Wait a second?... How is it that I'm the one that's crazy, insane, delusional, and brainwashed?

Originally posted by Doomsday 2029
you still think 9-11 was the work of Osama Bin Laden and 19 hijackers...

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar ...
and sometimes terrorists are just terrorists.
They pulled it off.

Isreali intelligence probably had foreknowledge and let it happen in order to pull us into a greater war against it's enemies. But for anyone to claim that Bush43 had a hand in it ... ... one look at his behavior on that day tells a different story. If he had known what was going to happen then he would have been on a presidential tour of a military facility or something grand like that instead of having been reading a billy-goat book to kiddies. And he had a deer in the headlights look when he got informed.

Sorry ... but it was radical islamic terrorists who pulled it off.
And it was definately airplanes that flew into the buildings.
And the passengers of Flight 93 pulled it down - before being shot down.
It's just the truth.

Originally posted by Angus123
You're just making blanket statements about you being right and the Truthers being wrong.

This was almost identical to what I was going to post about the OP.
Not one new thing in there but - - i'm right and you are wrong.
Silly thread after all.

Originally posted by Ray T
9/11 happened 7 year ago and still the people responsible for this crime remain unknown.

That's not true. HERE is a picture of those who were ultimately responsible for 9/11. The perps who pulled it off.

You can blame this or that ... blame Clinton for deep cuts in the Intelligence budget that left us deaf and blind .... the airlines for not having better security in place ... The Bush administration for not getting up and running in the new administration fast enough ... UBL for putting it together and financing it ... radical Islamic Imams for pushing their brainwashing upon youthful Muslims ... Saudi Arabia for dumping billions of $$ into Wahabbism in order to appease it ... Israeli Intelligence for not informing the USA of what they knew was going to happen .... Everyone who buys gasoline from Saudi Arabia which in turn finances radical Islam ....

But the ultimate people responsible are the perps who got on those airplanes, hijacked them, and killed all those people.

Originally posted by Doomsday 2029
Don't tell me Youtube is garbage when it has been more useful than the TV as of late.

Spoken from a veteran truther! Although I never said ALL of youtube is garbage. Many truthers watch video's on YouTube and see it as fact.

Is anything on Youtube automatically disregarded in your mind?

Nothing is automatically disregarded in my mind. I always try to give it my best attention.....sometimes I get frustrated at the lies and filth that is presented though and don't make it all the way through.

Most videos on the internet end up on Youtube... you do realize this right?

Again, it's not "youtube" as much as it's the content that is placed there. Video's get chopped and quote mined. WTC-7 for one; the truthers never post the entire collapse.

And yes... I will tell you what you watched on TV... because unless you were watching the events of 9-11 happen as a personal witness... then you were more than likely watching it on TV. Which one is it?

Thats NOT what I meant and you know it. EVERYONE that has a television watched TV on 9/11 for many hours. Oh that's right, the evil media filtered what I saw on 9/11.

News alert sir. My knowledge of 9/11 goes WAY past the TV and computer. I spoke with first responders, FEMA members, Scientists, Engineers, victim's family members, people that were at ground zero. I have also read several books. Not from liars like Steven Jones. I read Richard Clark; Against All Enemies, and Your Government Failed You. I have read other books from real people that were at the Pentagon, at the WTC. I have read MANY papers regarding the collapses of the WTC. I can go on, but I think you get the point.

No, I'm not an Alex Jones follower, or a David Icke follower, or a Zietgiest follower, or a Loose Change follower... I'm a person that has a opinion.

Thank God...there is hope for you!

And if you must know when my opinion started to question the official story... it started at Killtown.

Oh, I take back what I said about having hope for you.

Killtown? The anti-semite who harassed Val McClatchey, posting her contact information on blogs. Calling her at her place of employment.

but since we can't believe anything we see on the internet... I guess I need to go back to watching TV, and reading the newspaper.

Don't be goofy. I never said not to believe anything, stop putting words in my mouth.

Or... I could pick up a well documented book written by Jim Marrs called The Terror Conspiracy.

Although Mr. Marrs is a very popular figure among conspiracy theorists, I am not a big fan. I did read a book of his call Crossfire.. ( i think that was the name of it regarding the JFK assasination)

Mr. Mars is also a supporter of "Remote Viewing" and other...well... far out ideas.

