Spare the Rod , Spoil the Child (today's youth)

First off let me say I agree that American kids nowadays are pathetic. Unruly, disrespectful, spoiled as hell, and just lazy. Yes there are lots of kids that work hard, keep their nose to the grind stone, and are good kids but in my opinion they are few and far between and even if they are they are still spoiled to an extent. But I'm more jaded than average because I'm living in Orange County, CA. I've never see so many pathetically spoiled kids in my life. It disgusts me as an American how I see some of these young punks both male and female living.

Secondly, our youth are simply a result of their parents laziness and lack of discipline. Sometimes good parents get a bad apple and no matter what they do their kids will be trouble or screw ups. However, 3/4 of the time it's because of bad parenting. I see it day in and day out. I'm 29 years old. I think there is lack of discipline in our kids because there is such a far reaching lack of discipline in adults. Adults are just as fat, lazy, stupid, spoiled etc. So their kids are going to be a product of their environment. American society is the pinnacle of materialism. We live like no other nation on Earth. We have everything we could ever want and more. That's the way it is on the top of the food chain. But we better be careful because there is always a hungrier "wolf" ready to lead the pack aka China and other nations who are more discipline, harder working etc.

I also think a big part of it is not only lack of discipline (physical as much as mental) but also the destruction of the family and the stay at home mom and working father structure that was widely embodied pre and post WWII. Parents spoil their kids materialistically out of guilt, lack of time spent with raising kids etc. Most American kids don't have to work for anything. Hell most adults hardly have to work for anything anymore.........want a new car? Finance it? A house? Take out a mortgage. A college education? Ask the government. A fridge full of food? Go to the grocery store.

Everyone loves to talk about our financial recession and the destruction of the US economy.................well the US family structure and our "psyche" has been on the same path of destruction for a lot longer and the ramifications are much more dire in my opinion.

Here's an example.......My fiance and I were having a BBQ with friends at a local neighborhood clubhouse. There were other BBQ's going on across the way. We had all our food laid out and tables set up. A mother and her child walk by and the kid drops his stuff to the ground and B lines it to the bowl of peanut M$M's we had on the table. He starts grabbing handfuls of hem, NOT just a few or one or two. HANDFULS! Then one of our friends chastizes the kid asking what he's doing. The kid drops the handfuls and his mom states they were invited to the BBQ but we reminded her it was the one down the way and not our private party. The mother was upset that we scolded her rude son and said "He's just a kid"! LMAO! This "kid" was cleary around 12 years old and chubby as it is. Even if it WAS their party that's no excuse for his behavior. You don't run up to a table of food and start grabbing handfuls of anything. Parents are #ing clueless nowadays.

Oh and I definitely believe in physical discipline. But when it comes to hitting a child EVERY parent should follow the rule nothing but the hand and nowhere but the butt. That is PLENTY to send a message to any young toddler. As a kid gets older there are other things that can and will work that have to do with physical discipline. I.e. running around a track, push ups, etc. You have to be creative and intelligent as a parent. Something many adults in our society lack. Any PARENT that slaps their kid in the head or the face or my god uses a belt on their kid is a #ing idiot and LAZY! I grew up with friends that were "whipped with a belt" and had their mouths washed out with soap. Some turned out ok and some didnt. But those two acts by a parent are unacceptable in my opinion.

Also disciplining a kid takes patience, reinforcement and EARLY ONSET. The latter is HUGE!

The key to disciplining a child is making the child understand there is a line, and crossing that line has consequences...a smack on the butt, time out, whatever the parent deems sufficient. The line needs to be consistent, as close to the same as to make no differance every single time.

My neices and nephews knew that I was a whole lot more fun to be around when they stayed on the right side of that line...cross it, and I wasn't as much fun to be around. The trip would end, or whatever might be going on...it doesn't take a whole lot to get your point across. I never had to resort to anything short of a frown and a "we're going home". Kids aren't stupid, they'll figure it out...just keep it consistant and understandable...and loe and behold, it works.

reply to post by Zosynspiracy


I completely agree with you. There is no reason to hit a child with anything but your own open hand and the only safe place to do so is their butt. Keeping it bare serves as an indicator so you don't cause bruising or damage in other ways that would otherwise be obscured from view. The last thing any parent needs is to leave marks (because they spanked through clothing) and have someone (like a teacher) find it. It's crucial to maintain a solid connnection between the child's actions and the consequence. "I took something that wasn't mine and got spanked as a result of it". There isn't any reason to use belts, shoes or anything else... your own hand really should be sufficient. Besides, how else can you guage the force of impact? It would be only too easy to hit too hard with an object. You are trying to reinforce a lesson, not beat them to a pulp!

I absolutly agree!!!!! I am the eldest, my next sibling is about 6 yrs younger then down from there. When I was a small child, I got a smack for anything out of line, actions, tone of voice, the "look' on my face whatever, by today's standards it sounds abusive lol, but it wasn't. Now, when my siblings were born it was no longer acceptable to hit your child, and they are the products of "time outs". Dear God, help the people that encounter them, don't get me wrong, I love them, but the attitude and disrespect are apparent. I would often joke that I wish I had my siblings parents, bc it was a very different experience. One time I was about 18 and my sis was 12, she started getting very disrespectful with our mom, and I knocked her against the wall. I'm not typically a violent person, I don't even need a whole hand to count the amount of times I've put my hands on another person, but all I can say is sometimes it is highly deserved and it definately teaches a lesson. Even today, they are adults, and continue to "have a mouth", with everyone but me . Somehow, they know how to speak to me.

