The DOW drops! Are you happy now?

reply to post by Helig


Well then you get to be happy now.

The market took it's third swing for the day and is back in the green.

OP, you should at least wait until the end of the day for this type thread.

As for the other part of your thread. Let is crash, let it crash and burn.

I won't be happy unless those that are corrupt, go broke.

reply to post by j2000


The statement I made "The DOW drops! Are you happy now?" was meant partially in a figurative sense. I suppose I should have clarified that to begin with.

I will only be happy when they do away with the archaic Dow system and replace it with a system that works.

Don't ask me what that system is, but there's gotta be something better than rampant speculation.

I am weary of the dead-rat bounces,the corruption,the manipulation,and the core beliefs that I have based my life and life's work/savings on being abused by greedy people and politicians who are taking up space that a good dog could have used.

I did it all "the right way" only to be rewarded with stress and uncertainty when I should be allowed to enjoy my efforts and in spite of it all,hope for brighter days ahead!

Until things are allowed to find their true "value" and people learn that you simply must live within what you can viably afford,I'm afraid that the bad news will continue but it doesn't give me any pleasure.

It's all happened too quickly and already gone on too long with no real ened in sight and even if you try to "ignore" what's happening,it tends to bite you in the butt in spite of your best efforts.

I think people are fed up and frustrated because they can't figure out how to make it all "better" again and that no ones REALLY wants the alternative to come to fruition.

Originally posted by vkey08
I will only be happy when they do away with the archaic Dow system and replace it with a system that works.

Don't ask me what that system is, but there's gotta be something better than rampant speculation.

What is the history behind this?

When life deals you lemons, you make lemonade.

Times may be bad, according to the MSM and all that are in the gloom and doom business, but people are probably happy anyway because they are spending cash instead or using credit cards.
I've noticed when I go out to dinner, fancy restaurants are so packed with people, you never would have guessed we are in a recession.

Maybe people are holding on to their cash instead of investing with Wall Street or the banking system, which in turn forces the MSM to paint a false gloomy piicture of the economy.
???
Maybe that's the plan.

Originally posted by Stormdancer777

Originally posted by vkey08
I will only be happy when they do away with the archaic Dow system and replace it with a system that works.

Don't ask me what that system is, but there's gotta be something better than rampant speculation.

What is the history behind this?

Watching what happened with Madoff and his ilk over the years, the Insider Trading scandals in the 80's. There's got to be a way to have a market system that a) Respects the free market principles AND b) reduces market bloat based soley on speculative practices.

Now mind you I am not saying do away with the Futures market. I am saying that in the general market, (Stocks such as Apple and the like) should be set up in such a way that not just 20 or so (i'm not really sure what the index is composed of) stocks determine the market index, but rather an average of the whole (all stocks traded for a particular session) Credit buys should be done away with and all transactions should also be monitored by an independent auditor (hell not the Government, but some company that does that sort of thing) and all traders be required to prove what they spend and how and when EACH day, not just at periodic times a year.

I have this really awful feeling inside that our market figures are not as accurate as they really should be, that the numbers in 1982 (the 800's) haven't really ballooned up so high as we see now (long term growth the market has done very nicely until the huge jumps in the late 90's)

I'll just state again, I have no idea if this could be done, nor how to do it, just that there's gotta be a way to regulate the market in such a way that it's not intrusive to the point of being government controlled, but also not permissive enough to allow for a person like Bernie Madoff to get away with claiming he's buying and selling for 9 years without so much as a hint of wrongdoing.

I live in a city. In the case of a global meltdown -- to the extreme that some very smart people are predicting -- I will almost certainly starve to death.

If we see the S&P fall another 50% or so (perhaps less), then that scenario becomes incredibly likely, due to pension obligations.

I do not want to starve to death; and ergo, I am happy every time I see the S&P post a gain.

Originally posted by vkey08
I will only be happy when they do away with the archaic Dow system and replace it with a system that works.

Don't ask me what that system is, but there's gotta be something better than rampant speculation.

THe Dow is a group of 30 stocks whcih represent the leading industrials in the country. It is not a system.

The S& P 500 is 500 stocks.

The Russell 3000 consists of 3000 stocks.

There are plenty of ways to measure the market. These measuring devices are not systems which can be replaced. Which stocks you use can be and are replaced on occasion.

As for this thread, I am happy when the markets go up, not down. These corporations you all want to go out of business are the same corporations that provide for your day to day living needs. I hope they do well. I also hope the cheaters get caught and the market gets reformed to provide an even playing ground. It is already happening if any of you bothered to look. You need to keep the patient alive before you can start operating.

The economic reality is not nearly as bad as the market performance. GDP down 5% while the markets are down 50%. I think this rally takes back to about S&P 500 of about 875 and a dow of 8700. Then we will rest before the next leg up a few months later.

Originally posted by disgustedbyhumanity

Originally posted by vkey08
I will only be happy when they do away with the archaic Dow system and replace it with a system that works.

Don't ask me what that system is, but there's gotta be something better than rampant speculation.

THe Dow is a group of 30 stocks whcih represent the leading industrials in the country. It is not a system.

The S& P 500 is 500 stocks.

The Russell 3000 consists of 3000 stocks.

There are plenty of ways to measure the market. These measuring devices are not systems which can be replaced. Which stocks you use can be and are replaced on occasion.

As for this thread, I am happy when the markets go up, not down. These corporations you all want to go out of business are the same corporations that provide for your day to day living needs. I hope they do well. I also hope the cheaters get caught and the market gets reformed to provide an even playing ground. It is already happening if any of you bothered to look. You need to keep the patient alive before you can start operating.