But wait a second... this guy has been on youtube... so he's misguiding us.

Youtube is the messenger... its the message that is misguiding you.

Tell me CameronFox... did the Governmnet lie to us about what happpened on 9-11?

the following is my opinion:

Of course they lied! I never said they didn't. The cover up that happened on 911 and the weeks after were not to hide a MIHOP or a LIHOP, it was to protect the idiots that failed to protect us that day. Communication break-downs between the FBI and CIA, bureaucratic red tape, egotistical a-holes, an incompetent President & cabinet, and other pure ignorance.



[edit on 30-12-2008 by CameronFox]

reply to post by Doomsday 2029


It's amazing how qualified one can become in a wide variety of disciplines from Youtube/Google/Wikipedia/Etc....

There's never been more subject matter experts on engineering, physics, aviation, metallurgy, demolitions, etc... than in recent times.

We thank you for you diligent research.

[edit on 30-12-2008 by BlueRaja]


Mod Edit: Big Quote – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 12/30/2008 by Hal9000]

Originally posted by CameronFox
Mr. Mars is also a supporter of "Remote Viewing" and other...well... far out ideas.

If remote viewing is so "far out", why was it funded by the US government?

Remote viewing was popularized in the 1990s, following the declassification of documents related to the Stargate Project, a 20 million dollar research program sponsored by the U.S. Federal Government to determine any potential military application of psychic phenomena. The program was terminated in 1995, citing a lack of documented evidence that the program had any value to the intelligence community.[5]

en.wikipedia.org...

You may say that it didn't produce anything. If so, why was project "Stargate" funded from the 1970's to 1995? It took them 25 years to find out that it was too "far out"?

These projects were active from the 1970s through 1995, and followed up early psychic research done at The Stanford Research Institute (SRI), The American Society for Psychical Research, and other renowned involved psychical research labs. [3]

en.wikipedia.org...

They seem to fund a lot of "far out" things if you ask me.

The "gay bomb" being one off the top of my head.

posted by CameronFox
Thanks for this being your last post. Your years of research have lead you down a path... a misguided one. You watched youtube videos and read truther propaganda.... as they say.. "Garbage in...Garbage out."

posted by Doomsday 2029
You watched CNN, FOX News, and CBS... in other words, filtered information.

now what is this video? the media? or youtube?

again... the youtube argument needs to die... Most of the time it just replays the lies that you watch on TV.

CameronFox is just angry that YouTube and Google Videos and the many other internet video producers have effectively NEUTERED the effectiveness of the US Mainstream News Media Propaganda Machine for millions of Americans. Millions openly do not trust the lying MSM. CameronFox believes they are oracles straight from god. ( the government god )

The government has found out it is almost an impossible task to remove those videos which harm them and expose their lies and corruption. Original newscasts from the morning of 9-11 exposing the lies of the 9-11 perpetrators are freely available all over the world to billions of people.

Even the discussions of the Bush Regime involvement in 9-11 were prompted by videos in the Japanese Parliament, and then shown to the entire world by video with on-screen accurate translations availabe in a dozen different languages.

CameronFox is simply unhappy that so many open-minded persons across the world have not been so easily pursuaded into WILLFUL IGNORANCE and DELUSION as he.

Well, so let's say OP is true; what are we gonna do?

Same as always...Nothing different.

They've got organization, armies...We have our knowledge and outrage (presumed).

There being two sides to the belief's posited, it boils down to uncertainity, which is where it will most likely remain, as usual.

I don't believe those in control care much who believes what; they know they can get away with certain things, and they cover their tracks for the world stage, not the people's.

And since it isn't provable to all, with certainty, why go on about it? Can you say, JFK? Protect your mind's and your children's mind's, so they know what they live with. Someday, things will change...perhaps sooner than most think.

It's more than just the big boys fighting amoungst themselves (world stage); much more.

[edit on 30-12-2008 by SS,Naga]

Originally posted by Griff

Remote viewing was popularized in the 1990s, following the declassification of documents related to the Stargate Project, a 20 million dollar research program sponsored by the U.S. Federal Government to determine any potential military application of psychic phenomena. The program was terminated in 1995, citing a lack of documented evidence that the program had any value to the intelligence community.[5]

Gee, the government spent millions on idiotic research? Wow... that's something new Griff huh?

