The Whole Armor of God

ok, I will be the first to admit that I'm not that into religion, but I do consider myself a Christian.

I thought I would share my favorite scripture with everyone here as my first post- I feel it fits well with the times we find ourselves facing:

Ephesians 6:10-18:

10"Finally, my brethren be strong in the Lord and in the power of His might.

11 Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.

12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places.

13 Therefore take up the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.

14 Stand therefore, having gird your waist with truth, having put on the breastplate of righteousness,

15 and having shod your feet with the preparation of the gospel of peace;

16 above all, taking the shield of faith with which you will be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked one.

17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God; 18 praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, being watchful to this end with all perseverance and supplication for all the saints--"

Ok, I've started my first thread.. now I'm off to get some much needed rest.

reply to post by brohes


brohes:

Hello to you Yes, this is also one of my favorite passages. I think Paul is telling us to be spiritually alert and ready against the powers of the dark world and the spiritual forces of evil.

By the way, welcome and congratulations on your first thread.


Peace to you,
Grandma

reply to post by brohes


Absolutely beautiful. Thanks for sharing. It is so beautiful that our Lord did not command us to fight with tangible weapons but instead placed emphasis on the spiritual warfare and protection.

Originally posted by brohes
ok, I will be the first to admit that I'm not that into religion, but I do consider myself a Christian.

I thought I would share my favorite scripture with everyone here as my first post- I feel it fits well with the times we find ourselves facing:

Ephesians 6:10-18:

10"Finally, my brethren be strong in the Lord and in the power of His might.

11 Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.

12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places.

13 Therefore take up the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.

14 Stand therefore, having gird your waist with truth, having put on the breastplate of righteousness,

15 and having shod your feet with the preparation of the gospel of peace;

16 above all, taking the shield of faith with which you will be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked one.

17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God; 18 praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, being watchful to this end with all perseverance and supplication for all the saints--"

Ok, I've started my first thread.. now I'm off to get some much needed rest.

Hello and welcome.

You've picked a great scripture to start out with. I'd like to add some insight that I hope will help you.

This scripture can be confusing, because it states that "we wrestle not against flesh and blood", while the rest of the time in the New Testement you are being told to not be fleshly. Also, some of the language of this passage makes it hard to understand as well.

First it is telling you to be strong "in" the Lord. This people take to mean in his assurance, but it means just what it says. A kingdom can not be divided against itself. Surly you have heard that before. If we are to be strong in the lord, you must realize who the lord is and that you are in him, not awaiting him, otherwise you are divided against him.

Second, the "wiles" of the devil. Wile is a word that means "craft". It is actually the word that Wiccan is derived from. Craft means Sorcery, again confusing as in this day and age we think of a guy wearing a gnome hat casting spells with a magic wand. That is not what a Sorcerer was. The reason you have the imagery of them mixing up stuff in a pot to cast spells with was because they were making drugs or "potions". To beware the "wiles" of the devil means don't take drugs. Holy is another word many people are confused with. Holy is derived from Healthy. Make healthy the lord your god.

Third, 12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places.
You know the saying "My own flesh and blood"? That is what it is talking about. Why is that? You've heard "The flesh profits nothing" and this is true as the flesh is nothing more then a vehicle for the spirit. Jesus cast evil spirits out of people, not into them because once a spirit is external it is no more. Principalities comes from the word prince and power comes from Potent and means "to be able" in the sense of ability.

You've heard, "It is always the darkest before the dawn" or "the dawn of a new age". An age is roughly 10 - 12 Generations, but no more then 12. God doesn't count in years, but in lives. This is why you will see "and when ever the 1000 years should be full filled". "When ever" is not an accurate reading of measurement unless those numbers can be variable as in "He may save by many or by few". Also heaven, again many many people confused by this.

There is no heaven but the one you are in, as above so below. Heaven is not in the sky, but in your descendent's memory and those that new you. This is why Jesus says, "do this in rememberence of me". When the Jews lost someone, they had a mourning period of 30 days for the rememberence of those past a "Gathering to the people" building a new home for you to dwell, where all of the bad is not remembered, only those good things about you...Heaven.

Now on to the tough part because truth is seen not invisible and is the very reason we are not to worship idols. "Do not forbid the children to come unto me, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven". We are sending forth the only begotten image, one after another. The son of man is made as grass. He springs up, then withers down, but the grass always returns unless that seed is totally burnt up or "desolate" a dry desert. Burn up the seed, no more grass and this goes unto that man "woe to the one who's hand is in the dish with mine, it is him who is the betrayer" only remember this, Jesus did not partake of the bread or the wine only he broke it and poured it out, but did not partake. As a matter of fact he said he would never partake of it, never again, until it is full filled in his fathers house...our bodies. Our flesh, all of ours, is a house and a wondering tent. Who is it that will build a house for him? One not made with hands? Who has believed our report and to whom has the arm of the lord been revealed or "apocalypsed" too?

He is not a god who is far off, the one who is innocent and perfect. Here is the gospel and the good news. "Congratulations Mr.? it's a 7lbs 10oz baby boy".

The full armor of God.

Someone dieing on a cross is not good news and is not what Jesus told them to preach, not once ever. He told them to look only for the lost sheep of Israel and to tell them to repent for the kingdom is at hand. Repent means "Re think". The kingdom is at hand should be self explanatory, but it means "now".


Peace



[edit on 23-2-2009 by letthereaderunderstand]

The father rewards with wisdom and knowledge. This is the armor god gives you. As the quote says, it's not about flesh, so there is no need for such armor. But when fighting principles and such, wisdom and knowledge are the tools you need to do battle.

I wish I could quote this entire chapter. It's all great, but I'm going to highlight a few parts about the value of these things.

www.biblegateway.com...

8All the words of my mouth are in righteousness; there is nothing froward or perverse in them.

9They are all plain to him that understandeth, and right to them that find knowledge.

10Receive my instruction, and not silver; and knowledge rather than choice gold.

11For wisdom is better than rubies; and all the things that may be desired are not to be compared to it.

12I wisdom dwell with prudence, and find out knowledge of witty inventions.

13The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate.

14Counsel is mine, and sound wisdom: I am understanding; I have strength.

15By me kings reign, and princes decree justice.

16By me princes rule, and nobles, even all the judges of the earth.

17I love them that love me; and those that seek me early shall find me.

18Riches and honour are with me; yea, durable riches and righteousness.

19My fruit is better than gold, yea, than fine gold; and my revenue than choice silver.

Continues on down:

32Now therefore hearken unto me, O ye children: for blessed are they that keep my ways.

33Hear instruction, and be wise, and refuse it not.

34Blessed is the man that heareth me, watching daily at my gates, waiting at the posts of my doors.

35For whoso findeth me findeth life, and shall obtain favour of the LORD.

36But he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul: all they that hate me love death.

Of course, this wisdom comes from the father. Thus, armor of God.

Not a fan of Paul, but that is probably my favorite quote from him. Just wonder who's side he is on.



[edit on 23-2-2009 by badmedia]

Yea I love this passage.

Today is the age of arrogance and pride. This is the exact age before antichrist st Paul talked about. Pround boastfull arrogant, thinking they are the king of realness age that antichrist will be just like.

so this age will accpet him.


