Evidence Obtained Through Illegal Searches Can Now be Used Against You in Court

Originally posted by CaptGizmo
Just like the rest of Washington.....the Supreme Court needs an enema as well.This BS has gone on long enough! It's time to start taking back our country and I will start by writing my congressman about this and how it is unjust and unconstitutional. Supreme Court indeed

-SNIP-

did you read the dayam thread?

its a misleading

story

that if a cop makes a simple or basic or non- event altering mistake, the arrest is still legal

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[edit on 27-1-2009 by MemoryShock]

reply to post by Total Reality



So does that mean - now the police can just come in and search without warrants - cars, houses etc?

If so, that is completely and totally outrageous!

What is happening - by the time the Supreme court is done, they will have taken most of our basic rights away!

I've often wondered why a criminal should go free if evidence is obtained "illegally".

Imagine for a minute that instead of making that evidence not usable, that the police department that committed the error was fined and the fine would go to the victim of the illegal search.

You could make the fine pretty large. Police departments are not going to want to pay fines. So in general terms there would be education to make sure that all evidence collected was done in the correct manner.

At the same time, if you find a murder weapon that could lead to the conviction of a known felon, you wouldn't have to not use evidence that was collected in violation of his/her civil rights.

So if the police break down your door for no apparent reason and don't find anything, the department will be fined and you will get paid. If the police do an illegal search of your property and find that you are a serial killer, the department will be fined but you (the serial killer) will be convicted.

Originally posted by Wildbob77
I've often wondered why a criminal should go free if evidence is obtained "illegally".

Imagine for a minute that instead of making that evidence not usable, that the police department that committed the error was fined and the fine would go to the victim of the illegal search.

You could make the fine pretty large. Police departments are not going to want to pay fines. So in general terms there would be education to make sure that all evidence collected was done in the correct manner.

At the same time, if you find a murder weapon that could lead to the conviction of a known felon, you wouldn't have to not use evidence that was collected in violation of his/her civil rights.

So if the police break down your door for no apparent reason and don't find anything, the department will be fined and you will get paid. If the police do an illegal search of your property and find that you are a serial killer, the department will be fined but you (the serial killer) will be convicted.

look

depends on what the officer messed up

if it was something big

like he doesnt use a warrent

and he searches your car with a fake one

that would mean the investigation is corrupted

but a minor mistake

shouldn't let the criminal get off free for a crime because of red tape loop holes

You people really don't get it, do you?

I mean come on. There comes a point where you just have to be THICK to not see the light of day. Stop pretending there's a difference between a "little" mistake and a "big" mistake. There is not. There is no room for mistakes. If you allow "little mistakes" - and pay close attention kids, pop some Ritalin if you have to -

If you allow "little mistakes," then you allow all mistakes, because you clowns are not the ones who will be deciding the difference between "little" and "big." The people making the mistakes will be making that decision.

The cops now can search, arrest, and harass anyone they want. All they have to do is say they made a "little mistake."

What some of you sheep don't realize is that several thousand years ago, mankind invented this mystical school of magic called "LYING."

Now, thanks to these judges (and the approval and complacence they have from millions of idiots,) this magical LYING can be used to justify any breach of the Constitution as an "accident." Just a "little mistake." Just a slight boo-boo. A little goof-up got you tased, how humorous. Now go to jail anyways.

"Oh, we're sorry your honor. Yes, we did burst into this man's house at 3 in the morning, pull his family out of bed, and hold them to the ground at gun-point while we put him in cuffs and hauled him away. You're honor, you see, We thought we had a no-knock warrant. There must have been a mix-up somewhere. I guess we got the wrong house."

And you folks, you... blind, good little sheep, you sit there and spew words of complacence and acceptance for this, you are the enablers. You can't cast the blame at the government when you make excuses for their actions. The country is falling.

The American Dream is crumbling. The nation our forefathers paid in blood to build is being dismantled. The freedoms added to that nation by the Civil War, and by many other civil rights movements before and after it, are being taken away from you. And you're justifying it, every single time it happens, by saying "Oh, it's just a little difference. It's just a small mistake. It's only a minor loss of liberty, so it must not be a loss at all, right?

It's happening because you're letting it happen. They move slowly, then they let you adjust. They give you time to get used to it. Then they move forward a bit more. They crush one small liberty after another, and they say it's for your own good. And then you help them. You aid them. You get everyone else thinking its for their own good, too. And then THEY move forward a bit more, and the cycle starts over again.

The police aren't idiots. These aren't "mistakes." They government is just corrupt. Apparently so are the judges. And so to, most definitely, are the citizens who stand by and make excuses and justify the treason our government is committing every day. They don't even have to take our rights anymore. They've got you people so dumbed down you're just handing them over.

Washington would hang you people for what you're letting them do to the country he helped build. And rightly so, you people are crapping on his grave.

reply to post by mattifikation


from a clown to a wise one.

Instead of insulting why don't you please tell us how we Americans can over ride this decision?

