Should Smoking Be Banned?

Originally posted by stinger94
Typical smokers response. Yes why should you consider anyone else when in the end people are going to die anyway. Nice logic.
Well if you were right, and smoking does not cause any additional problems, how is it that it has been proven that smoking does indeed cause additional health problems?

Maybe you should consider the fact that you're not the only one on the planet and have consideration for others instead of just for yourself.

You sir, are an ass.
And you sir must be the captain of your debate team

You are arguing just to argue and contribute in no way to this debate.

The only reason you say this is because I disagree with you. If I agreed with you, you'd be applauding me.
And what I'm doing is expressing my opinion. The value you place on it is your own personal decision.

You want to force your opinions on everyone to show us little people how smart you are.

I'm expressing my opinion like you are expressing yours right now. See how it works ?

You're an idiot.

Really? That's how you have an adult discussion? You have no counterpoint so you insult me with childish names? Wow, I'm so impressed that I will change my stance immediately.

I have tried very hard to be civil but watching you badger people has gotten me to a boiling point.

Badgers don't smoke

A right is not a right with conditions.

Of course it is.
For example, in the United States, we have the right to own a gun however I cannot randomly fire it into a crowd of people.
I have the right to get together with my friends at the movies buy I can't yell fire unless there's really a fire. Of course rights have conditions.

Is your right to live as you see fit met with conditions? You are giving typical asinine non smoker reactions and wonder why you are being met with sarcasm. Yes we all breathe polluted air. It is an undeniable truth. But we have been doing so for years and one great thing about the human body is that it evolves.

Yes and since evolution happens so quickly, we never have to worry about how cigarette smoke will affect long term health.

You don't have the right to not breathe my smoke. Show me that in the constitution.

I see so I must breath your smoke and you're saying it is not an infringement on my rights yet at the same time, you're claiming me not wanting you to smoke is an infringement on yours.... really?

I will admit it isn't nice or right to blow smoke at people, but I have the inalienable right to do as I please.

And I have the right to stop you. For example, since you cannot police yourself, I can vote to ban smoking. See how that works?

Don't walk through where I am smoking.

Don't smoke where I'm walking.

You think because you don't smoke that you can walk anywhere you want and enforce your beliefs on people.

You think that since you smoke you can walk anywhere you want while smoking and enforce your smoke on people. See how that works too?

I'm walking here *cough cough* you shouldn't smoke here. That will be met with a you shouldn't be walking here.

And that will be met with COUGH COUGH I'm voting to ban smoking.

Look, I have said over and over that I don't want to see smoking banned HOWEVER, I don't want to be subjected to it everywhere. I don't want to see children exposed to it everywhere.

Originally posted by Recalcitrant
reply to post by Anti - Government

 

Besides... how dare people have the audacity to dictate what someone else does to themselves.

But do you understand that by smoking around people who don't want to breath it, you're dictating what they do to themselves?

reply to post by jfj123

I don't want to be subjected to it everywhere. I don't want to see children exposed to it everywhere.

Thats great you are so passionate about this.. So what are you doing about the water you give children? The flue shots given to children, and baby formula?

You see you guys are so worried about my smoking.. You have totally missed one of the biggest things yet to be noticed by most health geared people..
What about this????

This is 100X bigger than me smoking in an area.. They are getting you in your home. They are getting you while you are young, and thoughout your whole life.. Yet you are worried about my smoke...
Honestly guys.. My smoking should be the last of your worries...
I dont want to fight about this.. Its just what they want to see.
They want us divided.. So you can turn to the government, and say..
Hey what are YOU going to do about this..
Protect me PLEASE from the evil smokers!!!

While the whole time, the government is putting stuff in your water, food, and everything else you put into your body!!!
Odd huh?

[edit on 15-12-2008 by zysin5]

Originally posted by civilized mammal
It should be noted that pesticide free cigarettes CAN be manufactured. This hasn't happened even today! Even though scientists are aware that pesticides and other added chemicals are largely responsible for the any incidents of cancer. Smokers are merely scapegoats.

This is not true. Natural American Spirit cigarettes (Santa Fe Natural Tobacco Company) produces cigarettes not treated with chemicals. They have two kinds of Organic cigarette blends that they pay certain growers more to grow them, and not to use any chemicals on them whatsoever. Their other 8 cigarette blends are natural tobacco with no additives of any kind, but pesticides may still be used on those particular tobacco crops.

I used to smoke American Spirit cigarettes. They are a good, Earth-conscious company. You can also request from their website $20 in free gift certificates for their cigarettes, and they will also send you, on occasion, two free cartons of mixed varieties. I have about 2 cartons at home that I am not smoking, because I no longer care for the flavor of those cigarettes and now, unfortunately for my health, prefer the taste of Marlboro Lights.

There have been some excellent posts in this thread. I do not condone a ban on smoking because the government has already overstepped way too many boundaries, but I do believe that all smokers should be conscious of other human lives as well as the Earth. No smoker should throw their cigarette butts on the ground anywhere. They should be placed into a trash receptacle (once extinguished, of course).