Now what it also might mean is that, I read a prophecy somewhere saying mans intellect will be doubled every couple years near the end, maybee because of possesion and satan who is the smartest angel.


So this technology age is from that, and so to put on Gods armor in todays age, we need ..


1. To stay in the stae of grace. go to confession

2. pray the rosary. (catholic speaking)

3. Read what the saints say about these times

4. Wear the scapular.



Satan is very tricky, very smart, yet stupid in his own lies. So this age many people will lose the faith. Satan goes out as I heard from the saints, I think he tries and gets people to commit suicide, despair, whatever ways he works on souls he does and you need all God you can get.


Think of it like, the higher you climb to God, satan sees you and has you marked down to double his efforts. Yet worldy people who he has already, he doesn't even bother with.

so they never experience the struggle like Christians do spiritually.



anyways love tha passage.

Originally posted by JesusisTruth

Yea I love this passage.

Today is the age of arrogance and pride. This is the exact age before antichrist st Paul talked about. Pround boastfull arrogant, thinking they are the king of realness age that antichrist will be just like.

so this age will accpet him.

Today is the age of arrogance and pride? Have you ever read history? Acting like these things are new is silly.

Do you forget who is and always has been the power of this world? Do you forget who had the power to offer Jesus the entire world if he would worship him?

Now what it also might mean is that, I read a prophecy somewhere saying mans intellect will be doubled every couple years near the end, maybee because of possesion and satan who is the smartest angel.

Ignorance. Read what I gave you before. God is the one who rewards with wisdom, knowledge and understanding. Satan wants to keep people ignorant so they are more easily deceived. Just like you.

So this technology age is from that, and so to put on Gods armor in todays age, we need ..

1. To stay in the stae of grace. go to confession

2. pray the rosary. (catholic speaking)

3. Read what the saints say about these times

4. Wear the scapular.

More lies. Again read what I already gave you. The father does not give as this world does. And so if you think God's armor is physical in anyway, then you are deceived.

Satan is very tricky, very smart, yet stupid in his own lies. So this age many people will lose the faith. Satan goes out as I heard from the saints, I think he tries and gets people to commit suicide, despair, whatever ways he works on souls he does and you need all God you can get.

People lose faith because they start to realize all the manipulation and hypocrisy. Satan's biggest secret is that he is a Christian. He loves the Christian religion that puts all the meanings into idols and the physical instead of the message and teachings because that is what enables him to become the anti-christ. As all the spiritually blind people who look to the physical will accept him. Catholic church leads the way.

Quite a large demon you have there.

Oh I'm decieved and have a large demon.

why because I believe in the catholic faith which put your bible together and existed 1500 years before any protestant church?

The fact is that communion is biblical. Confession is and many other catholic doctrines. It is the church of christ predicted in the OT and has created tons of saints who raised the dead.

you are the one who I can tell by your post passing judgement.




When I said it's the age of pride, I'm going on st Pauls own words. Saying towards the end pride and arrogance will succeed any age prior to it. Kids at an all time high rebel against their parents, the culture has gotten worse even since the 90s.





again you call me ignorant for saying that technology and smarts is bad. Brother read the context.

I meant that idol minds combined with the itellect satan gives people creates as the bible says a devils workshop.

I'm talking about mans intellect doubling for our own destruction, not wisdom.




Satan is not a christian either. Hypoicrasy is in all forms of life. In gov. In churches, in most men. But the teachings of truth stay the same. Nobody leaves church because of hypocrites. If so then they had no faith to begin with and look for a cop out.


And the things I mentioned, God will show you after death, the rosary is not pyhsical, it's a group of prayers formulated to the blessed mother for help.

and the scapular is a sign of the end times, just as saint paul used relics and the OT itseelf talked about creating a brazen serpent for a sign.

so you're dead wrong. She was allowed the scapular as a counter to the mark of the beast.


the armor of God is all spiritual, but the scapular while seems physical has a signifigant meaning behind it. God did the same thing in the OT by creating angels to place in the temple, statues, and brazen serpents.


peace.

Originally posted by JesusisTruth

Oh I'm decieved and have a large demon.

why because I believe in the catholic faith which put your bible together and existed 1500 years before any protestant church?

The fact is that communion is biblical. Confession is and many other catholic doctrines. It is the church of christ predicted in the OT and has created tons of saints who raised the dead.

you are the one who I can tell by your post passing judgement.

Yeah, that catholic church who killed anyone who disagrees with it. The catholic church that has worked in sin for 1500 years. The only reason the bible still exists in the way it does, is because it was FORCED onto people.

Sure, it might be "biblical", but it's not of god. It is of Satan. Who is the only power and authority of this earth. As Jesus himself even says - this is not my kingdom. And yet, I'm supposed to believe that this church and bible which has come to power and has been in power all this time, committed some of the most horrible sins in history and is nothing like Jesus is actually representative of Jesus - before he even returns?

As I remember it, Jesus says those who believe will be persecuted until the end, not the ones doing the persecution.

I have not judged you. I had judged you, then you will be getting punishment for it. You know, like maybe killing you and persecuting you like the church you belong to does?

Your church is the reason people have turned away from god and Jesus. Because the hypocrisy stinks.

And for the record, the bible doesn't exist because of the catholic church. All they did was use the Roman powers to get a version of the bible they wanted, and killed and rejected anything which didn't go along with it.

Furthermore, the holy spirit doesn't need the bible. I didn't learn from the bible, I learned from the source. I am a son of god.

When I said it's the age of pride, I'm going on st Pauls own words. Saying towards the end pride and arrogance will succeed any age prior to it. Kids at an all time high rebel against their parents, the culture has gotten worse even since the 90s.

Yeah, pride and arrogance like claiming yourself to be the father of all those who go to church. Pride and arrogance like putting themselves above others. Pride and arrogance like actually claiming to be doing god's work while committing sins.

Oh wait, that's Paul and the church for 1500 years. oops.

again you call me ignorant for saying that technology and smarts is bad. Brother read the context.

sure, no problem. If this isn't enough, then go ahead and let me know, there is plenty more where this came from.

Proverbs 8.

5O ye simple, understand wisdom: and, ye fools, be ye of an understanding heart.

6Hear; for I will speak of excellent things; and the opening of my lips shall be right things.

7For my mouth shall speak truth; and wickedness is an abomination to my lips.

8All the words of my mouth are in righteousness; there is nothing froward or perverse in them.

9They are all plain to him that understandeth, and right to them that find knowledge.

10Receive my instruction, and not silver; and knowledge rather than choice gold.

11For wisdom is better than rubies; and all the things that may be desired are not to be compared to it.

12I wisdom dwell with prudence, and find out knowledge of witty inventions.

13The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate.

14Counsel is mine, and sound wisdom: I am understanding; I have strength.

Only Satan needs to keep people ignorant, so they can be deceived.

I meant that idol minds combined with the itellect satan gives people creates as the bible says a devils workshop.

I'm talking about mans intellect doubling for our own destruction, not wisdom.

Actually, it's from people who see themselves as being of the flesh rather than the spirit. And so because they are blind to the truth, they do things based on the flesh and saving the flesh and do things in sin.

Satan is not a christian either. Hypoicrasy is in all forms of life. In gov. In churches, in most men. But the teachings of truth stay the same. Nobody leaves church because of hypocrites. If so then they had no faith to begin with and look for a cop out.

