last post here tonight*

Unless you specifically request a reply, I will not continue this. I don't think you're interested in having a discussion of the topic, and I don't think you're reading anyone else's posts trying to understand them but only trying to find things to disagree with.

Originally posted by randomnumbergenerator
reply to post by americandingbat

 

Someone working in the mental health profession, has written, that the drugs are neurotoxic. These drugs work in the brain. They are obviously damaging brain tissue.

This is a perfect example of you not trying to comprehend other peoples' posts.

Someone working in the mental health profession has written that the drugs are neurotoxins: that in sufficient amount they damage nerve tissue.

You are getting the conclusion, "they are obviously damaging brain tissue," out of thin air.

How is it, that, people can get worse symptoms after taking these drugs?

I think it probably depends on the particular case. Some mental illnesses are progressive, for example, so the patient would be getting worse symptoms if he/she weren't taking the drugs also. Sometimes the medication prescribed is not the right one for the patient -- this can happen either because a doctor messed up or because there's no way to tell beforehand how a patient will react to a given medication.

Why is it that patients are told that the medical profession does not know why the work, only that they do what they want?

Again, I think this probably depends on the patient. Did they ask the doctor? If so, did they ask the doctor at a time when they were calm and rational? If the doctor starts telling them about how nerve cells work, are they willing to learn?

It's difficult, technical stuff, neurochemistry. And some of it is still unclear to researchers.

Here's what Wikipedia has to say on the question of how they work:

All antipsychotic drugs tend to block D2 receptors in the dopamine pathways of the brain. This means that dopamine released in these pathways has less effect. Excess release of dopamine in the mesolimbic pathway has been linked to psychotic experiences. It is the blockade of dopamine receptors in this pathway that is thought to control psychotic experiences.

Typical antipsychotics are not particularly selective and also block Dopamine receptors in the mesocortical pathway, tuberoinfundibular pathway, and the nigrostriatal pathway. Blocking D2 receptors in these other pathways is thought to produce some of the unwanted side effects that the typical antipsychotics can produce (see below). …

Atypical antipsychotic drugs have a similar blocking effect on D2 receptors. Some also block or partially block serotonin receptors (particularly 5HT2A, C and 5HT1A receptors):ranging from risperidone, which acts overwhelmingly on serotonin receptors, to amisulpride, which has no serotonergic activity. The additional effects on serotonin receptors may be why some of them can benefit the 'negative symptoms' of schizophrenia.[8]

Wikipedia

I hope that's helpful.

What is being hidden? Why are experimental drugs being used in the brains of people who are in need of mental health care?

In most cases, because the patient's doctor thinks that a new, experimental drug shows more promise than the standard remedy. If a patient is in an experimental protocal, they will generally receive either the standard treatment or the experimental medication.

Why are the mentally ill being experimented on?

To improve the availability of anti-psychotics that don't have the debilitating side effects that you have described.

When is this going to stop?

I suppose it would stop if we ever start finding cures for mental illness.

The simple fact is, patients are not told why they work. This information is either being withheld intentionally, which raises some flags, or this information is unknown, which raises some flags.

Or the patients aren't capable of understanding the technical explanations.

Either this medications is harmful to the brain, or it is experimental.

The pharmaceutical companies are therefore either intentionally harming the minds of the mentally ill, or they are experimenting on them.

This has to stop.

It is clearly a crime against humanity.

No. No. No. No.

I don't like the pharmaceutic industry; I think they are lying scum. That doesn't mean that all their products are evil though.

Changing the organs are they? You are saying this now as fact.

Ok, if they are changing the organs, and a higher dose is required as tolerance develops, and the treatment eventually stops working quite clearly this is damaging the brain.

Since the brain wasn't working right to begin with, changing it (specifically, changing dopamine activity by blocking certain receptors) is not necessarily harmful. Tolerance is not the same thing as harm either; it is a sign that your body has reacted to the presence of a foreign chemical or a innate chemical in different concentrations, by trying to go back to the way it used to be.