They seem to fund a lot of "far out" things if you ask me.

The "gay bomb" being one off the top of my head.

I don't disagree... total waste of money. A gay bomb? Does that make everyone happy?

No, I still do not buy that it was any sort of inside job. Aside from the typical nonsensical reasoning — that they felt it necessary to do this elaborate and complex plan of murder as a pretext to go to war, when we've gone to war on much simpler reasoning in the past (i.e. fake WMDs) — I've not seen any real proof. I've seen a lot of guesswork and bad detective work, biased interviews and research, and ignoring all facts that do not mesh with the touted conspiracy ideas.

There may be a cover up of some facts by our government. I believe they don't tell us everything, or gloss over facts, if it puts them in a bad light, or if they feel it would undermine a national feeling of security. I do not believe our government killed innocent people.

In any thread I've posted in regarding 9/11, one thing was constant. It was the absolute failure to answer very direct and pertinent questions asked about the different events. And if someone did dare to answer, the answers bordered on the absolute ludicrous. "Oh yes, the FBI could totally put wreckage on a lawn in front of everyone and no one would notice or ask why!" wha? You have got to be kidding me.

Beyond all that, not one single damning witness has been found. Not a single person apparently saw anyone planting explosives. Or planting bodies. Or planting wreckage. Or saw people knocking down light poles. Or cutting foundations. Not a single reliable witness saw a supposed jumbo jet pulling up and flying over the Pentagon.

Additionally, supposedly the sheer number of people involved was astronomical, yet not ONE witness to assuage their guilt, or to set things right, has stepped forward. None. No one finds this odd? I certainly do. Why hasn't anyone said "I helped plant wreckage. I was involved in demo. I was aware of all that was happening." Either they really managed to get together a huge group of people with no conscious to a man /woman, or there was nothing to admit, which I find much more likely.

Sometimes you have to use common sense when you approach stuff like this. Ponder these events prior to them happening. Would this be a plan a foreign terror power would carry out? Absolutely. Would this be a plan our government would put together to form a pretense to go to war? I can't even begin to imagine the planning meetings in my mind, it's absolutely ridiculous. You are seriously suggesting that they actually concocted this massively complex plan, where so many things could go wrong... but they didn't. It was executed perfectly, with no witnesses, and then no one admitted a thing afterward. Astounding.

Flying a plane into a single WTS building would have been plenty enough to convince folks that we needed to go to war. Why in the world make such a complex plan and throw extra lives away? Why risk getting caught by adding layers of complexity that are not needed? If there is one thing lacking in all of these 9/11 conspiracy theories, it's common sense.

Originally posted by SPreston
Millions openly do not trust the lying MSM. CameronFox believes they are oracles straight from god. ( the government god )

No Spreston.... we are to listen to the college reject whom you worship. Mr. Do-Over Dylan Avery.

Let's look at a YouTube Video with Dylan at the end of it:



If you don't want to watch the entire 9:38 min video, please scroll to the 9 min mark where your buddy Dylan yet again makes a complete fool of himself.

Reporter (speaking of Chief Nigro of the FDNY):

"But he's got over 30 years experience."

Do over Dylan Avery:

" I don't care what kind of f*@#** experience he has man, I don't care. He's a person in the system, of course he is going to tell you those things."

Yeah Spreston...you and your leaders are chock full of wisdom.

Please stop the bickering!

Lets discuss the topic and not each other.

Seriously. Gay bombs?

Please stay on topic.

video.google.com...

video.google.com...

video.google.com...

video.google.com...


If travel is searching,
And home what's been found

I'm not stopping

I'm going hunting
I'm the hunter
I'll bring back the goods,
But I won't know when

I've fought while they've disorganized freedom
How "Americanist" of me
This is who I am
You figured it out, didn't you?

You could smell it,
So you left me on my own
To complete the mission
Now I'm leaving it all behind

I'm going hunting
I'm the hunter
I'm the hunter
I'm the hunter

You just didn't know me,



So what I'm saying is you should...



www.myspace.com...