All foundations of the earth are off. Including the church. Satan is a Christian, because Christianity is the anti-christ religion. It was created after Jesus, in his name, and it then proceeded to kill anyone who didn't go along. Sound familiar? Isn't that what you wait for? Already happened.

And the things I mentioned, God will show you after death, the rosary is not pyhsical, it's a group of prayers formulated to the blessed mother for help.

Not true, God rewards with wisdom and knowledge, and that is given to me not, that is given to me before death. I am on this planet and this place by my own choice. I don't actually have to be here. And 1 day you will know that.

and the scapular is a sign of the end times, just as saint paul used relics and the OT itseelf talked about creating a brazen serpent for a sign.

so you're dead wrong. She was allowed the scapular as a counter to the mark of the beast.

The only thing that will save your from the mark of the beast is the key of David. Which is not physical, and if it was physical, it would be the US constitution, which was written in Philadelphia, the city of brotherly love.

the armor of God is all spiritual, but the scapular while seems physical has a signifigant meaning behind it. God did the same thing in the OT by creating angels to place in the temple, statues, and brazen serpents.

peace.

The armor of god is wisdom and understanding, so that one may not be deceived. PERIOD.

Yeah, that catholic church who killed anyone who disagrees with it. The catholic church that has worked in sin for 1500 years. The only reason the bible still exists in the way it does, is because it was FORCED onto people.

Sure, it might be "biblical", but it's not of god. It is of Satan. Who is the only power and authority of this earth. As Jesus himself even says - this is not my kingdom. And yet, I'm supposed to believe that this church and bible which has come to power and has been in power all this time, committed some of the most horrible sins in history and is nothing like Jesus is actually representative of Jesus - before he even returns?

As I remember it, Jesus says those who believe will be persecuted until the end, not the ones doing the persecution.

I have not judged you. I had judged you, then you will be getting punishment for it. You know, like maybe killing you and persecuting you like the church you belong to does?

Your church is the reason people have turned away from god and Jesus. Because the hypocrisy stinks.

And for the record, the bible doesn't exist because of the catholic church. All they did was use the Roman powers to get a version of the bible they wanted, and killed and rejected anything which didn't go along with it.

Furthermore, the holy spirit doesn't need the bible. I didn't learn from the bible, I learned from the source. I am a son of god


badmedia)




It might be biblical but not of God. That's a contradiction. Secondly the bible wasn't forced on anyone. Thridly you say worked sin? Don't you understand that you sin and there are hypocrites in every church. But it also has produced millions of saints.

you saying all of us and all good Catholics are evil sinners? You're insane.



The Catholic church has not killed for no reasons. As I recall the crusades and so forth were from defense of the muslims. Infact God did this in the OT. he ordered whole cities to be wiped out because he reads hearts and know who is not his people.


and btw the same church also condemns murder, it's still a commandment. So are they blatantly contradicting themselves?


and again you're talking about the leaders of the church, not the saints. Who didn't harm a fly.

You did judge me, you said I have a devil. You do too. You think sin is off limits to you? I am Catholic and I wouldn't persicute you, so basically you just bunched all us Catholics into one category.

tat's not Christ like at all.






(badmedia)

Yeah, pride and arrogance like claiming yourself to be the father of all those who go to church. Pride and arrogance like putting themselves above others. Pride and arrogance like actually claiming to be doing god's work while committing sins.

Oh wait, that's Paul and the church for 1500 years. oops.




The word father means spiritual father as a advisor of the soul. I call my dad father, you think God will get mad at me? No. Padre Pio was a stigmatist and a father. Yet he said himself that he was worse then everybody he met. So is that putting yourself above others? No. That's your ignorance speaking. They put themselves over in the fact that they are the ones who distribute communion and advise souls but are full of humility.

1500 years of sins huh? Yea well no other Christian existed those years but Catholic and orthodox. it's the church of God. You forget to mention the 1500 years of saints like st Teresa who gave her life for others, her entire life.

leave those people out all you want.

I also find it amusing how you turn pride in the end times to a way to bash the church. Your comment was WAY out of context. i was speaking about the end times.




badmedia)

Actually, it's from people who see themselves as being of the flesh rather than the spirit. And so because they are blind to the truth, they do things based on the flesh and saving the flesh and do things in sin.




Yea but this is not what i meant. Those people who are of the flesh, me included because I am human, I struggle with lust and so forth. Their understanding is blinded by sin, but this is besides the point as I was talking about technology and the age of destruction.



(badmedia)

All foundations of the earth are off. Including the church. Satan is a Christian, because Christianity is the anti-christ religion. It was created after Jesus, in his name, and it then proceeded to kill anyone who didn't go along. Sound familiar? Isn't that what you wait for? Already happened.






This doesn't make sense since I already stated that those crusades were in defense of the church. Now those who did kill unjustly since killing is commanded in our church to be a major sin, then they would be hypocrites.

we have had 50 antipopes in our churches history you know. Condemned by the saints and the hiearchy and finnally removed.


And the word christian is nothing more then a believer in christ Catholic means universal. And Christ did prophecy the church throughout the NT, and the OT calls this church in the future the bride of Christ and it was predicted throughout the OT.


Infact they also came together to break bread in that church on the first day of the week, which malachias said would spread throughout the whole world and Christ himself said he would create.


so if the church might be biblical according to you, then how is it false? this is truly more protestant, I hate Paul, garbage I see on the internet. pure lies.

paul was a saint. i cannot wait until detah when you sir meet Paul face to face and you see him standing next to Christ.




*badmedia)

Not true, God rewards with wisdom and knowledge, and that is given to me not, that is given to me before death. I am on this planet and this place by my own choice. I don't actually have to be here. And 1 day you will know that.



I agree! But this has nothing to do with my response. I didn't say he doesn't reward that stuff.





(badmedia)

The only thing that will save your from the mark of the beast is the key of David. Which is not physical, and if it was physical, it would be the US constitution, which was written in Philadelphia, the city of brotherly love.




No brother I didn;t say the scapular will save you from the mark, I said it was a (sign) given by Mary. God commanded Moses to make a statue of a serpent in the OT for a healing. It's a sign just like that.

The mark of the beast might be the micro chip, so only spiritual help will save you and a supernatural strength.



(badmedia)

The armor of god is wisdom and understanding, so that one may not be deceived. PERIOD



I agree. I wasn't disagreeing. I said that part of the armor is the sign God allowed Mary to make with souls.




peace.

Originally posted by JesusisTruth
It might be biblical but not of God. That's a contradiction.

No it's not. The bible is not the word of god, it is a replacement for the word of god because of manipulation. When I meet the father never once did he mention the bible. Never once did he even mention Jesus. Instead, he showed and gave me the knowledge and understanding that is contained in part by the bible. I was shown not to focus on the idols like Paul and the church does.

Secondly the bible wasn't forced on anyone.

Sure, and the slaves were always free because they could have chosen to walk away anytime they wanted. I guess the fact that they would be killed for doing so is no consequence? If you didn't go along, you were killed period. And those who were true believers did die for it.

Thridly you say worked sin? Don't you understand that you sin and there are hypocrites in every church. But it also has produced millions of saints.