You seem to be complaining a lot but yet I see no words on what you plan to do about it.

reply to post by jam321


There is only one solution that has not been tried yet, that I can think of. Sadly, if I share it over the Internet, I think I can expect to spend a long, long time in a place I'd rather not be put. And all for nothing, as I know my words would fall on deaf ears here.

Of course, there may be another way, but it lies within the brain of somebody much smarter and more of a leader than I.

However, there is a large moral and intellectual difference between not knowing what to do, and allowing yourself to be fooled into believing nothing should be done.

I'm afraid I do not have a good answer for your question, at least, not one that the American public is ready to hear spoken out loud. I also fear that, because the temperature is being raised slowly, the public will never be ready. And sadly, the public's readiness to be freed is vital to the process.

So, I can't give you an answer.

Whelp, anyways! On another note, look at this cool, completely unrelated bit of prose I found:

"We have four boxes with which to defend our freedom: the soap box, the
ballot box, the jury box, and the cartridge box. - Unknown."

Originally posted by ConservativeJack

Originally posted by CaptGizmo
Just like the rest of Washington.....the Supreme Court needs an enema as well.This BS has gone on long enough! It's time to start taking back our country and I will start by writing my congressman about this and how it is unjust and unconstitutional. Supreme Court indeed

lmao moron alert

did you read the dayam thread?

its a misleading

story

that if a cop makes a simple or basic or non- event altering mistake, the arrest is still legal

Allow me to direct you to this thread ConservativeJack!

Called Civility & Decorum Are Expected
www.abovetopsecret.com...
I strongly suggest you read it!

You appear to have not read this particular thread before making personal attacks. As I can see you have had several warnings in the past due to your negative point stature. No need for insults here!


[edit on 1/27/2009 by CaptGizmo]

Allow me to direct you to this thread ConservativeJack!

Called Civility & Decorum Are Expected
www.abovetopsecret.com...
I strongly suggest you read it!

You appear to have not read this particular thread before making personal attacks. As I can see you have had several warnings in the past due to your negative point stature. No need for insults here!


[edit on 1/27/2009 by CaptGizmo]

Hey, I have respect but you have to respect your self.

Come into a thread, haven't not read the OP...

just to post a knee jerker

Instant gratification, they say....They say it's like sex.

I'll make sure I check out that thread, have a nice day.

Originally posted by projectvxn
Wow. I don't know what more to say...I can't believe this. The constitution is officially ripped to pieces. I doubt Obama will do anything about this.

Wait a minute, so the supreme court decided by themselves that they're allowed to do this? This is not a presidential decision made by Obama?

There's not much Obama can do about it. When the Supreme Court says a right no longer exists, or never existed, that's pretty much where the buck stops.

The only thing Obama could do is ask congress to draft a Constitutional Amendment protecting us from unreasonable searches and seizures.

...

Oh. Wait a minute there...

I can not stop from getting more and more outrage at what is going on in this nation, I decided that I rather die as a patriot defending my nation from the same crocks, thieves and corrupted politicians that abiding by their corrupted laws.

Time for the next American revolution.

We have been rob blind, we have been lie too, our government has been taken from us and our rights are not longer there to protect us.

What else is left for the citizens in this nation but to fight back the corruption.

Obviously while we citizens abide by the Constitution our own government crap all over it.

[edit on 27-1-2009 by marg6043]

reply to post by mattifikation



I wish I had the time to go line by line with your thread to point out everything that is wrong, but dinner is almost ready so I have to make it short.

The forefathers that you mention built into the constitution room to move. they understood that times would change. Although they probably didnt imagine a group of "persians" crashing jet liners into buildings in manhattan though. But they did leave wiggle room in case of an emergency though.

This rule means that if the cop kicks in the door, then yells "POLICE", he can still use the 10 pounds of crystal meth he just found.

If your not running a meth lab or anything equivilant, then why worry?

Originally posted by spliff4020

The forefathers that you mention built into the constitution room to move. they understood that times would change. Although they probably didnt imagine a group of "persians" crashing jet liners into buildings in manhattan though. But they did leave wiggle room in case of an emergency though.

Wiggle room? Seriously? Yes, that's exactly what the forefathers wrote into the Fourth Amendment.

"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized. Unless, of course, it was an accidental search and seizure. Then there's some wiggle room."

If your not running a meth lab or anything equivilant, then why worry?

Ah, yes. The old "If you're not doing anything wrong, then why worry about losing your rights?" argument. I don't really need to pick your post apart line by line, because that's the dumbest thing people say when they discuss the loss of civil rights in this country. The dumbest.

You see, taking away rights is only part one in a two step plan. There's nothing inherently wrong with taking rights away from bad guys - they are bad after all... right? Well, no... not right. Step One of the plan sounds great. It's Step Two that makes Step One a real kick to the 'nads.

Ladies and Gentleman, I present to you, the simple two step plan of tyrants to actually get you to agree to hand over your rights:

Step One: Take away the rights of people who are doing "bad things." Sheep consent to this, thinking that it's not their problem because they aren't doing the "bad things."

