Vetting the President - A Challenge to Naysayers

Originally posted by kozmo

Originally posted by chickenshoes
[ Obama hasn't had a chance to even do anything, right or wrong (or have you not noticed that the inauguration hasn't even taken place yet?), and people are all over him like a duck on a junebug.

However, I'm pretty sure that the majority of the US gave Bush more than enough chances, eight years of them, in fact, and if we feel he screwed up massively, we all have more than enough reason to feel that way.

[edit on 12/2/2008 by chickenshoes]

And WTF does that have to do with questions relating to Obama's birth place. You see, you people are so filled with hatred for Bush that you can't even see through the haze at the REAL issue - WHERE HE WAS BORN!!! He got elected President - good for him and I could care less! BUT, the thingy called the CONSTITUTION - you know, the one you guys claimed Bush was destroying - specifically states the qualifications to be President. There are very legitimate claims as to whether or not he meets these qualifications.

Oh my.... wait a minute here... I think I got it... If a Republican violates the Constitution it is heresy and the onset of Armegeddon, but if a Democrat violates the Constitution, then it must be for a good reason.

Anyone smell that??? Smelss a little like HYPOCRISY!

The person I was replying to wasn't talking about Obama's birth certificate, I wasn't talking about that, in fact, I don't think this thread is about that (please God, not another OBC thread.

It's about Vetting the President, a Challenge to Naysayers. Nothing specific was mentioned here. Vetting the president could cover a lot of territory, not just one issue, I suppose.

All I was pointing out, as you can clearly see in my above original post, is that people are condemning Obama before he has even gotten a chance to do anything.

Bush has been given ample opportunity to do good, but has not. Therefore, if he has only around a 20% approval rating, and people (even conservatives at this point) despise him, it's well deserved at this point.

[edit on 12/2/2008 by chickenshoes]

Originally posted by The Nighthawk

In fact the right-wingers who control the MSM shut down ANY conversation that headed in that direction.

Right wingers control the MSM?

LMMFAOWBSOOMN

reply to post by Moonsouljah


Look, I know it is difficult to understand things. I know it is frustrating to have to read through and understand something. I know that.

However, I asked a simple question. If Obama needs to produce all of this documentation to the American public, previous presidents must have done the same. If so, produce it, thread over.

Now, notice where I posted this?

ABOVE POLITICS

I did not post this in the Crazy Dingbat Conspiracy Politics Forum. You want to talk fringe politics? Go ahead, but not with me.

I take it that no one can produce any documentation

requested of Obama for previous Presidents


I'll keep waiting.



[edit on 2-12-2008 by Irish M1ck]

Originally posted by hotrodturbo7


Obama is an admitted drug user. Noone is calling him out on it.

Wasn't GW an admitted drug user as well? Cocaine, if I remember correctly, and no one really said any too much about that.

Originally posted by sensfan
Does anyone not think that if there was any question regarding Obamas eligibility to be president, someone in the Republican party would have made an issue of it during the campaign instead of dragging up non issues like Bill Ayers, etc?

sorry to go off-topic, but i wouldn't exactly classify Ayers as a non-issue.

Ayers is just another McVeigh that luckily lacked the necessary skills.

Just a curious question Mick,

Does that mean that if Arnold Swazenneger runs for President claiming he was born in the United States, he shouldn't be forced to prove that he is actually a natural born citizen since no other President has done so?

reply to post by Jenna


I think they sould start every post on Obama with race, sorta get it out of the way, ya see?

reply to post by jam321


1) He's not a natural born American citizen.

2) Should he try to run for president and claim that he was (which he wouldn't), he would need to prove it to the proper officials.

Now, if he did that and you still didn't believe him and the officials that verified his legitimacy, then you would need to compile evidence and take it to court. That's what is going on right now.

However, in no way should anyone suggest that Arnold would be forced to show his private information and documents to the American public. Again, to the proper officials, and possibly to an appellate court judge.

Moreover, if you look back to the link that fringe conservatives, blogs, and members on this board are suggesting Obama needs to provide to the public, you will see much of it has nothing to do with where he was born anyway.

That is why I provided the entire list, not just the BC part. Why should Obama provide this to the public:

Baptism certificate -- None

Law practice client list -- Not released

University of Chicago scholarly articles -- None

Columbia thesis -- Not released

Passport (Pakistan) -- Not released

If it gets to court, that's fine. He can show the judge. It's ridiculous to ask him to provide copies of it for download online or something, however.



[edit on 2-12-2008 by Irish M1ck]

reply to post by chickenshoes


originally posted by The Nighthawk
"Excellent idea! And while they're at it they can surely provide Bush's military service record, right?

And his criminal record? Expunged coc aine conviction?

