Requesting Another Ruling Bloodline Disclosure

Some of you may remember a few months ago when someone who used the moniker "Hidden_Hand" began a thread which resulted in a long and intriguing discourse. H_H claimed to be of an elite ruling bloodline family and "disclosed" some information which seemed to divide the community here at ATS. The link to the original thread is here:

www.abovetopsecret.com...


And collated, minus the "interruptions," here:

home.comcast.net...


This happened once before (and even a few times before that, according to H_H), on GodLikeProductions.com, in 2005, by a person who called themself "Insider." The link to that archived, collated "disclosure" is here:

www.scribd.com...



In both cases, there seemed to be a large group of people who were convinced that these were hoaxes, as well as some who, at the very least, gave it chance and posed some legitimate questions to the OP's.

I, like those who found value in these "disclosures," are hopeful that we may see an event like this again soon, for there are many questions that we have. I would personally be very grateful if "they" would take the following request into consideration:




Could the "ruling bloodlines" please engage in another discourse again with the people of ATS? Some of us would greatly appreciate it, and this would provide yet another opportunity for each side to fulfill their given "roles" that they are "playing."

Consider this an experiment in Free Will. If we actually request such a discourse, might it happen again sooner than if we hadn't?







Who knows. Hope this generates discussion, either way. I still feel like these "bloodline disclosures" have not been given enough attention. Thoughts?

I think you are baiting creative writers lurking in the ATS shadows, great intention though, do you really think that these "disclosures" are real I mean think about it, why would these elite's have a need to disclose anything to the public? I read the forementioned thread in its entirety btw, so don't think I'm attacking you here.

How would the rulling elite's benifit from coming onto ATS to give out this information? Why not just do a press release or something like that why go all "underground" with it? to me it just doen not make any sense, but IMO because you asked, some crazy will answer your call.

Everyone is looking for the "Unified Theory of Everything" and when talented writers like H_H come out of the wilderness with all the hooks of a master con artist it seems that the usual crowd fall for it everytime.

No one individual person has all the answers and it should send alarm bells ringing when a charlatan makes elaborate claims as such. There appears to be an armchair conspiracy theorist junk food genre emerging and it appeals to passive thinkers who want all the answers on a plate served up with refreshments.

Do your own work and don't be lazy, when some has information that you want to believe in...step back and look at it from an analytical perspective and not some kind of new age groupie looking for the next "unified theory of everything bandwagon" to jump on.

(By the way I am the OP of this thread, just didn't log in before hand)

I think it's beyond a lot of people here on ATS to formulate something so extensive. We'd probably be able to recognize if someone was just messing around, pulling our chain, so to speak. It seemed to me, and some others, that this was more sophisticated and perhaps warranted some recognition.


Several factors to consider:

-The speed of the responses
-The eloquent manner in which they were answered
-The disappearance at the end (a hoaxer would likely drag it out for longer)
-Consistency with the 2005 incident, terms used, overall presentation and style, etc., while still unique


I was inclined to believe this story, if not more the message alone, then because I always felt that there was something more at work here than the typical NWO theories that get tossed around, some higher force that the NWO answers to. Made sense, and frankly, the core of the message had absolutely nothing negative about it. Basically it said that we should take responsibility for ourselves, become more loving towards others, figure out where we are, "work on ourselves," etc., all with a complete lack of any bigotry, hatred, discrimination, etc. (even if you take out all of the New Age stuff) Also he constantly reinforced that he didn't care if no one believed him (usually a hoaxer will try to get people to buy their story). Even if he was a hoaxer, I mean, damn, job well done. The message and style just seem to completely lack any reason to have just made it up.

One of the shames of this whole thing is that he was gone before we really had the chance to ask him enough questions to sufficiently test his authenticity.


Compare this to, say, Alex Jones, who ratchets up fear at every possible moment, always claims righteousness, and is constantly trying to get you to buy more stuff. And yet theres probably far more people who've jumped on his bandwagon.

Religions are the same way
Add other theorists like Icke as well



I guess in order to see the reason for any such disclosure you'd have to buy the spirituality aspect as well. Which I guess I did? Although I was already well into before this happened.


I will be the first one to admit that I could be wrong, but something just felt different here.

