Is God the good guy or the bad?

Is God really our Good Lord? Do we all have our time and he arranges them? If so, do babies of stupid 16-year-olds die at their time? I dont think that its fair that he decides our fates, w/o even letting us have a chance to live.

Since this sounds like an invitation to share my views on god, I'll throw an idea on here.

I believe it's all more complicated than my puny mind can possibly grasp.

I think the death of someone is less of a decision and more of a reflex, like when you are hit on your knee by the doctor, and you kick him in his groin.

reply to post by Alpha_Wolf


There is no good lord or bad lord. Maybe to lowly humans there could be god like beings (type 3 or 4) but there is no GOD that religion has told us there is.

We are each masters of our own destiny depending on the decisions we make.

Im speaking for myself when I say god is both the good guy and the bad guy...

I don't think anybody is here to have a pain free, challenge free life. One thing all humans have in common is suffering and it is this adversity which helps us to grow.

reply to post by dragonking76


I'm curious what you mean by reflex. I'm intrigue. -J

reply to post by Alpha_Wolf


Is god a good guy or bad? Well before answering that question we have to:

1. Establish that there is a god in the first place.
   
2. Establish that god is actually a guy.
   

To be honest, I think 'god' is whatever people want him to be - and everyone must be right in a universe full of infinite possibilities. So he's everything... good, bad, ugly, merciful, merciless, Jimi Hendrix Guitar!

IRM

reply to post by Chefj828


I guess I'm saying that 'god,' in all it's infinite posibilities, is comparable to a computer program. I'm not saying that it is, but that sometimes if(X), then(Y) is applicable. Maybe 'god' uses 'programs' to help him run things.

Most religious people feel that 'god' is very interested in their lives, and maybe 'god' is. Then again, maybe not so much.

I'm not capitalizing 'god' because I'm using the word as a variable... or a fill in the blank.

Originally posted by dragonking76

I guess I'm saying that 'god,' in all it's infinite posibilities, is comparable to a computer program. I'm not saying that it is, but that sometimes if(X), then(Y) is applicable. Maybe 'god' uses 'programs' to help him run things.

What? No 'else' in his arguments? God must have been reading page 2 of "VB6 for Dummies" if that's the case!

If(x)
Then(y)
Else(z)

umm... page 3

IRM

I guess I see 'god' as Slartibartfast

Great book, great bbc special.

Terrible movie.

reply to post by dragonking76


LOL, I firmly agree with you. Hollywood only know how to botch everything! Take a classic and ruin it!

I digress!

IRM

reply to post by dragonking76

I believe it's all more complicated than my puny mind can possibly grasp.

I don't know. The concept of god may not be that complicated after all. I mean, we can understand Quantum Mechanics, Atomic Theory, and even the way our own brains work. We know the basic components of life, and can now custom build organisms from "off the shelf" parts.

The tricky part is, the very concept of god requires that such a being be outside of our own universe. So it's hard to know anything definitive about such a being. What we can do, however, is falsify claims about god's meddling in our universe and show attributes given to such a being through belief as likely to be false by using what we know about the universe and our own logic.

Once you do this, you may start to realize that the vast majority of attributes assigned to god are merely anthropomorphizing projections of our own human ideals and frailties.

Indeed, this path generally leads to atheism as you begin to see behind the veil. Some still retain their belief in a god, converting instead to either a Deist, Pantheist, or other such belief systems. For me, it's easier to envision god as a programmer, and our universe a simulation. This seems to satisfy the major cardinal rule of God not interacting with our universe - yet still being the creator of it and yet outside of it as well. However, I tend to go a step further and strip away the attributes of omnipotence and omniscience from such a being. Elsewise, what use is a simulation if you can modify it at any time and already know the outcome prior to the running of the simulation. If god is not omniscient, then he would likely not interfere with the running of the simulation - so as to remove any taint of bias from the experiment. This means neither that he knows and loves us, nor that he even knows we exist. There isn't enough information at this time. God may also not be omnipotent, despite having created the universe. Programs have their constraints that prevent even their creators from having completely free reign over the program, despite having a debug toolbox or command line which allows them to preform miraculous tasks inside the simulation.

