Astral Projection and Higher Conciousness Through the use of Convensional / Non-Convensional Methods

This thread is in no way promoting the use of drugs to obtain OoBEs, and as such, asks its responders to refrain from posting any personal accounts of drug usage.

It's been a little over a year since I started to delve into the world of OoBEs (Out of Body Experiences), Meditation, Inner Chi, Chakras, and all other things metaphysical... and let me say, I feel very enlightened. I have many members on ATS, and great personal friends, to thank for leading me in the right directions, discussing personal accounts, and giving me pointers I've needed to reach this state. The subject is much easier to study and practice when the information comes from reliable sources, which is why I've created this thread, to help those on this site curious in researching, studying, and obtaining higher states of consciousness and Astral Projection.

Let me first start by saying that Astral Projection is very much real, but it is only the door to whats really going on around us. One does not need to Astrally Project or have an OoBE to see or feel this reality, but if you chose to do so, take the subject very seriously. It is a very personal decision to try and reach a higher state of consciousness, and only you can decide the balance you need in incorporating these practices in your daily lives.

Now we start.

Meditation
Meditation is the most used, and most balanced, technique for focusing chi, opening chakras, and unlocking many parts of our mind. It is also the key to successful Astral Projection. I'm not going to talk too much on methods for meditation, or different mantras, because everyone has their own techniques. It is important though, so if you are unfamiliar with meditation, you can explore more on the subject by clicking the link below.
How to Meditate

Astral Projection
There exist many types of OoBEs, conscious or non conscious, but it can be argued that all OoBEs are also Astral Projections. Astral Projection is, simply put, your inner self ("soul") escaping from your physical body and existing in what is called the "Astral Plane." The Astral Plane is a lot like our physical world, but more beautiful and with less limitations. When you exist on this plane, you are in what we call your "Astral Body," pretty easy to remember.

We will go into ways of how to actually Astrally Project (AP) soon, but first, lets talk about what you can first expect to see and experience when beginners AP. Like I said earlier, expect a lot of the same environment. Most first timers appear/project in the room they are sleeping/meditating in. Things are, for the most part, the same, but objects may appear a little different because since the astral world consists of thoughts and intentions, many objects are in the form they were thought up to be, typically making them more beautiful.
Also, physical boundaries are no longer there, so expect to be able to float, walk through walls, that sort of thing. I would say flying is to be expected, but the first few times you project, you'll probably be so excited of what your doing, that you'll wake up before you get to do what you want, but flying is very possible.
Oh, and don't be surprised if you hear your name being called too, we'll get into that too.

When people dream, they are APing without realizing it, which is why APing is often referred to as "Dream Yoga." When you encounter people in your dreams, or while APing, those are usually real people, also sleeping or APing and not knowing it (I'll give a great example later).
When you don't realize your APing, or Lucid Dreaming (which is when you realize your dreaming in your dream and take control), your consciousness is asleep. That is why the first step in APing, is to awaken your consciousness while your awake. This may sound confusing because some of you are thinking, "if I'm awake, so must my conscious be," but thats just not the case. Somewhere along the road, humans fell asleep. This is easy to see by our infatuation with "things." When someone sees something flashy that they want, their mind becomes infatuated with that object and desires it instead of seeing what it truly is, just an object, and that person becomes lost in their own thought and not aware of who or where they are. This is something that, at extremely advanced levels, people should always be aware of, who and where they are, at all times. God knows I'm not nearly that far advanced yet... not even close.

[SIDE NOTE]
Many methods of how to AP exist, and have been talked about on ATS numerous amounts of time, ie: the rope method, or imaging your floating above or below yourself, but don't listen to those. Sure, they may work, but you wouldn't stand a chance of successfully APing if you jump into those without realizing the goal and concept behind APing, which is awaking your consciousness, so just forget about those. They don't matter. More than likely your first AP will be from awakening in a dream.

