Hating on the Police...

reply to post by SpacePunk


Well perhaps that is the cause of some of our disagreements, I am speaking only of those actually arresting people.

reply to post by StevenDye


That's a narrow argument. How about wrongfully arresting people? Excessive use of force? Using a SWAT team, and breaking down doors in order to arrest someone? The British police are absolutely amicable in comparison to the police in the United States. The police here generally don't consider themselves to be civilians, and part of the community. In the United States, you do not talk to the police without talking to a lawyer first. Not as a suspect, not as a bystander, not for any reason. You say, "hello officer", "thank you officer", "have a nice day officer", etc...

reply to post by SpacePunk


By wrongfully arresting people I assume you mean they know trhe person has done nothing wrong? Otherwise, accidents happen.

And excessive force? Depends which side of the line you are on, you may not find it so excessive if you were the policeman.

Personally I don’t “hate” the police, it is such a broad organisation that it would be pretty ignorant to say you hate every single one of them, however I do have very little respect for the ones I’ve had encounters with, maybe I’m being a little biased but coming from a council estate I always got the impression that I was beneath them,

I’ve had no friendly conversations with them, it has always been “whats your name, what are you doing, have you got any sharp objects on you, we’re gonna search you.

I mean come on this kind of stuff gets on your nerves after a while! They seem to be loaded with preconceptions and it makes them defensive and quick tempered.

As for helping me, yeah one time…one time in twenty one years and that was when I was six years old big deal, all the times I’ve been assaulted, had things stolen or nearly been flattened by a car they’ve not helped me, damn one time It was the police that nearly killed me by driving down the wrong side of the road with no lights on doing 50 in a 30MpH zone when it was dark…even the boys racers aren’t that stupid.

I don’t hate them and I try to keep an optimistic view on them, but when ever things like this happen to me I just think damn your supposed to be setting an example and all you’re doing is shooting yourself in the foot by acting like a total moron.

I don’t like the idea but I’m getting the feeling nowadays that they don’t support the people, it’s the government they support and there job now is to do the governments bidding.

reply to post by StevenDye


"oops" isn't an excuse. There's no such thing as an 'accident', what is referred to as an 'accident' of any kind is the result of the incompetence or malice. If any policeman arrests anybody by 'accident', they should be removed and sent for additional training, if they keep arresting people by 'accident'... they should be fired, and restricted from holding any police job in any jurisdiction.

There's no excuse for excessive use of violence during an arrest. If the person says, "Ok, cuff me, take me in.", and offers on resistance, there's no excuse to, say, throw the person on the ground or over the hood of a car in order to place them in restraints. That is assault, and should be punished with criminal charges just as any thug would be punished.

This thread seems to be deteriorating pretty fast, but I fell the need to chime in. If anyone feels the need to respond then, great.

First off, I hate this idea that without the police crime would skyrocket. Whoever thinks that humans are that inherently evil is insulting our entire species. Not to mention whoever believes such foolishness has failed to realize that if people were that inherently evil then cops would be included thus making them the most dangerous members of society, evil and with authority. So by their own way of thinking they actually support the idea of cops being total scumbags without even realizing it.

The truth is when it comes to crime, cops are basically useless. You see there are actually people out there who believe that the function of the police is to fight crime. The function of police is social control and the protection of property.

Anyone can commit a crime just about anywhere they want, the cops will get called and they'll fill out a report, and they'll follow some leads and maybe they'll turn up something, usually it's detectives and investigators that break any ground in those regards. I'm not saying we shouldn't have police, I just think they're over rated, and lately there's too many of them. Cops do a lot of ticketing for parking somewhere, goin 10 over the limit, or jaywalking. Even if all these crimes we're done safely they still bust ya. It's funny that instead of being mugged by thugs on street corners, people just get ticketed by the police for doing basically nothing but technically breaking some useless law.

And if anyone thinks that cops aren't corrupt, then check out American Gangster. It's an example of how many police on a single force can be tied in with crime.


end.

reply to post by SeekerOfAUTMN


Sorry man but the days of good cops are behind us. There is a systemic problem with cops in this country.