So to answer the OP's question: Is god either a good guy or bad guy; the answer is neither. God, as envisioned by most believers, is merely a figment of their imagination. A meme.

"IDDQD"

Originally posted by Lasheic

So to answer the OP's question: Is god either a good guy or bad guy; the answer is neither.

Exactly, the question becomes what the definition of 'good' or 'evil' is. We generally see good as many different things. Some would say that good is loving all living things. Loving only humans. Love in general. Altruism.

Some would say good is responsibility, or paying your taxes. Giving to charities could be considered good. Feeding and clothing those who depend on you, even if you are able to do this because of the 'bad' things you do to get your income.

Killing could be considered evil, yet sometimes it's good because it ends some form of suffering. War could be considered evil, yet it usually makes perspectives clearer in the end whether they be for good or bad. The line is thin in many areas if you really think on it.

As for 'god' being all powerful or all knowing, there is no way to know. For all we know 'god' could be some old woman sitting in a cabin somewhere on earth who dreams about things and they happen.(back to the HGuide references). I think Joseph Campbell had some good ideas on the subject. If you are interested in religion he's an interesting read.

One possibility is that 'god' makes changes via humans without their knowledge. Some who say they are doing 'god's work, may not be, and probably aren't. There either is or there isn't a 'god.' Immanuel Kant would say something like that, and not think on it further.

I for one believe there is, but not in the way most probably would. Misinterpretations are everywhere, and maybe that's the way 'god' wanted it to be.

Truth is the only thing we do know, is that we don't know.

reply to post by dragonking76

Exactly, the question becomes what the definition of 'good' or 'evil' is.

No... I was mainly getting at that god, as he exists in most people's minds, is not real. It's a delusion, a fantasy, and it's this anthropomorphic visage which is based upon projections of the human condition. Good and evil are irrelevant, or secondary issues at best.

I'm really not interested in what's possible, in terms of god. That's just baseless speculation and no better than what organized religion champions. I'm interested in what's probable, and figuring out what properties god may possess if he is real.

So first and foremost, the most probable explanation is that god does not exist at all. I have a belief in god, but understanding this as the first line of reasoning gives me an understanding and insight into the atheist position. Since I believe, I take the existence of god on faith, which is not a wholly rational position... and recognizing it as such, it I think is important to keeping speculation under control.

I don't actually believe that god is some kind of cosmic computer programmer. I merely mentioned that scenario as a capable rationalization of what we do observe about god based upon what we already observe within the known universe. God is not man, nor vice versa - so the logic doesn't exactly follow when making that connection. I simply thing that it is perhaps the most useful basic framework we have for the time being.

Good and evil are relevant to the original post, but I will continue the discussion on the existance of 'god.'

I would say that what is most probable depends on your perspective.

Why is it probable that there is no 'god?'

Is it probable that there is no black hole at the center of our galaxy? We have not actually seen it, we have only seen it's gravity.

Depending on your perspective: life, the universe, and everything could be the probable gravity of 'god.'

As for the "anthropomorphic visage," this is mostly due to religious texts that state the belief that 'god' made us in his own image, and has nothing to do with the probablity or improbability of the existance of a 'god.'

Thank you for your many replies. My opinion is that there is a God, but he is not the overall ruler of the universe, nor did he create it. Scientists are proving that you can create matter by exploding protons. God is probably the moderator, but I do not think he is very good. Like I said, he lets babies die before they get to "live". I am not saying that he wants them to die, I just think that he isn't very good on timing deaths and such.

reply to post by Alpha_Wolf


Well, I can't really talk about the Dad, but his son...

Just take a look at this picture he posed for back in the day:





I don't know about you, but any son that was allowed to take a picture with his favorite repeating rifle, probably has a dad that promotes violence in the world...

Remember the old adage: The apple doesn't fall far from the tree...


Verdict: goD is bad