Armor

Smithy, if we meet up when I get back to blighty I'll put your homemade plastic armour to the test with my 180 lb xbow
The arrows aren't bodkins (very expensive) but they have a degree of armour piercing (although the arrows aren't weight heavy)

reply to post by Northern Raider


I'd love to have the cash available to buy such gear and other luxuries, NR.

But when my total available funds for everything is just over 2K a year after rent is taken out of my student loan, you can see why I always follow a 'scrapheap challenge' train of thought to survival problem solving

I'm not complaining in any way though, as its a great way to learn to adapt and look at anything and everything in a 'multi-purpose' way...hence the idea of using HDPE chopping boards to make anti-stab/arrow armour plates





[edit on 5-3-2009 by citizen smith]

reply to post by WatchRider


You've got yourself a deal WR

reply to post by WatchRider


Bring your snowshoes on your return.
You didn't miss much at Whitehaven last week
I drove around but couldn't find the cannons,it was dark and I was distracted tho.

Not sure about this one.

Did I hear that the Mongol Keshiks wore silk shirts because if they were hit with arrows the shirt would travel into the wound thus making the arrow easier to remove?

reply to post by Nirgal


I've read about that too in a bio of Ghenghis Khan (A warrior-general years ahead of his time)...the fine silk fibres apparently wrapped themselves around the rough wooden arrow shaft as it entered the body, so allowing a smooth withdrawal from the wound channel...assuming that the arrow-head wasn't a broadhead that is

Although I'm not sure how effective if would be today as most modern arrow and bolt shafts are either smooth carbon-fibre or aluminium.

Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
FYI, a compound bow will send a typical arrow sailing through the same vest that will stop a 5.56 or 7.62 NATO.

I don't know anything about ballistics, but is it a case of a high-mass arrow travelling at a low velocity having a greater kinetic energy to impart at the point of impact than a comparitavely low-mass bullet travelling at a high velocity?

Would Teflon-lubricant spraycoated on the arrows have a better penetration capability?

I feel a need for a white lab-coat, clipboard, and a selection of large pointy weaponry coming on

[edit on 5-3-2009 by citizen smith]

I just put a broad head right through a half inch cutting board with my compound bow (Approx 300 fps). Target points did not penetrate, but if you're being "hunted", you're probably better off wrapping yourself in hay bales.

Originally posted by Unit541
I just put a broad head right through a half inch cutting board with my compound bow (Approx 300 fps). Target points did not penetrate

Out of interest, what material were the boards? what range did you shoot from? and what distance did the arrowhead prodrude from the back side of the target board?

The more info on tests like yours we can pull together, the better idea we have of what to avoid/expect in a bow-fight

reply to post by griffinrl


Aye, arrows and bolts will pierce ballistic armor, as will knives etc. when used to stab rather than cut.

Originally posted by Unit541
I just put a broad head right through a half inch cutting board with my compound bow (Approx 300 fps). Target points did not penetrate, but if you're being "hunted", you're probably better off wrapping yourself in hay bales.

Interesting, broadhead typically is middle of the road for penetration capability.
Target points? Do you mean the standard cheapo arrows with no real warhead or the actual points of the broadhead???

Body armor is too heavy and impractical for any survival stuation. Unless you have a well stocked bunker and don't plan on moving for a while.

Originally posted by Anuubis
Body armor is too heavy and impractical for any survival stuation. Unless you have a well stocked bunker and don't plan on moving for a while.

Flak Jackets are doable mate, I've had to wear one for xx hours at a time in the forces, and that was with the ceramic plates too!

Well ..'some guy' is going to be making a fortune with his new D30 shock absorbing gel..

Home made version is of course the good ole cornstarch mixed with water
'Non-Newtonian fluid'..
Dug from the depths of an old boring Physics lesson.(let's see..I'm *cough* 25 *cough* so that would be a little few years ago)
www.metacafe.com...

You could carry the cornstarch powder,an inflatable jacket nicked from the passenger next to you on your next flight/ferry trip ...See disclaimer..

OY.. Where'd the rest of my post go??

..cont'd

Fill life jacket with cornstarch powder to keep weight low,and add water when neccessary..

Remember to shake well before use.

Disclaimer: I do not advocate the theft of life jackets from Planes or Ferries as I'm pretty sure that would contravene federal laws pretty much everywhere..



