Obama Presidency Watch/post election & first 100 days

Originally posted by marg6043
Why Obama stimulus will not work

I think it depends on what you mean by "work"... It will not work to do what? If you're saying it's not going to fix everything and send our economy into a fast recovery and everything will be bright and shiny by the end of the year, then I agree. It's not going to work to do that. NOTHING will work to do that. The damage is done. There's nothing we can do to stop a great recession that's coming our way. NOTHING.

But if by "work", you mean it will prevent devastating and permanent economic ruin, I'm not sure I agree with you. IF Obama uses the money as he says he will (along with all his other plans), I believe he will be able to prevent total economic ruin. We will come back out of it. It might take a few years, but we will get there. Without it, we fall off the cliff. People starve, die and possibly start killing each other for food.

So yes we are just piling more debt on top of more debt with no end on side for years to come.

Yes. It's true, With the wars and stimulus packages and bailouts, our children's children will be paying back this debt. What is the alternative? I mean now.

I tell you they are going to finish selling America to one very rich entities that hide behind the Rich Arabs world, they are the ones that will be finacing our debt.

Nice conspiracy theory. I don't buy it, but it's scary.

What do you think should be done?

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


Here is a link of what is going on behind Americans back with the Tresury department the new obama administration and the Arabs nations.

It seems that we are proping government workers already on how to deal with the tags that will come attach to the money that Arabs nation will be using to finance our debt.

In the NY times already it was an article telling how China is losing its appetize for American debt so if we lose china is not doubt that Obama will need money from sombody else of nation.

Sharia Finance? Obama the door to radical Islam In America?

What our traitors in the Treasury Department are doing? They are bending to the Arabs nations wishes and behind close doors to the American public in November they were offering seminars on “Islamic Finaces 101.

This new sector that will impact America culture and religious views is call Sharia-Complaiant Finance (SCF)..

The participants heard from Talal DeLorenzo, an American convert and product of a jihadist madrassa in Pakistan who has played a leading role in half a dozen U.S. Muslim extremist organizations, apart from being a kingpin among international “sharia advisors.”

Also speaking was American Islamic banker David Loudon of Chicago’s Devon Bank, whose close associate, sharia confidant and fellow banker Salman Ibrahim, just disappeared with up to $80 million stolen from Sunrise Equities, the Islamic financial house he headed.

Last but not least, there was the estimable Harvard professor Samuel Hayes, a long-time fixture at Harvard’s Wahhabi-funded Islamic Finance Project, aka, King Fahd Chair of Sharia Studies. A key player at the yearly sharia finance propaganda forums at Harvard, Professor Hayes advises Arcapita Inc., an Islamic investment fund,

www.humanevents.com...

www.jihadwatch.org...

www.economyincrisis.org...



[edit on 8-1-2009 by marg6043]

Historically speaking governmental spending on a massive scale is one of the more surefire ways to kick start an economy in depression.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


Well I heard Obama address just now and while he is very good and very convincing about the transparency of the government and how he will be working for the nation and he actually drill the failures of congress, the wealthy businesses and congress I can not stop wondering how he will accomplish what he is setting himself to do without either stepping on some dangerous people's shoes or changing the nations terrible policies enacted by other presidents in order to have his plan work.

Still his speech was flawless and very inspiring to the me and I can imagine to every American worker.

Originally posted by marg6043
I can not stop wondering how he will accomplish what he is setting himself to do without either stepping on some dangerous people's shoes or changing the nations terrible policies enacted by other presidents in order to have his plan work.

The bolded above is what he's planning to do.

Marg, have you looked at his Plans?

More to Read about Plans for Government

His Blueprint for Change (I know... hokey name) outlines a lot of actions he's going to take to make money available to pay for his ideas.



Economist's Poll of Economists

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


I have BH but still when he starts changing laws and start supporting laws for the american worker then I will be the first one to give him all the credit he deserve.

But so far his appoitments to his cabinet has not impresed me at all as many of them are the same ones that help bring the economy to what is right now.