Motor vehicle records?

Anything?

I think a lot of posters just can't wrap their brains around the possibility of an African-American starting from nothing and achieving so much under his own power. Whether they wish to admit it to themselves or not, they're racists. "

sorry should have quoted with original reply

President Bush's Yale transcripts made public on his own website.

2004.georgewbush.org...

I could not find Clinton's transcripts apparently this quest for transcripts began in 1999.

For better or worse, voters have taken an interest in candidates' grades since 1999, when the New Yorker published President Bush's transcript at Yale and disclosed that he was a C student. Mr. Bush had never portrayed himself as a brain, but many were surprised to learn the next year that his opponent, Vice President Gore, did not do much better at Harvard despite his intellectual image. When Senator Kerry's transcript surfaced, reporters found that he actually had a slightly lower average at Yale than Mr. Bush did.

What is the big deal. If Obama is proud of his academic achievements, why not make the transcripts available. We may just discover that he is human just like the rest of us.

[edit on 2-12-2008 by jibeho]

reply to post by jibeho


There's one.

Good job. Glad someone can focus. Question:

I looked up your source, and it said this:

when the New Yorker published President Bush's transcript

How did the New Yorker get the information? Did Bush release the transcript, or did the New Yorker do some investigative research?

reply to post by Irish M1ck

he would need to prove it to the proper officials.

That is the problem. There is no proper authority to verify anything.

And how is it that you can say arnold is not a natural born citizen if he has never produce his BC? In addition all the documents that prove he isn't doesn't have to be released if Arnold doesn't give his permission.

I see where your coming from on Obama but there needs to be an agency responsible to ensure that all candidates are eligible as per se the constitution. Otherwise, one day we will be duped by somebody who is smart enough to keep quiet and keep all of his or her documents confidential or concealed.

reply to post by jam321


Not sure I follow you. For instance, in Obama's case, the State Department of Health verified his birth there. That would be a proper official, since they hold his birth certificate, and have the authority to view it and determine its authenticity.

As far as Arnold... he admits he isn't natural born. That's how I know.

reply to post by Irish M1ck


Now Mick, I found medical records for our previous presidents. So that isn't exactly true. And no other president or president elect has been questioned except for Arthur. So your demanding things that may never have been brought up and I highly doubt after all these years that we could find most of those about the earlier presidents.

reply to post by Irish M1ck

the State Department of Health verified his birth there.

And they may have violated privacy laws in doing so? In addition, the BC should be verified by a federal agency, not state. Whose to say that these two weren't paid off. Only these two have seen the document. Did these two swear under a penalty of perjury that the document really exist. Should we trust their words just cause they are in a position of authority? Should we trust them as we did our intelligence agency that said that Saddam had chemical weapons.

My deal isn't with Obama. I personally feel it is a non issue. However, I would like this issue addressed for future possible incidents. Not to have or force Obama to show his BC, but for Congress to assign responsibility to an agency to verify that all candidates are eligible according to what the constitution says.

reply to post by jam321


Nope. They did an official state investigation (due to all of the accusations). They verified that he was indeed born in Hawaii, that his BC was there, and that it was valid. They did not release any other information because that would be a violation.


State Department of Health declares Obama birth certificate legal

Major points of this article:

1. State Department of Health declares Obama birth certificate legal
   
   
2. State officials say there’s no doubt Barack Obama was born in Hawaii.
   
   
3. verified that the health department holds Obama’s original birth certificate.

Also, this is in there:

She says state law bars release of a certified birth certificate to anyone who does not have a tangible interest in it.

For obvious reasons.

[edit on 2-12-2008 by Irish M1ck]

reply to post by Jenna


I disagree. I think it is only fair to do this. Obama has released relevant medical records, by the way:

Obama health summary

The Obama campaign has released a summary of Obama's health records. This comes almost a week after McCain made his health records available to a handful of reporters.

Obama's physician writes that Obama's biggest health risks are his history of smoking and a family history of cancer.

Laboratory studies included triglycerides of 44(normal under 150), cholesterol 173 (normal under 200), HDL 68 (normal over 40), and LDL 96 (normal under 130). Chem 24, urinalysis and CBC were normal, PSA was 0.6, very good. An EKG was normal.

Now,if someone wants Obama to release all of this information to the public - something other presidents have not done in the past, then they better have a damn good reason.

All of these accusations flying around that Obama should have already done this are unfounded, and this thread will be proof.

reply to post by Irish M1ck

State officials say there’s no doubt Barack Obama was born in Hawaii.

I challenge you to show me the person who said this. I believe this to be the words of the person writing the column.

reply to post by jam321


Right, since the Associated Press is so known for their biased reporting...