Obama freezing pay of top staff; signs ethics rules

Originally posted by CoffinFeeder
yeah, it would be nice though if they're were getting a pay cut, but they're not, they're just getting a freeze.

It's not just a freeze, and the message this sends alone is very important.

Remember when Bush used to promote people who botched up? I would say taking into consideration the Administration we had and the choices they made, this a big step forward.

No one is saying this is perfect, in fact Obama himself said many changes and Executive Orders he signed today wouldn't fix all the problems, but are a step in the right direction.

If he had cut the salaries of people in the White House the critics would cry "in these troubled times how dare he cut the salaries of these people?".

Taking all this into consideration I think this was the best decision and definitely a step in the right direction, setting the right tone.

Originally posted by stander

Perhaps not all Bush's idea were rotten "if Obama follows a structure similar to the one George Bush set up."

You want to know what GWB's first executive order was? EO13198, issued Jan 29, 2001: "Agency Responsibilities With Respect to Faith-Based and Community Initiatives"

"By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, and in order to help the Federal Government coordinate a national effort to expand opportunities for faithbased and other community organizations and to strengthen their capacity to better meet social needs in America's communities..."

Basically it created five centers for Faith-Based & Community Initiatives.

www.archives.gov...

Is that rotten?

How about Executive Order 13201 - "Notification of Employee Rights Concerning Payment of Union Dues or Fees." : "This order is designed to promote economy and efficiency in Government procurement. When workers are better informed of their rights, including their rights under the Federal labor laws, their productivity is enhanced."

www.presidency.ucsb.edu...

Also rotten?

Here's one last example - Executive Order 13210 - "Presidents Commission To Strengthen Social Security": "to preserve Social Security for senior Americans while building wealth for younger Americans"

"Modernization must not change Social Security benefits for retirees or nearretirees;

(b) The entire Social Security surplus must be dedicated to Social Security only;
(c) Social Security payroll taxes must not be increased;
(d) Government must not invest Social Security funds in the stock market;
(e) Modernization must preserve Social Security's disability and survivors components; and
(f) Modernization must include individually controlled, voluntary personal retirement accounts, which will augment the Social Security safety net. Sec. 4. Administration.
(a) The Social Security Administration shall, to the extent permitted by law, provide administrative support and funding for the Commission.
(b) Members of the Commission shall serve without any compensation for their work on the Commission."

www.presidency.ucsb.edu...

Also rotten, right?

How about you Bush bashers grow up for a change. How about you do some friggin research before you go bashing on the man and make STUPID, IGNORANT statements saying he never did anything good for America. Because if you truly say such things then you really have NO clue what the hell you are talking about.


[edit on 21-1-2009 by sos37]

Originally posted by sos37
How about you Bush bashers grow up for a change. How about you do some friggin research before you go bashing on the man and make STUPID, IGNORANT statements saying he never did anything good for America. Because if you truly say such things then you really have clue what the hell you are talking about.

Unlike Obama's, Bush's decisions have yielded results and they are not pretty for the great majority of them, and from that perspective people have the right to judge him and his decisions.

Originally posted by converge

Originally posted by sos37
How about you Bush bashers grow up for a change. How about you do some friggin research before you go bashing on the man and make STUPID, IGNORANT statements saying he never did anything good for America. Because if you truly say such things then you really have clue what the hell you are talking about.

Unlike Obama's, Bush's decisions have yielded results and they are not pretty for the great majority of them, and from that perspective people have the right to judge him and his decisions.

WRONG, sir. SOME of Bush's decisions have yielded results UNDESIRABLE to the majority of the people. Definately not all of his decisions. SOME of his decisions yielded quite FAVORABLE results as shown in the Executive Orders above. Are you not capable of giving a man credit where it's due? Or does that bit of humanity escape you?

Get off the ALL OR NOTHING bandwagon.



[edit on 21-1-2009 by sos37]

Originally posted by sos37
WRONG, sir. SOME of Bush's decisions have yielded results UNDESIRABLE to the majority of the people. Definately not all of his decisions.

Get off the ALL OR NOTHING bandwagon.

If you had read my post carefully you would have noticed that I said the majority of Bush's decisions were bad.

I have no doubt that overall he was a bad President, but I'm certainly not on the "all or nothing bandwagon".

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
reply to post by intrepid

 

HI Intrepid, I was wonder why in light of the past he is making these changes now,

That is my question.

I will give an answer to your question even though it is just what I think and although off-topic, I think many people are asking.

Maybe he had to abuse the flawed system to become president IN ORDER to fix it? Look at Ron Paul. Great ideas but did not have a chance in hell. Could it be that Obama knew that he had to take such money from companies to even have a hells chance in the presidency? A big double standard. Barrack DID become president through the classic means where other viable candidates such as Ron Paul did not. Think of it as a secret agent climbing the mafia to end it.

NOW - that would IMO be the best answer. It could also be that he is a hypocrite and will always be like that despite the current talk of freezing pay. He just started and with some of the acts Bush done I think ATS will easily be able to detect any bad change.

NOW...regarding this comment of Obamas. He is making well over 100,000 a year. I wonder if he plans on freezing his first check and what not so he can only receive that much as well?

While this sounds good, and main idea behind this may not to actually save money but bring some officials to a realization of the current economic situation. On the grand scale, I do not see how this would save much money in the scheme of things. If he continues this policy onto many government branches, such as by eliminating useless and tedious sub-parts to the branches, then can I say he is trying to save money. There is still plenty to be done though in those regards.

Note the key word "Frozen", rather than "Capped".
This means that he actually expects a depression and the GDP to reduce significantly, so he's protecting his friend's income and making sure they will always be paid more than the average worker.