Specially this one.

“Free Traitor” Emanuel Primed to Repeat Past Mistakes

One of President-elect Barack Obama’s biggest missteps thus far has been surrounding himself with old Washington insiders that are proponents of disastrous “free trade” agreements that have utterly decimated America’s manufacturing base and were instrumental in putting the economy in the poor shape it is currently in.


The appointments of Bill Richardson to head the Commerce Department, a nomination that was recently withdrawn, former Dallas Mayor Ron Kirk as U.S. Trade Representative and Rahm Emanuel as Chief of Staff represent a complete about-face from Obama’s campaign rhetoric regarding “free trade.”

“There’s no doubt that [the North American Free Trade Agreement] needs to be amended,” Obama said during the campaign. “I’ve already said I would contact the president of Mexico and the prime minister of Canada to make sure that labor agreements are enforceable.”

www.economyincrisis.org...

Even Obama has been very truth about the failures of Free treade agreitments.

But still is surrounding himself with people that are the ones that made the wrong decisions before and that still support it.

This just happen recently and many didn't even knew about it and is been under a democratic congress.

Congress Sweeps Level Playing Field Under the Rug

During the 110th Congress, Rep. William Pascrell (D-NJ), along with 14 additional cosponsors, introduced the Border Tax Equity Act of 2007 in the U.S. House of Representatives, a key piece of trade legislation that would have went a long way towards remedying the border tax inequities that hamper the U.S. since the Value Added Tax (VAT) is utilized by most of America’s trading partners.


In short, the bill would have allowed the U.S. to levy its own border taxes on VAT nations to level the playing field unless the U.S. Trade Representative was able to negotiate a remedy within the framework of the World Trade Organization

This are the bills that our nation needs in order to protect America but look what happen, it didn't even got a chance.

www.economyincrisis.org...

I hope Obama does better once he is the president.






[edit on 8-1-2009 by marg6043]

You cannot solve the problem of too much debt with MORE DEBT.

Here are some one page articles written by Karl Denninger - a brilliant trader and economist. Please read them

Obama Verdict: Insane

Obama Prescription: FAIL

To Obama: Your First 100 Days

One Trillion A Year?

And from What They're Doing Can't Work

The problem is that there is too much debt in the system; adding more debt to the system simply makes the problem worse at an exponentially-increasing rate.

It is impossible to fix a problem that is best explained as "too much" of something by adding more of that same thing.

This is true whether the "too much" is a drunk who wants a bottle of whiskey, a crackhead who wants another hit, or a heroin addict who begs for another shot.

You can't solve any of their problems with more of what ails them any more than you can solve a debt problem with yet more debt.

Yeah, real unbiased sources there.

If all Obama was going to do is borrow more money, then I would agree with you. But he is making other fundamental changes to the way the country operates in conjunction with this stimulus package in order to lessen the effects of the coming recession/depression.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Yeah, real unbiased sources there.

If all Obama was going to do is borrow more money, then I would agree with you. But he is making other fundamental changes to the way the country operates in conjunction with this stimulus package in order to lessen the effects of the coming recession/depression.

It's 1 source, not sources, and that source is a brilliant economist. Sorry if that is not good enough for you.

Obama is not making changes that need to be made. His plans are not going to fix the problem. They are going to make it worse, MUCH WORSE!

There is a way of avoiding that. It is to:

* JAIL the fraudsters, including those in Congress, Treasury and on Wall Street. Bluntly - if we can find a predicate felony to nail you with in this mess, off you go.
* REMOVE all of the overseers. This includes The Fed. Set up a new agency that is charged with enforcing all of the laws related to the financial system including The Federal Reserve Act, and empower them with subpoenas. Direct that they must act and operate "in the sunshine", with everything published on The Web and other publicly accessible places. You do an evil thing, the public sees it. They try to hide it, the public sees it.
* DEFAULT all the bad debt. Yes, this "booms" a lot of banks. Tough.
* SET UP new banks. Take the remaining $350 billion and capitalize ten banks with $35 billion each. IPO them to the public. By law no officer, current or former, of an existing public bank may serve on these firm's boards. Now we've got the means to replace the credit creation the boomed banks can't do any more.

