The Mystery of the Sphinx

Though I am an advocate of discovering the unknown, I dislike aimless chatter and conjecture. I am attempting to organize documented and credible theories concerning the age, origin, and nature of the Sphinx. Any educated (or at least literate) posts concerning this, and the supposed chamber(s) beneath, are welcome. To begin, this is direct quotation from the National Geographic, copyright 1996-2008.

“Constructed circa 2520bc, Khafre's necropolis also boasted an unprecedented profusion of statues, among them the Sphinx. Carved from bedrock in front of Khafre's pyramid, the Sphinx depicts the pharaoh as a human-headed lion, wearing the headdress of the pharaohs. The great statue is the embodiment of Khafre, the third ruler of the 4th dynasty, as the god Horus.”

On the forementioned page, it is also noted that a fourth pyramid was recently discovered in the Giza area buried beneath the sand. This pyramid was constructed by the same pharaoh lineage as the Great Pyramid, but has decayed to a much greater extent than its "brothers". I mention this only to illustrate that the sands of Egypt hold more than we know, even great structures such as the pyramids.

Now, to jump from scientific theory to a widely-accepted idea… The following is a direct quote from Edgar Cayce's prophecy concerning the Sphinx:

"...seek either of the three phases of the ways and means in which those records of the activities of individuals were preserved -- the one in the Atlantean land, that sank, which will rise and is rising again; another in the place of the records that leadeth from the Sphinx to the hall of records, in the Egyptian land; and another in the Aryan or Yucatan land, where the temple there is overshadowing same."

www.catchpenny.org...

If you are able to read, then it should be clear that this "hall of records" is not beneath the Sphinx at all, but somewhere in the sands between the Sphinx and the Nile. What may be beneath the Sphinx, if one subscribes to the prophecy, is nothing more than a marker leading to the hidden chamber.

The following is a fairly long quotation from encylopedia.com.

"In 1967, Herbert Ricke of the Swiss Archaeological Institute uncovered a temple at the foot of the Sphinx. Niches in the temple form sanctuaries dedicated to the rising and setting of the Sun, and a colonnade court in the temple features 24 pillars, which Ricke suggested represents the 24 hours in a day. The Sphinx, in Ricke's opinion, represents the Sun god that peers into the sanctuaries of the temple.
The temple is situated on an east-west axis that points to the spring and autumn equinoxes. A second temple, constructed more than a thousand years later, is oriented toward the winter solstice. At the time the later temple was built, the Sphinx was buried up to its neck in sand and was called Hor-em-Akhet. The Sphinx itself forms an image of the akhet hieroglyphic when approached directly from Memphis, capital city during the Fourth Dynasty, when the pyramids and the Sphinx are believed to have been built. On the path from Memphis, the Sphinx appeared silhouetted between two pyramids."

www.unexplainedstuff.com...


[edit on 28-10-2008 by Malfeitor]


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[edit on 3/11/08 by Jbird]

To continue my quote from encyclopedia.com...



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[edit on 3/11/08 by Jbird]

Yeah the fact that the Sphinx bears evidence of rain erosion disproves the old egyptological dating for it, but yet it is completely in line with the prophecies of Edgar Cayce and his dating of the Sphinx.

The tunnels and chambers also ARE there.

Really good documentary- Mystery of the Sphinx
video.google.com...

AFAIK its not a "fact" that the Sphinx has been eroded by rain, its still very much disputed. But granted, I havent kept myself up to date on it.

To me there is one logical flaw of the whole Atlantis theory... If a big cat was SO important to them that they decided to make a monument of it (and even more amazing, the ONLY surviving one), why didnt Plato mention anything of that?

Allow me to reply to this by asking a question; why is the testimony of Plato, who arguably wrote his piece about Atlantis as a metaphor about Rome, so widely accepted as the only reliable acount of the lost land?
Ancient China spoke of the lost continent of Mu, and many other civilizations had tales of an advanced society which was lost to a cataclysm. I simply don't understand why the account of Plato is considered more reliable than the accounts of other wise men.
This is in no way a smear against Plato, mind you; I'm simply offering the point of view that Plato, while wise, may not have been overly concerned about presenting the details of a legend to his readers. If he had possessed the foresight to know that thousands of years later people would look to him for clues to Atlantis, he surely would have provided more detail.

reply to post by merka


One more thing I must mention.
There are more than seventy sphinx surviving in ancient Egypt, not just the famous one. The Great Sphinx is simply the largest and the oldest known. The other sphinx are varied, posessing bird's heads and other differences, but they're sphinx nonetheless.

