Within 7 days - 6 died at Minot Air Force Base 07 - Commander now dead

secrecy, for sure back to May 1, 1776 and the Masonic Order joined by the Illuminati Order on July 1782 and have planned in general conceptional terms three world wars and two major revolutions in the 19th century by Adam Weishaupt and Albert Pike 1850

No. This particular "conspiracy theory" is real. In these matters, it is difficult to know the truth, but sometimes things really are exactly what they appear to be. I'll admit it. I am perversely thrilled by this Minot AFB drama because I know that, despite all its might, the Pentagon has a raw nerve exposed here, and apparently it is so important that they are playing poker with the American people, the way they did when they mailed anthrax to congressmen and journalists who weren't keen on their imperial ambitions. They could kill me or you, but that won't change the fact that this latest killing is a sign of desperation. This gives me hope, because it's also a sign of weakness. I don't want a weak military for my country, but I do want rogue entities within it to be weak.

Oh, I'm sorry... you were talking about Illuminati or NWO or space people or something? Please... do go on.

reply to post by KyoZero


So what you are saying is that the U.S. military can't be expected to keep track of all of its nukes, forever, because mistakes are bound to happen. And what about Russia, and Russian nukes? What about all the other nuclear powers?

Good morning planet Earth.

reply to post by poet1b


Not at all poet, that wasn't my intention one bit. It was a horrible thing that happened and just punishment should be handed out. What I am saying is that this was an accident and from what I can tell, everyone in this post and the others that were started before this refuse to believe this could have been a simple, albeit horrific accident.

But like I said, I was there, I know what went on and that fac isn't going to change things one bit. I coudl show my DD214, my vMPF records, answer questions about the base or the people or something and even when I finally convinced someone of my job and extremely close proximity to these events, they probably still will never believe me. I'll either be a disinfo agent or I will be brainwashed or something. This is the part of ATS and the like that I don't get. A person comes up with a conspiracy. They post it here and instantly if someone disagrees they are wrong...period.

So that's fine. If that is indeed how they want to live, well I am certainly nobody to tell you what to do. Tis a free country and you are wlecome to your thought. Hence why I said c'est la vie. I could have proven to folks I was there, hell if it were legal I could have taken pictures of me working on them and even then I still wouldn't be believed. No big deal

Adios

-Kyo

reply to post by KyoZero


I believe what you are saying, I wasn't trying to deny that, or claim that you are a disinfo agent. What I am saying, is that if what you are saying is true, then we can't count on our military being able to always continuously control the nukes that exist, or probably any other government as well. If horrible accidents like this can happen, Murphy's law, anything that can go wrong will.

I also submit the possibility that purposely allowing this event to happen, sends a big signal to the world. Oops, we can't always be in control of our nukes, one of them could get lost, or stolen, hence one of them could be used, and it wouldn't be due to our intent.

Just another possibility.

reply to post by KyoZero


KyoZero,

I'm confused, because there are "experts" on this thread who say that this kind of mistake simply cannot happen. There are too many signatures involved. You on the other hand claim that mistakes of this sort do happen.

I gather that a nuke was inside a CM, but nobody knew. That just doesn't sound right at all!!!

I'm not military, but I'd like to find out about the protocol of moving a nuke. I already asked for a very brief and sketchy description of what is really involved to move a nuke from base A to B. I believe this would clarify a lot of things without jeopardizing any aspect of National Security.

Thank you,

N

There is another angle:

nationalexpositor.com...


[edit on 5-2-2009 by Nichiren]

Right...

so let me tell you about the experts here. They are fine military folk who probably do their job amazingly. They make mistakes and so do we.

The signatures involved are vast and many but cmplacency can and does occur.

Ok without going into any classification here is how it works

We take several empty 'sticks' (non-nuclear missile bodies) and we send them to a building for checks. When that happens signatures take place for reception of the missiles. They do some work to include removing warheads. Then when ready, we schedule a time to send them to a B-52. Signatures take place again to say we sent them and a new set of signatures takes place to say the flightline received them. Now, the loaders put them on the place and the pilots take off with them. At all three steps, loading, checkout, and pre-flight, there is a step called verification.