Since the way it used to be was dysfunctional, once tolerance develops the dysfunction returns and a new medication has to be used.

Is developing a tolerance for alcohol good for your body?

The tolerance itself is neither good nor bad I don't think. In the case of alcohol tolerance, it largely involves the liver cells overexpressing the proteins that make up the smooth endoplasmic reticulum, which is responsible for processing many toxins.

They are being over prescribed in the sense that they are either dangerous or experimental or both.

There have been a few people to testify on this thread to knowing people who have been greatly helped by anti-psychotics. There is not the sort of mass prescription of anti-psychotics that you do see with, for example, antidepressants and ADHD medications. Psychiatrists do not put people on anti-psychotics unless they have clearly demonstrated a need.

reply to post by americandingbat


I am more than interested in discussing this topic. I don't think you are interested in seeing sense.

This is a perfect example of you not trying to comprehend other peoples' posts. Someone working in the mental health profession has written that the drugs are neurotoxins: that in sufficient amount they damage nerve tissue. You are getting the conclusion, "they are obviously damaging brain tissue," out of thin air.

These drugs go to work in the brain. Neurotoxic. Do you understand what the word toxic means? Seriously. If you don't understand what that word means, then, please, do not come back to this thread. It's like if I use insecticide on an insect.

A tiny bit will harm it. A bit more will kill it.

Just like these drugs. It is harming the brain. Understand yet? Or are you busy defending the indefensible?

*warning: this is my last post here tonight* Unless you specifically request a reply, I will not continue this. I don't think you're interested in having a discussion of the topic, and I don't think you're reading anyone else's posts trying to understand them but only trying to find things to disagree with.

I request a reply. I would like to see how much further you can try and change the definitions of commonly known words. Who do you think you are fooling? People know what the word toxic means. Maybe you don't quite understand.

I have written they know what it does, sort of. They know it targets certain receptor sites in the brain. They do not know HOW it does it. Stop attempting to change what I am writing.

Yes, we know. They target receptor sites in the brain.

What we don't know is how/why the drugs do it.

This is experimental science. On humans.

There is not the sort of mass prescription of anti-psychotics that you do see with, for example, antidepressants and ADHD medications. Psychiatrists do not put people on anti-psychotics unless they have clearly demonstrated a need.

YOU CAN GET A PRESCRIPTION FOR THEM AS A SLEEP AID. THAT IS NOT A PSYCHOTIC ILLNESS.

Since the brain wasn't working right to begin with, changing it (specifically, changing dopamine activity by blocking certain receptors) is not necessarily harmful. Tolerance is not the same thing as harm either; it is a sign that your body has reacted to the presence of a foreign chemical or a innate chemical in different concentrations, by trying to go back to the way it used to be. Since the way it used to be was dysfunctional, once tolerance develops the dysfunction returns and a new medication has to be used.

Working right by what definition? If someone claims to have a genuine religious experience, the psychiatric profession would call that a mental illness. We don't know about the brain. The government has done research on psychic phenomena. Remote viewers have been used in this millenium, by the government. If you told a psychiatrist you could do remote viewing, you would be medicated. But the government seems to do it...

You wrote that once tolerance develops the dysfunction returns and new meds have to be used. These meds allegedly do the SAME THING. But, they don't know how.

This is human experimentation. It has to stop.

I suppose it would stop if we ever start finding cures for mental illness.

They don't look for cures. They look for treatments. Cures don't make money.

These points have all been addressed.

Facts are:

Amphetamines are neurotoxic and prescribed to developing minds.

Neuroleptics are neurotoxic and experimental, and are actively prescribed.

The people who have 'sick' minds are getting given treatment to make them sicker!

Do you understand yet?

If you went to a doctor and discussed some things off this website that are proven true, but unknown to them, you will be given neurotoxic substances to 'help' you.

Originally posted by randomnumbergenerator
reply to post by americandingbat

 

*warning: this is my last post here tonight* Unless you specifically request a reply, I will not continue this. I don't think you're interested in having a discussion of the topic, and I don't think you're reading anyone else's posts trying to understand them but only trying to find things to disagree with.