Nicotine has been proven to have benefits in people that suffer from certain neurological disorders, such as Tourette Syndrome. Of course, there are more health-conscious ways of delivering the Nicotine into the bloodstream. Smoke is very harmful to the lungs, and nicotine does constrict arteries and therefore restricts blood flow. Most smokers know this, because they often wake up with limbs being partially numb. When I quit smoking at one point, my circulation improved and I no longer had those issues.

Obviously, the chemicals in tobacco were not meant for man to consume on a regular basis, otherwise his brain would automatically produce those chemicals for him. Just like the opium poppy is not meant to consume on a regular basis, but many plants do have medicinal benefits to assist man at certain times. In modern society, people tend to use everything in excess and forget how to moderate the substances that end up having a detrimental affect on their lives.

Please I am begging a non smoker to tell me the difference from banning smoking because it “may” I repeat “may’ cause damage through second hand smoke. But the perfumes and colognes that people where directly can give people who suffer from migraines their migraines.

No replies from non smokers to a valid point, I am not surprised.

Just what we need - more laws restricting our freedoms. No thanks.

It's already a huge hassle being a smoker. When I was a kid, people could smoke in hospitals and airplanes.

Originally posted by Buddy420
I wouldn't care if cigarettes killed within a week of their inhalation. You will never convince me to give up my liberty to do as I please, and yes that means my liberty to do things which are considered very unhealthy. I will fight for people's right to decide for themselves how healthy a life they want to live. Would you want people telling you you're not allowed to eat red meat, ride a motorcycle, swim in the ocean, etc.. I know most of this has already been posted, but I don't understand why some can't understand such a simple concept.

Well here's the difference.
When person A eats red meat in excess, it doesn't DIRECTLY affect person B's health as it does with cigarettes.

Now let me be clear AGAIN, I am not in favor of banning cigarettes but there needs to be some type of regulation to prevent smokers and non-smokers conflicting in public, enclosed spaces.

reply to post by jfj123


Please I am begging a non smoker to tell me the difference from banning smoking because it “may” I repeat “may’ cause damage through second hand smoke. But the perfumes and colognes that people where directly can give people who suffer from migraines their migraines.

Originally posted by Phatcat
Originally posted by jfj123
I can show you 2nd hand smoke is both a direct lung irritant and can initiate disease factors. Will you believe it? Of course not as you have already decided that the facts that refute your OPINION are wrong. This is the problem with this issue. Since smokers want to smoke, they ignore facts to allow them to continue their behavior.


The pot calling the kettle black eh ?

I've seen several reliable sources burning down your arguments, but you choose to ignore this info so you can continue your personal crusade.
Since non-smokers want to disallow smokers from continuing their habit, they ignore the facts to allow them to condemn this behavior..

You're obviously not reading my posts very thoroughly. In almost every post, I've stated that I don't want to see smoking banned so I'm not asking smokers to discontinue their habit.

Just to be clear, it's not about YOUR future health, it's about everyone else's around you. You do not have the right to endanger someone else's health. PERIOD![/quote

And the drama queen appears for one more appearance..

Must be referring to yourself. I didn't know you were a queen

Awww poor smoker.
Do you honestly believe that the product in cigarettes which you inhale, have no affect on your health? and others?
Are you saying that cigarette smoke is completely inert and in no way harmful to anyone and anything? Do you actually expect anyone to believe that?

Do you honestly believe the soda you drink.. the food you eat.. the air you breathe.. the radiation from too numerous sources to mention are in no way harmfull to anyone and anything?

Give me a friggin' break..

Poor logic. Since other things are bad for us, lets not try to change any of them????

Originally posted by systemic.aberration

IMHO, drugs [not just marijunana - ALL drugs], gambling, public nudity, prostitution, public intoxication, public fornication, and imported ninja monkeys should be legal everywhere.

So, what should I explain to my children when we come across a drunk man, laid out on his back with a woman who is just about to impale her self on his manly charm, while she is just about to shoot up with heroin. All this whilst being egged on by a imported shuirken wielding ninja monkey?



[edit on 15-12-2008 by darkmaninperth]

Originally posted by Ant4AU
reply to post by jfj123

 

Please I am begging a non smoker to tell me the difference from banning smoking because it “may” I repeat “may’ cause damage through second hand smoke. But the perfumes and colognes that people where directly can give people who suffer from migraines their migraines.

Exactly how many times do I need to explain that I'm not in favor of banning smoking??? Seriously??? HOW MANY!!???

First of all it seems as if you have a problem with colognes. That sucks. But just for the record, if you worked with me and you told me that my cologne gave you headaches, it wouldn't even be a question. I would NEVER wear it around you again out of respect for you and your health.