When complacency sets in, mistakes happen and one of these steps can go by the wayside. The person who said it just 'doesn't happen' is completely wrong. That's the same mentality that many high-level 2W2's have...it just doesn't happen. Well Ihate to break it to you, but 2W2's are not ifallible.

Now...if hearing this you want to not trust the 2W2's at Minot, I will never argue you becase your opinion is just as valid as mine. I just thought I would shed some light on this for everyone.

Awaiting both your replies

-Kyo

reply to post by KyoZero


You aren't actually suggesting that the Broken Arrow was an accident, are you? That argument has already collapsed. It holds no water.

Still, if you want to play Goebbels and just repeat a lie over and over and over until people believe you, feel free. You deserve what you get.

Louisiana was surprised. True patriot(s) risked their careers and possibly more to bring this to the press. The flight took 1.5 hours longer than normal. Six left, five arrived. Steve Fossett's disappearance and the monumental search but correlation does not prove causation. It is well noted.

OK, just googled the title and not 1 MSM reported this, of the 3 pages I checked however, here's a site that outlines some intresting facts

www.niemanwatchdog.org...

The rense one makes an attempted to discredit the goings on.

Originally posted by KyoZero
Right...

so let me tell you about the experts here. They are fine military folk who probably do their job amazingly. They make mistakes and so do we.

The signatures involved are vast and many but complacency can and does occur.

Ok without going into any classification here is how it works

We take several empty 'sticks' (non-nuclear missile bodies) and we send them to a building for checks. When that happens signatures take place for reception of the missiles. They do some work to include removing warheads. Then when ready, we schedule a time to send them to a B-52. Signatures take place again to say we sent them and a new set of signatures takes place to say the flightline received them. Now, the loaders put them on the place and the pilots take off with them. At all three steps, loading, checkout, and pre-flight, there is a step called verification.

When complacency sets in, mistakes happen and one of these steps can go by the wayside. The person who said it just 'doesn't happen' is completely wrong. That's the same mentality that many high-level 2W2's have...it just doesn't happen. Well I hate to break it to you, but 2W2's are not infallible.

Now...if hearing this you want to not trust the 2W2's at Minot, I will never argue you because your opinion is just as valid as mine. I just thought I would shed some light on this for everyone.

Awaiting both your replies

-Kyo

welcome to ATS and plz comment on the quote below.

Having spent many years as an Air Force Munitions Troop both overseas and CONUS, working both locations with conventional and special weapons, I don't see how this could have happened. Everyone involved, and their chain of command, should be fired, and removed from PRP. There are far too many policies and procedures in place, that should have prevented this from happening." (The reference to the PRP is to the Personnel Reliability Program, a DOD directed program that insures the reliability and dependability of people working on nuclear weapons.)

source

I checked the military times and the forum was removed. grrr..

During the Cold War when the USAF stood nuclear alert, people were much more aware of nuclear weapons. Since the end of the Cold War, the USAF and certain other branches of the military have wanted to get out of the nuclear mission. Then they transferred all the nuclear missions and weapons to STRATCOM. Once the USAF was out of the role of handling them constantly, complacency set in and mistakes were made. If you did a job day in and day out, you would do it the same way every time.

Let's say you're an electrician, and you install ceiling fans day in and day out. That's all you do. You follow the same steps day in and day out to wire the fans, wire them to the switch, and the other jobs you have to do. You then switch to wiring water heaters. A year or so down the road, a friend asks you to help put in a new ceiling fan, but you haven't been doing it constantly anymore. You're a lot more likely to make a mistake putting the fan in now than you were when you were doing it all the time.

Slightly oversimplified, but the people handling nuclear weapons are just that.....PEOPLE. As for the question about Russian nuclear weapons handling, have you ever seen the stories about their weapons? Now THOSE would give you nightmares.

www.answers.com...

If you don't think that this hasn't happened before, think again. There was a document from 1998, when the military was following the same procedures, that questioned those procedures, and if they worked or not.

This story should have gotten much more play in the media. Even if it was "just an accident". There should have been follow up and clear resolution to the issue, firings, etc.

The story was initially leaked by airmen to military times. They called a newspaper and said "HEY!! guess what! we screwed up BIG TIME!!" and that is how we came to know this story???

That makes no sense. If you knew a mistake was made of that magnitude at your base, wouldn't you kinda hope it would blow over and nobody outside would have to know??

