“OMG! ‘Faith’ and ‘Quantum Physics’ are the SAME thing!” Well Maybe…??

Originally posted by OldThinker
reply to post by Byrd

 

And....further....here's a challlenging one from Dr. Ross...

See... www.reasons.org...

As amazing as it may seem, astronomers and physicists have a good understanding of the development of the universe back to when it was only 0.00000000000000000000000000000000001 (i.e., 10-34) second old. We may see some probing back to 10-43 seconds, but that represents the practical limit of research.

American astrophysicist Richard Gott has taken advantage of this infinitesimal period about which we know nothing. He proposes that there is an infinite loss of information about events before10-43 seconds. With this total loss of information, he says, anything becomes possible, including "the ability to make an infinite number of universes."10 In this "possibility" for an infinite number of universes, some non-theists see an opportunity to replace God with chance, or, more specifically, with random fluctuations of a primeval radiation field.

This question remains, however: If the universe had zero information before 10-43 seconds, how did it acquire its subsequent high information state without the input of an intelligent, personal Creator? A personal Creator is required, too, to explain the existence of the primeval radiation field.

This is the one thing I would like science to give an explanation of, and I am not trying to be being fecicious. If science believes it has accounted for the beginning of time, tell me what preceded it?..............Eternity...Time is not eternity and eternity is not in essence time..( meaning eternity is not held by time, but time is held by eternity)...Before there was....There had to BE..

Originally posted by rikk7111

Originally posted by OldThinker
reply to post by Byrd

 

This is the one thing I would like science to give an explanation of, and I am not trying to be being fecticious. If science believes it has accounted for the beginning of time, tell me what preceded it?..............Eternity...Time is not eternity and eternity is not in essence time..( meaning eternity is not held by time, but time is held by eternity)...Before there was....There had to BE..

Great question...


It's a Lawn-mover, cause-effect thing....OT thinks...?

Originally posted by OldThinker

Originally posted by rikk7111

Originally posted by OldThinker
reply to post by Byrd

 

This is the one thing I would like science to give an explanation of, and I am not trying to be being fecticious. If science believes it has accounted for the beginning of time, tell me what preceded it?..............Eternity...Time is not eternity and eternity is not in essence time..( meaning eternity is not held by time, but time is held by eternity)...Before there was....There had to BE..

Great question...


It's a Lawn-mover, cause-effect thing....OT thinks...?

Indeed something caused the effect............

Originally posted by OldThinker
NONE OF US IS AS SMART AS ALL OF US....

LOL everytime I hear someone say that... the only thing I can think of is

The herd is only as fast as its slowest member

really off topic... but here:



I promise you, its the funniest thing ever... and you'll understand why I chuckle when I hear that...

(I might be ADD, did I mention that OT? hehe)

Originally posted by nj2day

Originally posted by OldThinker
NONE OF US IS AS SMART AS ALL OF US....

LOL everytime I hear someone say that... the only thing I can think of is

The herd is only as fast as its slowest member

really off topic... but here:

I promise you, its the funniest thing ever... and you'll understand why I chuckle when I hear that...

(I might be ADD, did I mention that OT? hehe)

NJ, now that is funny as crap!!!!!!

And you made me remember a line as well.." A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link"

reply to post by nj2day




OK....off topic...yes!


Funny...diffenently!!


Needed....for sure!!!!


Thanks!

OT

reply to post by nj2day




You'd like HERBIE, in the TOC video....TOC is Theory of Constraints, by Abraham Goldrattt, it's a book/video....

Originally posted by OldThinker
reply to post by nj2day

 

OK....off topic...yes!


Funny...diffenently!!


Needed....for sure!!!!


Thanks!

OT

OK, OT.........Keep us in line..

i know the topic has floated away from my predicament but id like to ask anyone if they have a theory about the things that i can do...???

SFFT: Maybe the reason humans are here is because we are explorers/creators, we are here to create a foundation for a universe, perhaps we are just test subjects or maybe we are a natural occurrence of one of billions of universes that are out there and each one has a creator race that makes all of its laws through observation and perception, and perhaps the final goal is to see if the perfect universe can arise.

reply to post by rikk7111



Nah....that was great!!!


We need a bit of gooooooofinesss on this thread....the subject is a tad intense, right?

Originally posted by OldThinker

My non-scientific, pseudo-theological noodlings on your questions, OT:

A) Is there a connection/similarity between faith and material? If so, what?

I think science is going to prove that thoughts are matter. And thought is another word for belief. so I think the connection is that they are one and the same.

B) Are words the bridge?

Words are thoughts formulated into lines and sounds. I think words facilitate thought.

C) Is the Lord Jesus the missing ‘substance’ holding all ‘things’ together?

