Bond, James Bond

Do you guys believe that there are some super elite spies which have prevented countless wars, nuclear strikes, terrorist actions, etc? Kind of like Bond or Sam Fisher (Splinter Cell)?

Code red, we need to prevent a war. Send in Sam...

It seems improbable but at the same time logical. It would be cleaner to just send one person to do the job rather than an entire team.

But who would be fit for such a job? It's almost as if they'd have to be genetically modified, engineered in a way.

When 9/11 occured I felt as if Osama was the perfect super villian. The only thing missing was the "super hero". Ah, but we'd never know... the assasination would most likely be regarded as a heart attack or something. Sneaky bastards those secret spies are

it would be really nice to think there is a bond or someone out there savin our asses but it seems a lil to good to be true.

nice lil fantasy tho

Originally posted by toffa_h


But who would be fit for such a job? It's almost as if they'd have to be genetically modified, engineered in a way.

When 9/11 occured I felt as if Osama was the perfect super villian. The only thing missing was the "super hero". Ah, but we'd never know... the assasination would most likely be regarded as a heart attack or something. Sneaky bastards those secret spies are

They'd never, ever tell us who would be fit for such a job, if there were such a job in the first place- if there were, the US Forces wouldn't have a death toll of over 600 now.

"if there were, the US Forces wouldn't have a death toll of over 600 now."

without them it might've been 6000

perhaps this should be moved to military projects?

Originally posted by toffa_h
Do you guys believe that there are some super elite spies which have prevented countless wars, nuclear strikes, terrorist actions, etc? Kind of like Bond or Sam Fisher (Splinter Cell)?

ABSOLUTELY. Do I know any of these people? No, of course I don't. I'm not sure anyone really knows these people, but I am 90% sure that they exist. From what I've heard, there are the main sort of archetypes you might expect; the 'sleepers' --those that stay in remote areas or foreign hot spots waiting for calls, signs or orders; 'splinters' (just a descriptive term, i don't know the true call tag) who probably 'work' normal jobs and live in or near Wash.D.C.

All of these special agents, who are ex-special forces (more than likely Black Berets, aka Delta Force) take their orders from the heads of CIA and/or NSA.

If you want a description, probably the best is that guy from "Sum of all Fears" that meets Ben Affleck and Morgan Freeman when they get off the plane in the rain...
"I thought I wasn't doing this anymore."
"Your orders are on the plane."

[Edited on 6-4-2004 by Cappa]

It would make sense because how come Russia had thousands of nukes that could easily hit the U.S. how come terrorists with stolen nukes or some thing havn't blown us up. Because if you read or play or watch the Sum of All Fears you see how easy it is. So how come we havn't been hit by anything that makes us grow extra arms??? I always thought if this were true we would never know about it. Because the goverment is pretty good at cover ups. For example when ever I talk about stuff like the Roswell incident people call me crazy! So anywho its likely all right.

Who knows what MI6 get up to.

Because if you read or play or watch the Sum of All Fears you see how easy it is.

No offense, I'm not trying to be a jerk or anything, but, um... you know. It just sounded funny. Using a book of fiction, a video game from the book of fiction, and a movie staring Ben Affleck, as your points of reference. But I see your point.

Originally posted by curme
No offense, I'm not trying to be a jerk or anything, but, um... you know. It just sounded funny. Using a book of fiction, a video game from the book of fiction, and a movie staring Ben Affleck, as your points of reference. But I see your point.

Haha yes, I felt as uncomfortable making those references as you did reading them. What makes me feel in any way decent about it is the fact that many government employees have commended Tom Clancy on the realism he puts into his works.

Aside from that, I've spoken to many Army officers who have told me bits and pieces of information that have formed a solid picture in my mind regarding these 'special agents'.

For example, the Delta Force is the only group in the armed forces that are still fully able (encouraged?) to wear full beards-- and not just because no one will bother them about it. They are encouraged to look 'normal', in stark contrast to such military groups as Marines who are always clean-shaven and wear their hair 'high and tight'.

Other than that, little is known (and I mean very little, not like NSA/CIA little, where the public has to be told something about their operations) about the Delta Force. Think about it, if there weren't an old movie named Delta Force, how many of you out there really would even know that term?

yeah, but the delta force is still a group of people. i'm thinking about one single guy who saves the world whithout its knowledge. the guy who has the freedom to do what he wants to ensure his objectives are completed.