It will end badly.

See I dont have a problem with cops. It seems like the cops have a problem with me. Idk why but it seems like cops hate skateboarders.

reply to post by SpacePunk


Firstly, wrestling someone to the ground, even if they accept defeat. Someone that has been chased down a moterway at over 100 miles an hour (just as an example) who then suddenly gives up? I would bea bit cautious as to why he suddenly gave up so peacefully; by wrestling him to the floor he is unable to take me hostage with any concealed weapon.

Safety of the officer before comfort on the criminal. Now if he never runs an instantly gives up with his hands on his head, then yes, that is a different matter entirely.


And people are stopped and almost arrested all the time by accident. Mistaken identity, when you chase someone down and handcuff them you don't usually call out to them, "By the way before I chase you, are you .....".

If you fit the description of the person they are afetr there is a chance you will be accidentaly stopped or arrested.

reply to post by semperfortis


And you have put it better than I could ever hope to. Thank you.

Cops are useless? Power corrupts?

Sometimes that may be the case. I for one, will respect any police officer until they give me reason to do otherwise, simply because they have chosen to become an officer, the most thankless of jobs.

And semper, I'm sorry everyone posting seems to have ignored such a touching post. I won't forget it.

[edit on 6-12-2008 by SeekerOfAUTMN]

Here's a legit question. why are cops so freaked out when they find out that they have been recorded if they are doing nothing wrong. seriously go out and videotape a cop while he is doing his job in public. stand back like 50 to 100 feet and do nothing threatening. just documenting something that's going on. wanna make a bet the cop will come over and tell you it's illegal even though it's not. wanna make a bet the cop will start acting like a complete a hole and will attempt to take away your camera even though that's technically stealing evidence and intimidating a witness. wanna make a bet if you don't stop videotaping the cops wrong doings and said temper tantrum or fail to let him, like the bully he is, steal your personal property (the camera) he will beat the crap out of you senselessly taser you and drag you to jail on ficticious charges. who's the judge going to believe. the cop of course.

but karma catches up with these pathological abusers of the power and authority that we give them. Cops have one of the highest suicide rates in any profession. wanna make a bet it's not just because they seem (what a surprise) to have a lot of failed relationships in their life from family to lovers to friends.

Originally posted by SpacePunk
reply to post by StevenDye

 

That's a narrow argument. How about wrongfully arresting people? Excessive use of force? Using a SWAT team, and breaking down doors in order to arrest someone? The British police are absolutely amicable in comparison to the police in the United States. The police here generally don't consider themselves to be civilians, and part of the community. In the United States, you do not talk to the police without talking to a lawyer first. Not as a suspect, not as a bystander, not for any reason. You say, "hello officer", "thank you officer", "have a nice day officer", etc...

That is so not true, I talk to officers all the time, remember the officers are told what to do. But I would suggest try sometime talking to one, you might really be surprised. They are at first guarded in their response, due to the flack they get from people, but once you start talking to them, and they realize you aren't there to complain about them, they relax, smile and joke back with you. I have gone to police stations around the world and have talked to the officers without ever being afraid. I in fact search out police stations when I have been in other countries, so I can get police stuff for my daughter.

Try sometime talking to officers, it might broaden your world. (When I say talk to them - I mean nicely - and thank them for what they do)

Remember 99% of them are there for the right reason the other 1% is what gives them a bad name.

Its not that we hate the police we just hate what u have became , the police used to have "to serve and protect" on there cars with lights neon signs to spot a policeman a mile away but in the last 10 years u are becoming invisble just to catch something for money instead of to serve and protect the people we have other organizations to spy on us and to take away our rights . what if the coast guard stopped rescueing people introuble and started shooting them for a bonus on how many people they killed that month why would the coast save anyone if they was told the more they killed the more money they got .

you guys the police make what 25,000 to 28,000 a year thats less than a teacher . u wasnt made to stop crime u was made to protect humanity