Well, as a Christian, I believe the verse that says "in him we live and move and have our being". How that translates into scientific terms, I don't know.

D) Is there time in eternity? Are past-on relatives ‘waiting’ for us in Heaven?

What if heaven is a universe that doesn't share the same laws and values we have in our universe -- such as time? Friends and relatives who passed before us would already be in that universe. I have a hard time believing they are "waiting" or "passing time" until we join them. If this universe has so many incredible things to explore, what will heaven be like?

E) Is ‘speed’ the key to the infinite? Is it His home?

I have a friend who swears mushrooms are the key to the infinite. Oh wait, that's not what you meant. I don't know. I think there's something to the idea of "source" as God and Jesus returning to God, but also that he's in us and we are in him and he is in God and is God, and wow, now I'm just kind of all confused. I mean, is the Trinity the multiple self articulation of God when translated into a universe that has a time dimension? I mean, the Infinite exists outside of time, and then creates an articulation of himself to live within our spacetime (while the eternal part of him also remains in the timeless eternal) and then after he dies, articulates himself again to dwell both in us and in the timeless eternal. It's enough to melt my brain. Pass the mushrooms.

F) How does the Law of Attraction fit?

If thoughts are things and like attracts like, then our thoughts are like little magnets going out from our brains and bringing back to us more like themselves. And if our thoughts are our beliefs, then our thoughts create reality. And if as Jesus said, I should pray and believe something has already come to pass, then what I pray I am thinking/believing and therefore attracting. Did that make sense?

Where I stutter is with God's Will. How does that fit into the equation?

G) Did Christ ‘slow down’ to be the incarnate?

I don't know.

H) Can we (humans) mimic the creation-theme (on a small scale?)

Yes. Mark 11:20-24. The story of the fig tree. Jesus said we could and should do the same thing he just did. Wow!

I) Are the ramifications for ‘creationism’, ID, and evolution here?

Not sure.

J) What other bible verses would add to the dialog?

Mark 11, the story of Jesus cursing the fig tree. The transfiguration of Jesus on the mountain. The woman who touched his cloak and was healed based only on her thinking it would happen. Peter walking on the water.

K) What other secular sources/schools of discipline that would contribute?

I saw a good post earlier that listed a lot of them. I haven't studied most of them, though, so I can't really comment. Breaking out from old-fashioned Christianity was a big step for me, and I'm always wary that I'm on the verge of heresy at any given point. But I believe and trust that God loves me despite my questions. Or FOR my questions.

L) What other faith tenants/doctrines could help the discussion?

Not sure. Questions are asked in the next bullet.

M) Posters_fill_the_blank other questions?

If Jesus was God incarnate, and he's gone to "prepare a place for us", is he creating a new dimension/world/universe? Speaking it into existence? Was Jesus living the perfect link between faith and reality and showing us how to live that way too? What if our view of the bible needs to change as scientific principles change? What if it's all true, but was written as interpretation of events the authors didn't understand. Like how Jesus ascended or walked on water. They conveyed the story, not understanding the scientific principle behind it, but as science expands our understanding of the universe, shouldn't it also color how we read these passages? (Did that make any sense?)
Behold I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the old earth was carried away. New Universe, being created by Jesus (preparing a place for us)?
Jacob's Ladder (Gen. 28:12) a vision of inter-dimensional travel?
Are we the manifestation of God's thoughts?
If thought is the energy of creation, and God "knew" me before the foundation of the earth, then does that mean I had some kind of existence with God in eternity past?

I don't know. Most of this probably didn't make sense and probably irked a lot of people. I have a hard time getting these kinds of thoughts into formed and coherent sentences. I think I'll go lay down for a while.


[edit on 12/2/08 by GirlNextDoor]

Originally posted by tankthinker
i know the topic has floated away from my predicament but id like to ask anyone if they have a theory about the things that i can do...???

SFFT: Maybe the reason humans are here is because we are explorers/creators, we are here to create a foundation for a universe, perhaps we are just test subjects or maybe we are a natural occurrence of one of billions of universes that are out there and each one has a creator race that makes all of its laws through observation and perception, and perhaps the final goal is to see if the perfect universe can arise.

TT, welcome back!!!
we got a bit silly there...it's that atheist you know...can't keep um' straight....always offf on 'tangents' and such

Seriously....though... Yes we have the ability to influence our world....we are not, however....(in OT's opinion) 'creators' per se'....ever notice we have FEET....we are tied to this earth....pretty darn small in the grand sceem of things....


For perfection take a look at greek word 'teleos' ok?