Originally posted by nrky
Note the key word "Frozen", rather than "Capped".
This means that he actually expects a depression and the GDP to reduce significantly, so he's protecting his friend's income and making sure they will always be paid more than the average worker.

Good point. Word play.

I would like to see Obama tell everyone their pay has been cut by 50%, no medical benefits, expense accounts, or pensions, but that would be the real corporate world, not fantasyland Governmental sector.

Our Governemtn Spends what.....$1,000 dollars a minute every minute? I like that he made this type of a move within the first 24 hours or so but again it is only for show.

is it even possible that everyone is really this clouded by the obama siren song?

salaries FROZEN folks. Pay attention. what, were they expecting a pay raise after the first day!?

now back to your regularly scheduled PROGRAMMING

This is a step down the right path. However salaries in the government have not really been an issue. Most are underpaid which I think leads to some of the problems. Some have to support homes in DC and their real homes which would be nearly impossible on $100,000.00 a year and way below what civilian counterparts earn for the same jobs.

If he forces Congress to cut the budget drastically, shuts down many if not a large percentage of government programs and does not become a Pelosi lap dog, I'll become a supporter. One can hope anyway.

I would also need to see him stop throwing money at everything and instead address the root causes. Sending people who don't pay any taxes a welfare check will not help the economy and he knows that. Now will he be honest enough to risk his job to tell people the truth; that the country can not afford to pass out late Christmas Presents to everyone.

In the spirit of the saying about teaching a man to fish, he should be concentrating on creating jobs by expanding the economy. Giving people a tidbit to run out and buy a plasma TV won't give them a job will it?

I keep replaying in my head one of my staff running around the office yesterday saying "Obama is going to send ME a check".

I actually am praying that Obama lied to get in office and will now do the right things. Sometimes you have to lie to children when they are incapable of understanding what you are talking about. People who vote who can not even name their own Senator, Representative or influential people in government are nothing but children after all. All they know is that "Obama is going to send ME a check".

There's no doubt that he's making a lot of powerful enemies by doing this sort of thing. You really don't have to be a conspiracy nut to see that there's a large portion of America's elite right now would would like to see Obama out of office.

God forbid anything should happen, not only because I personally believe that Obama is a powerful figure, one of the most electrifying men to ever hold the office of the Presidency. The way he speaks to a crowd, he's speaking to every individual rather than using the old party lines and political cliches.

I also firmly believe that if anything should happen to Obama, there's a good chance of a second civil war occurring within the US - or at least martial law to quell the violence and rioting that would occur.

I'm a proud Obama supporter, but I don't envy the man right now. I feel I can safely say with some certainty that there are, in fact, a large number of people who would love to see him taken out. I've seen the posts myself, some of them right here on ATS.

Granted, around here you need to read between the lines, but it's all there, all over the place.

I think we should all hope that Obama's dream of a more perfect union comes to pass.

Good luck to you, Mr Obama.

I think I can safely saw that I've drank the Obama Kool-Aid, and went back for more.

Looks like you guys got yourself a real President this time. If he undoes everything the Bushes and Clintons did he will be a national/world Hero.

I wonder if banning lobbyists from the hill is one reason why Bill Clinton looked so grim yesterday? That would eliminate his sphere of influence and effectively cuts Hillary Clinton off from a lot of her (financial) backers. An interesting power struggle in and of itself, since Obama promised her a job to get her to throw support to him, and then he goes and slashes her personal power in less than half, also ensuring she can't make any power bids. Interesting move!

reply to post by nrky


Good point!

reply to post by xstealth


$400K is a total bargain for the position of President of the United States. I personally think it's not enough.

Those who disagree, I'm not sure what you are comparing it to. Directors in run of the mill companies are easily making $100K-$130K. Are you telling me that a Marketing Director is doing 1/4 the work of the President of the United States?

This is an insane job that I cannot even conceive what it takes.

delius



[edit on 21-1-2009 by delius]

Good to see out of Barack. Not enough to sway me from my neutral standpoint I have for our new President, but its only his first day, and this is a step in the right direction.

What I find very interesting, though, is how the very first laws he begins to implement are reffered to as "ethics laws"

According to the Mayan calendar, we have just entered the Ethics era of our evolution. We enter this realm of learning from our previous era, the Power era.

Very symbolic to me that Obama's first laws enacted deal with Ethics, after having finally shedding our skin of the Power era (Bush Doctrine).

Can Obama legally freeze the Pay raises of Congress that they themselves voted in as automatic yearly raises? The reason that Congress voted for a continual pay raise yearly for themselves is this would not have to come up on the floor of the Senate and House to be debated by themselves and the public.

If the public deems that Congress did a bad job of running the country that particular year or years would they not be more apt to not want them to be given a raise just like a person would expect in a public sector job. It would sure be nice if we in the public sector of the job market could vote our own raises in and how much yearly we would recieve with the boss not being able to reject the amount of the raise or if we deserve one.

[edit on 21-1-2009 by amari]

Originally posted by jam321
I am sure that many loopholes will be included in these measures so that everyone can have an opt out.

Why? Why are you sure? Why? Where is your crystal ball...

Even if a staff can't lobby for a period after leaving the white house, there is nothing to stop them from getting their family members to do it for them. There is always a Gray area in Washington.

You might as well quit and go home then if you are going to be so cynical from the outset.

Geesh... give the guy to speak and put his policy in place before you go judging it with cynicism

reply to post by Tgautier13


Where did you get the info on the mayan calendar and the "ethics era" you speak of?


Is this actually translated using the codex or is this some new age mubo umbo projected onto the mayans?

Personally I hope the former... just cuz that would be cool.