So, back to awakening your consciousness during the day. As stated earlier, meditation is a great way of doing this, but not the only way. To be conscious during the day, you should constantly ask yourself, "Am I dreaming?" Then, realize where you are. Right now, I am in the computer room of my house, which resides in my neighborhood, which exists in northern California, which is part of the United States, which is part of the planet earth in the milky way galaxy of our entire known universe. Wow. That should really give you the sense of how small we really are. Its an awestruck thought, and you should try and remember this when your driving, in school, the mall, at work, etc. It just gives you a good view on reality, and takes you away from the things we get caught up in everyday which cause us to forget ourselves. The same things that make our consciousness fall asleep, even when we're awake.

The goal of asking yourself "Am I dreaming?" during the day, and realizing where you are, is so that it becomes second nature, and you start asking yourself that in your dreams. When you ask yourself if your dreaming in your dream, you'll probably notice that you really are. Same goes for not getting caught up in fancy things. As I said earlier, when you get caught up in fancy things, you become awestruck by them. Instead of wondering what that thing really is, you just think, oh, that's really cool. When your dreaming, you tend to see some crazy things. If you realize that what your seeing is crazy, and not just become awestruck by it, you'll probably realize that your dreaming, and that's the first step to successfully APing.
Here is a piece written on achieving Dream Yoga written by the 2nd Dalai Lama:

The method of training in retaining dreams is twofold: during the day practicing an appropriate mindfulness meditation and at night applying the forceful method of the oral instruction.

The first of these involves regarding all objects perceived during the daytime as things of a dream. One must think to oneself, "These objects are but dream experiences and I must recognize this dream as a dream."

Practicing this mindfulness during the day will have the effect that at night when a dream occurs one will automatically think, This is but a dream experience." The stronger becomes the instinct of the training cultivated during the day, the stronger will become one's ability to recognize the dream state when asleep.
SOURCE

Also, before I forget, let me show you the passage written by Samael Aun Weor, which gives a good example of both the above, and meeting other people in your dreams, as we mentioned a few paragraphs above:

[continued in next post]


[edit on 15-2-2009 by Odessy]