I request a reply. I would like to see how much further you can try and change the definitions of commonly known words. Who do you think you are fooling? People know what the word toxic means. Maybe you don't quite understand.

Against my gut feeling about what I should do, but I did promise to reply if asked.

I know what toxin means. I also know that the effects of a substance are dependent on factors like the concentration of that substance and the length of exposure to that substance.

Caffeine is a central nervous system toxin, for example:

The toxic effects of caffeine are extensions of their pharmacological effects. The most serious caffeine-related CNS effects include seizures and delirium. Other symptoms affecting the cardiovascular system range from moderate increases in heart rate to more severe cardiac arrhythmia. Although tolerance develops to many of the pharmacological effects of caffeine, tolerance may be overwhelmed by the nonlinear accumulation of caffeine when its metabolism becomes saturated.

Abstract at PubMed.gov

I have written they know what it does, sort of. They know it targets certain receptor sites in the brain. They do not know HOW it does it. Stop attempting to change what I am writing.

Yes, we know. They target receptor sites in the brain.

My apologies; I was not trying to change what you were writing. You had not mentioned D2 receptors as far as I recalled, so I didn't know that you were aware of that mechanism of action.

What we don't know is how/why the drugs do it.

I'm not sure why this is so important to you, since we do know that they do it, and that it decreases psychotic symptoms.

This is experimental science. On humans.

No, this is medicine.

YOU CAN GET A PRESCRIPTION FOR THEM AS A SLEEP AID. THAT IS NOT A PSYCHOTIC ILLNESS.

I just looked this up, since you couldn't be bothered with providing a link yourself. It looks to me like a couple of the atypical antipsychotics (Zyprexa, Seroquel) are often prescribed in doses much smaller than those therapeutic for psychosis, as sleeping aids instead of the benzodiazepans, which have some pretty serious problems of their own.

You are really having a hard time with the idea that the size of the dose is important to its effects, both positive and negative, aren't you?

Working right by what definition? If someone claims to have a genuine religious experience, the psychiatric profession would call that a mental illness. We don't know about the brain. The government has done research on psychic phenomena. Remote viewers have been used in this millenium, by the government. If you told a psychiatrist you could do remote viewing, you would be medicated. But the government seems to do it...

Actually, I don't think that if I told a psychiatrist I could do remote viewing I would be medicated, unless there were other issues involved. I think a psychiatrist would consider me eccentric and perhaps deluded, but not psychotic.

As for "working right" I generally consider a mind to be working right when it is not contributing to its own suffering. If a person is not distressed by their mental and emotional experience, and is able to interact with others at the level required to live a productive life, I think their mind is working right.

Amphetamines are neurotoxic and prescribed to developing minds.

Neuroleptics are neurotoxic and experimental, and are actively prescribed.

The people who have 'sick' minds are getting given treatment to make them sicker!

Do you understand yet?

If you went to a doctor and discussed some things off this website that are proven true, but unknown to them, you will be given neurotoxic substances to 'help' you.

1) ADHD treatments I've already expressed my concern about

2) neuroleptics are the best treatment we have for some devastating diseases

3) no, they are being given treatment to lessen symptoms

4) yes, I understood from the beginning. You hate psychiatrists and psychoactive medication. You want everyone else to live according to your say-so, ignoring the fact that several people in this thread have told stories of how antipsychotics have helped people they know.

5) it depends on how I discussed the things from this website, and how they were impacting my life.

*I will not be responding again. Promising to this time was a mistake, but a promise. It all hinges on balance and doses, but you refuse to see issues in anything other than black and white. Unfortunately, mental health care is a whole bunch of grays.*

reply to post by americandingbat

Actually, I don't think that if I told a psychiatrist I could do remote viewing I would be medicated, unless there were other issues involved. I think a psychiatrist would consider me eccentric and perhaps deluded, but not psychotic.

Delusional disorder is treated with anti psychotics.