Of course, Christians would say the same thing about Jesus. And I think THEY'RE nuts.


It's all a matter of perspective. There are so many different versions of the "truth" floating around out there, and we all have our own.

Hidden_hand was a talented hoaxer that drew in the usual gullible crowd. I suspect the OP are sock puppets for H_H as he tries to draw continual attention to his thread in order to get a better laugh out of it and maximum mileage. A large amount of the OP's posts are exclusively in that thread and this one.

Its a case study in what happens when you tell people what they already want to believe. They fall for it, immediately, without ever questioning you. I pondered for a while doing the same thing just so I could make a demonstration out of the folly of it and how gullible some of the ATS crowd is becoming.

You notice the people praising the guy don't want any opposition, and "interruptions" like me is a code for serious critique. No critique allowed!

The factors the OP is trying to spin as making it "real" are actually all the signs that its a hoax. Good hoaxes are the most eloquent people you ever meet, and they never drag it out - because the longer you drag out the hoax the more likely you are to be discovered. H_H knows what ATS members want to believe, and the result was hilarious...people fell for it en masse.

The most LIKELY identity of the OP? A college student, probably a English major, who was looking for some fun over fall break.

[edit on 10-1-2009 by LowLevelMason]

I was one of those people who found something resonating within the material. Even if he was a hoaxer, just what he had to say itself really made me want to look deeper. I read the Ra material. There is quite a bit there I found totally enthralling, and other things I was kinda on the fence about.

LowLevelMason, I have to laugh because my spouse said exactly what you did regarding the identity of H_H. Someone writing a thesis for grad school or some board college student looking to stir some stuff up.

To me it was not whether or not the dude was legit, but rather the context of the stuff there. As a former Christian, I really identified with his breakdown of Revelations "New Heaven, New Earth". His explanation of the logos and Infinite Creator, too, resonated heavily.

2012 means alot to many different groups.Apparently it is starting to have some bearing in Christian Churches also. A girl my daughter goes to school with said their pastor told her that Jesus Christ was coming back to the Holy Land and standing on Mt. Olive in 2012 to take up all those who were worthy to be saved. I was pretty much gobsmacked when I heard this.

As a Christian I had always been taught God's appointed time was his own, and no one would know the hour of his Son's return. Apparently this doctrine is not quite so comfortable any longer with some of the newer Christian movements?

At any rate, not all posted here by H_H was able to be cast off as rubbish just yet in my own head. Isn't that what it's about. Each of us on our own journey to find where our truth lies.

Religion, especially the reaches Christianity has so boldy taken, has been much of the undoing of humanity. Stealing from pagan believes and inventing stories to dupe the masses.It has clouded all that for far too long. The SUN is the main focal point here, and not at all the SON.

I found the link to this whole discussion in another site and came to the discussion long after it ended. Originally, I had dismissed the whole thing and only skimmed it. However, when I read it in detail, some of the things that he(?) stated actually fit into "memories" that I have. So, I too want this entity to come back.

A few things I noticed is that when he spoke of ruling bloodlines, the responses seemed to assume he was talking about our traditional view of bloodlines as in ruling families of Earth's royal families. The reference could have been to another type of "ruling bloodline." I didn't see where this was completely explored.

Also, no one asked about the following response from him and it really begged more questions. Maybe I missed it, but I didn't see any. It was where he stated that the "family" originated from more than three bloodlines. It was pointed out that our science has proved that man descended from three. The response was that, I think he said his family descended from 13, if we saw him on the street, we would think he was like anyone else; but, that his bloodline did not originate from this planet. He also said something about them incarnating into one of us.

Now, this makes no sense. So much of what he said does make sense and, like I said, I do have a very clear memory of something that he discussed. Please don't ask what, because this "memory" doesn't make complete sense to me in my view or understanding of things. So, it wont make sense to anyone else. It is just what he described is clearly in this memory that was like a reaccuring dream that I have had since childhood.