From my memory—at his very moment—I recall another unusual case: many years ago when I was traveling through the countries of South America—since as a traveler I always walked from one country to another around the world—on a given night it so happened that I saw myself walking through a garden, then into a living room and through it, and finally I arrived at a lawyer’s office, where I saw seated at a desk a lady of a certain age, with grey hair, who very amiably attended me; she stood up and greeted me.
Suddenly, I observed that two butterflies made of crystal were on the desk—well, there is nothing odd about seeing two butterflies on a desk, right? Yet, the intriguing aspect of this matter is that the two butterflies were alive: they were moving their wings, their little heads, their little legs, and that is very odd, right? So, this was very unusual and intriguing: two butterflies made of crystal, and alive! These butterflies were not normal; it is clear that they were not natural, my beloved brothers and sisters, this was something odd; it was a case where one has to become very inquisitive.
Well then, do you want to know what I did? I did not become identified with the pair of butterflies, I only pondered the following question within myself: “How is it possible that there exist in the world butterflies whose bodies are made of crystal, whose head, legs, and wings are made of crystal, and that breathe and have life like the natural ones?” Thus, this is how I reflected, my beloved brothers and sisters.
What if I had become identified with the butterflies and not pondered an analytical question, without reflecting on those butterflies made of crystal? What if I had become fascinated, or enchanted, and had fallen into unconsciousness? Well, that would have been foolish, right?
However, I reflected, by pondering the following statements to myself: "No! It is impossible for these type of creatures to exist in the physical world. No, no, no, this is very strange, this is very odd, this is not normal. Here, I smell something fishy, there is something rare. This type of phenomenon, as I know, does not exist in the tridimensional world; since this is only possible in the astral world, it seems that I am in the astral dimension; could it be that I am in the astral world?"
Then, I question myself: "It seems that I am dreaming, it seems that I left my physical body sleeping somewhere, because indeed this is very odd. So, in order to be sure, I am going to perform a small jump with the intension of floating in the environment, thus, this is how I will verify if I am in my astral body, so let us see what happens." So, this is what I said to myself, yes brothers and sisters, with complete confidence I tell you that this is how I proceeded. It is obvious that I had to proceed in that manner and not in another manner, right? However, I was concerned about jumping in front of that lady; thus, I said to myself, “This lady might think that I am a nut case if I start jumping here in her office.”
Apparently, everything was very normal: a desk like any desk, the chair where the lady was seated was one of those that rotate from one side to the other, there were two candelabra in that office, I remember that one was at the right and the other at the left, they seem made of massive gold. So, I remember this with entire exactitude, my dear brothers and sisters, even though it happened a long time ago, many years, since I was very young in that epoch, thus, I remember that the candelabra were of seven branches. Well, talking here with complete confidence, I did not find anything odd in that room, everything was normal in that office, however, when I focused my sight in those butterflies they became the only truly questionable oddity there. As for the rest, I said: “There is nothing odd about this lady, she as normal as other ladies in the world; however, these butterflies make me intrigued.” The fact that they were alive on their own accord was very rare. Anyhow, be it as it is, I resolved to leave the room with the intention of performing a little jump, do you understand? Of course, I had to give an excuse to the lady, thus, I asked her consent to leave the office; I told her that I needed to leave the room just for a moment, and that I did.
Thus, when outside in the corridor and being sure that no one was looking at me, I performed a long jump with the intension of floating in the environment… and behold, let me tell you what happened, sincerely I tell you that I immediately remained floating in the surrounding atmosphere. Of course, I felt a delectable sensation, my dear brothers and sisters, a delectable sensation; then I said to myself: “I am in my astral body; here I do not have even the slightest doubt about it.” I remembered that a few hours before I had left my physical body sleeping in my bed and by displacing myself there in the astral world I had arrived to that place, to that office.
Then, I went back into that office, I sat again before the lady and spoke to her with much respect, I told her: “Be aware, ma’am, that we both are in the astral body.” Wondered, with sleepy eyes as a somnambulist, that lady scarcely looked at me; she did not understand, she did not comprehend, nevertheless, I wanted to clarify the situation for her and I told her: “Ma’am, remember that a few hours ago you went to bed, to lay down in order to sleep, therefore, do not wonder why am I telling you this; listen: your physical body is sleeping in your bed and you are here talking with me in the astral world…”
Yet, definitively, that lady did not understand; she was profoundly asleep, she had her consciousness asleep. Thus, upon seeing that everything was useless, comprehending that she would not awaken—not even with cannon shots, since that wretched lady had never dedicated herself to the labor of the awakening of her consciousness—then frankly, my dear brothers and sisters, I resolved to apologize, and left.
Well, as a curious thing, I want to narrate for you that many years after, maybe 30 years or more, I had to travel to Taxco, Guerrero, Mexico. Taxco is a very beautiful town, situated over a hill and built in the colonial style; its streets are stone-paved as in the epoch of the colonization, and it is very rich indeed; it has many silver mines, and many beautiful objects and jewelry made of silver are sold there.
I had to travel to that town because someone I was making some remedies for lived there; he wanted to be healed and wanted me to help him in his healing process; he was a wretched patient, very sick…
Well, I arrived at a house, I crossed a garden, and arrived at the living room, which I recognized immediately. There was there a lady; I looked at her and recognized her: she was the same lady that I had seen behind the desk many years ago in the astral world; however, this time she was in the living room.
She invited me to pass into another room, where I found the already mentioned lawyer’s office, where I, so many years ago, had arrived in my astral body. Yet now, instead of the lady behind the desk, it was her husband, a very well educated man who without a title was dedicated to the law (in some places these people are call interns); well, call them as you please. The fact was that he was seated there, in said office. He stood in order to welcome me and thereafter he invited me to sit down in front of his desk. So, I had immediately recognized the office and the lady.
Then, it so happened that because that man liked a little these sort of spiritual studies, we talked and conversed for a while on these matters; he liked everything related with esoteric studies. Thus, I surprised him a little when I told him:
“Sir, I was here already some time ago. I was out of my physical body, in my astral body, and you know that one moves, walks, and goes from one place to another.” This gentleman already knew a little about these things, so my statement was not unusual to him.
Then I told him: “See, on this desk there were two butterflies made of crystal. What happened, where are those butterflies?”
He quickly answered me: “Here are the butterflies, right here, look at them.” He then raised some newspapers that were upon the desk and certainly, they were there, the two very beautiful butterflies made of crystal... Of course, he was very astounded that I knew about those butterflies.
Then I told him: “But something else is missing. I see one candelabra of seven arms, yet I saw two. Where is the other, what happened to it?”
“Here is the other one, look at it,” the gentleman in his office answered me. He then removed some papers and newspapers that he had there and indeed he showed me the other candelabra, yes, it appeared in order to confirm my assertions even more. Of course, the man was amazed.
Then I told him: “I want you to know that I know your wife, because when I came here your wife was at the desk.” Well, the gentleman was amazed.
Thus, at dinner time we were seated at a round table and something truly unexpected happened: in the presence of her husband, the lady told me: “I met you a long time ago. I do not know exactly where, but I have seen you... Yes, I have seen you before in some place. Anyhow, you are not an unknown person to me.” Then, I immediately elbowed the gentleman and told him: “Do you realize it? Are you convinced of my words?” SOURCE