The church has never produced a single saint. Not once. Not a single one. God produces saints, not the church. And true saints are persecuted. Any saints did so in spite of the fact, not because of.

you saying all of us and all good Catholics are evil sinners? You're insane.

Only good people need to be deceived. If they were evil, then they wouldn't need to be deceived. Yes, they are deceived and they do go to the church of Satan.

The Catholic church has not killed for no reasons. As I recall the crusades and so forth were from defense of the muslims. Infact God did this in the OT. he ordered whole cities to be wiped out because he reads hearts and know who is not his people.

There is NO justification for the actions. NONE. AT ALL. ZERO. For vengeance is mine sayeth the Lord. I seriously doubt the father ever told anyone to kill another person. If God told me to kill someone, I would tell him to do it himself. For the commandments say - do not kill. The entire "just war" theory is nothing more than manipulation of the devil. To get people to sin and walk the path of death and destruction. It is seen as 2 sins, not 1.

and btw the same church also condemns murder, it's still a commandment. So are they blatantly contradicting themselves?

YES! Because they also murder. They kill. I know you are trying to set me up for somekind of justification, but there is no justification. If you kill another, then you break a commandment.

And why would they do such a thing? Out of fear of death? To save their own life? And you claim this to be a religion of Jesus, rather than a religion with his name? A religion that follows Jesus and has their heart close to Jesus, rather than a religion that just gives lip service to the idol of Jesus while doing whatever the powers that rule this earth decide?

I think not. I look at the fruits(actions), not the lip service.

This is what the church can expect to hear:

20Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

24Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

25And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.

26And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:

27And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.

They do not do as he says. The things you speak of are done out of fear. Example:

Matthew 10

26Fear them not therefore: for there is nothing covered, that shall not be revealed; and hid, that shall not be known.

27What I tell you in darkness, that speak ye in light: and what ye hear in the ear, that preach ye upon the housetops.

28And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Matthew 16

24Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

25For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.

26For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

So the actions you speak of "in defense" is just people who fear what they shouldn't, and then try to save themselves based on that. And they sin because of the fear, because they break commandments and kill.

Plain as day for those who understand, Just as Proverbs says.

and again you're talking about the leaders of the church, not the saints. Who didn't harm a fly.

That is correct. But yet, all beliefs and support for these leaders come from what? The deceived.

You did judge me, you said I have a devil. You do too. You think sin is off limits to you? I am Catholic and I wouldn't persicute you, so basically you just bunched all us Catholics into one category.

You do have a demon. I don't say it very often, but I know one when I see one. You are only the 2nd person I have ever said it to here.

tat's not Christ like at all.

Oh, but it is. You just don't understand Christ. Think not that I come in peace. I do not come to compromise. I do not come to hold my tongue. I do not come to pat you on the back. I do not come to comfort you. I come in truth, and there will be NO compromise or peace.

For what man doesn't weigh the odds before taking on something? But there is no reward on this earth great enough for this soul.

Luke 12

51Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:

52For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three.

Matthew 10

33But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

34Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

35For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

The sword is the truth. Which strikes the lies of this world down, and will split apart those who live in the lie from those who live in the truth.

The Church views their salvation in the death of Jesus. As if Jesus is some Satanic sacrifice. They find their salvation in his death because they are of the lie. And they see Jesus as a sacrifice so that they may live. In this way, Jesus is a sacrifice of truth so that the lie of this world may live. And live it has.

True salvation however can be found in the path and example of Jesus. In his life, not in his death. The grace of Jesus is to do what he did when he didn't have too. And by following his example and doing what he says might you be saved. This is why he says so many times about follow the path and doing as he says.

Paul and the church take the focus away from this, and put all the focus on Jesus the idol. And act as if it is some "free gift", which is marketing 101. They take people down the broad path, not the narrow path. I speak of the narrow path.

Tell me, why didn't Jesus tell the rich man to just believe in him? Why did he tell the rich man to go sell his stuff and walk the path? But yet, according to the church all this man needs to do is believe and accept Jesus as his savior. Because it is the broad path and they just want all people for support of their goals and agenda.

The idol is built up so that one day Satan and the anti-Christ may take the role upon itself. Although honestly many of churches have done this by using the symbolism to lead people on that broad path in the name of God, getting them to sin in the process. For this is deception.

Gonna have to break this up into 2 replies.

Originally posted by JesusisTruth
The word father means spiritual father as a advisor of the soul. I call my dad father, you think God will get mad at me? No. Padre Pio was a stigmatist and a father. Yet he said himself that he was worse then everybody he met. So is that putting yourself above others? No. That's your ignorance speaking. They put themselves over in the fact that they are the ones who distribute communion and advise souls but are full of humility.

False. There are 2 births. You call your parents mom and dad because you see yourself as being born of the flesh. However, when you realize who and what you truly are, then you will realize you are soul and consciousness. And that is born of the father.

You believe Mary is a virgin. False again. She is and was not. Nor was it a "sign" from god. It is manipulation to keep you from seeing the real truth. People forget he denies Mary is his mother.

Jesus knew he was not flesh, that he was soul and spirit. Because of this, he realized who his true father is, god. The virgin is not Mary, the virgin is the father.

And so this is what it means to be born again. When you realize and understand this. When this happens, you experience John 14:20. This is a specific day. It even says - on that day you will know.

20At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

21He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

22Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world?

23Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

24He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

25These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you.

26But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

27Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

This is what I experienced and know. I highlighted 14:24 because I did not hear Jesus, I heard and seen the father. I and the father are one. Notice, this is specific things that happen to someone, and the holy spirit does not need the bible to teach, although you will find the teachings in the bible. However as I show, no where near the same context and understanding the church will give you.

1500 years of sins huh? Yea well no other Christian existed those years but Catholic and orthodox. it's the church of God. You forget to mention the 1500 years of saints like st Teresa who gave her life for others, her entire life.

leave those people out all you want.

I don't. But I will not be blinded to the right hand either. Btw, mother Teresa admitted to having doubt about it all, she just wanted to do the right thing and help people. I look at both hands, and I look at the fruits. The good people were that way in spite of the church, not because of.

I also find it amusing how you turn pride in the end times to a way to bash the church. Your comment was WAY out of context. i was speaking about the end times.

Your comment was out of context, as you put the end times and things as now, when the truth is it has been going on for nearly 2000 years. All the things prophesied about the anti-Christ religion were fulfilled with the formation of the christian religion. You fail to see it because you look at it from every perspective except your own. You put all other religons and things to the test, except your own. And this is what will make you a hypocrite. If you take a look at your own religion and history from the point of view of someone not in it, then you can see the truth.

Matthew 7

1Judge not, that ye be not judged.

2For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

3And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

4Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?

5Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

Cast the beam/demon out of your own eye, then you will be able see clearly.

Yea but this is not what i meant. Those people who are of the flesh, me included because I am human, I struggle with lust and so forth. Their understanding is blinded by sin, but this is besides the point as I was talking about technology and the age of destruction.

To sin means to make a mistake. But an error doesn't become a mistake until one refuses to fix it. Thus why you are automatically forgiven, once you repent(fix the error). If you keep making the same mistake, then you have no repented or fixed the error. All that is asked is that you learn from your mistakes. You do not ask for forgiveness by saying "please forgive me". You do so by fixing the mistakes. It can be a struggle, but over time it can and will be accomplished. If you fall in the ditch, all you need to do is look to the path and extend your hand and someone will help you out of the ditch.