Times are different now as both parents have to work. The stay at home Mom is a luxury that is not afforded nowadays. With rent and mortgages at $1500, utilities at an all time high, car payments, insurances (car, health, home), food and other bills to pay. There are very few jobs that pay over $10 an hour, and most of the people who did make good money have been laid off as their jobs are sent to India.

The idea of stay at home mothers is a concept seen only on 1950s TV shows. Women went to work during WWII, and many decided to keep working. If they wanted that nice suburban home, two paychecks were needed.

I was the product of working parents, and my grandparents helped out since they lived with us. (Not recommended as it took an emotional toll on my parents.) Physical punishment was the norm, and belts were usually used. I came out OK, but I vowed never to hit my children.

I also worked with troubled teens (and was a foster parent) who were beaten and some even had cigarettes put out on them as punishment. One can see another reason why I am against physical punishment. The boys would listen to me as I still meant business. I respected them, and they respected me. It is a two-way street, and they had to earn that respect.

I do agree that many kids are very disrespectful, but that was also true during the early 1970s when I was growing up. I had friends who would talk back to their parents at an early age. Telling their mother to drop dead, and other nasty things. Dr Spock can be blamed for letting children do what they want. I am not an expert on what should be done, but time outs on a small child do work. Obviously when they get older something else is needed.

I only agree with swatting on the rear to keep a small child from running in the street. They do not know that a car can kill them, but do fear a swat on the rump.

Parenting is a difficult job, especially with all the obstacles set up. There are so many cases where DFCS is called for bogus reasons such as making a ten year old do the dishes. (I actually read that in the paper some time ago, true story.) While I am opposed to spanking and physical punishment, I do believe it is the parent who must decide what courses and actions to take.

Originally posted by ryckE
I have to disagree. People that were beat as children are messed up mentally, I have seen it. I am 16 and my step dad used to punish me whenever I did anything wrong. I am against using an physical form of punishment, because all it does is teach the kid to fight back, or be scared of that person. I personally had to go through this and it just ended badly. I think a person should be able to punish their child with out hitting them or using a belt or whatever. I think that if you have to physically hurt your child to get them to listen then you are a bad parent.

I am 30 years old and I was spanked as a child and I feared the wooden spoon and I turned out FINE. I am not mentally messed up nor am I afraid of that person. I knew that if I did something wrong there were consequences. I see it all the time, kids now-a-days IMO are brats with NO respect for adults. They get away with everything because the parents are in fear of DCF knocking on their door. I am not saying beat your kid but a smack on the butt wont harm them. When I was in school the principal had a paddle and if you went to the PO you could very well be paddled.
Example. I was in Wal-Mart recently and this kid was screaming and throwing things out of the cart and the mother gave the kid CANDY to get them to stop. Now that kid needed a smack on the butt NOT candy. That kid will grow up thinking they deserve a reward when they are being bad. That is NO way to raise a child. I see this all the time in public and it drives me nuts.

I have to agree,

some kids are raised in such a way that they truly believe that anything goes and there are never any serious consequences. Sadly, once they have to fend for themselves they'll be in for a very rude awakening.

I blame the parents.

On the note of parenthood: you have to pass tests and tests again just to get a licence to drive a car, but any two people can put another human on this world.

I don't want to sound too negative, but sometimes it's hard not to sigh and silently wish you were a long way away

just my two cents

About schools, kids would fight back in anyone in the school system hit them. I can safely say that no amount of physical punishment would stop these kids from getting revenge on the school officials that hurt them.

I am an unusual case, but I was terrified of our schools version of detention in elementary school and middle school, to the point where it was unhealthy. My mom never cared that much when I did get in trouble, which happened about 3 times, but it really upset me. To the point where I stopped hardly talking or acting like a normal kid since I was afraid I might do something wrong.

But no one really cared or even talked to me, which is what disciplinary action should be about. They stick you in a corner with a worksheet basically to fillout for an hour and send you home to have a parent sign something for the next day. Not once do you have an adult actually talk to you and see how you're doing.

I have a cousin whose dad was physically abusive to his son and wife, and he has a lot of problems which seems to stem from that, and the dad was abused as a kid as well....so it is a dangerous path. Now my cousin is abusing drugs and alcohol and is basically getting taken care of by the state and probably the federal govenment.

If we're going to tolerate physical punishment, is society as a whole ready to clean up the mess and help these people get through their troubles that stem from a parent that is "too keen" on hitting their child? I'm not leaning any way, but it is an interesting question...


[edit on 11-5-2009 by ghaleon12]

In my school system back in the seventies, students were allowed to be paddled. The same students were in the office, getting their rear ends reddened with a paddle. If the system worked so well, one would think those kids would learn. If a parent wants to use physical punishment as a tool, that is their right. I, however, will NEVER raise my hand to a child or adolescent. It teaches that violence will solve the problem.

My mother spanked us, and now wishes she did not. It was a different mindset, but that does not mean it was correct.

If a child throws a temper tantrum, just ignore him. My friend did that with his little boy, and after the child stopped crying told him "After all that crying, you still did not get what you wanted." No more temper tantrums as the child knew they would not work. No hitting was needed, but patience in hearing a child wail.