I truely feel like the the fbi cia nsa fema kgb mg etc that spends the money to pay there agents to make crimes and then bust them for there own wealth are doing a good job without the police turning on his friends and family for a extra 200 dollar bonus that month for more busts when if u are trying to find a crime u cant serve and protect the poeple

sorry to spam but you guys are forgeting who u serve watch some old westerns the tax payers pay your wages not the government u are the arm of justice to serve and protect those that cant protect themselves agianst any injustice government or foriegn.You dont judge u only protect and serve and let the courts decide justice

Let me give u a example in my town we have a four lane highway right in the middle of town with 24 police on a 12 mile strip wrighting speeding tickets in a 35 mile an hour speed zone ,by them the chief the lawyers and the judges sending u out to bust 150 speeders dui dwi etc. they make the money u dont look at there houses u are here not to bust huminaty for profit , if that was the case u would be a laywer judge fbi cis nsa etc. you are my friend to protect me when others cant

get back to thAT PLEASE WE NEED YOU!

Do not let the powers at be tell u are nothing more than agents from there arm to enforce law , there is others that enforce law u was made to protect and serve thats all u are here for and alot need that back, u put your life on the line everyday for peanuts while the real money is being made behind closed doors.

Know your job the government are trying to make u into the SS and not paying u for what u are doing

the people is who u serve not the government

I am more afraid of a botched "No knock" warrant than criminals when it comes to home security.

These "smash & kill" raids have to stop.

What happens if my door gets smashed in at 3 AM? I come out armed... What would happen if cops hit my house by mistake or on a so called "tip"?

Tell me Mr. Cop, I come out armed.... What am I supposed to do now die? I have a pretty good idea that they will gun me down in a heartbeat if I come out with a shotgun... Don't You?

So, what do I do now... die or shoot? Why the hell am I being put in this position of even thinking about it? Because cops are abusing their authority and the peoples constitutional rights by not even knocking or doing a bit of investigation before performing a freeking military raid!!

So, what is the answer... Die by gunfire and not fire back because they have a black/ navy blue uniform on or do I defend my self and family and get charged with murder if I live? At 3 AM, I might not even know they are cops you know... these asses raided that mayors house in street thug cloths.

www.cato.org...
Overkill: The Rise of Paramilitary Police Raids in America CATO Institute:
www.cato.org...
These increasingly frequent raids, 40,000 per year by one estimate, are needlessly subjecting nonviolent drug offenders, bystanders, and wrongly targeted civilians to the terror of having their homes invaded while they’re sleeping, usually by teams of heavily armed paramilitary units dressed not as police officers but as soldiers. These raids bring unnecessary violence and provocation to nonviolent drug offenders, many of whom were guilty of only misdemeanors. The raids terrorize innocents when police mistakenly target the wrong residence. And they have resulted in dozens of needless deaths and injuries, not only of drug offenders, but also of police officers, children, bystanders, and innocent suspects.

Meantime, a black man named Cory Maye was still sitting on death row in Mississippi, the last I heard, because he heard men trying to break into his Prentiss, Miss. home late at night in December of 2001, where he was alone with his 18-month-old baby daughter.

Mr. Maye, who had no criminal record, got the child down onto the floor and lay down beside her to protect her. When one of the men finally broke into the bedroom, Cory Maye shot and killed him.

The man was hit in the abdomen, just below his bulletproof vest, and died a short time later. It turns out the man who had failed to knock and identify himself before breaking in was a cop, who was really after suspects in the other half of the duplex where Cory Maye lived. Turns out the cop was the white son of the white chief of police. An all-white jury sentenced Cory Maye, who is black, to death for exercising his right to defend his locked home and family against violent invasion by an unknown intruder. The all-white jury took only a few hours to do so, at least one juror explaining he wanted to get home for supper.

The list of such abuses goes on and on – Atlanta police planted marijuana on Fabian Sheats, a "suspected street dealer." They told Sheats they would let him go if he "gave them something." Sheats obligingly lied that he had spotted a kilogram of coc aine nearby, giving them the address of the elderly spinster Miss Kathryn Johnston, who neither used nor dealt drugs, but who did live in fear of break-ins in her crime-infested neighborhood.