This doesn't make sense since I already stated that those crusades were in defense of the church. Now those who did kill unjustly since killing is commanded in our church to be a major sin, then they would be hypocrites.

As I pointed out before, there is no justification. Justification is a lie. For vengeance is mine sayeth the Lord.

we have had 50 antipopes in our churches history you know. Condemned by the saints and the hiearchy and finnally removed.

And nobody thought to examine the system that allowed such to happen? Such a system is not a system of the father, for there would be no evil fruits.

And the word christian is nothing more then a believer in christ Catholic means universal. And Christ did prophecy the church throughout the NT, and the OT calls this church in the future the bride of Christ and it was predicted throughout the OT.

No, he did not prophecy a physical church. The whole thing with peter was not about founding a physical church on a rock. The true church is built of understanding and wisdom. Which is like being built on a rock. Because it is in your soul/consciousness, no man can take it away. It is in both heaven and on earth. This is not the only time Jesus talked about founding things on a rock. I quoted this earlier from Matthew 7, but here it is again.

Matthew 7

24Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

Infact they also came together to break bread in that church on the first day of the week, which malachias said would spread throughout the whole world and Christ himself said he would create.

But you are using words and things under manipulated meanings. Malachias was like hundreds of years before Jesus. All physical meanings put on things which are not physical.

so if the church might be biblical according to you, then how is it false? this is truly more protestant, I hate Paul, garbage I see on the internet. pure lies.

Because the church is not physical. A physical church/place of worship is a synagogue. You can call it a church, but it's still a synagogue. A rose by any other name still smells the same.

paul was a saint. i cannot wait until detah when you sir meet Paul face to face and you see him standing next to Christ.

It wouldn't bother me if he was. I do not judge Paul, I judge what is attributed to him from his writings. For all I know these writings could have been at a time when he was still learning. It could have been from times when he himself was deceived. He could have went on to write and know many other things and truly have changed his ways. I myself would be terrified if anyone ever took up my writings and created a religion based on it. Such is not the way. So if he is truly up there then he is routing me on as much as anyone else. But what is attributed to him is the same thing politicians do. In the writings, he is a wolf in sheeps clothing. For more information about wolves in sheep's clothing, and how you can recognize them, I created a thread about it:

www.belowtopsecret.com...


Looks like it's gonna be 3 replies, although the next one looks to be short.

Originally posted by JesusisTruth
I agree! But this has nothing to do with my response. I didn't say he doesn't reward that stuff.

Such are the only true rewards of the father, and worth more than any item on earth.

No brother I didn;t say the scapular will save you from the mark, I said it was a (sign) given by Mary. God commanded Moses to make a statue of a serpent in the OT for a healing. It's a sign just like that.

The mark of the beast might be the micro chip, so only spiritual help will save you and a supernatural strength.

I know nothing of such things. I'm not a biblical scholar by any means. I didn't learn from the bible, I was just given understanding, knowledge and wisdom by the father. I have been helped by others to find a lot of the things I know and talk about in the bible. I tried to find what you are talking about in the bible, but I couldn't find it.

I agree. I wasn't disagreeing. I said that part of the armor is the sign God allowed Mary to make with souls.

Again with the Mary talk, and I can't find what you are talking about exactly. I know the catholic church has some big deal about Mary and such, but as far as I can tell it's all unfounded because she was not the virgin, the father is the virgin. Jesus was born of the flesh of Mary and Joseph, he was born of the soul/consciousness from the virgin who is the father. Again, to understand and know this is to be born again.

Originally posted by badmedia
The father rewards with wisdom and knowledge. This is the armor god gives you. As the quote says, it's not about flesh, so there is no need for such armor. But when fighting principles and such, wisdom and knowledge are the tools you need to do battle.

I wish I could quote this entire chapter. It's all great, but I'm going to highlight a few parts about the value of these things.

www.biblegateway.com...

8All the words of my mouth are in righteousness; there is nothing froward or perverse in them.

9They are all plain to him that understandeth, and right to them that find knowledge.

10Receive my instruction, and not silver; and knowledge rather than choice gold.

11For wisdom is better than rubies; and all the things that may be desired are not to be compared to it.

12I wisdom dwell with prudence, and find out knowledge of witty inventions.

13The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate.

14Counsel is mine, and sound wisdom: I am understanding; I have strength.

15By me kings reign, and princes decree justice.

16By me princes rule, and nobles, even all the judges of the earth.

17I love them that love me; and those that seek me early shall find me.

18Riches and honour are with me; yea, durable riches and righteousness.

19My fruit is better than gold, yea, than fine gold; and my revenue than choice silver.

Continues on down:

32Now therefore hearken unto me, O ye children: for blessed are they that keep my ways.

33Hear instruction, and be wise, and refuse it not.

34Blessed is the man that heareth me, watching daily at my gates, waiting at the posts of my doors.

35For whoso findeth me findeth life, and shall obtain favour of the LORD.

36But he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul: all they that hate me love death.

Of course, this wisdom comes from the father. Thus, armor of God.

Not a fan of Paul, but that is probably my favorite quote from him. Just wonder who's side he is on.



[edit on 23-2-2009 by badmedia]

"What good is it if a man gains the whole world, but looses his soul?"

When it speaks in Isaiah 14 about Hillel (thought to be lucifer) falling. It speaks of why he is rejected, because he destroyed his land and murdered his people, and was therefore "not buried with them". Hillel literally means "praising".

With Jesus insight into scripture such as, the temple is the body and not a temple I am able to see that the "promised land flowing with milk and honey (a honey used for producing wine)" so more appropriately "promised land flowing with milk and wine" I am able to see that the "promised land" has never been land, but the actual dirt we are made of.

I see that the body profits nothing, but that the spirit and life that is in the blood profits mankind and so I am able to see why it is important that the "blood" not be on "your head". Head as in Chief, or Newest in charge.

If truth is truth, then God who claims such is not hidden, just as he says, nor is he a man, as he says, but all beings alive and dead are his, then it is no wonder we are to treat one another as ourselves, we all are the living temple of god who's spirit (which means gust of air) flows through all of us, and we are "ruling as god" understood as Israel.

"1Jn 5:6 This is the One coming through water and blood, Jesus Christ; not by the water only, but by the water and the blood. And the Spirit is the One witnessing, because the Spirit is the truth."

Spirit come by speaking, truth comes by full filling the spirit put forth...."my words do not return to me empty"...

Peace

(badmedia)

False. There are 2 births. You call your parents mom and dad because you see yourself as being born of the flesh. However, when you realize who and what you truly are, then you will realize you are soul and consciousness. And that is born of the father.

You believe Mary is a virgin. False again. She is and was not. Nor was it a "sign" from god. It is manipulation to keep you from seeing the real truth. People forget he denies Mary is his mother.

Jesus knew he was not flesh, that he was soul and spirit. Because of this, he realized who his true father is, god. The virgin is not Mary, the virgin is the father.