There are better ways of treating psychotic illnesses. There are many people who report complete absence of symptoms once undergoing dietary modifications and supplementation. As in, symptoms do not return, at all.

Our diets are inadequate.

We are being fed too much processed junk. People do not take care with what they are eating. These problems can, and have, been fixed with the right diet, without the negative issues surrounding the medication. Emotional, physical and mental problems of the medication are gone, so is the illness, and people are able to live drug free.

Not to mention we are being given medications for the mind that are neurotoxic.

Why are natural therapies not encouraged?

The number of prescription medications which are actually derived from plant products would astound you.

This is about profit, not cures.

This is an outrage.

What's irrational about them? I respond to what you claim to be fact with what I claim to be fact. You change subjects and go off on a tangent, and then get personal. Stick with the topic please.

You have made claims that have no relevance to any of my posts. They appeared out of context and you assumed that I could confirm these claims and accustaion for you. I found this irrational. You continue to claim that neurotoxins are TOXIC by prescence alone without addressing dosage issues. I have asked you a number of questions relating to your claims which you have ignored, I find that irrational and ignorant and equates a lack of respect for discussing the range of claims, accusations and beliefs you have.

If you fail to understand how a neurotoxic substance which is designed to work within the brain, is going to be toxic to braincells, and therefore to the brain, I don't know how I am going to be able to continue to have a rational discussion with you.

Neurotoxins are natural and man made, they effect nerves. You fail to understand what the neuroleptics do. They block receptors that are responsible for the chemical reations that create psychosis. There are side effects. Large or heavy dosage over long periods of time will have effects, as with any substance, are large or heavy doses the norm?
Do you even know what dangerous dosage is in relation to Amphetamines that inspire a risk of psychosis.
Is this what manufacturers intended. NO. Unless you have more proof then your claims and poor interpretations, misunderstandings and personal prejudices inspired by your own mental health issues, then I will politely ask that you don't continue to rant aimlesly from your own point of view whilst twisting and ignoring large parts of my posts to suit your own beliefs.

Neurotoxins will cause damage, but its a matter of dosage of periods of time, as I explained before by giving examples of Meth, marijuana and alcohol. You fail to understand this and seem to believe the mere prescence of a nurotoxin will cause irreversable and permanant damage that will require neuroleptics. This is not true.

In regards to previous quote, here you write that neurotoxins are going to cause damage by merely being neurotoxins, where you wrote previously that they won't.

You are seeing things that are not there! Please read my posts properly. Your twisted interpretation can only lead me to believe that your cognition and perception are damaged.

Also, with experience in the mental health field, and presenting yourself as having a wide understanding, how come you aren't familiar with the French studies that find THC to be neuroprotective?Am i supposed to have read every study done on Marijuana because I worked in the health care field. Your point is asinine.
Marijuana is linked to the onset of schizophrenia. There is no debate overthis. This is a fact. Stop smoking it.

I did not write that the mere presence of amphetamines will cause irreversible damage that will require neuroleptics, I wrote about the prolonged, continued use. Do you not recall or are you trying to verbal me?

The prolonged and continued ABUSE of amphetamine may expose ABUSERS drug induced psychosis, which may require neuroleptics. The administration of medicated doses is not ABUSE. We have been administering amphetamines as a drug for decades.

Amphetamines are neurotoxic.

The human brain creates its own versin of amphetamine, also neurotoxins called , ever heard of phenethylalimine, acts the same as amphetamines. Neurotoxin. Fact.

Neuroleptics are neurotoxic.

They are also medications for severly ill people. You seem to totally ignore this end of the discussion and want only to discuss some imagined intentional toxicity designed to deliberately damage people. By ignoring these issues you are free to paint the idea of these medications as being sinister. Why you would do this is unimaginable given your are totally ignoring the health, welfare and future well being of the many severly mentally ill individuals who need neuroleptics to function.

Both are widely and commonly prescribed for the most insane of reasons.