Anyway, back to my question, which I was wondering if anyone else caught and if I missed a further explanation. If they incarnate into one of us, then their DNA would have the same three lines as the rest of us. If they have different DNA because they come from 13 lines, then, their appearence would be different from our's. Something is missing in this. As above, so is below, or something to that extent. So, while I don't think this is a hoax, I think something was not completely presented is the best way to put it. Maybe to throw us off or to play with us to some extent. Another test? Okay, so their family has arranged marriages. So, if they are indeed talking bloodlines in terms of human understanding or existence, then the additional lines may not throw anyone off, except a doctor when one of them goes into a hospital. I mean, at least somewhere along the way, one of them has to have gotten sick and the difference would show in a simple blood test. What they kill off the doctor afterwards? I think, that within what was given in his message, there is some truth and some stuff meant to throw us off and the whole thing, while a gift, is also to play with us to some extent. Maybe the only doctors they go to are members of this bloodline.

I am going to go back and read the whole thing again. If anyone has noticed these same oddities in the conversation, please reply with your thoughts.


[edit on 10-1-2009 by Little Star]

I had to laugh when I saw LowLevelMason suggesting that I was a "sock puppet" for Hidden_Hand. I recall that he was one of the most critical of H_H, so that's to be expected. And for the record, I don't spend a lot of time on forums, I joined ATS (after visiting a few times) because I was intrigued by H_H's thread (after having read the Insider thread of 2005), and when I did join I was already a member of Project Camelot's forum (no longer because they've started requiring monthly fees). H_H only answered one of my questions as well. So there's your explanation.

I'm starting to enjoy posting a bit more though, so I'm sure you'll see me around more frequently. I have a couple of threads I'm thinking of starting, none of which are related to Hidden_Hand or Insider.

In the original post I gave the link to the thread minus the "interruptions" because that was his request, and I honor it because I fully admit that I "bought" his story. But like I've said before, some people buy the Bible, and they don't have any more proof of their claims' veracity than I do. Also, please note that the first link I provided was the original thread with ALL COMMENTS. So anyone is free to view them as they like. And, as I also stated before, I will be the first to admit that I could be wrong (at least I have a sense of modesty and humility, unlike some), but I am choosing to accept H_H's story because it seemed like everything I had seen before that was pointing in that direction. We're all entitled to our opinions.

Also, I don't really have any lofty expectations that any more "Hidden Hands" are going to return because I asked them to. But I don't think too many people really had a chance to analyze that thread fully (or even saw it, much less), and if nothing else then I wanted THIS thread to generate some discussion of it. I'm glad to see that both sides are represented so far, and I'd like to see it continue.


-----

I've read the whole thing a couple of times, so, Little Star, I think I can maybe help clarify as far as I understood it. H_H stated that his "Family," at least the original pure Power Lines, were not from this planet, although they've been incarnating here since before the time of Atlantis. The names we know of and typically associate with the NWO are of Earth origin, and are said to be part of the "extended Family," and all of their power and knowledge of the "truth" is only what is handed down to them from the Hidden Hands (the off-world Power Lines). They operate in a similar structure to the Power Lines, but are more or less separate and have little or no direct interaction with them (there is some other group that acts as the liason (sp?)). H_H also notes that the original 13 Power Lines do not live on the surface, meaning they probably make their permanent residences in highly advanced communities beneath the surface within hollow parts of the Earth's crust (hence the reference to a "hollow Earth"). Or perhaps they even orbit the planet in spacecraft? Probably some combination of the two. Although I'm guessing that, assuming this is the case, they have easy access to the surface through underground transport systems. At least that's my take on it. But it's all in there so I'm sure you'll see it once you read it again.

I'd be interested to hear your thoughts, and if reading it again clears up your dream at all.

Hidden_hand appeals to people because it is what they want to hear. They want to believe there is the one, unified explanation that explains everything in the world. So much so that they will believe anyone who tells them that its true their full attention and treat it seriously. We have even had some people who have read the thread 5 times and analyzed his every word as if God himself were speaking.

Were anything he says even remotely true, he could have proven it easily and beyond a doubt. He did not. And still, people believe it - because they want to. And the reason why people defend him - "because he writes so well."

Sigh.