I love this story, and it’s a fantastic example of what we’ve been talking about so far. Once you realize your dreaming, a new world opens up. Usually, people lucid dream, and go about their dream, knowing they are dreaming, but not knowing they are Aping, but if you practice the above steps every day, your first thought will be, “hey I’m APing!” and so, you have the advantage over the person who doesn’t actively try to awaken.

[edit on 15-2-2009 by Odessy]

Personal Experience
Now, I want to mention my Personal Experiences with APing.
The first time I APed I was trying the aforementioned “rope” method (which I won’t even talk about because I think it’s a bad way of going about it) and I ended up falling asleep. When I woke up from a dream I was having, I was floating above my bed. I knew I was APing, but as I started getting excited I began to float down, towards my bed, to where by body would be. I knew from studying AP that if you go back into your body then you usually wake up, so I tried to concentrate very hard on calming down (because I was hella excited) and I gently pushed myself off the bed and floated upwards again. The best way I can describe it is what I think it would feel like to walk on the moon. I did this 3 or 4 times, and then decided I wanted to see if I could see myself in the mirror for confirmation. The bathroom was the next room over, so I floated through the wall, and looked at myself floating in the mirror, which I could see perfectly. Then I started hearing my name being called, or at least it became clear to me that my name was being called, and I decided I wanted to wake up, so I did, instantly. After it happened I knew exactly what had happened. It was an awesome experience. I’ll also get into why I think I was hearing my name being called, and why that made me want to wake up because it scared the hell out of me, a little later.

The second time I APed, it was with the method I’ve been talking about, and took me by surprise. It had probably been 6 months since my first AP, and after my first AP I started really studying the subject and found the method I’ve been talking to you guys about. So from time to time, I would ask myself if I were sleeping and reflect on where I was in the world, and then, for some reason, I just stopped doing, it, my consciousness fell asleep again.
About a month or two after I stopped practicing, I took my summerly trip to Israel, and one night had a strange dream. For some reason, on that night, I realized I was having a strange dream and said to myself, this can’t be happening, I must be dreaming, and thought to myself, “now’s my chance to AP!” Instantly, I was frozen in my dream, and everything around me became black. I was terrified. The blackness remained and I opened my eyes. I was in the room of the apartment I was staying at, but it was different a little bit. It was almost how it looked when I was there as a kid. I was fully conscious and realized at that point that I was not in bed, but standing in front of my bed. Now, it’s been said that when you AP, you can sometimes see your body lying in bed, and even a silver cord attached from you to the body, always keeping you connected to eachother. The first time I APed, I didn’t see my body, but for some reason I knew that if I turned around this time, I would see it lying behind me. I didn’t really want to see it, so I decided to wake up, and bam, I woke up.
The first projection probably lasted about 20 seconds, and the second about 5. Both times I knew perfectly well, during and afterwards, that I was APing, and I have not APed since. That was about 6 months ago.