This is your belief and opinion, I have offered mine that this is false, so there it ends. You are free to wallow in your own delusions if they serve you well, but only time will be the judge of that.

What does that say about people working in the field? The lunatics are running the asylum?

You should know. I have come across similar arguements to justify one ceasing their meds.

Yes you have raised this. You also raised the point about botox not harming the brain. This is MAYBE because a lot of neurotoxins do not reach the brain? These drugs are designed to reach the brain. And they are neurotoxic. They cause brain damage.

Read what you just wrote, neurotoxin work on nerves, if you abuse botox, there will be damage. People are not abusing neuroleptics, they are taking medicated doses. Problems with these drugs are due to the processes they INHIBIT, there are side effects to shutting down psychosis. We win by having reality return and delusions, hallucinations etc being relieved. This is what the drugs are designed for and nothing else.

These drugs work up a tolerance. These drugs can cause conditions which never existed to surface. These drugs cause brain damage.

All drugs work up tolerance, should we ban all drugs.
Many, many medications will bring other problems to the fore, high blood pressure, or lowering blood pressure for a modest example. This is normal for many medication and not specific to psychiatric mendications, its called a side-effect. These drugs, like ALL drugs, will cause damage in heavy doses or cases of abuse. Again this is not specific to psychiatric drugs.
Are you suggestion that we do not medicate anyone at anytime because we have these flaws and are not perfect.
Once again I will ask. What is your alternative. Please be specifc.

Giving someone drugs against their will is abuse. Giving someone drugs of which their exact method of action is unknown, whilst knowing it causes damage to the organ attempting to be treated is abuse. Giving someone a drug of addiction against their will is abuse.

Yes it is, I agree. Are you saying that a schizophrenic person who believes he/she are being chased by government agents because they have secrets locked inside their stomach lining and wants their stomach removed to stop the agents from comming after them(this is in fact a real story) should be accepted as being reasonable in his/her choice against neuroleptics, that to treat this individual, and many like that, is abuse?
If your answer is yes, then you really need to look long and hard at yourself. Long and hard.

It all seems like human experimentation. It is a crime against humanity.

To you it does. Have you ever considered that it is not what it seems to you.

Giving a doctor the power to detain someone against their will for personal reasons is abuse.

Doctors do not have that power, where do doctor detain people for personal reasons? Once again please tell me how your comment relates to my comment on liberating ones mind from delusion, paranoia, fear.

Calling somebody mentally unwell, and attaching stigma to silence an individual is abuse. It's inhumane. The profession has to be overhauled.

Is this what has happened to you?
What has this got to do with the discussion?
This is why I stopped before, and why this is my last post.

reply to post by atlasastro

Is this what has happened to you? What has this got to do with the discussion? This is why I stopped before, and why this is my last post.

I am happy about that, because you, as someone who is claiming to have experience in the mental health field, are absolutely clueless.

Do you even know what dangerous dosage is in relation to Amphetamines that inspire a risk of psychosis.

Have you heard of super sensitivity? Do you know what an athlete is? Athletes and other people, when in a condition of relatively high fitness, are super sensitive to most substances. When incredibly fit, a cup of coffee will have you absolutely wired. When of average fitness, a cup of coffee is just a cup of coffee.

Thank you for showing me that you, as an alleged mental health nurse, have no idea what you are talking about. I am grateful to the mental health profession, that you, at least, are not writing prescriptions.

Please do not come here, throw credentials around, and blatantly have no idea of what you are discussing.

A main tenet of this discussion was the effects on the highly gifted. With that comes heightened sensitivity.

Not to mention people who are in an extremely fit physical state, who are also highly sensitive to stimuli.

Once again.

Amphetamines are widely prescribed. And are neurotoxic.

Antipsychotic medications are proven to be neurotoxic and cause brain damage.

Is this what manufacturers intended. NO. Unless you have more proof then your claims and poor interpretations, misunderstandings and personal prejudices inspired by your own mental health issues, then I will politely ask that you don't continue to rant aimlesly from your own point of view whilst twisting and ignoring large parts of my posts to suit your own beliefs.