And so this is what it means to be born again. When you realize and understand this. When this happens, you experience John 14:20. This is a specific day. It even says - on that day you will know







I see what you are now, one of those david coreshes. First of all I never knew the bible before I knew God, I'm not learned either. And you seem to think you are the only one with the holy spirit.

secondly you just went off on a tirade about mary when I wasn't even talking about that in that qoute. I was talking about why we call preist our father. You see let the readers learn from this. This is how false prophets work.


They say they have the holy ghost, yet noone else does, and they lead souls astray.







(badmedia)


I know nothing of such things. I'm not a biblical scholar by any means. I didn't learn from the bible, I was just given understanding, knowledge and wisdom by the father. I have been helped by others to find a lot of the things I know and talk about in the bible. I tried to find what you are talking about in the bible, but I couldn't find it.






You see that's humility. that's good. It's in numbers 21. God commanded moses to make a statue of a serpent because the isrealites were being bitten by serpents in the wilderness and told them whoever looks on the statue will be cured.


God works this way by signs and statues he uses for rememberence. I am neither a biblical scholar and am an idiot, but I do my research.



(badmedia)


Again with the Mary talk, and I can't find what you are talking about exactly. I know the catholic church has some big deal about Mary and such, but as far as I can tell it's all unfounded because she was not the virgin, the father is the virgin. Jesus was born of the flesh of Mary and Joseph, he was born of the soul/consciousness from the virgin who is the father. Again, to understand and know this is to be born again.




Oh really not according to the NT new testamant. it says.


" Unto you this day the saviour born of a virgin "


Now mary was kept a virgin because she was the new covenant, the ark of. Like the old ark she wasn't touched. She never knew man her whole life, again after death God will show you this. False lies try and say otherwise, all I have to say to that, just wait and you will see.






(badmedia)


I don't. But I will not be blinded to the right hand either. Btw, mother Teresa admitted to having doubt about it all, she just wanted to do the right thing and help people. I look at both hands, and I look at the fruits. The good people were that way in spite of the church, not because of.



look at my post about the trintiy on our human bodies and let me know what you think, it's in my profile somewhere. Every orginization including the law God set up in the OT had it's hypocrites, yet the law itself doesn't change.

Those fruits you are attributing to hypocrites. Yet how come bad fruits were in the Old law like the priest of the old law? Did the law itself die?

The fruits of our church are the saints, not the leaders. That's why few popes have become saints, even though they lead office.

and the fact is st Teresa had doubts, but did she forfeit the faith? No. Because all the faithful will have doubts sonner or later. it's a temptation from the devil.






(badmedia)

Your comment was out of context, as you put the end times and things as now, when the truth is it has been going on for nearly 2000 years. All the things prophesied about the anti-Christ religion were fulfilled with the formation of the christian religion. You fail to see it because you look at it from every perspective except your own. You put all other religons and things to the test, except your own. And this is what will make you a hypocrite. If you take a look at your own religion and history from the point of view of someone not in it, then you can see the truth




Oh I'm the hypocrite? let me get this strait. You said I have a demon and that I am a hypocrite, yet you give me this passage?

How bout the passage that says.

" pray and love yourenemies "

You should be praying for me and not calling me that.


first of all I said that the age of technology is the sign of the final end. I didn't say satan has never been working which he has. Yet you say christianity is false and created by satan, yet the own scripture you use talks about a church jesus himself talks about all throughout the bible. Shall I get my passages?

what I'm saying is that God has allowed this technology to be created because of idolism and pride, it began around the early 1900s and is a sign of the final end


why?

Nukes for one thing because they can wipe the planet out in minutes. So think what you want.





(badmedia)

As I pointed out before, there is no justification. Justification is a lie. For vengeance is mine sayeth the Lord.




Yea but God said that in the OT and he commanded in the OT to wipe cities out by killing. So there is a such thing as justification from God.


what he means when he says vengance is mine, he means killing on personal opinion and on their own accord, not from God.






(badmedia)


And nobody thought to examine the system that allowed such to happen? Such a system is not a system of the father, for there would be no evil fruits.




Yes they did, it was after the antipopes got elected and then taught heresy in the seat of Peter, and then were cast out.

Like a wolf in sheeps clothing, you can tell them by their words. Like I said before every church and law had it's share of hypocrites. doesn't make the law itself invalid.





(badmedia)

No, he did not prophecy a physical church. The whole thing with peter was not about founding a physical church on a rock. The true church is built of understanding and wisdom. Which is like being built on a rock. Because it is in your soul/consciousness, no man can take it away. It is in both heaven and on earth. This is not the only time Jesus talked about founding things on a rock. I quoted this earlier from Matthew 7, but here it is again





No this is not true. They literally talked about building they went in to preach and recieve the bread and drink. This is false. And he also said whatever (you) bind on earth and loose on earth you loose in heaven, meaning the doctrines founded by the apostles in the later years.


He also gave certain souls the ability to forgive sins and retain them in John.

So no not only are you wrong, but it's insane arguing with you, because it's ciruclar argument all day talking about this with you.

The church is not founded on wisdom, because just like the OT law God founded a hierarchy and servants and servicemen. preist are talked about and the church with literal functions through the NT


and look at our churches fruits. No other church has produced saints from year 33 till now then the Catholic church, universal church, and those are the real fruits.






(badmedia)



It wouldn't bother me if he was. I do not judge Paul, I judge what is attributed to him from his writings. For all I know these writings could have been at a time when he was still learning. It could have been from times when he himself was deceived. He could have went on to write and know many other things and truly have changed his ways. I myself would be terrified if anyone ever took up my writings and created a religion based on it. Such is not the way. So if he is truly up there then he is routing me on as much as anyone else. But what is attributed to him is the same thing politicians do. In the writings, he is a wolf in sheeps clothing. For more information about wolves in sheep's clothing, and how you can recognize them, I created a thread about it:






Oh Lord brother look, I'm responding to this and enjoying the rest of the day.


Listen God would not allow people to create a church, HUGE church and then let millions of saints be decieved. Those writings themselves are in line with the sacraments of our church.
The sacraments are biblical, not only from Pauls writings but way back to the old testament.

So basically it was successors who carried out what christ himself said and told them to spread it. This is why Peter and Paul went to rome and that's why it took 300 years for it to become the state religion, because Paul and Peter had to build the faith in rome and finally the church was born and had it's biggest success.


the fact is that the church is spiritual. All we do is go into a building. the building itslef isn't the church of God, it's a temple that hold the sacraments and preist which are the church of God.

But he did literally create a hiearchy and organization just like the OT and those buildings hold those people.


I'll get the bible passages I wrote down soon and explain more later.


peace.

btw I just want to state that i don't know if badmedia is a false prophet or not, but the whole ( I am a son of God ) I go by the holy ghost thing he always says sounds like something false prophets do,


All of us christians have the holy ghost in some form or another and are sons of God, so because he sounds so singular about it makes me wonder.


Souls shall see this more and more in the coming years.


have a good day everybody.

reply to post by letthereaderunderstand


Actually, the truth is not really hidden. That is kind of the beauty of it, and something I was in aw of when I first realized the truth. It was always there. I just didn't notice it. I just never seen things in the same light before. Everything I learned and seen then was always there.

When I was learning it felt like synchronicity. Because it was like I would learn and see 1 thing, and then based on that understanding something new would also pop up. I was getting answers from just non-related things. I would be pondering something and taking a walk in a park. And something would happen that was not out of the ordinary, but yet had special meaning towards the questions I was pondering.

