Bill to abolish IRS introduced

Originally posted by MoonMine
reply to post by Total Reality

 

Isn't it strange that Ron Paul has not signed this bill (yet)?

How odd, I would suspect he would be frontrunner on this one.

Nah, Ron Paul is not in favor of this I'd bet. It's not really a solution. I'd be surprised if he did sign it. And if he does I'd bet it's because it puts attention on the system more than anything.

Ron Paul is in favor of getting rid of the fed and the taxes that come with it in order to pay for the "service". That is where all income tax goes and has since atleast the 80's, just paying interest on the national debt.

The need to get rid of the fed, the interest on money they create out of thin air, and then you have no need for ANY of these extra taxes. Government will make it's money off tarriffs from imports and exports and corporate taxes as should be.

This is supposed to be a "free" country. Corporations are soul less entities and are the only thing that should be paying taxes. Yes, some of that will go to the consumer, which is not much different than a consumption tax. But the corporations only pay taxes on the profits, so the more they increase the prices, the more taxes they pay, and they are in price competition with others.

If I knew taxes were used properly, paying taxes wouldn't be such a big deal.

You've got the IRS and Federal Reserve. Get rid of them both. We are supposed to be able to print our own money anyway, right?

Yes, a simple, flat tax would simplify things. You buy more, you pay more. Done. So, the folks who can't buy as much don't pay as much. It works out. It's a simple and fair tax system. And it's sane.

Think about it, no tax filing, none of that beginning of the year crap. Think of all the paperwork it saves.

I suppose you could still keep the tax refund thing going if you wanted to.

Troy

Originally posted by BlackOps719

Better yet imagine the relief of not having to worry about filing taxes and getting audited every year, imagine keeping your money that you earn and paying taxes by choice on the items that you buy. And better yet imagine a world where there is no criminal IRS waiting around the corner to beat down your door and take everything you own for making one clerical mistake on your taxes.

Completely agreed and well said! I have a friend who has been evading taxes for about 10 years now. He always files exempt on his w-4's and has managed to not be thrown in a maelstrom of technobabble and locked up since he lives like a gypsy from place to place. I would love to just evade taxes as well but until I know tax code and the like better I really don't think I could represent myself when being audited and would be up sh*tcreek.

I love your IRS description as it is a criminal waiting around a corner to mug you and your money.

[edit on 5-2-2009 by N3krostatic]

Originally posted by MoonMine
reply to post by Total Reality

 

Isn't it strange that Ron Paul has not signed this bill (yet)?

How odd, I would suspect he would be frontrunner on this one.

I was just thinking the same..............maybe a few emails to him to find out why..........

While I believe this may be a step in the right direction, there has always been one problem I have had with a flat sales tax. It is not fair at all and still benefits the wealthy. Please follow as I elaborate.

Under a flat sales tax, the poor will pay a higher percentage of their income toward taxes than those who make more money. This is a simple fact as poor people have to spend a larger portion of their income to meet their basic needs.

Assume the sales tax is 20% (I don't know what the real number is but this makes for easy math and could be close.) If someone makes $25,000 a year, that person will need to spend about 90% of that income to survive. That means they would pay 18% of their total income toward taxes.

If we consider a person who makes $300,000 a year, they will be saving a considerably larger amount. Putting money away for college, investing in the stock market and building an IRA would not be taxed. Thus, that person may only spend 70% of their income on consumer goods, saving the rest. That means they would only pay 14% of their total income toward taxes.

Of course the more people make, the more they can save and the less they will be taxed in relation to their total income, forcing the poor to pay an undue burden.

There is the fair tax proposal, which offers people a yearly tax rebate up to the poverty line, which is around $25,000 I think. All this rebate does is shift that unfair burden on to the middle class, as they will now be paying an unfair portion when compared to the rich.