Originally posted by Malfeitor
reply to post by merka

 

One more thing I must mention.
There are more than seventy sphinx surviving in ancient Egypt, not just the famous one. The Great Sphinx is simply the largest and the oldest known. The other sphinx are varied, posessing bird's heads and other differences, but they're sphinx nonetheless.

really?

I did not know that

thanks for the info

Sphinxes usually come in pairs as well. Which begs the question, could the great Sphinx have a twin?, and if so where is it?.

[edit on 2-11-2008 by Resinveins]

Originally posted by Malfeitor
Allow me to reply to this by asking a question; why is the testimony of Plato, who arguably wrote his piece about Atlantis as a metaphor about Rome, so widely accepted as the only reliable acount of the lost land?

Because Plato's account is the only account we have from the ancient world. And even it isn't "ancient" enough to be plausible.

Originally posted by Malfeitor
Ancient China spoke of the lost continent of Mu, and many other civilizations had tales of an advanced society which was lost to a cataclysm.

There is no Mu legend in China, or anywhere else, that predates the mistranslation (by Brasseur de Bourbourg) of the Mayan Madrid Codex in the 1860's.

Originally posted by MalfeitorI simply don't understand why the account of Plato is considered more reliable than the accounts of other wise men.

Got any of these other "accounts" that describe a powerful seafaring civilization in or around 10,000 BCE?


Harte

It was me, i fashioned the entity out of rock, with my supreme stone masonry skills. I achieved this all in one night. The people going about there daily business the next day were amazed, where did this spirit trapped in stone come from? I navigated my way out of the sahara by going deep underground, back to the CORE.. SORRRY pointless chatter , i could'nt resist. Its a mystery still???

You requested evidence, or other accounts, of lost civilizations. I would not speak if I weren't prepared to offer such, my friend; this has been a lifelong hobby of mine.

These first links are simply regarding technology which may or may not have existed in past times. I'll not vouch for the validity of either link; however, I've read of both subjects numerous times in the past, and feel that most, if not all, of the data presented is accurate. As for the first link, I'm not familiar with the legend; read it if it pleases you, but don't complain if you don't like it.

www.heart7.net...

www.world-mysteries.com...

These next three links are official and placed in the order of relevence to the topic at hand. The first is simply an interactive "map" of sorts which details some of histories finer mysteries. The second details the "discovery of a lost continent" somewhere near Australia. The third, and my favorite, is about Japan's sunken pyramids, which by default must be at least 10,000 years old.

www.nationalgeographic.com...

news.bbc.co.uk...

news.nationalgeographic.com...

If there are other reliable accounts of anomalous artifacts or structures, please enlighten me; I've simply grabbed what I could find before dinner.

Originally posted by Malfeitor
You requested evidence, or other accounts, of lost civilizations. I would not speak if I weren't prepared to offer such, my friend; this has been a lifelong hobby of mine.

These first links are simply regarding technology which may or may not have existed in past times. I'll not vouch for the validity of either link; however, I've read of both subjects numerous times in the past, and feel that most, if not all, of the data presented is accurate. As for the first link, I'm not familiar with the legend; read it if it pleases you, but don't complain if you don't like it.

www.heart7.net...

www.world-mysteries.com...

The first link is literature - not applicable to any discussion of fact.

Do you believe in Grendel as well?

The second link above discusses "ancient flight" using the South American stylized flying fish (again) and the so-called "Pharoah's glider" which appears to have been a weathervane used on Egyptian ships.
It then goes on to claim that the Mahabharata contains a passage that begins:

"...(the weapon was) a single projectile
charged with all the power of the Universe.
An incandescent column of smoke and flame
As bright as the thousand suns rose in all its splendor...

As most longtime ATS members here will already know, that passage cannot be found anywhere in the Mahabharata -- no matter which translation you choose.

The flying fish and the weathervan have been discussed many times here before.