I live in IL in the States here
passed a similar law last year, guess Brit smokers must be pansies because theres not that big of a difference here

Then I would say you are a pleasent person for accomadating me. But, simply everyone is affected by odors and pollutants every day it's time to stop picking and chooseing which one to eliminate and face the fact that anything you are exposed to has a link to some sort of cancer. If second hand smoke was eliminated then other pollutants one would still caouse the cancers and then who would be blamed.

you can't bann smoking, you'd have to arrest almost every smoker cause most of the won't give a #. like in germany, until july 2007 smoking was legal for 16 year olds and then banned for those under 18, and what happened? they spend millions for private security companies running round asking smokers for there ID and when they are under 18 send their parents a letter which said that they smoke and thats it (buhu all those little #ers must be scared as hell from a letter).
And then you start arresting people for doing something they were allowed days ago?
I am not saying that smokers are violent but i know many people (me included) who would instantly go on the streets and throw over the gouvernment.

reply to post by jfj123


Lets put health aside for a moment here.. And lets talk about respect.
Becasue honestly all this health talk, as I have stated is a moot point.
Our governments dont have our health in their best interests.
So again we are going to leave health out of this.. And get somewhere that we can all agree upon, or come as close as possible.

Respect. Something that has been thrown to the way side in our society.

I would respect a non smoker, and not smoke in a restraunt. I wouldnt smoke in an enclosed area where other non smokers would have to deal with that smell. As a smoker.. IF Im not smoking. Smoke can kinda stink.
Dont care about the health part.. it simply stinks..

I would be willing to make sure that we can come to a place where we dont yell and scream at eachother, and find a way to work together.
Presay you being the little brother, and me being the slightly older brother who does something and you run and tell the parents.. aka the government.

If we can work on respect a bit more.. I think we would really get somewhere with all this.. Becasue its got much more to do with respecting someone, over the health issues.

One thing I dont like is the fact I can not smoke in a bar.. We are all drinking stuff that is bad for our bodies.. One man will sit here and pour Jack into his body, yet get upset over some smoke???
Bars should not outlaw smoking.. Bottom line.. I love to smoke and drink. IT goes hand in hand. I smoke more when I drink.
I hardly smoke if Im not already on something else.

Smoking is sometimes like butter. ITs great! And I personally wouldnt give up smoking. But I am willing to respect others.
However they must respect me, and learn much about what I talk about here on ATS. And what is going on with so much stuff I have already linked one time.. No reason in trying to be to pushy about what I know.

But those who are caught up on the health kick side.. You have to drop that. Because its false.

Respect my friends..

Respect.. Im willing to respect you, if you will respect me.

Otherwise we are back at square one..
Anyone want to make a deal?

How about we outlaw people from deficating in public restrooms i.e. Target and Walmart, while I smoke from the comfort from my own home.

[edit on 15-12-2008 by designerplague]

[
But just for the record, if you worked with me and you told me that my cologne gave you headaches, it wouldn't even be a question. I would NEVER wear it around you again out of respect for you and your health.

Ya know, I think most reasonable people would do the same. Simply out of respect for the individual in your example.
How would you react if the same person confronted you with, "Your cologne gives me a headache, I am filing a complaint with OSHA ( substitute any agency ) " My reaction would be quite different.
I believe smokers are being placed in this somewhat unsettling predicament . Hence their collective defensive posturing.
I really do not blame them. Again you hang your hat on the SHS argument. You can not offer an 'impartial' study that supports your opinion. The opposing side has. At least the OP has come out as the clear winner. He has dropped his loaded statement and solicited the desired response. Thirteen plus pages of pissed off people that would normally interact in a more civil manner. I am off to the UK . I shall confront the evil OP with a 25 cent cigar in hand.

Originally posted by Xwino
[
But just for the record, if you worked with me and you told me that my cologne gave you headaches, it wouldn't even be a question. I would NEVER wear it around you again out of respect for you and your health.

How would you react if the same person confronted you with, "Your cologne gives me a headache, I am filing a complaint with OSHA ( substitute any agency ) " My reaction would be quite different.
I believe smokers are being placed in this somewhat unsettling predicament . Hence their collective defensive posturing.
I really do not blame them. Again you hang your hat on the SHS argument. You can not offer an 'impartial' study that supports your opinion. The opposing side has. At least the OP has come out as the clear winner. He has dropped his loaded statement and solicited the desired response. Thirteen plus pages of pissed off people that would normally interact in a more civil manner. I am off to the UK . I shall confront the evil OP with a 25 cent cigar in hand.

Finally someone understand the point I was trying to make. Thank you X

I think smoking should be ban along with the rest of the issues mentioned in this thread and the others linked.
what we should do is come up with a list of things that we need to fix and prioritize them. once thats done, make it happen. maybe we can start right here. we do the research, get the facts, start knockin out the people who think they can poison us with whatever method they are using.

Smoking doenst benefit anyone, at all, ever... Smoking is actually a long term money maker and thats about all it will ever be. just a money maker.

remember, they LOVE of money is the root of all evil...
there is nothing wrong with making money, there is nothing wrong with making lots of money. but once you start to love your money/power (sometimes money means power) thats when things start to go wrong. look at our government, look at the food and drug admin... a conflict of interest within itself and in love with making money. they dont care about you or me, all they care about is making their millions.

its time we stood against this

reply to post by Methuselah


So basically we would have to shut down the entire planet and re engineer all industries completely wipe the economy so that if we survive the man made ice age we emerge completely earth friendly. Yeah that makes total since.