Is Free Speech Dying?

Recently Holland enacted a law stating that it is an offense to bad mouth Islam. This is outrageous and will open the flood gates to other religions and groups. However this isn't an isolated case of free speech being trampled upon.

The UK, USA, and many European countries have become so politically correct that we are effectively shackling our discussions and the language we use. Free speech to me means that you can say whatever you like. This includes racist views, religious views, anti government views, holocaust denial or anything else. I don't agree with racism or holocaust denials but i will defend anyones right to say such things. That's what free speech is.

Why are we stopping people from saying what they want? Won't this just cause tensions when one group cannot criticise another? What about asking serious and pertinent questions when we aren't allowed to ask them because someone belongs to a certain group?

Free speech really seems to be dying, where will it go from here?

[edit on 26-1-2009 by ImaginaryReality1984]

I think free speech anywhere is pretty much the way it always has been.

You can say anything you want as long as nobody cares.

Your completely correct. Slowly but surely were being told what is "Ok" and what is not to say. In the US the government has issued free speach "zones" during major political rallies and other events that forced protestors and people speaking they're minds, be limited to little spaces outside the view of cameras and outside the view of whoever they were there to protest against.

We live in some very odd times, but it's up to the people to show up in mass to these things and DEMAND they're rights. Nobody is given anything anymore we have to take it.

Hopefully that will be done peacefully.

Originally posted by Nohup
I think free speech anywhere is pretty much the way it always has been.

You can say anything you want as long as nobody cares.

Not quite, in the past you could say a great deal without getting sued or arrested. Now you can be in a great deal of trouble for mentioning a religion in Holland. Actually arrested for just criticising a religion and this venom will spread throughout Europe if it takes hold.

Furthermore i don't care if it upsets some people. That is the point of free speech, to say things some may find uncomfortable but be able to say them without prosecution.

Excellent subject! I agree with you Imaginary. If you have some time and want to listen to something really great, this PODthread is one of the best on ATS, in my opinion... My thoughts on this subject are there. We get into the whole "political correctness" thing and how that can stomp on Free Speech. It's really good if you have some time.

My Rights VS Your Rights

Bad mouthing Islam is a killing offense, apparently.

I think this law was passed not out of respect, but out of fear.

Such a peaceful religion.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


Will give it a listen tonight, thanks very much for that podcast.

Damn second line requirement

[edit on 26-1-2009 by ImaginaryReality1984]

reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984


Yup that is the whole point of free speech. It's the right to your own opinion regardless of what people think of the subject matter.

This whole getting arrested for talking about religion is news to me though. Never thought it would be this far so soon, thats kind of scary really.

Just to clarify the situation in Holland i shoudl say that it will be the outcome of the court case that decides the future fate of criticising Islam in that country.

news.bbc.co.uk...

ATS is a great example..

- You prove a Mod wrong .. you get banned
- You don't like Obama, your a racist and get U2Us
- Both of those combined, you Lose your account.

In fact there is a 99% chance this will be removed.

reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984


political correctnes is directly opposite of free speech .... freedom of speech is to be able to say what people do not want to hear, since anyone agrees to hearing what they like ...

It is just the word "correct" that makes it sound good ...


“I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.” - that is free speech

[edit on 26-1-2009 by pilot70]

[edit on 26-1-2009 by pilot70]

reply to post by pilot70


I agree completely to this statement. I am sure it's offensive when a comedian makes a joke about someone who is disabled for example, but should we really stop that comedian? Simply not watching it if you're offended is the answer.

I find it amazing that people often get outraged at things they havn't even seen. For example the christian groups who were protesting the Jerry Springer musical in London when none of them had even gone in to see it. They were offended by proxy because of what someone had told them it contained.

reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984


And that just boils down to blind obedience. It's the chain effect, one person thinks they know what something is about and tells a whole wack of other people what they should think about, and before you know it people are protesting in the streets.

People who protest things they know nothing about are really just hurting everybody else who organize and demonstrate in the name of important things such as Free Speech.

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984

 

And that just boils down to blind obedience. It's the chain effect, one person thinks they know what something is about and tells a whole wack of other people what they should think about, and before you know it people are protesting in the streets.

But we should still defend their right to SAY so .... not to throw molotovs though ... that is a different issue ..

[edit on 26-1-2009 by pilot70]

Originally posted by pilot70


But we should still defend their right to SAY so

.... not to throw molotovs though ... that is a different issue ..

[edit on 26-1-2009 by pilot70]

Yep they have a right to say it, but i wish they'd actually watched the play before being outraged lol. Anyway yes they still have a right to voice their opinion. Although to have an opinion i would think you need data on the subject you are talking about first.

Originally posted by Cio88
ATS is a great example..

- You prove a Mod wrong .. you get banned
- You don't like Obama, your a racist and get U2Us
- Both of those combined, you Lose your account.

In fact there is a 99% chance this will be removed.

I have proved a Mod wrong just recently in mistakingly closing a thread..I got a thank you.

I don't particular care for what I have seen from Obama, during the campaign nor since taking office. I especially did not care for the self-appointed Office of the President-Elect...that doesn't make me racist in the least nor do I receive many U2U's outside of applause for contributions to a thread, a thank you for making someone laugh and a few other private discussions.

Both combined and I have been here since June 2006 and more than likely will continue expressing my views, opinions and subjecting unfortunate readers to my sense of humor.

I do agree that there is a good (maybe not quite 99%) chance that your post will be removed on the grounds of making a public outcry of a private matter between your friend and the actions taken by the staff and/or owners of this site. Sorry, I have seen you post a number of times on this and thought you might want a heads up before the Mod Squad gives you one.



ON TOPIC:

I would gladly give my opinion on whether or not Free Speech is dying but I am not entirely sure that I am currently inside a designated Free Speech Zone.

[edit on 26-1-2009 by Ahabstar]

Originally posted by ImaginaryReality1984

Originally posted by pilot70


But we should still defend their right to SAY so

.... not to throw molotovs though ... that is a different issue ..

[edit on 26-1-2009 by pilot70]

Yep they have a right to say it, but i wish they'd actually watched the play before being outraged lol. Anyway yes they still have a right to voice their opinion. Although to have an opinion i would think you need data on the subject you are talking about first.

Haha getting some sound info is great but your info might be my nonsense ... and vice versa ... we need all the cards on the table ... then we can make a decision ... making people shut up reduces our chances of knowing what is true ... nomatter how rediculous they sound

Originally posted by Ahabstar

ON TOPIC:

I would gladly give my opinion on whether or not Free Speech is dying but I am not entirely sure that I am currently inside a designated Free Speech Zone.

[edit on 26-1-2009 by Ahabstar]

Ahh i forgot about the exclusion order around parliament here in the UK. How dare we speak and let elected officials hear! They shouldn't be burdened with the public's outcry now should they

Originally posted by dooper
Bad mouthing Islam is a killing offense, apparently.

Yes its a capital offence in Pakistan where the 'government' actualy kills you if you do not mindlessly conform.

www.belowtopsecret.com...

Talk about insecure.