This clears the system and requires no stimulus spending.

There is no solution to this problem that does not involve clearing the excess debt from the system.

This debt will default. Our choice is to do it now and have it suck badly, or to try to avoid it and have it suck catastrophically.

To travel down the road of curing the debt junkie with a bigger fix of debt will do nothing more than cause a greater depression than the one in 1929.

Believe me, I do not want to be here in a year or few and be able to say "I told you so." But if the debt is not forced to be cleared, that is exactly what will happen, and in the end, it will be Obama who is blamed for it in the history books, if there are any written, that is.

All the politicians are doing is bailing out Wall street that is what the government has been moronic staged to do by the elite powers that runs this nation.

Bailing the fortunes of those that has been profiting at the expenses of tax payers.

Because they see themselves in their greed as the priority over the nation and the citizens.

Even when Obama in his speech today mention this fact about government and wall street its going to take a lot of cojones to go over the heads of all this powerful people, because obviously we the people has not lifted a finger to help at all.

We are dumping all the work on one single man that while it has the best intentions he is just one man.

He will fail if we the people do not support him and fight for his right to help us against the elite that wants to rob us blind.

Are we the people ready to fight for that? or we are just to sit here and complain until is too late.

Ahh... but the real question is Marg... will he fail miseribly... or will he fail magnificently?

reply to post by marg6043


Marg, after reading your post it dawned on me,

The world got their president not American, the world, the world got the man that would make America even weaker,

President of the world.

reply to post by Stormdancer777


Nonsense... Obama is and will be very much president of America and not the world... however he is definately more open to our rights and responsiblities globally than the current occupant.

reply to post by semperfortis


Take it ease mate either Obama is going to be the democrats Reagan or there is going to be an awfully lot of disappointed people . Look as much as I think that Bush is an incompetent man who got a lot further then he should have thanks to the political genius of Karl Rove , I don't however subscribe to the school of thought that Bush is responseible for every ill in the world . If you want to gain some traction with your arguments post some solid logic which in any case I am about to do .

Truman left office with what was then record disapproval ratings . Today despite those poll ratings Truman is regarded as one of the better presidents . Bush could well redeem his reputation like Nixon did and on some issues will be cut some slack by rational historians .

reply to post by xpert11


well I am not really upset XPert, but thanks for asking..

The "Substance" you requested is in the post actually, pretty plain I thought..

So much hype about What he is "Going to do", that I have begun to wonder if some of these people are really Obama in hiding. No way anyone can know what he is "going to do" as he has no relevant or successful history.

And my request to use the adjectives I listed to describe BHB still stands. If they can be used, and apparently universally accepted about GWB, why can I not use them to describe Obama?

I think that is a fair question...

Semper

reply to post by semperfortis


You can not use them yet and lower your self to the standards of those that do because Obama Is not the president of this nation yet and he has not done the traitorous deed, blunders and mistakes that our present president has done.

Plain and simple, you can indeed complain, debate and bash what Obama has planned for America, with links to back as why.

But complaining about what others do base solely on opinions is not going to win you any points.

Originally posted by semperfortis
It saddens me to see this from people that I perhaps differed from politically, but respected their intellect.

So much for this quote of yours, then, huh?

Originally posted by semperfortis
I know it has been said a million times these past few weeks, but folks, it really is about the issues and not the person. That person sitting across from you, posting in favor of their candidate or party; truly wants what is best for this country just like you do and so deserves all the respect you would require for yourself.

You know what? Maybe these mystery people with whom you have differed politically but respected their intellect don't really care whether you respect their intellect or not.

Not to leave out the hypocrisy of calling for no criticism of Obama from the very same people that spouted such VILE and unsubstantiated characterizations for the current President.

Did someone call for no criticism of Obama?? Where? Skepticism and criticism of our governmental officials are good things.

