Why are people so politically blind?

I just got a call from an opinion poll regarding the upcoming run-off election to be held in GA between Saxby Chambliss (R) and Jim Martin (D).

Now frankly, I just want to get as many Dem Senators eleted as possible. Because I don't believe this gives Obama full reign as much as it puts him directly at odds with lots of Dems who have been there forever. It's time for the Democrats to have the showdown between belief systems of governing, and thats the best way to make it happen.. Marginalize the Republicans and the Senate Dems will end up fighting with the Democratic President.

Anyway...


The pollster was asking questions like "Is this ad convincing..."

And to be honest, 98% of all attack ads, from either side was not convincing to me because it left out facts. For example, one said "Jim Martin Voted to raise taxes on Georgians X times...."

Well ok, but for what? Where is the context? I'll pay more taxes if it is for something I care about. But I'll be ticked off if it is for something I am against. So.. Not convincing.


Another one was "Saxby Chamblis says he's against amnesty for illegal immigrants, yet he helped form part of the Kennedy-McCain coalition which tried to give amnesty to undocumented workers".


Ok.. so this is a hugely unpopular thing, but yet he has to work with people in his party. Of course he has to say he's against amnesty, and then work with the coalition to help sway it in that direction.

So anyway... all of these lack context, and I called 98% of them unconvincing. There were a couple that actually dealt with issues and not FUD.

Either way, the lady says "I've not talked to anyone today as informed as you. You've made me think about these things, you don't seem to buy into any rhetoric which is for candidate or against your opponent"


Why is this? Why am I the only person today she has talked to who cares about context. Whether you agree with my conclusions or not, the fact that I was the only American in GA she talked to who cares about context is breathtaking.

Why do people like to cling to soundbites and idiocy?

Well it's designed to be that way. This fraudulent two party system is made up of mudslinging and misinformation. The public feed of it and begin to hate the other party. Just look at all the McCain supporters that have created anti-obama threads here. People just love to hate and thrive off these "attack-ads".

It's hell of a lot easier for someone to tell you that Mr. X has voted to raise taxes while Mr. Y hasn't. Also that Mr. Y has taken money from corrupt bankers to fund his party. All of this is ridiculous. People live off this drama and are drawn into it. After watching these ads they would accuse the other party of the allegations but never once research for themselves if the said allegations were true.

-Ign0RanT

[edit on 9-11-2008 by Ign0rant]

[edit on 10-11-2008 by Ign0rant]

They will all lie to get elected and then do what their told or get fired.The organism is already formed... they are all mearly cells. if that one cell disobeys the organisms intent it will be rejected and removed. Do you really think they want to lose ALL of that bribe money not to mention what they already get paid? They will fall in line and do what their told because they are ignorant, selfish, and mentaly weak.

You seem to be the one who is blind. The ones who are worthy of such power dont desire it..... ever.

The last time a pollster called me was a complete waste of my time. I will admit some of the questions made sense. Most were a scale 1-10 series. They became stumped when I said I could not answer because I did not subscribe to the premise of the question itself. After a few of these they said the whole thing was invalid because I did not or would not answer the question. Complete garbage.

It is what sells, most people only care about what they see and hear, a good example of that is Obama, his rhetoric doesn't match up with his voting record.

We as American's have gotten to the point where we don't think it is that big of deal, that is what Reps and Dems keep getting voting into office because a lot of them won't take the time to research the candidates, or figure out why we are going through the problems we are going through.

Most of America has been brainwashed into believing that there are only two parties so there are only two choices. Just the way it is right now at least.

Another thing you need to think twice about having as many dems in senate as possible because once they get 2/3rds majority they can override veto's. Which pretty much gives them free reign over the budget. I think they are at 57 right now, along with two independents that caucus with them, although Lieberman's fate is still up in the air.

Once they hit 60 seats then they can steamroll any legislation that they want.

ok.. then let's pose it this way.


Why are so few Americans (like me) hell bent on getting the context when people say things which are obviously designed to persuade while typically obcuring other facts?

reply to post by HunkaHunka


Interesting. What do you have to say about the context of the ad run in Georgia by the Democratic party asserting that Saxby Chambliss wants to raise the taxes on "almost everything you buy" by 23%?

Come to The uk, it is not quite were you are yet, but they are working on it.

Personally i think Democracy is a bad idea.

Q:If 61 vote to kill all White people how do you object?

