Zecharia Sitchin..."he's just another one making a living selling books that treat folks to a tale

reply to post by OzWeatherman


I believe that he and Jordan Maxwell parted company but I don't think that even he would deny that he makes money from his work. It’s whether it’s of any value or indeed entertaining? I don't know how to read Sumerian or Hebrew or Greek so when I read the books such as these I and you, are at the mercy of the writer and even they can be wrong if they are using 'other' expert’s works also to justify their own work.

The prime example is the Bible, its used probably more than any other book to justify, actions, feelings, faith, wars, life, death, countries existence and religions. Yet, its a fact that the source is unlikely to be in existence (no, the dead sea scrolls are still works that are not source). Also, most if not all of what we have today has been changed many times, sometimes deliberately, often by accident because the copiers of old making these copies before the printing press where often literate and just copied as best they could not knowing what they were copying! Yet as I've said people actually use this book to justify almost everything they do!

This is Jason Martell of Xfacts.com.... Here are some points to note. Sitchin stands out where all other mainstream sciences DO NOT accept the extraterrestrial reality. Therefore, none of them will agree with Sitchin that the mythological tales are not just tales but ACTAUL recorded events.

Everything else the Sumerian culture left has been proven to be of great value. We still use their math, calander and time to this day. Why not also accept what they say about where they learned all their information? See the links below to learn more as to WHY this information deserves more creditable research.

Sumerian Culture:
xfacts.com...

Latest Research:
xfacts.com...

Jason Martell
Xfacts.com

Originally posted by CoolBlackHole
1. I repeat that some of your posts do distract from the thread’s main issues and/or imply unsubstantial questions.

Again...when you are asked a question, you dismiss it and say it is irrelevant to the main topic, attacking the person for asking the question.

This is the claim I called you on...

Originally posted by CoolBlackHole
...the principal message, that human genes were destructively manipulated and influenced by another race originating from a planet in this solar system.

Asking you about the "principle message" is somehow irrelevant and distracting.

Originally posted by CoolBlackHole
Secondly some of your posts just blatantly negate clear facts. For instance the fifth post on page 7: “…nowhere has anyone produced the evidence you claim they have”. This is flatly ridiculous...

Your claim is both unfair and ridiculous. I asked you for examples specific to this claim...

Originally posted by CoolBlackHole
...the principal message, that human genes were destructively manipulated and influenced by another race originating from a planet in this solar system.

Then you said the following people posted evidence supporting this claim...

Originally posted by CoolBlackHole
In this whole thread we can see about 10 examples of great evidence supporting Sitchin... by numerous posters, many well explained. Now, if all these arguments and explanations (just a few examples: 'Xcalibur254' on several pages, 'Boogley' on page 6, 'Anonymous' (link of 3rd post on page 6), 'Anonymous' (16th post on page 6)

Let's look at these one-by-one...

Xcalibur made posts here, here, here andhere. There is nothing in these posts supporting your claim.

Boogley's post here is about the Nephilim, which you would really have to stretch and twist to match your claim.

The first Anonymous on page six was discussing supposed evidence of ancient aircraft (however, those are a known palimpsest that has nothing to do with aircraft), not anything regarding your claim.

The second Anonymous was discussing George Smith's accomplishments translating Sumerian, and not your above claim.

Thus far...no one had posted a single shred of evidence supporting your above claim.

After that, you started listed people...

Originally posted by CoolBlackHole
'enir nabu' on page 7, 'TheRealDonPedros' on page 7, 'WISHADOW' on page 7, 'PhyberDragon's several extensiv posts on page 8) are just a “nowhere has anyone.....” for you, then simply no reasonable discussion can be led with you insofar.

...who posted their arguments after I rightly said that no one had posted evidence supporting your claims. The earliest, Enir Nabu, came three hours after my post. That is rather unfair, don't you think?

But let's look at these posts, shall we?

Enir Nabu's post is about how he believes certain authors support Sitchin, it says nothing regarding your above claim.

DonPedros' post deals with the dual-locality of sacred locations in certain mythologies, nothing regarding the genetic manipulation of man.