Now let’s gets to those voices I mentioned earlier.
I had done a fair bit of research on AP before I tried it the first few times, and much more after my first success, and its been confirmed through other people’s experiences that what I’m about to say is real, and why I was scared when I heard my name the first time and decided to wake up. Many people experienced in AP say that at some point in time, you realize that you have guides, usually 2. Call them what you want, angels, etc., but I will say guides, as that is the term most commonly given them. They are with you at all times, and if you become powerful at AP, many people talk to them and even receive knowledge or lessons from them. Many people have very positive relationships with their guides, and even know their names. For whatever reason, when I heard my name being called over and over again, at some point I remembered that people had mentioned guides before, and for whatever reason, I was scared of seeing mine, so I woke up. If I ever AP again, I’m still not sure if I’m ready to meet them. I guess I’ll make that call when I get there. You will probably have to make the same decision at some point if you pursue AP, and that is entirely your call.
Dangers
So, we’ve covered a lot so far, now let’s briefly tackle one of the most common questions when it comes to AP, can you get hurt?
I say, no.
I’ve heard many scared people say that demons can possess your body when your APing because your soul is not in your body, but I call foul play. First of all, you are ALWAYS attached to your body, even when your not in it. Call it the silver cord, call it whatever you want, when you want to go back in, you can, and do, no questions. Its YOUR body!

This is what Samael Aun Weor says about it:

Is Astral Projection dangerous?
Samael Aun Weor: It seems to me that to become cognizant of one’s own natural phenomena can never be dangerous; one must become cognizant of the food that one eats, of what one drinks, of the state in which one’s health is and also of the process of astral projection that occurs in any living creature.
SOURCE

What I get from this statement is that AP is an everyday occurrence. It happens when we sleep every night, and it has to happen if we are to gain very high levels of consciousness, so as a natural process for humans, it can’t be harmful.
BUT, let me make one thing clear, I personally believe that you can encounter some scary sh*t APing. You are discovering the world behind the physical, where spirits come to visit, learn, and exist. I think that if you choose to explore certain areas, you may encounter things that scare the hell out of you. More than likely, if you ever do, you’ll just wake up, but I think it’s a choice to see those things, and if you do, they can do no physical harm to you whatsoever, you may just be too scared to AP again… but don’t let that dissuade you because APing is awesome and I think one would really have to go looking for those things. Personally, I don’t think I will ever encounter anything like that because I would only explore things that are good, and I think things that are evil hold little power over that which is good.


[edit on 15-2-2009 by Odessy]

Drugs
Now I want to talk about the disclaimer I put at the top of the OP, and an unconventional way of Astrally Projecting to the next level through the use of drugs.
I am not condoning the use of these drugs, and I will only mention examples from a well known scientist that was once governmentally funded, until they found out he was open sourcing all of his material, we’ll get to him really soon, you guys will love him. He is the king of open sourcing.
The drug I want to talk about is '___' (dimethyltryptamine). I mention it, because as I will eventually point out, it has many similarities of APing, is in DIRECT relation with dreaming (which is APing), and paints a clear picture of what may really be out there. It is also important in the study of Astral Projection because '___' is a NATURAL substance that your brain (pineal gland) produces every night and what makes you dream. It is also found in almost every living organism! This substance causes you to dream and you AP every time you dream!

Alex Shulgin, a name you should all look up online. Here’s the short version. He’s a brilliant man that was funded by the govt. to make all types of drugs for them. He created MDMA, 2CB, and about 230 other drugs. This was great, until the govt. found out he was open sourcing all of his research to the public. When they found out, they pulled the project and his funding. He is the author of several books, and gives lectures every year at a number of places, including Burning Man. He is married to a very famous therapist.

I want to mention one of a series of two books he authored PiHKAL and TiHKAL (Phenethylamines i Have Known And Loved, and Tryptamines i Have Known And Loved). We’re going to be talking about TiHKAL. In those books, he researches many psychedelic drugs and writes AMAZING descriptions of his experienced in a very scientific manor. He is such a brilliant man.