A:You cannot. it's democracy

Good post. Good question.

I'd just like to add that it's not a problem with Americans as it is with the whole world. The human race.

Who is responsible for teaching people critical thinking ? Well the administration of education or something along those lines is.

If you ask me, the whole problem lies in how we educate our children. I don't believe anyone are stupid becaue they want to be stupid. There are people who needs guidance more than others to figure these things out and learn to think less impulsive.

I do believe corporate influence is somehow involved in keeping our education systems from teaching us these things. It must be in alot of rich peoples interest to keep the majority of people stupid and impulsive. But that's another topic.

Originally posted by HunkaHunka


Either way, the lady says "I've not talked to anyone today as informed as you. You've made me think about these things, you don't seem to buy into any rhetoric which is for candidate or against your opponent"


Why is this? Why am I the only person today she has talked to who cares about context. Whether you agree with my conclusions or not, the fact that I was the only American in GA she talked to who cares about context is breathtaking.

hahah that made me laugh.
Scary stuff, I know. People need to think more.

Originally posted by CVTman
reply to post by HunkaHunka

 

Interesting. What do you have to say about the context of the ad run in Georgia by the Democratic party asserting that Saxby Chambliss wants to raise the taxes on "almost everything you buy" by 23%?

To be honest, I want to know what those taxes are being used to fund, if indeed he did raise them as stated. I may believe in what he raised taxes for, or I may be opposed to it.

I refuse to "react" to a negative add, regardless of the class of it's tactics. Instead I have to ask questions like "Sure he voted for that bill, but why? What else was on that bill which is not being mentioned here, might have been a bipartisan compromise?

Originally posted by JustAThought


I do believe corporate influence is somehow involved in keeping our education systems from teaching us these things. It must be in alot of rich peoples interest to keep the majority of people stupid and impulsive. But that's another topic.

Yep, and that topic is being discussed here (The LIE of Hard Work) to dome degree.

I can answer that question easily..... They think we are ignorant and that we will believe anything. I don't buy into that either! I look into it, see who's beliefs I can connect with. Most people don't. they go off the bull *@^# that they hear. How do you think Obama got elected?

Originally posted by HunkaHunka

Originally posted by CVTman
reply to post by HunkaHunka

 

Interesting. What do you have to say about the context of the ad run in Georgia by the Democratic party asserting that Saxby Chambliss wants to raise the taxes on "almost everything you buy" by 23%?

To be honest, I want to know what those taxes are being used to fund, if indeed he did raise them as stated. I may believe in what he raised taxes for, or I may be opposed to it.

I refuse to "react" to a negative add, regardless of the class of it's tactics. Instead I have to ask questions like "Sure he voted for that bill, but why? What else was on that bill which is not being mentioned here, might have been a bipartisan compromise?

Well my answer to increasing taxes is always NO!
Because the rest of us have to make choices on what we do with the money we make so why shouldnt the government do the same? I cant go to my boss and say I want a bigger house so pay me more. The government already gets a raise every time we get a raise because taxes are based on a percentage of our income. If they find something they want to do that is important then they should find some things of equal vaue to cut out. I want to eat a fine dinner at the nicest restraunt every night and I can do that if I dont want a car or a house. They should have to make the same choices.

[edit on 10-11-2008 by justsomeboreddude]

Watch Idiocracy.

"I like money."

I'm a Georgia voter and nobody called me for my opinion. Probably because I voted for Buckley the libertarian candidate.

reply to post by HunkaHunka


Both extremes (left and right) are equally sinister and wrong. The majority of people are moderates, sanely. Check the bell-curve.

When will people understand that being a Democrat (fascist) or being a Republican (fascist) makes you EQUALLY dumb.

The only hope for America, is that someone with some celebrity starts to convince the population that the world is not black and white. It's gray. And, until we address the idea that these moderates ALL have similar beliefs, we'll see that the world's problems CAN be fixed, if we just listen to the TRULY intelligent middle-ground majority.

in Liberty,
Rok

Originally posted by justsomeboreddude

Well my answer to increasing taxes is always NO!
Because the rest of us have to make choices on what we do with the money we make so why shouldnt the government do the same? I cant go to my boss and say I want a bigger house so pay me more.

I think you don't quite understand what Governments role is. To say that you don't like tax increases regardless of what the money is used for is akin to just being blind.