Nor do WISHADOW's two posts say anything about the genetic manipulation of man, but are rather defenses of Sitchin the man.

As far as PhyberDragon's post, while entertaining, say absolutely nothing regarding your claims.

So...after that point by point examination...I am very confused about how any of the above posts support this claim...

Originally posted by CoolBlackHole
...the principal message, that human genes were destructively manipulated and influenced by another race originating from a planet in this solar system.

[edit on 23-1-2009 by SaviorComplex]

Meh.. if people want to blindly believe any old economist who claims to know more about archaeology than actual archaeologists, that's their prerogative. He isn't "thinking outside the box," he is making stuff up to fit his own agenda.

I think his ideas are beyond ridiculous — his theories are based on wild guesswork, not fact. That isn't archaeology. It is personal opinions. Could he be right? I guess there is the 1 in 10 billion chance he could have guessed right. But I rather doubt it. He is just one of many in line to cash in with new age ideas, that's all.

Originally posted by CoolBlackHole
Yes. He is. And he is bringing a lot of light to some hidden subjects, like the secret genetic manipulation of humankind.

The link you posted bases it's arguments on this claim...

the human genome contains 223 genes that do not have the required predecessors on the genomic evolutionary tree.

From an issue of Science. And while that issue of Science states scientists beliefs these were passed to humans from bacteria during evolution. Your link dismisses this and makes the leap that Sumerian gods did it, despite the fact this is documented in nature.

However, those supposed 223 genes are in question...

None of these genes is likely to have been acquired outright from bacteria, say investigators at The Institute for Genomic Research (TIGR) in Rockville, Maryland, who conducted the study. Rather, they suggest that some proteins may appear to exist only in humans and bacteria due to the loss of genes among nonvertebrate species and the failure to detect human and bacterial genes that are present but mutated in nonvertebrate species.

SOURCE

As for your pictures, could you please explain the connection between the Caduceus and the DNA, as the Caduceus has nothing to do what-so-ever with genetics or even medicine (until the 20th century).

Originally posted by fleabit
"Meh.. if people want to blindly believe..."

Well THAT’S a nice blanket judgment, yes, we Sitchin believers are all blind, many thanks fleabit!
My opinion is Sitchin followers are not “blind”, but discerning thinkers.

"...he is making stuff up to fit his own agenda."

Do you really believe he “made” that just up to “fit his own agenda”. What a convincing explanation ...

I think his ideas are beyond ridiculous — his theories are based on wild guesswork, not fact.

His ideas are NOT beyond ridiculous, but very convincing. Actually so convincing, that many fear them and try to ridicule him. People open your eyes!!!

"That isn't archaeology. It is personal opinions. "

You must be an expert.

"He is just one of many in line to cash in with new age ideas, that's all."

What the heck is wrong with selling some books if you’ve been a resercher for many years, providing people with interesting information? Should we e.g. condemn Obama only because he “cashes in” a presidential salary?

reply to post by CoolBlackHole


I do agree Mr Sitchin does bring up some interesting points in his books. I have read the early ones, and he raises some good questions. However, I think his conclusions are speculative, and not based on what is now known about the tablets.

If anyone wants a fun read, head down to your library and check out Mr Sitchin's books (I did not buy any). That way you can read his ideas without spending $30 on a book.

Originally posted by CoolBlackHole

"...he is making stuff up to fit his own agenda."

Do you really believe he “made” that just up to “fit his own agenda”. What a convincing explanation ...

That wouldnt be the first time someone has "made" something up to fit their own agenda. Remember Blossom Goodchild?

His ideas are NOT beyond ridiculous, but very convincing. Actually so convincing, that many fear them and try to ridicule him. People open your eyes!!!

While his ideas, may not be ridiculous (especially compared to some of the ideas on ATS), they are extremely unplausible

"He is just one of many in line to cash in with new age ideas, that's all."

What the heck is wrong with selling some books if you’ve been a resercher for many years, providing people with interesting information?


So if someone came to you with what they claimed to be a time machine, would you buy it?