What makes me feel in any way decent about it is the fact that many government employees have commended Tom Clancy on the realism he puts into his works.

Never thought that Clancy (I've read all his books, love them) is part of some agency? In a novel he wrote (I believe the title is Red Storm) he describes a stealth plane AS INTELLIGENCE AGENCIES WOULD PEOPLE BELIEVE THEY LOOKED LIKE, not like the F-117 is.

My point is: novelry is used to enforce an idea, but... who decides which idea?

Romans said 'Cui prodest', it means 'who will gain more' is THE question to be asked when analyzing a fact, so, if government employees tell that Clancy is reliable, or realistic, does this mean that he is, or that the Government want US to believe he is?

Originally posted by toffa_h
yeah, but the delta force is still a group of people. i'm thinking about one single guy who saves the world whithout its knowledge. the guy who has the freedom to do what he wants to ensure his objectives are completed.

Well then I believe you have slightly the wrong idea, friend. There never is, and would never be, a guy who has "the freedom to do what he wants", especially as far as this subject of secret agents goes. Obviously, he would have to be left somewhat to his own devices, but more times than not he would probably be given orders and taught strict adherence to them. Working on his own accord, most likely, would only come into play when the plan goes astray (and really, no one except the operative himself could tell you-- and wouldn't tell you, how often that sort of thing happens).

*In these days of high-powered communication and transmit capabilities, they've probably eliminated the possibility of communicae loss with an Op, so my best guess would be that he's always in touch with someone.

And if I appeared to be saying that the Delta Force itself was like those secret agents, I apologize-- what I was saying was that secret agents were recruited from secret military groups such as the DF.

Originally posted by BrunoDT
Never thought that Clancy (I've read all his books, love them) is part of some agency? In a novel he wrote (I believe the title is Red Storm) he describes a stealth plane AS INTELLIGENCE AGENCIES WOULD PEOPLE BELIEVE THEY LOOKED LIKE, not like the F-117 is.

Well, I thought the fact that Clancy got his information from sources inside of intelligence sectors would be obvious by now, but, good, I'm glad you have some sort of reference.

My point is: novelry is used to enforce an idea, but... who decides which idea?

No one who works in Intelligence would give important information out (if they wanted to keep their job, and maybe their life) unless specifically ordered to do so. All information is compartmentalized, so it can be tracked back to a specific group of people that would be privy to it-- therefore if I were to tell you something, it could specifically be tracked back to me because I'd be one of, say, five people that had it.

Romans said 'Cui prodest', it means 'who will gain more' is THE question to be asked when analyzing a fact, so, if government employees tell that Clancy is reliable, or realistic, does this mean that he is, or that the Government want US to believe he is?

'who will gain more' is a good point-- but I think the better idea is "Who will gain MOST" Because in any situation, someone will gain, someone will gain more, and someone else will gain the MOST. Most of the time, the people that simply gain 'more' are middlemen, if you take my meaning.

For example, in the war in Iraq:
The Iraqi people will gain
Government Contractors will gain MORE
The U.S. Gov't and/or Bush will gain MOST

...or if you believe in the Illuminati:

Gov't Contractors will gain
U.S. Gov't will gain MORE
Those in control of the Illuminati will gain MOST

does this mean that he is, or that the Government want US to believe he is?

That is an excellent question, because it's double faceted. IMO - It's double-agent material; information and misinformation. Clancy himself probably doesn't get as much truth as he thinks he does. Whatever data is given to him is probably mixed, with certain truths, untruths, and blatant untruths-- for the simple fact that those who might have some prior knowledge of past operations/situations get easily confused as to what could be real. Is that making sense?

i think that there probaly is some organisation from some country/countries that has teams of james bons /sam fisher type operatives looking out for the world
aka "rainbow six"
loved that book and it is a great idea

"James Bond For Real"

www.danbrown.com...

A site from author Dan Brown ("The Da Vinci Code", "Digital Fortress", "Angels and Demons"), where he quotes a CNN article about some of the super-spy gadgets that exist and are implemented by U.S. Agents.

If anyone can find the 100-page document it talks about, please post.

*EDIT*
Nevermind, I found it. "Responsed to Transnational Threats" (PDF):

www.acq.osd.mil...'l3.pdf

[Edited on 12-4-2004 by Cappa]