Police then lied to a judge, claiming they had actually purchased drugs at the Johnston house, acquired one of those once-rare "no-knock" warrants, and violently battered down the reinforced metal door of a private home where there were no drugs.

Miss Johnston fired a warning shot at the unknown people busting down her door. That bullet lodged in the roof of her porch, injuring no one. Police replied by firing 39 rounds at her, hitting her five times, and wounding each other with another five rounds – though they lied and said they’d been shot by Miss Johnston.

They then handcuffed the old woman as she bled to death on the floor, and searched her house. Finding no drugs, they planted three bags of marijuana.

Next day, the cops picked up one Alex White, an informant, advising him that they needed him to lie, saying that he had purchased coc aine at Johnston’s house. White refused, managed to escape, and went to the media with the story.

Last month, two of those officers pleaded guilty to manslaughter – in deals which helped them escape murder charges – and now face more than 10 years in prison, after authorities demonstrated they lied to get their warrant.

So, what do we do and again why are WE put in this situation?

reply to post by SeekerOfAUTMN


I am one person that actually trusts my government and their forces, and although I don't agree with their means, I have faith it will work out. They are after all only human.

I am also a really nice, kind and considerate citizen. I've always tryed to follow the laws, although when I was younger I liked smoking a god given plant that has been made illegal. Since the day I stopped smoking it and became compleatly within the laws, I still suffer from being a kid scars of the judgement of lesser men in blue with badges and egotrips.

I have much respect for the law enforcement team. If you look into it, that is not an easy policing job to try to get groups of near monkeys not to kill and rape eachother. However some of their theories for policing tenequs leave something to be desired.

As I've said before I have alway been a mostly law abiding citizen and I am a white man, but I too have been scared by profiling and guilt through association among other mishandlings of my charactor by men with big egos and little minds who knew someone that got them a job with the police force.

This is not to say all police are big egos with little minds, but that i was found stigimtized through association so why sould police be any diffrent then to have to face being profiled by the populis?

Like i said untill the police learn they are for the poeple to protect and serve huminaty this will hapen

everyone makes money of crime and death sad but true

It is wrong for another human to have the power over other humans that police do.

From personal experience I have never met a good cop. Every time I get pulled over they are always rude and search me 90% of the time. I am always polite. I think they just don't like people who are different, or they just hate teenagers.

I was walking home the other night at 10 pm. I take the bus to my work so I have to walk a little. I see some bright spotlights up ahead. They start coming at me very fast. The rest happens like a typical COPS scene. I was thrown on the ground and searched, just for being out "late". Since when does Amerika have a curfew?

I lived in this neigbourhood my entire life, and yet i'm treated like a criminal when I walk down the streets.

The fact that you get thrown on the ground for looking "suspicious" makes me hate the pigs alot.
Where is there a law that says looking "suspicious" is cause for being searched?

I can't have respect for humans that think they have authority over my life.

[edit on 6-12-2008 by theendisnear69]

This map says it all.... click on the markers for the stories. 40,000 raids a year.... ridiculous!

www.cato.org...


No Knock Meets the Castle Doctrine: Man Shot Five Times by Police, No Drugs Found, Arkansas Man Charged with Assaulting Officers

jonathanturley.org... ing-officers/


Video: Police Officer Turns Off Video Before Woman is Found in a Pool of Blood
Published 1, February 20, 2008 Criminal law , Justice , Lawyering , Society , Torts

The use of videos to record custodial conditions and arrests has yielded some surprising evidence of abuse over the years. However, this video is perhaps more chilling for what was not filmed. Shreveport, LA Officer Wiley Willis is shown clearly getting angry with Angie Garbarino, who was arrested on suspicion of drunk driving. After roughly handling Garbarino, Willis is shown turned off the video. When it is again turned on, Garbarino is shown lying in a pool of her own blood.

To many to post... point blank these abuses both concern me and anger me... and I have no criminal record.. not even a speeding ticket. I can imagine that people who have had to deal with these "bad apples" )and there seem to be a whole ton of these bad apples by the way) would be even more upset.

[edit on 6-12-2008 by infolurker]