New Hampshire Fires First Shot Of Civil War

Originally posted by jBrereton

Originally posted by RealtruthDoes anyone remember the movie "Braveheart"?

Yes, it's unhistorical bull# made by people making a quick buck off showing the English getting cut up.

I am not taking literally, calm down. And I gave no reference to the English getting cut up.

It had to do with the content of the Divide and Conquer, or Support both sides and Conquer ideals.

www.cnht.org...

MAKE THEM ACCOUNTABLE!!!





MAKE THEM ACCOUNTABLE!!!

While there are many here who are evidently aware of the nature of this resolution; I disagree with the idea that it is either meaningless, or lacks significance.

While it is true (considering the maxim "The winners write history") that this may be overlooked in future times, I find it unlikely that such will be the case.

Essentially, there is a growing awareness, in both public and private areas, that the Federal Government has been undergoing an increasingly rapid evolution. Much more rapidly than the citizens of the nation can possibly keep up with, lacking true representation and leadership in vital institutions we complacently considered as reliable. This fact leads to several key matters of vital significance to the common citizen. There are a number of factors in play, and also a number of troubling possibilities that must be addressed in regards to the changes we, the actual "states" that comprise the union are experiencing.

If you will indulge my opinion, please read on;

I have no doubt that the United States of America constructed its conceptual 'collective' governance with a clear mandate towards this basic aim:

Never diminish freedom, minimize the centralization of authority, ensure the governed consent to the governance, unswervingly uphold the power of redress, and earnestly represent and protect the sovereignty of our union against all who would impose their agenda above that of the people of our nation.

This is not the direction in which the Federal government seems to be heading.

Lincoln struggled to maintain the Union largely because he believed in the truth behind the axiom "A house divided against itself cannot stand." His goal to maintain the union was fundamentally focused on forging compromise and providing adequate interstate relations, despite the political environment which seemed bent on 'control'. Imagine that. Even then, Mr. Lincoln struggled with office seekers and petty political rivalries which all centered around the usual exploitation of resources and who was going to get the 'profit' from it. Personally, I think his efforts to install a new currency (the greenback) was instrumental in the muddling of his objectives, and perhaps could have had something to do with his eventual murder. But that is a topic for another thread.

Comparing those days to these seems a stretch. Romantic, but a stretch nevertheless.

What some state legislators seem to be doing is 'reminding' the Federal government that it is not IN CHARGE of anything. They are there to SERVE. They seem to be signaling that there is a visible and tangible disconnect between the Constitutional nature of our Republic and the federal machinery setting up shop in our nation. There seems to be a misunderstanding, commonly held, and repeatedly propagated by some agents of ignorance, that the Federal government "IS THE LAW," when clearly, this is NOT the case, nor had it ever been so intended.

The question of how this happens, is where the details of our despair live.

At most, the federal government is "the keeper of the law the States have developed", not the "law" itself.

Our problem seems to have become increasingly exacerbated as 'career politicians' with 'classist' attitudes and a collectively inflated sense of 'entitlement' became entrenched within the District of Columbia. A social culture evolved, some might contend was cultivated by 'private' interests, which literally glorified politicians into celebrity stature, and created a 'show business' like atmosphere around their lives.

Once removed from the 'common' people - it became easy to attract them into a shift of ideological stance. Essentially the public servants' commitment to the oath of Constitutional loyalty was usurped by one of loyalty to a 'profession' or 'class.' This brought about a general posture of collectively (nearly conspiratorially) building the Federal Government (Senate, House, Exec, and Judicial) into an "enterprise" which was devoted to the prospect of centralizing controlling power over ALL states as subordinate entities. It bears repeating that this had never been intended by the framers or the American people.

Economic power provided the means to reach this goal. Once established those in the business of profit were well-situated to begin an increasingly effective means to reshape what it means to be a politician. In today's environment it appears that the culmination of any politician's career is corporate leadership. The more influential and effective a politician is in furthering the financial success of a corporation, the more likely it is he or she will be secured by his benefactors.

However, the plan has several weak spots, most notably in the area of controlling the numerous State-level government officials. The means to consolidate loyalty from them comes through the power of the support of political parties. Hence the downfall of the honorable political party affiliation, now reduced to a club membership, with money being the driving factor to one's position in the order. Not necessarily how much you have, but how much you can attract.

This decay of the hold our collective principles have on our political caste is increasing rapidly for a simple reason. People are starting to see (or at least suspect) that their is a shadow play in progress.