The proof is there. The substances in question are neurotoxic and cause brain damage. You are just a nurse.

Am i supposed to have read every study done on Marijuana because I worked in the health care field. Your point is asinine. Marijuana is linked to the onset of schizophrenia. There is no debate overthis. This is a fact. Stop smoking it.

I don't smoke marijuana. You claimed it is neurotoxic. Recent studies have reported it as being neuroprotective. Another point on which you are wrong.

They are also medications for severly ill people. You seem to totally ignore this end of the discussion and want only to discuss some imagined intentional toxicity designed to deliberately damage people. By ignoring these issues you are free to paint the idea of these medications as being sinister. Why you would do this is unimaginable given your are totally ignoring the health, welfare and future well being of the many severly mentally ill individuals who need neuroleptics to function.

These medications are dangerous. I am trying to help people.

Read what you just wrote, neurotoxin work on nerves, if you abuse botox, there will be damage. People are not abusing neuroleptics, they are taking medicated doses. Problems with these drugs are due to the processes they INHIBIT, there are side effects to shutting down psychosis. We win by having reality return and delusions, hallucinations etc being relieved. This is what the drugs are designed for and nothing else.

Please, how can you not understand. These drugs work in the brain. They are neurotoxic. They are toxic to the brain. Tardive Diskinesia is a problem that can occur from their use. That is clear brain damage. Clearly, these drugs damage the brain.

Doctors do not have that power, where do doctor detain people for personal reasons? Once again please tell me how your comment relates to my comment on liberating ones mind from delusion, paranoia, fear.

I gave an example of a person being threatened in an ED for making noise.

[edit on 20-3-2009 by randomnumbergenerator]

Is there something more at work here besides chasing profits? The diabolical nature of this seems to go beyond the usual chasing profits explanation.

This has an inky black, low murmuring evil feel to it. Echoes of Dr. Mengele.

cryptogon.com...


[edit on 23-3-2009 by randomnumbergenerator]

I'm on both Zoloft AND Adderall. I have Multiple Sclerosis and the Adderall makes it possible for me to get up and move instead of staying in bed feeling as if I have the flu.

I was reminded real quick the day I decided to wean myself off the Zoloft as to why I was on the Zoloft.

I have brain lesions/damage caused by the MS and the brain lesions in turn cause major depression along with reoccuring thoughts. Like my brain will not stop replaying some random thing that may have went on that day.

I have come to realize you cannot fix this type of depression without pills. Something attacked my brain and the Zoloft helps counteract the problems.
I have learned how to cope with it to some degree but cannot "will" these damaged areas to "straighten up and act right" with the use of alternative therapies. I HAVE to take the Zoloft.

Sadly I have to depend on Zoloft and Adderall to keep me alive and give me a decent quality of life.

[edit on 23-3-2009 by Bachrk]

I can tell you that I am bipolar and also have adhd. I get amphetamines, antidepressants, a sleeping pill, and an antipsychotic. These chemicals give me something to function with, whereas, before I could not function at all. These drugs have saved my life from having none at all. I don't like my meds a lot but without them I am haywire. I also recommend having a good head doctor, don't settle for a doctor who won't listen to you when you say it hurts. If a medication is really bothering you it can't be good. If you are needing to see the head doctor then chances are you need a counselor also, and a good listener/ puzzle solver is needed here, don't settle for less. If you are bipolar it can be life saving literally to take your medication, as severe depression can often lead to suicide or suicidal tendancies. However they do not make a pill for bipolar specifically, yet, so you must settle for something else that helps. On the ampheamine note, I can say that without treating my adhd problem I will exhibit serious bipolar symptoms even if being treated for it. So I take dextroamphetamine and it makes my mind much sharper and gives me an attension span longer than 5 seconds.

Originally posted by americandingbat
Anti-depressants saved my life, and have made it possible for me to have a life.

Are they overprescribed? yes.
Are the pharmaceutical companies immoral liars? yes.