The economic reality is not nearly as bad as the market performance. GDP down 5% while the markets are down 50%. I think this rally takes back to about S&P 500 of about 875 and a dow of 8700. Then we will rest before the next leg up a few months later.

I did say in my second post that I was not quite sure how many it was.

And a question from a person who is a sideliner, why can't it be replaced with another measuring system?

reply to post by nonnez

I rejoice whenever I see the index going in the direction where it is naturally supposed to go: DOW joNes.

Originally posted by andy1033
Not until it is zero, will many of us be happy, lol.

We can all live in hope.

You and me both, mate. Until it is zero, I won't be satisfied that we have swept all the corrupt corporate thugs from our existence. Time to stop worshipping the dollar and start worshipping eachother instead. Peace and love, brother... peace and love!

By the way, I did a commerce degree and realised that I despised the very goal I was trying to reach. We all need to reset to zero and figure out a new way of doing business, devoid of the big-dollar and debt manipulation courtesy of the bankster cartel. It's time we put the Bilderbergers out of business for good.. don't you agree?

September 15th was nothing. You havent seen the market crash yet. I agree there must be blood in the streets before it bounces back. I expect it to happen in April or late Spring. I strongly suspect that the big five investment banks have an informal agreement to collectively buy stocks, futures, etc at times when the market is about to move down more than 300 points on the Dow in one day. This happened more when Paulson was around. I hope Bloomberg wins their lawsuit to get some answers. There is a lot of manipulating going on. The interventions to reverse the market direction seem to always take place in the first 1/2 hour the DOW drops dramatically or in the last 2 hours after the market has been steadily declining all day. I wouldnt rejoice though, main street is directly associated with the fall of wall street. China is catching on and by no means can they rescue us. That is B.S. A more sinister plan is in the works! "regulation?" "socialism?"

I expect a major collapse, but I don't get upset when things look up. Every day that's not the end of the world as we know it gives me a little more prep time.

There were a couple upturns in 1930 similar to what we're seeing now. Blips on the radar as the line gradually fell off the charts for 3 year and markets didn't recover for a decade.

Young people out there angry at the greed and corruption want to see it all collapse. Easy to say sitting in front of your computer furiously typing away.

But anarchy you don't really want to see. Starvation, disease, your neighbourhood run by armed gangs. Practically the first things you'll lose is your Internet connection.

If we're lucky, if we're very lucky, things will maintain some level of normalcy though everything will be downscaled to fit the new economic realities.

The time may be ripe finally for new political forces to emerge who actually have some interests that aren't totally self-serving. What has happened in the last year might make the population at large realize they've been lead down the garden path all their lives. This should a time of organizing and preparation, not doomsaying and waiting for everything to fall apart just so you can say "See, I told you so!"

Anyone who really is politicized is doing more than looking at what went wrong and who to blame.


Mike F





[edit on 20-3-2009 by mmiichael]

It really depends on what side of a trade I'm on if I'm happy if the market goes down. If I'm short via puts, inverse etfs, or straight short positions. It makes me smile when the market goes down and frown when it goes up. If I'm long switch that around. I'm all in cash and T's ATM and don't have time to actively trade so I guess I would rather see it go up.

Notice I said trade. I'm not investing right now, only a fool tries to catch a falling knife. There is a certain technical signal I'm waiting on to get back into a buy and hold mentality. IMHO any money put in the market right now should be considered thrown away like a lottery ticket or money you are willing to lose in a casino.

I've already got to say I told you so to the people I warned over a year ago when I moved into T's and cash.

I don't think we are at the bottom in the markets yet, and the past two weeks have been simply a Bear market rally. There are more issues that will surface sooner or later. No one has been indicted and punished from a major US bank or Insurance company, and I don't think money will come in until we know who is dead and have some confidence that there is actually some effective regulation/enforcement in the finance industry.

reply to post by nonnez


I get bummed when it goes up because I want the world to be punished. Especially USA. Any country that invented the Nickelodeon Kids Choice Awards deserves to go under.

Originally posted by mmiichael
Young people out there angry at the greed and corruption want to see it all collapse. Easy to say sitting in front of your computer furiously typing away.

But anarchy you don't really want to see. Starvation, disease, your neighbourhood run by armed gangs. Practically the first things you'll lose is your Internet connection.

That reminds me of that guy who wrote about his experiences living through Argentina's economic collapse. He basically said that anybody hoping for a collapse is either a clueless idiot, or a twelve year old pretending to be an adult over the internet.

reply to post by nonnez


I buy low sell high, naturally, so it depends on the day. If the day before I made a big purchase, I curse and throw things to see a big drop in the S&P (I don't buy DOW components, sorry). But for the most part since I am focusing on long term right now it doesn't matter, but the more down days I see the better the prices.

No real trader likes to see volatile irrationality in the markets, but we also like to see the true value, not inflated markets all based on bits of news "leaked" out -- which is what this last major rally was.

I don't take any joy in the dow falling! However, I get sick at my stomach when it rises because of BS rumor. My wife and I have been savers since our early 20s. We built a ranch out of nothing, we worked hard so we could take care of our son comfortably without working 70 hours a week a piece. We saved. We invested. And now, we have seen our 401k's and other investments decimated.

So, to all you 'eat the rich' whine bags! Go **** with a pointy stick. I worked two paramedic jobs and my wife worked tons of OT as an RN to build our savings. And now, just as our boy reaches his tweens and we head toward our 40s comfortable some scumbag billionaires wipes us clean and then our village moron in the White House says, "if you are makin' 250k, you're RICH!" What a knuckle dragging trog you 'wealth redistributors' have elected. You deserve the FEMA camps you'll soon be herded to!