As the Federal government continues to extend its reach and authority, State sovereignty (such as it is) is in dire danger of vanishing completely. This may be an inevitability, although I suspect that resistance is NOT futile.

We never wanted kings and queens and barons to populate our leadership. So now we see that it is slowly being reforged into a different kind of proto-feudal form; one where economic serfdom is evident, and dissent is viewed as 'illness' or 'aberrant.'

We need the states to recognize this fact; we need the Governor's and local elected officials to be alerted, if only to ensure that they understand that the the citizens are not the dull-witted cattle they require us to be. We require diligent attention and oversight of our politicians. Such things must be codified and noted. Therefore New Hampshire is doing the right thing. It is not done with an expectation of change, but one of recognition.

Political partisanship is not the answer, violence is not the answer. Simple understanding and recognition will suffice to stop this trend. We now know that at least in NH, someone is paying attention. More to follow....

[edit on 13-2-2009 by Maxmars]

They do know it and their schedule is off track. They need another 911 and soon. Latest prediction is the east coast and or chicago with a WMD.

Confirmed that the concentration camps are now authorized and completed. Their use are in the House under bill H.R. 645. There is also confirmed a military force of 350,000 well equipped and trained Mexican troops, to be followed by Chinese and Russians in Mexico as we speak. The drug cartel violence is more bunk like the cold war, and fake war on terror. They will take out Mexico's economy and then ours not long after. If the 911 happens next month it will take our minds off of mexico and then they will strike..........



[edit on 13-2-2009 by tgambill]

reply to post by Jay-in-AR

Jay, when you call your representative and give your speech(to some intern or secratery) let us know what kind of response you get. My experence with my representive and senators is that they just ignore you!

What Was Judd Gregg Thinking?
foxforum.blogs.foxnews.com...

Nothing Relating to the Resolution here Either...maybe in the Comments? I looked through a few but Nadda...

Originally posted by ZindoDoone
sir_chancealot,
Yup, thats a much better explanation. The only thing that bothers me is that I have grave doubts as to a peacefull restoration! I think it will be a very violent one!
Zindo

As it should be my friend.

Might I remind you that never in the history of civilization has a tyrannical government ever been effectively dealt with through the ballot box. The only way to effectively deal with the said government is through the end of a rifle.

Well, it looks like I know which state will have martial law imposed on it first..

Good ole New Hampshire .. lol ..

They'll be made an example of if they totally push for this kind of autonmy to the point of secession from the union.

I only hope you have the stones to actually stand by this when the going gets tough! If you do there are lots of people to your south who will stand with you! Many in Massachusetts dont plan on becoming socialists just because their leaders are traitors to the Constitution like Kennedy and Kerry.

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by Leto

 

I wouldn't count on it. The KGB wasn't very capable of helping maintain Communist rule over Russia. The fact is, if we rise up, we may not have to fire a shot as they may crap their pants and capitulate very quickly. But if not, then I'm game

Keep in mind that capitulation is no substitute for eradication. The best way to cure the body of cancer is to catch it in its early stages, cut it out, and destroy it. That same course of action is required here. If we don’t eradicate those who are the problem they will be back with a vengeance!

reply to post by ZindoDoone


Yes, finally there is revolution taking place!

But be weary, you should all be savvy in this subject for this is VERY VERY VERY HOT WATER.

It is literally a violent issue, if this goes through some states will be against it some wont, this is a close relation to what happened in the civil war.


This form of currency and society is failing it MUST be reformed, but to recreate one must first destroy.

Interesting times in the period of great enlightenment.

Also this may be unlikely considering breaking away from the central government means losing your life line (No more federal funding/pay checks)

I'm a little bit on edge you should be too.

-Psycho

[edit on 13-2-2009 by Psychonaughty]

Originally posted by KonigKaos
Well, someone needs to fire the first real shot. This country needs to change and it needs to do it quick. Revolution, Restoration, Civil War, whatever lets get on with it!

Originally posted by falcon
Lets the war begin.

Falcon

Originally posted by thebeast87
I for one will just sit back and enjoy the show

It seems that some members on ATS are, at best, unthinking and immature, who's attitude towards war was fed on the diet of the sanitized version of war we get in video-games, movies and the nightly news. They have not realized the true consequences and costs of war.

At worst, they are sociopaths who relish the opportunity to see death and destruction on their doorstep. That it is just some show to enjoy.

Do you children really want a Congo in the South, a Yugoslavia in New England, or a Rwanda in the West? Go find out what modern civil wars look like, then tell us if it is something you are eager to see in your hometown.