Do SSRIs and other new-generation antidepressants, in combination with therapy, work for major depression? yes.

Blanket judgments are almost always wrong. And telling someone who can barely drag herself out of bed to brush her teeth that it would all be better if she just did some volunteer work is cruel.

I usually do not take prescription meds but I am bi-polar and an anti-psychotic saved my life! I would have hurt myself if it wasnt for this medicine. I dont agree with what the companies do or what they charge but their product did help me.

Have you ever considered the possibility that you have undiagnosed MPD and that these 'psychotic' breaks you experience are personalities beneath the surface trying to break free and regain control?

Facts are these medications are poisonous to you. They are harming your mind, the thing you are trying to fix.

They could give you a lobotomy and that would 'fix' your mind, but at what cost? It is destroying brain tissue and is stupid, and thankfully they don't do that crap anymore.

Did you check the link in my previous post?

Well having been on various psychiatric drugs for bi=polar I have never had any of this happen to me. I usually stopped taking one to go to another because of cost. I never had any problems or audible hallucinations before or after medication. I am currently on lithium and it's great. I feel wonderful. I am not ashamed of being bi-polar I am very well aware of it and I have learned how to deal with it. Most people are surprised when I tell them I am. I believe these medicines affect everyone differently. What may work for some may not work for others.
I dont like having to take a pill because I am not one to really take medications but I tried many natural remedies and they did not work, in fact some made me feel worse, but that was just me.

Yes some folks experience uncomfortable states of mind for extended months/years. Anxiety is the result of personal self-awareness conflicting with society's views and expectations. (whether or not you care to admit it, most people are more concerned with how other folks view them than how the individual views himself.)

Yes pharm companies have developed drugs that help alleviate the symptoms. You can take a drug or drugs... feel some improvement. Then comes the point whether you are strong-minded enough to feel the improvement, let go of the drugs, and go from there. Or continue the cycle of 'I feel bad, i need drugs because they are helping."

Pharm companies have billions of dollars in research of the human brain and psychology and physiology, but billions of research dollars does not settle the score... pharms are not the end-all god of human suffering.

Sure, of course they have to have benefits, in order to show at least short-term improvements so the patients will continue paying.

But they have not yet realized the full potential of the brain to see improvement, build itself back up, and grow from there.

The pharm companies really do know how to use chemicals to treat anxiety, but in the short term... without recognizing the true base of social anxiety (drugs can't fix that). Just realize that drugs are not evil... they are just trying to manipulate us to make profits.

Sure, if you are feeling horrible chronic anxiety, see a doctor and try a treatment. If it seems to help, use your rebuilt well-being to meditate on your own personal situation, and maybe try even quitting the drug while maintaining your analysis of your own self well-being.

Drugs are blankets to treat general 'disabilities' or diseases. Do not trust a drug or drugs to handle your personal situation to perfection.

Pharms can have their benefits, but they are not the end-all of your personal problems.

And yes, they are extremely over-prescribed and abused.

If a doctor told you you had something wrong with your heart and gave you medication that was cardiotoxic he would deserve to be shot. At least you can get heart transplants.

If a doctor told you you had a brain disorder and gave you medication that was neurotoxic, would you trust your doctor still? He is either an idiot and has no idea what he is prescribing, or he is knowingly causing you harm.

Natural remedies do work. Which is why medical associations and pharmaceutical companies try and ban them.



[edit on 17-4-2009 by randomnumbergenerator]

If anyone is still reading this:

Antipsychotics reduce the amount of available dopamine in, I believe, the frontal lobe.

Low dopamine in the frontal lobe is associated with schizophrenia. A clear link has allegedly been found between people with low dopamine in that part of the brain and schizophrenia.

These medications will make you mentally unwell.

The pharmaceutical companies want to make you sick because if they do they earn more money from more medication.

You all know that right?

And you also know these medications WILL, CAN and DO cause mental illness?

There are better treatments out there involving diet and lifestyle changes.

The medications make you crave junk food, and make you sedentary.