In my opinion, the only way to make everyone pay a truly equal amount in proportion to their income is to make a flat income tax on every source of income. From income earned through capital gains to wages to reselling used stuff at a garage sale, make a flat tax on all of it.

reply to post by Total Reality


4 more added to the list total of 44

Rep Akin, W. Todd [MO-2] - 1/6/2009
Rep Alexander, Rodney [LA-5] - 1/6/2009
Rep Bachus, Spencer [AL-6] - 1/6/2009
Rep Bartlett, Roscoe G. [MD-6] - 1/6/2009
Rep Bilbray, Brian P. [CA-50] - 1/6/2009
Rep Brady, Kevin [TX-8] - 1/6/2009
Rep Brown, Henry E., Jr. [SC-1] - 1/6/2009
Rep Brown-Waite, Ginny [FL-5] - 1/6/2009
Rep Burton, Dan [IN-5] - 1/6/2009
Rep Carter, John R. [TX-31] - 1/6/2009
Rep Conaway, K. Michael [TX-11] - 1/6/2009
Rep Crenshaw, Ander [FL-4] - 1/23/2009
Rep Culberson, John Abney [TX-7] - 1/6/2009
Rep Deal, Nathan [GA-9] - 1/6/2009
Rep Duncan, John J., Jr. [TN-2] - 1/6/2009
Rep Fallin, Mary [OK-5] - 1/6/2009
Rep Franks, Trent [AZ-2] - 1/6/2009
Rep Gingrey, Phil [GA-11] - 1/6/2009
Rep Hensarling, Jeb [TX-5] - 1/6/2009
Rep Issa, Darrell E. [CA-49] - 1/9/2009
Rep King, Steve [IA-5] - 1/6/2009
Rep Kingston, Jack [GA-1] - 1/6/2009
Rep Lamborn, Doug [CO-5] - 1/6/2009
Rep Lucas, Frank D. [OK-3] - 1/6/2009
Rep McCaul, Michael T. [TX-10] - 1/6/2009
Rep Mica, John L. [FL-7] - 1/9/2009
Rep Miller, Gary G. [CA-42] - 1/14/2009
Rep Miller, Jeff [FL-1] - 1/27/2009
Rep Moran, Jerry [KS-1] - 1/13/2009
Rep Myrick, Sue Wilkins [NC-9] - 1/8/2009
Rep Neugebauer, Randy [TX-19] - 1/6/2009
Rep Olson, Pete [TX-22] - 1/26/2009
Rep Pence, Mike [IN-6] - 1/6/2009
Rep Poe, Ted [TX-2] - 1/6/2009
Rep Posey, Bill [FL-15] - 1/27/2009
Rep Price, Tom [GA-6] - 1/6/2009
Rep Stearns, Cliff [FL-6] - 1/6/2009
Rep Sullivan, John [OK-1] - 1/6/2009
Rep Thornberry, Mac [TX-13] - 1/6/2009
Rep Tiahrt, Todd [KS-4] - 1/6/2009
Rep Westmoreland, Lynn A. [GA-3] - 1/6/2009
Rep Whitfield, Ed [KY-1] - 2/3/2009
Rep Wittman, Robert J. [VA-1] - 1/6/2009
Rep Young, Don [AK] - 1/6/2009

reply to post by Total Reality


The Senate has a sister bill to this one and three co-sponsors.

S.296
Title: A bill to promote freedom, fairness, and economic opportunity by repealing the income tax and other taxes, abolishing the Internal Revenue Service, and enacting a national sales tax to be administered primarily by the States.
Sponsor: Sen Chambliss, Saxby [GA] (introduced 1/22/2009) Cosponsors (3)
Related Bills: H.R.25
Latest Major Action: 1/22/2009 Referred to Senate committee. Status: Read twice and referred to the Committee on Finance.

Sen Chambliss, Saxby [GA] (introduced 1/22/2009

Sen Coburn, Tom [OK] - 1/22/2009
Sen Cornyn, John [TX] - 1/22/2009
Sen Isakson, Johnny [GA] - 1/22/2009

Hell yes get rid of it! Maybe then the government will actually have to wisely spend tax money.

No I am not against taxes 100%. I think government needs some regulation...but the amount of money they are currently throwing into the garbage shows to me that they in more then they can handle.

reply to post by Total Reality


They have my support. The only, truly fair way to tax. Food and Medical Care should be exempted.

A tax revolt is not sensible however. That's like leasing an apartment and then refusing to pay rent because you don't like the color of the walls. It would just make a person a flake leeching off others. Nobody would actually believe it was to make a statement

I've met the tax resistor bunch and been pitched by them. Believe me, they are just people who are criminally minded, engage in criminal activity and want others to pay for everything for them. They are not the kind of people you take home to meet the Parents. They don't even believe the nonsense they spout.