[edit on 30-12-2008 by Americanist]

We'll find out 50 years later what the bastards did.

Hi.

I have been here for quite a while on ATS, (mostly reading threads.)
I am a beliver of many things but have always kept away from the 9/11 board for some reason. Just "knew" the official story was true.

After reading your thread about beeing sick of all the people who ignorantly dismiss all other explanations than the official i must say i really know how you feel. Thats whats kept me of the govt projects, ufo boards and ATS in general for over half a year now.

Anyway, reading your thread made me look a little into the 9/11 "conspiracy" and i just wish too thank you.

My eyes are now open at last, one of our times most signifficant political events, wich has led to a chain of other events, was possibly created by the very government average people belive in and are brainwashed by. I dont say its a fact. I say that the official story is not.


Do not let the "debunkers" make you leave. We need your theories and research on the subject. And everytime you make one see the truth it is a great accomplishment.

Thats for all you fellow ATS members!. Dont let anonymous replies, namecalling and the horde of those with all those stupid theories, just too see if we belive them drive you off!.

They are the ignorant and delusional.

Keep up your good work.
Deny Ignorance!

Zykloner. (back too stay)


[edit on 30-12-2008 by Zykloner]

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS

So we're all to believe that this massive scale conspiracy successfully brought down the twin towers etc. but the same clowns couldn't pull off faking a couple of weapons of mass destruction? Riiiiight.

Can we all just step back and use a little common sense sometimes.....please?

Maybe the ultimate objective was to get us to question the obvious?

Man, we can't be this weak that we let them get away with all they're getting away with. I wish the military would honor their pledge, get together without the clowns who are controlling them and decide what to do for the good of the planet. I think an orderly show of solidarity in marching up to the white house to pull the puppets out in handcuffs would be a nice start. Nobody would object to that and if they do, maybe they need to be in handcuffs, too.

I guess it's too much to ask?

posted by SPreston
Millions openly do not trust the lying MSM. CameronFox believes they are oracles straight from god. ( the government god )

posted by CameronFox
No Spreston.... we are to listen to the college reject whom you worship. Mr. Do-Over Dylan Avery.

Let's look at a YouTube Video with Dylan at the end of it:

Yeah Spreston...you and your leaders are chock full of wisdom.

Sorry. You are quite mistaken. I have not once supported Dylan Avery nor have I ever made one single favorable comment on any one of his videos. I post to more than eight different forums, and yes one of them is LC, but search as you may; you will not find one single post from me supporting Dylan Avery nor his videos. In fact if you search carefully, you will find a few critical posts of mine. Dylan Avery is not one of my leaders and never will be.

Please feel free to post anything you find which might prove me in error.

So how does your false accusation show that I'm the one that's crazy, insane, delusional, and brainwashed? The 9-11 OFFICIAL STORY has been full of holes and lies and contrdictions and outright impossibilities from day one. We have just been exposing them more and more and more and more with our incessant research and digging.

It is the faithful fanatacal government god believers and defenders who have been proven crazy, insane, delusional, and brainwashed.

Originally posted by Zykloner
Hi.

I have been here for quite a while on ATS, (mostly reading threads.)
I am a beliver of many things but have always kept away from the 9/11 board for some reason. Just "knew" the official story was true.



Anyway, reading your thread made me look a little into the 9/11 "conspiracy" and i just wish too thank you.

My eyes are now open at last, one of our times most signifficant political events, wich has led to a chain of other events, was created by the very government average people belive in and are brainwashed by.

Wow, you read a rant from a truther about NOT being brainwashed and you all of a sudden have your eyes open to 911 being an inside job?

Enjoy this talking point...






"Aaron, just a two or three minutes ago there was yet another collapse or explosion. (I am now out of sight. A good Samaritan has taken me in on Dwayne Street.) At a quarter to eleven there was another collapse or explosion following the 10:30 collapse of the second tower, and a firefighter rushed by us estimated that 50 stories went down."

Originally posted by Hal9000
Please stop the bickering!

Lets discuss the topic and not each other.

Seriously. Gay bombs?

Please stay on topic.

The point was that the government funds ridiculus things.

But then we are considered paranoid and crazy for pointing it out. Which would be on topic. No?