[edit on 11-1-2009 by LowLevelMason]

reply to post by suterlaben


Not to attack you or defend lowlevelmason, but in retrospect (LLM) presented some very thoughtful and eye opening insight into HH's thread, meaning,and writing style. I do agree with your points however the possibility of a great deal of study and preparation before hand (pre thread) IMO is what we have here. I for one am not so quick to dismiss LLM.

I'm not really trying to dismiss anyone here, and I completely understand why LLM and others who share his opinion think the way they do. I just wish they would refrain from belittling people and acting like they themselves are so "right." Being a hardcore skeptic is a good ground to stand on because when you're dealing with things that don't offer any sort of definitive proof, you can always have the higher ground, at least from a purely logistical perspective.

But think about it in the broader sense...the vast majority of the world's population would look at all of us here on ATS as completely out of touch with reality because of the very nature of what we discuss, and we don't appreciate them judging us on those grounds.

And yet some of us seem to love doing the same to others within this small community that we are a part of.

*Sigh*

alyosha, your response is appreciated because it was respectful to all. LLM does make good points, from a purely logistical perspective, like I said, but I guess I'm someone (and there are plently like me) who will have our beliefs, regardless of whether or not they can be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt.


LowLevelMason, are you actually a low level Mason, or is that just a moniker you're using? Just curious.



"______" appeals to people because it is what they want to hear.


Names you could put in that blank spot:

Barack Obama
Jesus (The Bible)
Rush Limbaugh
Alex Jones
David Icke
George W. Bush
etc. etc. etc.

You see the point I'm trying to make here?

reply to post by suterlaben


When someone comes on, with 0 proof, and you blindly believe them because it fits with what you think the world already is, it is NOT denying ignorance. This isn't about believing in something that doesn't have enough proof to be beyond a shadow of doubt. This is about believing in something with absolutely no proof what so ever. Anyone can (and people do) come on to ATS and claim to be anything. Gods, messiahs, inside Illuminati members, "ruling bloodlines," reptilians, aliens, time travelers, you name it. That doesn't mean you should believe them.

This isn't about being skeptical, this is about requiring at least one piece of evidence before believing in something.

And as to your question to me - I am a mason, but there are no levels (low, high, whatever) in freemasonry. The name is a sarcastic remark on people who believe in such things because there is absolutely no evidence for it.

After reading the Q & A with double H, (from previous thread, Oct.)

One thing keeps warring between my mind's eye and statements made by HH.

At some point, while fencing with the 32nd degree mason dude, (Name slips my mind at the moment), and HH replies (after saying he was done sparring),

to this effect,
It's not the messenger, but the message. (you remember I hope.)

Then others ask about unclear or cloudy thoughts/memories/intuition/feeling, and one of HH's replies is something like;

Trust your feelings or inner sub logos or whatever it was named, and you will know what is right....blah..blah...

So basically,
Without emphasizing on his credibility, just get what you can from the message and use it as a catalyst.

and
if you are not clear in mind of fuzzy pasts, why you are here, etc...trust your inner-self.

Something along these lines.

Then, regarding the "Harvest", using precision percentages; 51% for positive and 95% for negative to achieve the fourth dimension,

and that evidently it's easier to get the negative, advance to the fourth dimension and then worry about turning things around to a positive fourth dimension existence.

Does the above generally describe what the HH said is the deal?

If you concur, read on.

Taking this purported information as fact, I should not prioritize proving his credibility and just get what I can use out of the content of his information.

So, using this procedure as a guideline,

He states that there will be a galactic alignment and the earth is doomed, BUT....
Since he and his family of elite royal bloodliners have done such a wonderful job causing death, dstruction, and hate, etc...

only to achieve their "contract" to "help" us,

We should be grateful if we understand that their wickedness towards us is done out of love and it is hard for them because it is against their nature.

Kind of like a father whipping a child with a belt and telling the child that it is going to hurt him more than the pain inflicted upon said child.

It is a classic whipping statement.

But, since there is no need for us, nor any desire of him wheather he be accepted ond believed or not, nor that he is telling truth about his seventh dimension of advanced plane , including reality, spitituality, and being,
due to the "fact" that interpretation of things such as these, are incomprehendable for us.