Originally posted by GirlNextDoor

Originally posted by OldThinker

I don't know. Most of this probably didn't make sense and probably irked a lot of people. I have a hard time getting these kinds of thoughts into formed and coherent sentences. I think I'll go lay down for a while.

GND....no....that was very coherent....you did real goood!!!! OT has more to ponder now....thx!

"Irked people?" That's a good thing.....those atheists make a life of it with OT.....I am better because of the challlenge! And I have thanked them many times....


OT


Enjoy the sleep!


I'm bout ready too!

Thats the thing we may be tied down to this earth, but what i am saying is that if i learned to control this ability i could do what ever i wanted, go were ever/ when ever i wanted.

but think im still only 18 and ive managed to make a good amount of progress from when i first got it.

This power is very addictive though, every time i make people do things that i think them to do, whether by accident or on purpose i get this insane power rush and its so intoxicating. And its like evertime i use my ability it feels as if, lets say this ability is represented as the pacific ocean, i feel as if im a man in a small island putting my foot in the water.


EDIT: one more thing i forgot to add, why do they keep saying this eternal love is the only way to achieve this and that, im actually more of a villian then a good guy and yet i still can do these things. IMO the universe doesnt give a sh%t about good and bad, it just is.

BTW: That video was extremely funny.

[edit on 2-12-2008 by tankthinker]

reply to post by tankthinker


TT, I've found it is better to give, than recieve....


Reallly, it 'feels' better....


Use that teleos ability for good, you will sleep better....live will be good for you....


Please keep coming back to OT's thread...we apppreciate your contribution...please know you will find answers and contenment...just give it some time, ok?

OT prayin'



[edit on 2-12-2008 by OldThinker]

Originally posted by tankthinker
i know the topic has floated away from my predicament but id like to ask anyone if they have a theory about the things that i can do...???

SFFT: Maybe the reason humans are here is because we are explorers/creators, we are here to create a foundation for a universe, perhaps we are just test subjects or maybe we are a natural occurrence of one of billions of universes that are out there and each one has a creator race that makes all of its laws through observation and perception, and perhaps the final goal is to see if the perfect universe can arise.

Hello Tank, tell me if you will, When did you first notice you had these ability's?......If you have stated this before, please forgive my laziness in not reviewing the past post to refresh my memory. If you will let me know of any idiosyncrasy's in your journal within a week.

We have not forgot you my friend, you just pose an uncanny ability that is intriguing and unorthodox. The more info that we can acquire, the better the assessment we can give.

I'd like to trade with you for a day, just to experience the thought.

it started in grade 7 i would say,
its funny but the people i tell about this in real life usually say that they notice it happens to them as well but nowhere near the intensity or frequency, the thing is the never noticed before

ok im going to start the journal Thursday because i have an exam tomorrow and will be busy

omg i just remembered something that might be relevant, i remember that in grade six (i remember because i went to the zoo for the first time that year) i prayed to god/jesus (i used to be a very devout christian in my [younger] youth and i said that if i could have a power like that of superman or spider man that i would take any amount of pain necessary for it to happen. Strangely not to long after i had pretty bad stomach pains but i didnt tell anyone and i endured it, i actually had the pains for like half of the summer until they went away.

omg i just thought of that i cant believe i forgot


EDIT: sorry O.T. im not the "giving" type, im afraid ive already been tainted by the venom of Power, it doesnt mean ill go around killing people, but im not going to be a jesus either.



[edit on 2-12-2008 by tankthinker]

reply to post by tankthinker



epiphany?

maybe the answer would come if you re-evaluated that signature?



Good night!!!

reply to post by tankthinker



TT, one last thing....go back and re-read SLOWLY your last post....and ask yourself...."do I see any disconnects here?"

Night!

Originally posted by tankthinker
it started in grade 7 i would say,
its funny but the people i tell about this in real life usually say that they notice it happens to them as well but nowhere near the intensity or frequency, the thing is the never noticed before

ok im going to start the journal Thursday because i have an exam tomorrow and will be busy

omg i just remembered something that might be relevant, i remember that in grade six (i remember because i went to the zoo for the first time that year) i prayed to god/jesus (i used to be a very devout christian in my [younger] youth and i said that if i could have a power like that of superman or spider man that i would take any amount of pain necessary for it to happen. Strangely not to long after i had pretty bad stomach pains but i didnt tell anyone and i endured it, i actually had the pains for like half of the summer until they went away.

omg i just thought of that i cant believe i forgot


EDIT: sorry O.T. im not the "giving" type, im afraid ive already been tainted by the venom of Power, it doesnt mean ill go around killing people, but im not going to be a jesus either.



[edit on 2-12-2008 by tankthinker]

So you asked God for this power, and now your an Atheist?..............Bite the hand that feeds you....hummmm...