Step Two: Once people doing "bad things" have no rights, redefine what constitutes "bad things" so that nobody has rights.

Can't you see that? Did you honestly not know that? Aw, forget it. Go enjoy your dinner. I bet your taste buds work double time when your eyes fail you so completely.

To anyone else who's reading: Never let them fool you. Don't let them take away individual rights. Not even from the scum of the earth. You never know when you might be labeled the scum.

Originally posted by spliff4020
reply to post by mattifikation

 

I wish I had the time to go line by line with your thread to point out everything that is wrong, but dinner is almost ready so I have to make it short.

The forefathers that you mention built into the constitution room to move. they understood that times would change. Although they probably didnt imagine a group of "persians" crashing jet liners into buildings in manhattan though. But they did leave wiggle room in case of an emergency though.

This rule means that if the cop kicks in the door, then yells "POLICE", he can still use the 10 pounds of crystal meth he just found.

If your not running a meth lab or anything equivilant, then why worry?

Because it also means that if the police knock your door down at 3am by mistake, they can also use anything else that may, or may not, be illegal depending on your location. Things like, say, your GUNS.

Does THAT get your attention?

For all the "Conservatives" (anyone calling themselves "conservative" at the same time they advocate the shredding of the Constitution needs their flippin' head examined) out there who support this crap, remember, if it happens to YOU it won't matter if your guns are properly locked up, registered, and 100% legal--when the cops come a' knockin' it ceases to be your "collection" or your hunting gear and instantly becomes your "bad guy stockpile". Same goes for any "subversive" materials you may have, such as magazines, fringe-group newsletters, etc.

A "small mistake" can quickly turn any ordinary, law-abiding citizen into a domestic terrorist.

Chew on that for awhile and get beck to me.

Originally posted by The Nighthawk

Originally posted by spliff4020
reply to post by mattifikation

 

I wish I had the time to go line by line with your thread to point out everything that is wrong, but dinner is almost ready so I have to make it short.

The forefathers that you mention built into the constitution room to move. they understood that times would change. Although they probably didnt imagine a group of "persians" crashing jet liners into buildings in manhattan though. But they did leave wiggle room in case of an emergency though.

This rule means that if the cop kicks in the door, then yells "POLICE", he can still use the 10 pounds of crystal meth he just found.

If your not running a meth lab or anything equivilant, then why worry?

Because it also means that if the police knock your door down at 3am by mistake, they can also use anything else that may, or may not, be illegal depending on your location. Things like, say, your GUNS.

Does THAT get your attention?

For all the "Conservatives" (anyone calling themselves "conservative" at the same time they advocate the shredding of the Constitution needs their flippin' head examined) out there who support this crap, remember, if it happens to YOU it won't matter if your guns are properly locked up, registered, and 100% legal--when the cops come a' knockin' it ceases to be your "collection" or your hunting gear and instantly becomes your "bad guy stockpile". Same goes for any "subversive" materials you may have, such as magazines, fringe-group newsletters, etc.

A "small mistake" can quickly turn any ordinary, law-abiding citizen into a domestic terrorist.

Chew on that for awhile and get beck to me.

Well, lets see. I do own guns. Both pistols are registered. The rifles are not, as they dont need to be. I also have a few issues of car and driver laying around.

Nope, doesnt bother me in the least.

Wow, now thats ridiculous. Anything to get away with a screw-up. Now all the police have to do is claim an 'oops' and get what they want. That basically gives them free reign over everything. Dear god, the hypocrisy in the country has already started.

I'm expected the right to bear arms will be excommunicated very shortly.

Um, they always could get away with it. It was up to a judge to decide if the evidence was admissible. Its just been tidied up for ya now!

But, hey if they forgot to yell "police!" before they kicked the door in and found 2 pounds of meth and a pc full of child porn then ya, that guy should walk...

Its really a no-brainer.

Originally posted by Wildbob77
I've often wondered why a criminal should go free if evidence is obtained "illegally".

Imagine for a minute that instead of making that evidence not usable, that the police department that committed the error was fined and the fine would go to the victim of the illegal search.

You could make the fine pretty large. Police departments are not going to want to pay fines. So in general terms there would be education to make sure that all evidence collected was done in the correct manner.

At the same time, if you find a murder weapon that could lead to the conviction of a known felon, you wouldn't have to not use evidence that was collected in violation of his/her civil rights.

So if the police break down your door for no apparent reason and don't find anything, the department will be fined and you will get paid. If the police do an illegal search of your property and find that you are a serial killer, the department will be fined but you (the serial killer) will be convicted.

so with what you said above, you won't mind if police come into your house at anytime and do a complete search of your house. if they found a gun in your house that you had bought at a gun show years ago, and it now shows up on their database as a gun that was used in a murder, you can be arrested for that murder or at least be arrested as an accomplice.
or......
20 to 30 police just start seaching every house in a neighborhood known for gang activity by going door to door, because they have suspicion of illegality in that neighborhood, but no actual crime committed that they know of, in those individual houses.... this is the slippery slope