Maybe I'm missing something, but wouldn't this really screw poor people? If I make $500,000 a year and bought $100 worth of clothes and paid $7 in a federal tax, its not much to me. But if a person who makes $20,000 a year pays 7% (or whatever % it is) on items they need to survive, it could represent a larger chunk of their overall income than what they were initially losing to income tax. Depending on what expenses low income people have, this could take a serious toll on their ability to afford necessities.

In the mean time, since wealthy people would not be taxed on incomes from their investments, their wealth could sky rocket out of control. Since wealthy people have large amounts of capital and access to the best financial planners, they could insure a proper ratio of new spending to new income in order to grow their wealth more. This could potentially create an even greater shift in overall wealth towards those that are already wealthy.

Although, I could be looking at this wrong. I'm open to all criticisms of my statements

If they abolished income tax and only had sales tax it would put the government in complete control of what we buy and how much we pay. If they decided to screw us by raising taxes it could be really bad for the middle class.

Then again if they only took sales tax and we decided to boycott big business it would probably hurt them pretty bad too.

reply to post by johnnyg5646


Not really. You just do like some States and issue exemption cards for those below a certain income level. You also exempt necessities like food and medical care. Corporations and Businesses pay the same sales taxes on all of their purchases.

I sure hope this passes.
+1 Star

reply to post by Total Reality



Oh what a wonderful Holiday this will be.. Boortz Co Authored a book on the New Tax and I bet he is happy to see it get in the House. I'm not a Boortz fan but I will align with him when it comes to the IRS.

Everyone needs to take the time to write their reps

www.house.gov
www.senate.gov

If we want big change people we need to speak up. Not only did I just email my thoughts I just faxed all my reps.

Originally posted by n0tsympl
... i think this bill would greater divide the rich from poor

Even more so than the current and last bailouts???

on a side note about the irs. i was scanning through jobs posted at the local dept. of labor today and stumbled onto a hiring ad for the irs. it seems they are hiring all across the united states trying build up a back log of employment applications. this leads me to believe there is going to be a push on to increase the amount of field agents to do audits and enforce collections.

Originally posted by Blaine91555
reply to post by Total Reality

 

They have my support.

The only, truly fair way to tax. Food and Medical Care should be exempted.

A tax revolt is not sensible however. That's like leasing an apartment and then refusing to pay rent because you don't like the color of the walls. It would just make a person a flake leeching off others. Nobody would actually believe it was to make a statement

I've met the tax resistor bunch and been pitched by them. Believe me, they are just people who are criminally minded, engage in criminal activity and want others to pay for everything for them. They are not the kind of people you take home to meet the Parents. They don't even believe the nonsense they spout.

I have seen a bunch of criminally minded tax resistors that want others to pay everything for them also, they are Obama's nominees. I am sure these are not the only politicians that are skimping out.

But the big difference between these guys and the common tax resistor is that the common tax resistor doesn't push for higher taxes and complicated tax codes.

Why should one class of citizens be forced to pay taxes or deal with huge penalties while another class gets to snake out of it until the media happens to catch them?

A tax revolt is perfectly sensible at this time.

reply to post by N3krostatic


Why be polite. Your friend is a leech and a bum. Does he go to food banks and take advantage of the contributors also. I know some people like that. They think others owe them for some reason. New job every few weeks. Lie and say they quit when in fact they were fired.

Originally posted by Blaine91555
reply to post by Total Reality

 

They have my support.

The only, truly fair way to tax. Food and Medical Care should be exempted.

A tax revolt is not sensible however. That's like leasing an apartment and then refusing to pay rent because you don't like the color of the walls. It would just make a person a flake leeching off others. Nobody would actually believe it was to make a statement

I've met the tax resistor bunch and been pitched by them. Believe me, they are just people who are criminally minded, engage in criminal activity and want others to pay for everything for them. They are not the kind of people you take home to meet the Parents. They don't even believe the nonsense they spout.

According to your mentality our founding fathers were all criminally minded and engage in criminal activities.....I look at them as freedom lovers....I guess Thomas Jefferson was not one to take home to ones mother.....

Taxing labor is just not right. I am 100% on board with this but it will never pass why? Because it makes to much damn sense.

[edit on 5-2-2009 by tjeffersonsghost]