[edit on 13-2-2009 by SaviorComplex]

Now we're having a discussion here!!!

What I can't quite wrap my head around are the people saying we're going to get nowhere with this kind of action/movement. What did you expect? Did you think that one morning, a large portion of America would wake up and just stop going to work or watching tv or drive their cars in protest to what's happening around them? Did you think that the federal government was going to ASK us if we wanted to be manipulated any more? I don't think so.

I think it starts with the brave congressmen and women who are willing to attach their names to these kinds of statements. They're actual bonafide public servants who are putting their reputations on the line to let us know that they're listening. I think it is an insult to discredit their intentions by saying they're "congresscritters" and just pandering! I'd rather have my representative "pander" for votes by putting his name on such a radically different resolution or bill like this than to keep on legislating our rights away. Shame on Byrd for his/her comments and think twice before jumping to conclusions as to these few representatives intentions. I don't trust very many people, but maybe, just maybe, there are a few people representing "us" who really do want a radical change in the way our country is headed and the way the rest of the world views us.

Even though this movement is so far comprised of state representatives proposing resolutions (and bills too I might add, not just "silly" declarations of an intention)...

This is the beginning!

An easily disregarded whisper is starting to turn into an audible voice of the people. No it's not in the mainstream media yet, did you think it would be? Look at what the mainstream media has become and who runs it. But when enough people are talking about this, it's not going to be so easy to ignore.

It may be a pipe dream to think we can win back our rights in a courtroom, but at a bare minimum, it is the finest example of the kind of bravery and ingenuity that the American idea was founded on. The constitution was a pretty genius formula to keep a nation free and prosperous, we should question the intention of those who want to trample on it, especially in an environment like we're in today full of turmoil and fear mongering.

We have turned over enough of our rights in the name of peace and security, isn't it time we stood up for ourselves despite the challenges that it may present!?

So thats why the Brits do not have a written constitution.

reply to post by SaviorComplex


I have to agree with much of your statement. I have seen first hand the carnage and waste of a civil war. I was in Rhodesia/Zimbabwe in the 70's. Its an unfortunate fact that sometimes, the seeds of freedom must be drenched in the blood of patriots and citizens! I see that our government is trying to stem this tide by causing the separation of the races and ethnicity and use that against us. That can't be part of any resurection of our constitutional freedom! I see them creating a type of cast system of the haves and havenots and making promises that will never be kept to further the agenda. I'm not sure that a peacefull reconstitution of our nation by the people will ever be possible. That scares the hell out of me, and it should others, but the fact remains, we must start somewhere, and to just shove your head in the sand only makes you dirty!

Zindo

[edit on 2/13/2009 by ZindoDoone]

Let's all think of the extent of the possibilities. Whether you call it a civil war, revolution or a restoration, the real questions are (1) "Will you personally push your state legislatures to follow New Hampshire's example?" and (2) "Will you do whatever is necessary to see it through?"

We need to talk this up on the grass roots level. Too many of the people we all know want someone else (George?) to do it.

Think long and hard. Make your decision. Don't let anyone deter you from what you think is right.

This is so disappointing to read about NH not declaring their soverignity. I was actually thinking about moving there since CA is getting so freaking expensive to live in, but at least CA has declared their soverignity back in 1994 yet!!!!

Haven't read the whole thread (stupid I know), but I'm pressed for time this morning.

Have any MSM actually reported about all these states that are drafting legislation over sovereignty?

Or is all this controversy going on without the people even knowing?

What good is a revolution when nobody turns up?

Originally posted by tgambillConfirmed that the concentration camps are now authorized and completed. Their use are in the House under bill H.R. 645. There is also confirmed a military force of 350,000 well equipped and trained Mexican troops, to be followed by Chinese and Russians in Mexico as we speak. The drug cartel violence is more bunk like the cold war, and fake war on terror. They will take out Mexico's economy and then ours not long after. If the 911 happens next month it will take our minds off of mexico and then they will strike..........

Errr...

Yes... I'm sure the Mexicans, Chinese and Russians are going to invade... right... put down the Clancy for a second and think about what you're saying. Not bloody likely.

Whats happening here is that they are setting themselves up to be martyred for the cause. The federal government will totally over react in that state , showing other states that were on the fence before the kind of intentions they have for a dissenting voice. Its genius, i hope TSHTF and the people who threw the poopie in the blades get stuck cleaning it up.