This is one (of many) experiences with '___' he recorded in his scientific journal, TiHKAL:

(with 100 mg, smoked) "As I exhaled I became terribly afraid, my heart very rapid and strong, palms sweating. A terrible sense of dread and doom filled me -- I knew what was happening, I knew I couldn't stop it, but it was so devastating; I was being destroyed -- all that was familiar, all reference points, all identity -- all viciously shattered in a few seconds. I couldn't even mourn the loss -- there was no one left to do the mourning. Up, up, out, out, eyes closed, I am at the speed of light, expanding, expanding, expanding, faster and faster until I have become so large that I no longer exist -- my speed is so great that everything has come to a stop -- here I gaze upon the entire universe."
SOURCE

This experience mimics many others from many different people. It is the one psychedelic drug that people report to have the same experience; they get transported to another dimension, talk to an alien/Buddha like figure, and see the universe. I mention this drug for many reasons relating to AP. Firstly, he mentions his feelings of fear, before he was witness to the universe. This is exactly how I felt when I realized I was dreaming and then everything turned black around me and I was frozen. Secondly, many people claim to speak to a god like figure. When you AP, you can talk to guides. The only stories I’ve heard of the god like figure is kind, welcoming, and tells that person to “let it all in” or “not give into astonishment,” as in the case of comedian Joe Rogan:

Lastly, and most importantly, I think that this god like figure, the witnessing of the universe, and just being able to go to this place in our minds is part of the big picture that the doors of AP only begin to take you to.
The Buddhist monks say that '___' is the closest you can get to reaching the first stage of death, and '___' is also produced in an absurd quantity right before humans die. The similarities are absurd.

American psychedelic pioneer and '___' guru Terence McKenna gave '___' to a Tibetan Buddhist monk, and after the experience was over, the monk told McKenna that it brought him to a place the Buddhists had seen many times through meditation, but he also stated that it was about as far as one could go into the Bardo and still return to the physical plane afterward. Jesus Christ and other biblical prophets used fasting and sleep deprivation to achieve mystical states and have the visions upon which the Bible is based. Sleep deprivation increases endogenous '___' levels, and this triggers these transcendent visions and religious experiences. Buddhists and Hindus have the same experiences through meditation, and the South American shamans use their sacred '___'-containing brews to break into the same space. The emerging networks of entheogenists within modern urban societies use '___' crystals with the same goal in mind. In this light, it seems clear that '___' is an integral part of all religion, whether or not it is acknowledged.
SOURCE

Enlightenment
I’m going to end this post with my personal thoughts on everything we’ve talked about, and how it works into the way I perceive my religion to be today. Religion is the most common question and quest of mankind. That search for something else, something bigger than us. I believe that dreaming, APing, and '___' are all glimpses into this reality going on around us.
I don’t buy into many of the big religions, because I always thought that if something WAS the REAL religion, all of mankind would simply be attracted to it at some point in their life. With religion today, most people simply believe because its what their parents brought them up with, not a choice they actually made. I was once a part of one of those religions, and I feel as if my life has changed for the better since researching and practicing some of the things I mentioned above. I became unclouded and at one point was close to atheism, until I began feeling an attraction, a natural desire if you will to find out more about this world that is so clearly going on around us. I still don’t know what’s the “right” religion, but I know that something is out there, and I’ve only had good experiences with what is out there so far, which is a comforting thought.
I would LOVE to entertain all of your questions, and look forward to having some great discussions.
-Odessy


[edit on 15-2-2009 by Odessy]

Just bumping the thread, as I wrote it at like 3 in the am.
Hope you guys enjoy

Thanks for this when I have a little more time in my life this is something I would very much like to be involved in...
I dabbled a little in my teens but was never brave enough to fully AP.....
But it is something which I would like to try again,but need to fully understand,and learn about first....

Just really giving you a bump, but also, re '___' I don't think you mentioned Rick Strassman and his book/research 'The Spirit Molecule'.

A good read for those that like the how-for and where-for rather than just the experience

reply to post by special


Hey Special, np!
You have a wise head on your shoulders.
AP is def not to be taken lightly, and is something that only you can decide when your ready to discover it.
Its the reason I stopped practicing, but feel that I'm ready again, and have matured a lot. Its easy to say yes the first time because you think its cool, but you really become "enlightened" in a sense, and knowing whats out there will change your life.

reply to post by RogerT


Yes RogerT! "The SPirit Molecule" is a great book to check out!