Let's wait and see. He has surprised us so far with his "Change" being just more "Clinton Style" of the same.

Why should we wait to talk about his plans when people are freely talking about how "more of the same" it's *going to be*? If his critics can jump on his cabinet picks, being just certain that they indicate "more of the same" (without really having a clue), why must his supporters wait to talk about the change that we see coming in the future?

As you said, he hasn't done anything yet. We're ALL predicting. You are no more sure that his picks indicate "more of the same" than I am that his stated plans indicate "change". Why should either of us be silenced?

Having looked at the past posting of several people active on this thread may I please call Obama....

You don't have to ask permission. Feel free to call him whatever vile name you like within the T&C. I'm not promising I'll stand silently by, but then, no one stays silent when I call Bush an idiot, either.

[edit on 10-1-2009 by Benevolent Heretic]

reply to post by marg6043

he has not done the traitorous deed, blunders and mistakes that our present president has done.

That is your OPINION and you are indeed entitled to your OPINION but there are no facts...

So no "Valid" answer yet.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

So much for this quote of yours, then, huh?

So much of what?

You know what? Maybe these mystery people with whom you have differed politically but respected their intellect don't really care whether you respect their intellect or not

Whether "they" care or not is entirely irrelevant to how I feel and that was the crux of my post. Do you equate and regulate all of your feelings based on whether people care or not?

Did someone call for no criticism of Obama?? Where? Skepticism and criticism of our governmental officials are good things.

Yes

I have personally been called to NOT criticize Obama by no less than 3 posters. And that is just my limited participation. I have observed it from many; to many; so far. Just examine the post above yours for verification.

Why should we wait to talk about his plans when people are freely talking about how "more of the same" it's *going to be*? If his critics can jump on his cabinet picks, being just certain that they indicate "more of the same" (without really having a clue), why must his supporters wait to talk about the change that we see coming in the future?

The point applied to either side of the argument, however when one "assumes" a politician is not going to keep their word, I would hazard they are more than likely on the right side of the equation and I doubt many that look objectively at anything would argue. (Key words "Look Objectively)

You don't have to ask permission. Feel free to call him whatever vile name you like within the T&C.

Do you consider the names you have called GWB to be vile?

Please look at your past posts first and let me know how you really feel about them.

Back on topic,

The one sure thing that we have learned we can count on, is that politicians lie, cheat and steal. Obama is a politician and showed his true colors when he stabbed his friend and mentor, Alice Palmer, in the back politically and basically ruined her career.

The first 100 days I am sure will be exactly like the first 100 days of any politicians career. Getting back to the business of making themselves more powerful and more rich.

Semper

OK I will answer what I can without going off topic .

Originally posted by semperfortis
The "Substance" you requested is in the post actually, pretty plain I thought..

I tried to throw you a bone because while Obama has promised an awful lot it cant really be connected to peoples comments on Bush two terms in office .

So much hype about What he is "Going to do", that I have begun to wonder if some of these people are really Obama in hiding. No way anyone can know what he is "going to do" as he has no relevant or successful history.

I don't buy the whole change mantra myself . If you want an indicator what Obama will do then his advisor's policy planks rather then his promises would be a better guide . Although unless Obama is as easily influenced as Bush is I wouldn't rely on this method 100% .

Presidents and Prime Minsters have differnt constitutional responsibility's but a common trait that is needed is common to both jobs . A person in either position needs to be in the very least a very good manager of people . As a general Ike was a average strategist(SP?) but he was a brilliant manager of people . He even managed to become friends with General Montgomery .

The fact that Ike was such a good manger of people stood him during his time in the oval office . Ike was able to ignore the hawks in his own cabinet and party all the while more or less continuing Truman foreign policy.

I think that is a fair question...

You can say what you want with in the T&C . People have put forward rational for there arguments that's what was asked for rather then have Obama untouchable and Bush lampooned as per usual . I am responseible for my own postings not for what others have said about Bush . The whole " you are so what I am I ? " or rather what is Obama ? is of no value anyway .