Its called being a con artist. I doubt Sitchin was intentionally selling his books to prey on gullible believers, but considering the prophecies were never initially fulfilled, and considering that he is still writing books, then I think he now in fact knows what he is doing.

Important message:
Please do NOT read from Sitchin! Do NOT click this link! Its only a lie, all made up, to brag! Sitchin is a fool, like e.g. Galileo Galilei was. Remember how that idiot corroborated the world is NOT flat, but sphere-like? A sphere? Ridiculous. Shaking, laughing, rolling on the floor, and holding my sides! Everybody knows we’d fall down if the world was a sphere, wouldn't we. So why bother reading from such hoaxers.




[edit on 24-1-2009 by CoolBlackHole]

I don't believe Sitchin's work, but I have to tell you... according to "proper" scholars, the only thing ancient people did was worship and screw.

Reminds me of the story where the "scholars" were sitting around discussing the "religious significance" of a "bird" found in an ancient tomb, and an engineer picked it up, and threw it across the room. Turns out it was an ancient toy glider.

I have read three of his books...however...I read them for entertainment as I do many such "theories". As anyone on this site, I'm sure knows, everyone is entitled to an opinion. Some...like Sitchin...just have a small library of opinions.

Originally posted by CoolBlackHole
Remember how that idiot corroborated the world is NOT flat, but sphere-like? A sphere? Ridiculous.

That is not what Galileo is famous for or even what he did. He advocated heliocentrism, having discovered the Galilean moons orbiting Jupiter. By the time of his discoveries, it was already well-known that the world was round; Sir Francis Drake sailed around the world when Galileo was 16 (and the Earth being a sphere had been accepted fact in the West for at least 1800 years before that).

But the history lesson is beside the point. Your argument here is that because a radical theory in the past has been proven correct, that we should be accepting or at least more open to radical theories now. That they should not be judged on their own merits, but rather the merits of theories that may have come before. However, this ignores the fact that there have been as many, if not more, radical theories that have been shown to be wrong. A theory or belief should be judged on its own merits and not because an unrelated theory or belief may have been proven right or wrong in the past.

[edit on 24-1-2009 by SaviorComplex]

Originally posted by sir_chancealot
I don't believe Sitchin's work, but I have to tell you... according to "proper" scholars, the only thing ancient people did was worship and screw.

Perhaps you could tell us which scholars say this.

It seems many Sitchin supporters here have had no real exposure to historians or archaeologists, their attitudes towards these disciplines based solely on what Sitchin and the like have told them.

Sitchin is no Galileo, Newton, or da Vinci. He is not basing his theories on his wealth of archaeological experience, nor brilliant mind. He is not a scientist. He makes wild claims and is unable to provide any proof. Nuclear war eradicated the Sumerian culture? Yea.. he is just brilliant.

Previous brilliant men were scoffed at NOT due to their scientific methods. Those were sound. They were scoffed at or even acting against the laws of the times, because what they discovered went against religious beliefs of the time. They to the church, were heretics. They had to be careful because of zealots. Sitchin is sort of the opposite of them.

At first I thought he just had some bad ideas. Poor research. None of which were supported by mainstream science. Serious researches considered his work very suspect. Then I went and read some bits of his books as I could from across the Internet. Now I really think he is either waaay out in left field... an utter new-age nutjob, OR.. and perhaps more likely, he is a brilliant salesman. He IS an economist. He has found a niche. Willing people to snatch up his radical ideas. Isn't it amazing how FAST and how many books he puts out? Hmmm.

He has no scientific proof that a former race of servant aliens, who acted as our gods, came and cross-bred our people, or engaged us in a nuclear war with another alien race. It's even bad fiction.

Sitchin is no great genius. He rode in on the crest of the 70s wave of the new popular interest in the concept the aliens influencing life on earth. Von Daniken was the champion and a bestselling author.

With Sumerian writing largely untranslateable 30 years ago he could get away more easily with his fantastic claims. As his modest popularity grew the claims became wilder. Modern archeology and translations as well as the science of genetics ar\e now far more sophisticated. Sitchin's speculations on these subjects are not even within the realm of physical possibility given our advanced knowledge.