Yet taking into account the message(s) delivered by HH,

I use my inner spirit to tell me what I information I trust, and my inner spirit says:

HH is a wolf in sheeps clothes, sent here to use elegance and charm such is the case with most stereotypical sociopath or psychopath, yet his demeaner doesn't prove a thing,

and regarding what my soul/spirit/light force tells me intuitively, is that this "Harvest" or "Negative Harvest",
Is most likely the following;

The change from cellestular Pisces to a new age of Aquarius, is such a long transition, (2700-3600? years), that the "Harvest" only happens in regard to the same frequency of the solar/galactic cycle.

In this amount of time, (were it verified as true), is long enough for three bloodlines to start a reproductive cycle that includes thousands of generations of those to follow us through procreation, that we now have like 7 billion humans on the planet?

I, through trusting my intuition within, believe that, in HH's reality, the world is a ranch to breed and increase human population. Now, the world is bursting with billions of us, and we are ripe for harvest as the galactic cycle ends, just like clockwork.

So, we are the treasure, the spoils. We are the feast for the coming Annunaki/human meat eaters (they are anticipating the long-awaited taste of human flesh, likely a delicacy and a great ranch crop.

Soon now, they will take us from this world to those huge cooking pots somewhere in the night sky.....

If you had only seen H_H's thread by itself, then yes, I would say he had "zero proof." But here's how I got to thinking that maybe there was more to it.

About a year ago I started getting into Alex Jones after watching "Endgame." Then, my childhood interest in UFO's was renewed when a friend told me about the "Project Serpo" website. That directed me to Project Camelot. Project Camelot is full of great information for those who love to discuss "conspiracy theories" and such. Through Project Camelot I learned about and looked into the "Svali" testimonies. Look it up if you don't know what I'm talking about. In addition to that, I have also watched a hell of a lot of presentations and read materials from every sort of "whistle blower" and "insider" that are out there, spreading what they know. You name it, I've probably seen or at least looked into it. NWO, Illuminati, 2012, ET's, secret bases, martial law, world war III, secret societies, banking conspiracies, population reduction, etc. etc., yes, I've heard it all and it has passed through my filter.

After all of this, I joined the Project Camelot forums because it felt like a very harmonious, open-minded community. Someone posted a thread which linked to the 2005 "Insider" material (contained within the original post on THIS thread). It made me drastically reconsider what I felt was true, at a time when I was becoming very confused based on how much "truth" was out there, and suddenly I felt like everything had been redirected towards something greater, a point that had perhaps been missed, even by the myriad of "truth seekers" who are out there. I hoped that I would be able to be present should something like it happen again.

And then it did, in very similar fashion, Hidden_Hand came along, and gave his story.

And you know the rest. But in short, everything I had seen basically directed me towards the core of H_H's message. Can anyone prove that he was of a "ruling bloodline?" No. But does it ring true that we are here in this world to work on ourselves, develop a respect for all that is, transcend the darkness of this world and shine a positive light no matter how negative it seems? Yes. Even if it was a hoax, at least someone said something that made complete sense amidst the heaps of stagnant hatred, fear mongering, division, etc. that we all see every day.

I have read plenty of postings on here about people who claim to be all of that which you mentioned, I mean it happens at least a couple times per week (I've been a member since October when the H_H discourse took place, visiting every day though rarely posting). Basically all of them that I've seen I would have to agree with you. The only reason I believe H_H is because it fit in with all that I have experienced thus far, after running the gamut and going through so many of the viewpoints that are expressed within both ATS and the larger "conspiracy theory" community. I don't expect you or anyone else to understand where I come from until you have taken the same journey that I did, but seeing as how everyone's journey is different, then I don't expect anyone to fully understand at all. As I don't expect to fully understand anyone else. But many of us can at least offer insightful opinions and have a respectful discussion without acting like we know everything. I could be wrong. So what; if that turned out to be the definitive case, then I'd admit my mistake and move on. Any genuine person would forgive me. As I would them.