Thanks for that, I had left it out because I simply wanted to focus on some of the points and similarities between AP and '___' experiences, and not focus too much on '___' as ATS is a little funny about such things.

But yeah, from a scientific standpoint, Rick Strassman does an excellent job. If anyone is interested in learning more on '___', check out that book. thanks!

Wow thanks, i've been looking for something to help me in AP.

I have a couple questions,
One is how do you AP? I know i've been told lay down until you are on the verge of sleeping and keep you concious but not body awake... didn't work to well.

And my second question, is what religion are you? Not to be nosy, but i have pondered over my own religion, and i truly do not believe in it: as because my parents brought me up with it.

Thank you!

Originally posted by nymph
Wow thanks, i've been looking for something to help me in AP.

I have a couple questions,
One is how do you AP? I know i've been told lay down until you are on the verge of sleeping and keep you concious but not body awake... didn't work to well.

Well, I pretty much explained above in my first 4 posts how I think one should go about APing.
Yes, you can lie down in bed, imagine a rope over you and pull yourself out blah blah blah. That may work .1% of the time.
If you want to AP on a regular basis, take the Dalai Lama's advice (also quoted in my OPs). You need to, on a REGULAR basis, during the day, ask yourself, "Am I dreaming?" Since dreaming is the main road to AP, if you've trained yourself to constantly be aware of where you are, you will begin to ask yourself in your dreams, "Am I sleeping?" When this happens, you will realize you are dreaming, and can then go on to AP.
That takes dedication, but is the best route to go to successfully AP.
On top of that, you will be more aware during the day, and slowly, awaken your consciousness.

And my second question, is what religion are you? Not to be nosy, but i have pondered over my own religion, and i truly do not believe in it: as because my parents brought me up with it.

I too strayed from the religion I grew up with. Now, I suppose the best label for what I believe is Gnosis, which is learning from experience. I KNOW that something else is out there, what exactly it is, I dont think we will know until we get there. The concept behind Gnostisism is that through our own experiences (meditation, APing, etc.) you learn the truth. Other people may get something else from their experiences, and thats why you learn from your own.

Religion is a tricky subject. I believe something happens when we die, and I believe in higher beings, though they may also simply be your own higher states of consciousness, who knows. Whats important is that if you live a good life, treat others well, then you dont need to be worried about what happens next, because you've walked the right path.

Hope that helps.



[edit on 15-2-2009 by Odessy]

reply to post by Odessy


hey odessy - awesome thread- ive gotten into this big time lately by talking to someone who is very spirtiually evolved, and they told me who my main teacher and guide is. so i really got intrigued. my question for you is if i get to the point of AP OoBE,1- will i be able to communicate with the spirit that roams my house. i feel she is benevolent and young, but i do wonder that. also,2- do most people freak out when they AP the first time? 3-and if i start dozing off while meditating and am dreaming but feel like im awake, is this astral projection? - i read the thread but im just really interested in your answers and sorry it got to be so many. S&F for sure. thanks for your time and i wish you the best!!!

i also sent you a U2U. some stuff i would like you to know.

[edit on 16-2-2009 by ziggyproductions05]

Originally posted by ziggyproductions05
hey odessy - awesome thread-

Hey Ziggy, np buddy, here to help
I'll do my best to answer your questions, but know that I can only speak on my thoughts and feelings, so take from my answers what you like.

if i get to the point of AP OoBE,1- will i be able to communicate with the spirit that roams my house. i feel she is benevolent and young, but i do wonder that.

Thats a very good question. From my knowledge, yes, you can communicate with lost loved ones, which would make me assume you can also speak to spirits etc, in the Astral Plane.
BUT, more than likely, this wont happen the first few times you do this. It could, I suppose, but from experience, my first projections lasted no longer than 30 seconds.
I've also read that you guides speak to you when they feel you are ready to be witness to them, but then again, most people dont know they have guides, so if you go into it wanted to speak to them, I bet you could. I've heard to let them know before you AP, and your chances increase.
But yeah, I think you could, if you wanted to, but for the most part they will prob wait until you are ready.