[edit on 14-3-2009 by AGENT_T]

reply to post by AGENT_T


Bloody genius idea T

I'm not sure about the lifejacket though, as I imagine the cornstarch-fluid would all gather in a pooled lump at the lowest point of the jacket around your midriff, making you look like you have a pair of 'Pamela Andersons' (at age 50)

If you could fill a small series of 'cells' with the stuff...such as using ice-cube freezer bags that are filled from a spout at the top and runs through the matrix of interlinked bubbles

...like this:

iconceptz.com.sg...

and sandwich between two lighweight resistant layers, then I'm sure the concept would work as a shock-dissipating layer for added protection.

Not to mention that it could also make for an emergency foodstuff of sorts as its almost pure starch...wouldn't want to try and move too quickly after a large meal of the stuff though after the demonstration of its properties in that vid clip






[edit on 14-3-2009 by citizen smith]

reply to post by citizen smith


Yeah definitely a few stitches here and there to stop the jacket 'ballooning' in all the wrong places.

It would have to be watertight,otherwise the liquid would permeate through..leaving a large,sticky,white stain on your lovely black night-ops shirt.

You could inject it into your sleeping mat 'en location'...A little more support for sleeping and a rather spiffing bullet proof barricade...

Now you KNOW I'm going to have to test that now...

I've got a Gerber Mat with a slow puncture(dodgy valve).It has a cell structure to stop the 'PAM50' effect,I think the foam cell inserts might interfere with the bonding action of a high speed impact..but hey let's see.

Now where'd I put the bow and the video cam.?

Actually,a good test would be shooting a balloon filled with the stuff...
Maybe some of our lucky American counterparts could test this out with a standard .303 or something?

When it comes to Armor... its all about the layers.

Now lets forget talking about ballistic vests and plates. We are talking SIT X and you dont have one so you need to find some everyday stuff to make armor.

I found a method to make moldable flexible low level armor which can help protect against blades and will greatly reduce the damage caused by any projectile and will likely stop a smaller caliber round from any penetration.

Get your self a bunch... and when i say bunch i mean A HUGE ROLL of commercial or restaurant tinfoil...

THATS RIGHT TINFOIL!

First take a long sleeve shirt and pants. Begin layering tinfoil sheets shaped to your body and duct daping them to the clothing as a baselayer. Countinue to add more and more layers. For mobility keep the joints as open as you are willing to have. Trade mobility for protection here at your descretion.

Now LAYER THE HECK OUT OF IT. Go back and forth between a layer of foil and a layer of duct tape or paper.

You can also form 'tiles' of tightly folded tinfoil sections which are now thick squares of multi folded foil and use these tiles mixed with full sheeting.

The more layers the better of course. And other materials would be much better.... But if you need a little armor.... all you need is tinfoil and tape.

I know what youre thinking tinfoil? But with enough layers you will see that it provides decent protection on short notice in a SHTF scenario for little to no $.

Gets me to thinking.... anyone with a variety of caliber weapons and some land to test our tinfoil layers ? I would be unable to complete this testing.
How many layers to stop a .22?
How many to stop a 9mm?
A 7.62 nato?
Arrows?

I know this is gonna sound all Rambo, Arnie, but I can't afford to buy any armor. But I have thought ,maybe if under the right conditions the guy I have to take out to protect me or my family will have some armor and a better weapon. Maybe will have some cool toy too.

Even body armour is going Gucci now, and its getting talked about on the BBC which makes me think perhaps we need to be doing more prepping.?

news.bbc.co.uk...

[edit on 16-3-2009 by Northern Raider]

Originally posted by WatchRider

Originally posted by Anuubis
Body armor is too heavy and impractical for any survival stuation. Unless you have a well stocked bunker and don't plan on moving for a while.

Flak Jackets are doable mate, I've had to wear one for xx hours at a time in the forces, and that was with the ceramic plates too!

If you are talking about a full on collapse of civilization then most armor probably is too heavy. But if you were to ignore the projectile armor and concentrate on armor for use in close combat, you could probably use similar things to what medieval people would have used (they did have a lot of battles, I'd think there must be some degree of lightweight armor somewhere). If you only protected the chest, stomach and thighs, and maybe the neck, you've got a reasonable degree of protection there. Obviously you would be going for weight to be as low as possible, but you could probably make something. If you don't get some modern armor that would be what you are restricted to anyway, so it could probably do enough.

just my probably flawed opinion.

Not flawed!

Very groovish and on the button!

A brigantine is pretty decent was worn particulary by the reivers and other folks in a dangerous area such as the borders etc.

en.wikipedia.org...:Brigandine,_Italian,_c1470,_Royal_Armoury,_Leeds_(internal_view).JPG