And anyway, none of the above predates the Egyptians, who (according to Plato) came 9,000 years after Atlantis sank.

Originally posted by Malfeitor
These next three links are official and placed in the order of relevence to the topic at hand. The first is simply an interactive "map" of sorts which details some of histories finer mysteries. The second details the "discovery of a lost continent" somewhere near Australia. The third, and my favorite, is about Japan's sunken pyramids, which by default must be at least 10,000 years old.

www.nationalgeographic.com...

This link outlines a handful of things that are still unknown in history. Nothing there dates far enough back to indicate anything at all about Atlantis or any Atlanten-like civilization in the depths of prehistory.

Originally posted by Malfeitor
news.bbc.co.uk...

This outlines the discovery of a sunken continent that went under around 20 million years ago:

Drilling by the Joides Resolution research vessel, which traverses the seas extracting samples from beneath the sea floor, suggests that the continent, about a third the size of present day Australia, sank from sight only 20 million years ago

Again, not pertinant, but interesting. Did you know there is more to this? The Indo-Australian plate has bobbed up and down several times over the last several hundred million years. To the northeast of Australia, the islands there (most of them) are the mountaintops of part of this plate that was also once above water.

The last sinking of these portions of this plate predate humans by so far that there could not possibly be any connection between them and Atlantis.

Originally posted by Malfeitor
news.nationalgeographic.com...

The only scientist studying this natural formation - the Professor Kimura that I'm sure your link mentions (I didn't read it - I've read it a million times before) has concluded that this formation sank beneath the waves around 2,000 years ago.

That's hardly 10,000 years old "by default." But even if it were that long ago, there's no evidence at all that there was any human involvement with this rock formation.

You can find links to Kimuras' statements right here at ATS. A thread about it was put up by a poster called cormac mac airt.

Byrd is one of the members that has completely debunked the ancient flight hypothesis (along with, ahem, myself!)

Originally posted by Malfeitor
If there are other reliable accounts of anomalous artifacts or structures, please enlighten me; I've simply grabbed what I could find before dinner.

No such reliable source exists. I already stated this demonstrable fact.

Harte

While I thank you for your input, I'm well aware that there isn't any conclusive or completely reliable source, hence my posting this thread. I'm looking to find information of which I don't already know. As to the first few links I posted, I felt they were relevant simply because they imply the existence of modern technologies in ancient times, which would suggest an advanced civilization which is presently unknown.
The next link was posted to demonstrate the complexity of some known civilizations which were unknown until the last few centuries; it follows, logically, that we may have missed more than a few dead societies.
The link concerning the sunken continent was simply posted because it was not something of which I knew, and I found it interesting.
The final link, concerning the monument, is more ambiguous. While many reputable scientists claim that it was formed naturally, and others (including the good Professor Kimura) believe it sank within the last few thousand years, there is evidence to suggest otherwise.
I'm well-aware that if it is a natural formation, it likely fell from the nearby cliffs due to erosion. Furthermore, it seems obvious that if it sank only two-thousand years ago, while still interesting, it is not relevant to the discussion at hand. However, other reputable scientists feel that it is in fact man-made, which brings complications to the theory that it is only two-thousand years old. If man-made, the area on which the "monument" stands has not been above sea-level since the end of the Ice Age, which places its age at approx. ten-thousand years, hence the reason I mentioned it in the first place.
I have no illusions about the matter; I'll not find the truth about the Sphinx, Atlantis, or even the sunken "monument" by posting on this web-site, or any other for that matter. But new information about these things is my interest; I hope you won't begrudge me that.
The last thing I will mention, as it is relevant, is that when I made my last post I was running a fairly high fever, so my judgement was, to say the least, less than average. I hope my future posts will be less swayed by medication.

Did anyone ever see that FOX special about about the great pyramid when they were sending the robot through that square hole in the rock? The one where the robot drilled through the stone and then came upon another stone?

There was also mention of the caves complex underground the Sphinx. Apparently they had just start digging out these tunnels.