Today I realize it wasn't synchronicity, as they were always there. It was just me learning.

It's like my signature. The supply of truth has always been in excess of demand for it, even as scarce as it seems. People just don't really look for it, so it stays hidden to them.

So that is how it is "hidden". It's truly amazing. It's always there for those who look. A 1 bit of understanding can lead to much much more. The entire way I seen the world changed, but nothing changed about me physically.

Originally posted by JesusisTruth
I see what you are now, one of those david coreshes. First of all I never knew the bible before I knew God, I'm not learned either. And you seem to think you are the only one with the holy spirit.

If anyone ever thought about following me, I'd call them a fool. I am not the teacher, there is only 1 teacher. I am not to be followed. If anyone should accept what I say as truth, I will call them a fool. If they accept what I say as truth without understanding then it's just a matter of time before someone else comes along, and smooth talks them into something else. Such is the problem today, not my goal or point.

It's about discussion which brings about better understanding. Jesus says when 2 people are discussing him, he will be among them. Because that is how understanding comes about. For all involved.

secondly you just went off on a tirade about mary when I wasn't even talking about that in that qoute. I was talking about why we call preist our father. You see let the readers learn from this. This is how false prophets work.

I was explaining why the father is the father. I was giving you understanding. You explained why the priests do it, I explained why I do it.

They say they have the holy ghost, yet noone else does, and they lead souls astray.

Sorry, not true. The entire point is for people to learn and understand for themselves, not to repeat what I say as truth or fact. As I mentioned in my post, I would be horrified and it would be terrible if anyone turned my writings into a religion. That is not the point. Any fool can know something, the point is to understand. But what I ask is if people have the holy ghost, then why would it not teach them the same things I have learned?

You see that's humility. that's good. It's in numbers 21. God commanded moses to make a statue of a serpent because the isrealites were being bitten by serpents in the wilderness and told them whoever looks on the statue will be cured.

Well, I was talking more so about the Mary part, but ok.

God works this way by signs and statues he uses for rememberence. I am neither a biblical scholar and am an idiot, but I do my research.

I myself don't worry about what I say, as I am always given what I need when I need it.

Oh really not according to the NT new testamant. it says.

" Unto you this day the saviour born of a virgin "

The father is the virgin. You keep talking about the OT laws, but what about the part where God says he won't do things against the laws/physics?

Now mary was kept a virgin because she was the new covenant, the ark of. Like the old ark she wasn't touched. She never knew man her whole life, again after death God will show you this. False lies try and say otherwise, all I have to say to that, just wait and you will see.

Here's a story I once heard regarding the virgin mary as being a sign. There is this small town outside Chicago. The wind blows hard there, and it keeps blowing down there traffic signs. This is a pain for them to have to keep putting the signs back up, and it is potentially dangerous to people if they get hit by a sign.

So they have a town meeting to discuss the problem. They argue back and forth about possibly solutions, but none really stand out. Finally, this little old lady stands up in the back and says - "If you want to fix the signs, then listen to me". She tells them to bury the signs completely in the ground, and then the problem will be solved. The wind will no longer blow those signs over.

Sound funny? Why? It does solve the problem, but yet - a sign isn't really a sign if you can't see it. So how can anyone really know that Mary is a virgin? And are you trying to say that Jesus didn't have any flesh brothers and sisters?

Sorry, but the entire virgin mary deal is just to keep people from understanding the truth. The flesh of Jesus is born of Mary and Joseph. His soul and spirit is born of the virgin father. This is manipulated as such, so that people will not realize that this is also true of them. Because he realizes what he truly is, then he does not call either of them mother or father. When Mary and his brother come to see him and they tell him, he says it is NOT his mother or brother. Because he knows who his father is. As our souls are born of the virgin father.

look at my post about the trintiy on our human bodies and let me know what you think, it's in my profile somewhere. Every orginization including the law God set up in the OT had it's hypocrites, yet the law itself doesn't change.

Hypocrites rule the world, which is evil and all foundations of the earth are out of course.

Those fruits you are attributing to hypocrites. Yet how come bad fruits were in the Old law like the priest of the old law? Did the law itself die?

Correct, many hypocrites. Much manipulation. I only point out the bad fruits so they can be seen. I do not look at what they say, I instead look at the fruits and actions. And when I speak of the church, I am looking at the fruits of the church as an organization, not as individual members. But I know that a good tree does not put forth evil fruits, and I know the church does. I know the church and all it's traditions, it's hierarchy tries to replace and take the place of god and the holy spirit.

The fruits of our church are the saints, not the leaders. That's why few popes have become saints, even though they lead office.

These are fruits of the father, not the church. If the church was good and created only good fruit, then there wouldn't be another hand.

15Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

16Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

17Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

18A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

19Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

20Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

and the fact is st Teresa had doubts, but did she forfeit the faith? No. Because all the faithful will have doubts sonner or later. it's a temptation from the devil.

She was a good person period. Trying to claim she was good because of the church is just plain out absurd. She was good either way. You attribute saints to the church, I attribute them to the father.

Oh I'm the hypocrite? let me get this strait. You said I have a demon and that I am a hypocrite, yet you give me this passage?

How bout the passage that says.

" pray and love yourenemies "

You should be praying for me and not calling me that.

You are not my enemy. My only enemies are the wicked. Which is those who know the truth, turn their back on it and deceive others.

first of all I said that the age of technology is the sign of the final end. I didn't say satan has never been working which he has. Yet you say christianity is false and created by satan, yet the own scripture you use talks about a church jesus himself talks about all throughout the bible. Shall I get my passages?

It's not so much about the technology, as it is what it enables those of power to do. I don't disagree so much, but the technology and such you mention is not the sign you think it is. We have always been technology advanced. Meaning, we have always felt as those we were on the edge of technology. People thought SSN's were the mark of the beast, then bar codes, then credit cards, now microchips. Yes, there will in the end become a technology that fullfills it. But these things have been worked and advanced upon for years and years in our history. The attitudes and arrogance and things you mention have been around for a long long time. The end happens because the powers get to the point where good can no longer be seen. And thus when there is no more good here, it will end. The only question the father asked me was - do you want it to end. To which I replied - no, there is still good out there.

Yes, Satan will use technology to become as god on earth. All knowing? Yes, you see this now with spys and technology that bypasses technology. All Powerful? Yes, you see this now with a mighty military, able to rain down fire from the skies. Judgers of all? Yes, we see this with judicial systems that will put people to death and decide their life etc. I don't disagree. But you must realize these things are NOT new. They have been worked on and developed for years and years.

what I'm saying is that God has allowed this technology to be created because of idolism and pride, it began around the early 1900s and is a sign of the final end

And yet, there are more Christians today than at any point in history. You attribute these things only to today or in the past 100 years, but these things have gone on since before Jesus. We are in the same environment today as Jesus was. All the same things Jesus dealt with is still here today. Much of which comes from the church. Pharisees are just hypocritical teachers you see on TV, synagogues are the churches and so forth. The names are changed to keep people from realizing it, but when you look at the fruits the truth is revealed. A rose by any other name still smells the same.

why?

Nukes for one thing because they can wipe the planet out in minutes. So think what you want.