This is way to fishy in so many ways, if people are content to accept the official story of this being an accident then I can't understand why you would bother discussing it on a conspiracy message board?? To enlighten all us delusional folk with your wisdom and expertise?? Get a life, we aren't here for that!!!

reply to post by Zaphod58


wow.. all i can say is i have this image in my mind and it goes something like this ..

"two depts juggling with nuke warheads and neither can't decide what to do with 'em .. "I dunno .. i dunno .. opps .. heh.. dropped one.. bah .. no problems ...doubt if that one has a head on it....*looks at the USAF juggler*..did you put a head on that? *USAF shrugs*.. I don't remember HA ! i'll check the paperwork..DOH!"

WOW !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHAT A ZOO!

It really is. There are stories out there that would turn your hair white if you were able to hear them. And not just the military, it's the same with just about any organization or group. I worked with the TSA for several years, and there were things about them that blew my mind.

reply to post by Zaphod58

Let's say you're an electrician, and you install ceiling fans day in and day out. That's all you do. You follow the same steps day in and day out to wire the fans, wire them to the switch, and the other jobs you have to do. You then switch to wiring water heaters. A year or so down the road, a friend asks you to help put in a new ceiling fan, but you haven't been doing it constantly anymore. You're a lot more likely to make a mistake putting the fan in now than you were when you were doing it all the time.

well, that has to be the weakest delivery EVER! Why, what part of NUKES didn't you understand?~! Fans and NUKES are 2 WAY different items. 1, being NON lethal .. 2nd LETHAL!

As a tech in the high volume high tech industry, ......techs are responsible for ensuring that procedures are done correctly. So what you're telling me is, basically this ..

a military OIC yawns, signs the paper work, hands it to his OIC, who yawns, signs...doesn't check, *yawns*.. and hands his OIC for final sig.. who then files it..?

WOW.. I've been in the military and KNOW that's NOT how it goes.. there's a reason why they call some in the military 'chief-of-Smoke'.. I've been on that receiving end of that, only once it's something you rather avoid.

I'd like to see what JAG has to say on this.

[edit on 5-2-2009 by Komodo]

reply to post by Komodo


Yeah, I don't think they were implying that installing fans is equal to handling Nukes!

It was an analogy. Not a very good one, but most got it I think.

I still don't buy this entire scenario.
They are charged with the care and (very rare) transportation of these devices.

Surely you would have to receive and order from above to access these weapons, and an order to mount them on missiles.
In this case, one would be terrified, surely, at the prospect that your country is about to go to war!

These devices are transported occasionally. But when are they mounted onto missiles for transport?!
Common sense would dictate that if you are moving a nuclear device, you don't make it easier for them to be used by mounting them onto a missile!
You move them in components, not ready-to-fly weapons.

None of this story makes sense.

I have no clue what the actual procedures are involving the handing and transport of nuclear warhead devices, however, I would expect that there are electronic devices that require pass codes somewhere in the mix. Now the human "error" would now also involve computer security system violations....hmm. Sorry can't buy it.

These people who claim that a few signatures were skipped and somebody just reached up on a shelf and removed a nuclear warhead filled "stick" and loaded it on a plane AND managed to overlook this is laughable on the face of it. Please, give it up. Grocery stores have more sophisticated security apparatus - we do not have the full story, and I am not satisfied with this human error explanation, and neither should you be.

reply to post by Komodo


As I said, it's oversimplified, but it's the same basic idea. You don't do something for a long time that you did day in and day out, and you're going to make mistakes. And I'm not saying anything like what you suggested, I am simply saying that they are human, and they got complacent. Just because they are nuclear weapons doesn't mean that the people handling them don't get complacent. There have been incidents handling nukes for as long as there have been nukes out there.

Just last year they had a fire in a missile silo because an electrician didn't double check a battery connection, and left it loose. Complacency.

Yes, the people SHOULD spend more time being alert when they handle nuclear weapons, but they don't always. And there are times when the procedures that they should follow fail.

detachedindividual I know it wasn't the best, but it was the best I could come up with on short notice. Thanks for noticing the whole analogy thing. It's hard to come up with good ones when you're on here at work.


[edit on 2/5/2009 by Zaphod58]