There are a number of brilliant dedicated scholars of Middle East antiquity.
I doubt 1 in 1000 Sitchin readers would bother to read their works as they don't have the same fastasy science fiction appeal of Sitchin.

There have been some notable thinkers who were ahead of the curve in their field who saw things the academics of their day did not. Sitchin is not even in the running in this category.


Mike F

reply to post by OzWeatherman


He's not the only one that translated the tablets... WOW! - Spend more time RESEARCHING YOURSELF, instead of goving things like this stars! - How sad... Nobody is 100% correct. - If you notice, anyone can have anything to say about anyone, such as Alex Jones, David Icke, etc... Listen to the info, and verify it for yourself. - Same with what we all should be doing with the crap we get from the media & governments.
I personally don't agree with the Planet X part of it, but the Ananaki (those guys in my avatar) are reported in throughout different civilizations in the world & history.

And as it can vew clearly seen; It is not about being able to 'read Sumarian' - A child can SEE this: - For they at least have open minds.


... Just out of proportion? Or is this a (stated) 'god'?


You going to tell me this is just art? .. Right... What a coincidence that all the people of the world 'fantasize' about reptilians... That they imagine winged ones (that have been documented in ufology) coming down from the sky... This page also has interesting information entitled:
Scientists confirm Extraterrestrial genes in Human DNA.





Anyways, why would some of these tablets NOT be clearly 'speaking' of ETs? - They have been visiting us for a LONG time.

Just look at this:



[edit on 24-1-2009 by Time=Now]

The thing is, when you attach a name to something, and when there are some errors, but the rest of the information is true, what we see is posts like this, and attacking the messenger. - We all have to make a living.

By the by, I find it funny that someone offended by this...

Originally posted by CoolBlackHole

Originally posted by fleabit
"Meh.. if people want to blindly believe..."

Well THAT’S a nice blanket judgment, yes, we Sitchin believers are all blind, many thanks fleabit!

Would end up posting this pic to target those he does not agree with...

Originally posted by CoolBlackHole

Originally posted by Time=Now
He's not the only one that translated the tablets... WOW! - Spend more time RESEARCHING YOURSELF...

I would recommend doing the same yourself, since so much is based on absolute ignorance and just taking Sitchin and his ilk at their word. Have you studied Sumerian history and archaeology outside of Sitchin and the like?

Tell the truth.

Originally posted by Time=Now
... Just out of proportion? Or is this a (stated) 'god'?

You must really be grasping for straws to say someone shown out of proportion is proof of extraterrestrial visitation.

Originally posted by Time=Now
This page also has interesting information entitled:
Scientists confirm Extraterrestrial genes in Human DNA.

First, the Canadian is little more than a Weekly World News dressed in fancier clothes.

Second, that article has been all but debunked by Michael Salla and Linda Molten Howe. Seems no one involved with the Human Genome Project has ever heard of the Dr. Chang quoted in the article.

Originally posted by Time=Now

You claim it is a "reptilian" alien, but that looks an awful lot like a bird.

Originally posted by Time=Now

Another debunked tablet that those ignorant of Sumerian language and culture hold as proof of ETs. That does not show a solar system, but stars in the sky. The center object is not the Sumerian symbol for the sun, but for a star.

Originally posted by Time=Now

And what is the exact context of this statue? Without the context, one could claim that is anything.

Originally posted by Time=Now
Just look at this:

This website, by an Italian art historian, explains in great detail that "mysterious image" in the Madonna and Child with the infant St. John. It is announcement to the shepherds of the Gospel of Luke.

Of course, you know all this already...cause you did your research, right?

For those of you who ridicule Sitchin for whatever reason, some who have not even read his books, you should visit this link:
ridiculed and vindicated mavericks

As a for instance which demonstrates closed minds:
Wright bros (flying machines)
After their Kitty Hawk success, The Wrights flew their machine in open fields next to a busy rail line in Dayton Ohio for almost an entire year. American authorities refused to come to the demos, and Scientific American Magazine published stories about "The Lying Brothers." Even the local Dayton newspapers never sent a reporter (but they did complain about all the letters they were receiving from local "crazies" who reported the many flights.)