By the way, you don't sound like a mason. Most masons will at least acknowledge that there are three degrees before one is fully initiated, and then beyond that there are many acknowledged levels until one reaches the 33rd degree. Hell, it's public knowledge. So explain what you mean. Offer me some evidence of YOUR credibility. How do you know you're not just a low level Mason who has been told what to believe by the hierarchy, until he's deemed worthy to know more?

reply to post by imd12c4funn


I have an entirely differently understanding of it. If we hope to transcend this world then we must rise above that which we see as "negative," not play into it and give it more power by affixing all of these horrible properties to it. H_H and Insider (did you read that one?) are happy to admit that we have much more power than we realize, but that we willfully give it away by accepting that which we are opposed to. By just assuming that H_H and "the Family" are evil and we are being harvested for evil purposes, then you are creating it and allowing it to occur, rather than rising above it.

We have opportunities every day to show that we are above that which we feel, deep within our souls, we are not. Less than 6 months ago I would go around spewing all kinds of conspiracy, "elite" "new world order" theories and jargon, trying to convince everyone that it was all evil and that we have to FIGHT it.

Now I sense that there is a greater picture that is being missed by many. What was interesting about H_H's message was that he (and also Insider) fully admitted to being part of the group that is creating all of the negativity that we see in the world today (and it spreads, like ripples in a pond), yet they both explain that we must rise above it if we ever hope to "free" ourselves from this cycle. I say try it, lead by example, and see where it gets you.

I will ignore that your "proof" consists entirely of conspiracy videos and people in those videos have no incentive to tell you the truth. That is a whole other topic. Ignoring that, we still have someone who offers absolutely no proof of who he is. I could sign up under another name and say the same sort of new agey stuff and also get people to worship me on here - its rather scary how quickly some ATS members fall for whatever someone says if it fits what they'd like to believe.

Something doesn't ring true because it is true, its because you want it to be true. I can read any new age book and make people believe I am a spiritual guru because I am telling them what they already want to hear.

The highest degree of freemasonry is the third degree or master mason. The other two degrees are not lower in the traditional sense, it just means the candidate has not received all the lessons of the lodge yet. Everyone goes from the 1st to third degree within 6 months. All it takes is some memorization.

There are no acknowledged levels beyond that, there are people who want to make imaginary levels. The whole 33rd degree thing is amongst the biggest lies in all conspiracy theory. It comes from one side order which offers side degrees that go up to the 33rd, and you go from 3 to 32 in 2 days. The 33rd is given to people who do a lot of community service. All the other side orders are ignored even though they have just as much power (which is to say - no power) because they don't have flashy high numbers. The CT presumption is that any increase in numerical value carries a increase in rank, authority, or something else. This is wrong. A 33rd degree mason is the same rank and power as a 3rd degree mason, and a Knight Templar (one of the side orders always ignored because it doesn't have flashy number) has just as much power as both of them.

The evidence is all over the place, its like arguing the sky isn't blue: start by reading Dr. Brent Morris's book "Light on Masonry" and "Is it true what they say about Freemasonry?" You can also read the "Idiots Guide to Freemasonry" which also shares the same truth. There is no hierarchy, and according to the CT myth I am a high level mason even though no such thing exists.

Say what you will, but I think you're being duped, as I'm sure you think I am. Can we agree to disagree? I'm getting sick of this.

No, because your disagreement is not based on any facts. I am a mason, I would know what goes on in freemasonry. There is no reason or incentive to "dupe" anyone.

The most logical way to look at this is....those that KNOW don't tell and those that DO NOT KNOW, will tell....at least their version of what they THINK they know.

All has been revealed....it all lies within the interpretation.

~Holly

reply to post by suterlaben


The whole thing is I believe that thinking of him, or his family, as aliens is a big mistake. I didn't see where he said that at all. The thing that struck me about what he said is that it lines up perfectly with this "memory" or "dream" experience of mine. What I saw in my dream had nothing to do with aliens. I think folks want to see him as that as it lines up with how our minds work. Also, Christians became upset because he said that his family was "Lucifer" which is actually in keeping with the Old Testament because it says that God gave Lucifer dominion over the Earth. So, someone of that "family" being part of a ruling blood line would make sense. Also, what he says is more in keeping with a loving God. The last message contained something that I have "heard" as well. We are given what we need to survive in this incarnation to learn what it is we have to learn. We are actually never really in trouble even if we think we are. Our thinking we are is what will cause us problems. This is a lot harder to live than it sounds.

Hey, how do you do a spell check on this thing?