What if those taxes aided an effort to destory an asteroid heading for the earth. Or more in line with reality, perhaps it was to fix the roads you drive on everyday which are now costing you money on an annual basis in the form of auto repairs?

You see, it's not like the gov is getting a raise, in order for the gov to do anything for the infrastrcuture it requires taxes. In my case I would be for taxes that supported programs which directly effected me in some way.

Alternatively I would be against taxes which funded a war I didn't believe in.

When do we wake up to the fact that promoting Absolutes are the downfall of any civilization or culture?

[edit on 10-11-2008 by HunkaHunka]

Originally posted by monkeybus
Come to The uk, it is not quite were you are yet, but they are working on it.

Personally i think Democracy is a bad idea.

Q:If 61 vote to kill all White people how do you object?

A:You cannot. it's democracy

That's why the supreme court is there to judge the constitutionality of any laws passed by the senate. The problem arises with the ability to pass consitutional amendments unchecked. That is why the second amendment exists, to make the congress, president and judicial branch aware that it is the PEOPLE that run the country and that passing legislation that is contrary to the peoples will, will be met with less than lethargy.

It is not the right of the people to keep and bear arms, it is the responsibility of the people to keep and bear arms and to defend these United States from all enemies, bith foreign and DOMESTIC.

Jaden

Yes, I was curious too. And I jumped on the net to find out what the Democrats were (actually weren't) talking about when they ran an ad in Georgia saying that Saxby Chambliss wants to raise the sales taxes to 23% on “nearly everything you buy.”

Its true that Saxby want's to raise sales tax to 23%.

True, but only people who want to be informed will care about the context. So, great thread! Flag and star!

I knew there must be a catch to what they were feeding us, so I dug a little and found out that what they are talking about (and what they convieniently failed to mention) is that Saxby supports the Fair Tax.

Here are the facts on the Fair Tax that I found:

The FairTax Act (HR 25, S 1025) eliminates ALL federal taxes and withholdings and replaces them with a single 23% sales tax to be collected by existing state sales tax authorities at the retail level.

This means that:

-The Fair Tax eliminates the income tax.
-The Fair Tax eliminates Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid
deductions from your paycheck.
- The Fair Tax eliminates the death tax.
- The Fair Tax eliminates the capitol gains tax
-The Fair Tax eliminates all the embedded taxes that are built into the
price of everything we buy.
-The Fair Tax prebates every head-of-household in the country on the
tax-liability for purchases on the bare necessities. For example:

A married couple with 3 children will receive a check from the government every month in the amount of $591.00 as reimbursement for the sales tax they paid on bare necessities to support their family.

A single person with no children, on the other hand, will receive a monthly check in the amount of $196.00.

This means that you keep ALL of your paycheck, and your family receives a monthly check from the government to boot.

Digging further, I found that the size of your paycheck will actually INCREASE by the amount of your employer's share of your Social Security, Medicare, and Medicare burden. In other words, if you currently earning $500.00 a week BEFORE taxes, and taking home $425.00, then under the Fair Tax, you will take home around $550.00 a week free-and-clear - WITH NO DEDUCTIONS. Add to that the amount of your monthly pre-bate check from the gov't, and you are taking home a minimum of $600.00/week, whereas before you were only taking home $425.00.

And the Fair Tax continues to fund Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid as before.

It gets better:

Also, under the Fair Tax, the price of everything remains about the same. Currently, all businesses are taxed, and those taxes are built the price of products at every stage of production. By the time that product reaches the shelves, the total embedded cost of the taxes built into that product amounts to about, yep, you guessed it, 23%. Simply, the naive will believe that businesses pay taxes, but the reality is that businesses collect taxes by passing the tax cost onto the consumer.

So the embedded taxes amounting to about 23% are eliminated thereby reducing the price of the product, and then those taxes are replaced by a simple visible 23% national sales tax.

Finally, the Fair Tax is revenue neutral, meaning that it is designed to fund the government at its current level. It is NOT a tax cut or tax hike. We still have to pay for our Government.

So those are the basics on the Fair Tax, and how Saxby Chambliss is going to "tax nearly everything your buy" by 23%

I won't argue the pros and cons of the Fair Tax here. I simply found out the facts relating to the Democratic ad, and I encourage every one to check the facts that I listed for yourselves.

I simply want to point out that since we are talking about ads and context, that the Democratic ad supporting Jim Martin needs to be discussed in detail here since it is a case-study in things contextual