2- do most people freak out when they AP the first time?

I'm not sure if most people freak out the first time, but I sure did. I was very excited and had to try and constantly control myself because every-time I got too excited I could feel myself being pulled back to the physical, and on my second projection, woke up right away from excitement.

3-and if i start dozing off while meditating and am dreaming but feel like im awake, is this astral projection?

Yes and no. You AP every night when you dream, so technically, yes, you are projecting, but most of the time your consciousness is asleep and doesnt know it, which is why its good to go through the exercises I mentioned earlier.
When you consciously project, youll know it, trust me, its awesome.

i also sent you a U2U. some stuff i would like you to know.

checking it out now.

Hope I helped

You guys should all check out the site www.gnosticteachings.com for any and all things Astral Projection, Meditation, etc. Its a great start, its also where I got mine.

'___' is taken from a frog or toad skin I believe, if you look at the structure, you can litterly tell its effects as it resembles '___' and other psychotropic drugs

Your belief is wrong, and I have a feeling your just trying to close this thread.
This isnt a thread about '___'. Please post on the Narcotics forum.
Thank you.
-Odessy

I recently read the Steven LaBerge book "Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming" and from his experiments he concluded that AP is actually only lucid dreaming.

He said the dream self can leave the body and explore the dream world, even looking down at your sleeping body. This would also explain why everybody sees the room as a little different to the real thing. It isn't real. Just a figment of your imagination.

I have had a few lucid dream experiences since reading the book and they were awesome. More real than real life as my senses seemed 100 times better in the dream.

Has anyone ever met someone during AP who has corroborated their story?

I have read the long thread by theRiverGoddess, but to me there wasn't any concrete evidence that AP is a real phenomenon and not a product of our holographic brain

I would love AP to be real but I have my doubts now after reading books by Munro and others. It proves we can exist after death if true. But even Munro could never corroborate that he actually left his body.

reply to post by Apocalypse69


I have also read "exploring the world of lucid dreaming", but did not agree with the concept of projecting being a lucid dream. My experiences leaving my body have usually been "blind" where I cannot actually see anything, but am aware of what is around me in the room and have to consciously make the effort to see which is not something I've ever experienced in a dream. I have also experienced being pulled back while only half separated from myself and have to pry myself back out again. "Prying" also comes with some unexpected sensations, such as it feeling almost like I was attempting to pull two magnets appart, except I was the magnet, and also becomming very cold instantly on a separate occasion. I've also experienced a pain in my back while trying to separate, which although not too uncomfortable, was enough to make the choice to stop for the night. I have spoken with a person at my school, and her first time projecting she ended up in her friends house, and called her at told her what she had been wearing and watching on tv when hers had ended.

As far as "concrete evidence" the best way to prove something is prove it to your self. I've read different books on subjects that I have no experience in, but I also believe the people who tell me of their experiences, because the truth generally seems to be more fun than fiction.

What's a holographic brain anyway?

Apocalypse69,

Some people believe one thing, others believe another. There have been many other authors who say that Lucid Dreaming is in fact different from Astral Projection. I agree with them through personal experience, but you can believe whatever you want. Either way, our minds are capable of incredible things.

I tend to believe in Astral Projection from sources such as the second Dalai Lama and other buddhist practitioners. Things seem different from the real world (such as a room, or a table) because those objects in the Astral Realm are in the form they were intended to be in, which differs from the actual result in the physical realm. Thats a theory at least, but I'm sure we can all explore that on our own.

Either way, believing in either theory, they both lead to the expansion of your mind, which is a good thing. I'm all about learning from personal experience, so keep exploring and the answers will come

reply to post by Kiwiemperor


Thanks for letting us in on your experiences.
I have never been stuck in and out of body, but have DEFINITELY experienced the blindness. In fact, that came from a lucid dream going into Astral Projection.

I had realized I was dreaming and then told myself that I wanted to Project. As soon as I decided to do this, everything turned pitch black and my body felt like it was frozen stiff. I had to keep telling myself to open my eyes and with some effort eventually did. It was a weird sensation, but I learned a lot from it