What I think is I don't care. If nuclear war breaks out, I hope the first one lands on my head. All our flesh will die someday, I fear not.

Originally posted by JesusisTruth
Yea but God said that in the OT and he commanded in the OT to wipe cities out by killing. So there is a such thing as justification from God.

I don't believe those things to be really true. Rather, I believe them to be things men have done in the name of god. Just like the crusades were done in the name of God. You think people weren't saying the Lord told them to do these things?

The father has never, not a single time asked or told me to do anything, except to follow the commandments. Although it wasn't go read the commandments, I was shown how and why to follow them. I recognize them now as the commandments. When I gave my will to the father, it was not taken. Instead, I received back wisdom and understanding so that my will can and would be in line with his.

Possible my purpose is different, yes. Possible my path is different, yes. I realize all things happen for a reason. I realize the evil is there to teach me the evil, so that I may see and wisely choose the good and so forth. We all get the lessons we need, and so who knows what lessons people will get. But I do not believe those things to be true, and I would never be asked to do such things. Because I know it is to break a commandment.

To say otherwise is IMO to say that the father is a hypocrite. Who doesn't follow and do what he says, and this I find hard to believe. Do we see Jesus doing these things? Nope. Quite the opposite. Dies rather than defend his flesh and break a commandment. The scribes can write whatever they want, it's not the father I know.

what he means when he says vengance is mine, he means killing on personal opinion and on their own accord, not from God.

So god is a hypocrite who tells people to follow his laws, but does not follow them himself? As I just mentioned, and what of Jesus? The father spoke through him, and he followed the commandments and does he do such things? No.

God is not a hypocrite. So that leaves me to believe that these are merely things done in his name by hypocrites, or people who didn't understand. Curious thing is god only ever tells a certain leader or person. And people follow that. Even GWB claimed to be doing the Lords work. Wolves in Sheep clothing.

Yes they did, it was after the antipopes got elected and then taught heresy in the seat of Peter, and then were cast out.

Like a wolf in sheeps clothing, you can tell them by their words. Like I said before every church and law had it's share of hypocrites. doesn't make the law itself invalid.

Changing the person is not changing the system that allows for such things. This is exactly the deception we face today. The people will build up a big system of management and control over our lives. And they will do so under someone they believe has their best interests at heart, and someone they believe is trying to do good things. And the people will give up their power to this authority for it. But then all it takes is a simple change in power, and then comes along someone else who will take this newly given authority and be tyrannical. Bait and switch. I noticed it in politics before I realized it in religion. It was actually that which allowed me to become involved and understand religion at all, outside my own personal relationship. I only ever equated the bible and Jesus to what people do in his name. Now I realize the churches and Christians actually do the opposite of what he says, while just paying lip service like politicians do.

The problem was not only the antipope, but also the system which you built that allowed it to power in the first place. This is exactly the reason I was told not to make a leader of myself, not to put myself above others. This is why Jesus tells them - do make or call yourselves rabbi's, for there is only 1 teacher. Do not make yourself masters, because there is only 1 master. This is why Jesus taught people they were the authority, not the scribes, not the books. This is why he REFUSED to become king or any such thing. This why God did not want to give man leaders and kings, but men demanded it.

That is the deception. And still today people fall for it. Building systems and creating authorities and giving away their personal responsibilities in exchange for it, thinking this is all in their best interest when it is not. This is exactly what Paul tries to do, making his appeasement to authority, talking of creating governments and so forth. We see what happened right after the Catholic church is formed, we enter the dark ages where the government and authority of the time killed those who did not go along. Fought and warred with people because they did not believe the same, and this is ALL sin of the worse kind. This is exactly what Jesus was saying he would know them not in Matthew 7.

No this is not true. They literally talked about building they went in to preach and recieve the bread and drink. This is false. And he also said whatever (you) bind on earth and loose on earth you loose in heaven, meaning the doctrines founded by the apostles in the later years.

You are bound to earth. Your soul is bound to earth for now. What you gain in knowledge and understand is here with me on earth, as I speak from it now, and will also be with me in heaven. Had nothing to with doctrines. All the physical shall pass away, including those doctrines. It says YOU, not the physical church, not scriptures and so forth. The knowledge contained in the bible? Yes, but not the doctrines themselves, which comes through other people and is filtered.

Jesus says anytime people are discussing him, he will be among them. There are tons of buildings on this earth, big deal. You don't need a building to discuss Jesus, and the church isn't even a discussion, it's preaching to tell people what to know, not what to understand.

He also gave certain souls the ability to forgive sins and retain them in John.

Where is this? Again someone trying to take the role of god on earth. All are forgiven they do not need to physically ask. A sin is a mistake, to miss the mark, to be wrong. To repent is to correct the mistake. All you are doing here is making people into authorities, so I'd like to know where it says this. I would guess at best, a soul might be able to point out the mistakes to someone and show them the correct way and how to fix them, which sorry is not a bunch of hail mary's, and isn't about certain people going around saying you are forgiven.

The church is not founded on wisdom, because just like the OT law God founded a hierarchy and servants and servicemen. preist are talked about and the church with literal functions through the NT

www.biblegateway.com...

This is for this topic. The entire chapter applies, I'm going to highlight a few things to keep it short.

1Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,

2Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:

3All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

4For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.

5But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,

6And love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues,

7And greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi.

8But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.

9And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

10Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.


....


8 And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty.

19Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?

20Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things thereon.

21And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him that dwelleth therein.

22And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon.

and look at our churches fruits. No other church has produced saints from year 33 till now then the Catholic church, universal church, and those are the real fruits.

The church doesn't produce these things, the father does. You would be wise to give credit where credit is due, and not give it to those where it is not due. Does a rose bush produce oranges every few years? And sorry, but god has produced many saints among all cultures outside the Christian religion.

cont.

Originally posted by JesusisTruth
Listen God would not allow people to create a church, HUGE church and then let millions of saints be decieved. Those writings themselves are in line with the sacraments of our church.
The sacraments are biblical, not only from Pauls writings but way back to the old testament.

Really? God wouldn't allow these things? I'm sorry, but the entire prophecy of revelation and so forth says completely the opposite. Christians won't be happy until their religion is the only world religion. Prophecy again fulfilled. Christians will travel the oceans to convert a single person. This Jesus scalds the pharisees of his day for.

So what you speak of exactly the opposite of what is said. God is not the bible. It is not the word of god, it is a replacement for it. Unless the bible just magically appeared out of no where, someone had to hear the actual word of god for it to even be divinely inspired.

So basically it was successors who carried out what christ himself said and told them to spread it. This is why Peter and Paul went to rome and that's why it took 300 years for it to become the state religion, because Paul and Peter had to build the faith in rome and finally the church was born and had it's biggest success.

Didn't realize these people lived that long. As I remember it, most of them were killed. It's biggest success resulted in the dark ages, a time of war, death and destruction and has continued on for 1600 years and is exactly what is prophesied. The roman catholic church is the first beast of revelations.

the fact is that the church is spiritual. All we do is go into a building. the building itslef isn't the church of God, it's a temple that hold the sacraments and preist which are the church of God.

Your body and flesh is the only temple of god, because it carries the father.

But he did literally create a hiearchy and organization just like the OT and those buildings hold those people.

No he didn't.