Now--apparently there are tunnels and a "mysterious room" in the Pyramid. No info on it. One of my big problems with sites like these is when "evidence" is offered up on a subject that is not true. In a previous post someone highlighted that the mention of a "atomc" explosion in a old wirtting cannot actually be found anywhere in the text. Yet I have seen that specific stanze of the poem on several sites all claiming some kind of ancient atomic warfare. So..when we start sprinting with sicsors we run the risk of stabbing ourselves. I guess I'm going to have to fact check more than I would like on some of these posts. Which is what we should all be doing anyways!

But..I am curious about the Pyramids. For example..the sleeping prophet predicted the chamber of records for Atlanitis being discovered underneath the Sphinx. Now I realize according to a prior post it doesn't say underneath the sphinx sa much as it uses the Sphinx as a marker to the Hall of Records. Can someone tell me what the truth is here? I have heard mention that there is evidence of the chamber actually exisiting. Is this iron clad or more speculation turned "fact"

Common sense tells me that since we have always been facsinated with history that ancient cultures must have been as well. I think one of the hallmarks of an advanced civilization is the mark they attempt to stamp upon the earth "Kilroy was here," if you will. So I think that it is not a wild thought that there exists a "Hall of Records" for the ancient world. For upright humans to have existed possibly 400,000 uears ago seems like too long a tme to not have a possible highly advanced civilization.

Look at our country. One invention, even something as seemingly unimpressive as a Cotton Gin begins to change the world as we know it. Now, within a couple hundred years...we fly. Commonly. So.. with such a leap happening so quickly..hell look at the distance between now and the stone age...it seems irresponsible to assume nothing like us as come before. If life is cyclical...doesn't that mean everything else should follow the same path? After all...one cannot deny the importance of the circle in history no more than the triangle. Circle=Life. Triangle=religious beliefs (strong foundation tapering off to a point "higher existence"). Square/rectangle=foundation. Most buidlings based upon this.

Course I am getting a head of myself. I must say I love the skepticism of this site. It helps temper those who reach to believe anything!!

Originally posted by Malfeitor
...I felt they were relevant simply because they imply the existence of modern technologies in ancient times, which would suggest an advanced civilization which is presently unknown.

Actually, they're not "modern technologies." We can do far better than that, and with better accuracy.

So what's going on? What's happening is that much of the breathless goshwow stuff is being written by people who don't have much information on the cultures they're writing about. They're not aware that the ancient Egyptians had workshops that mass produced amulets, that Romans had water powered rock saws ... and so much more.

I've suspected their "knowledge" of "ancient civilizations" comes from the movies like "The Ten Commandments" (which is full of really great acting and costuming and is as accurate to the times and places as a carnival carousel is to riding a horse in an equestrian event.) I love those old movies but they're not history.

The next link was posted to demonstrate the complexity of some known civilizations which were unknown until the last few centuries; it follows, logically, that we may have missed more than a few dead societies.

That's mainly because the science of archaeology didn't actually begin until the mid 1800's. Before then, artifacts were "curios" and were looted and owned by the wealthy. Nobody actually studied them... they were just weird and neat collectibles.

Much of what we know about ancient civilizations (learned in the past 180 years) comes as a real surprise to anyone who isn't a historian/archaeologist/anthropologist/paleontologist. People don't read science news and don't go to the meetings, so you may not know about Catal Hyuk in Turkey or the antelope taming and raising in the Levant and so forth.

There's nothing wrong with not knowing about it, but there are a lot of people who turn these news stories into fantasy.

The link concerning the sunken continent was simply posted because it was not something of which I knew, and I found it interesting.

(smile) Now, if you were into roadside geology, you would know that lots of places have sunk. Here in Dallas, we were a sunken area, covered with ocean, as recently as 60 million years ago.

In south Texas, near the Rio Grande, the ocean had a number of volcanoes that poked up from its surface... you can still see them today, but they look like low flat hills unless you're into geology. In Big Bend, volcanos from that era pumped out ash and lava in a layer that's 2,000 feet thick.

The world is a wonderful place, but some folks take the wonder and fictionalize it rather than learning the more interesting bits of truth.

The final link, concerning the monument, is more ambiguous. While many reputable scientists claim that it was formed naturally, and others (including the good Professor Kimura) believe it sank within the last few thousand years, there is evidence to suggest otherwise.

Check around a bit... see if you can find the names of the "many reputable scientists" and what field they're in. It's one thing if the "reputable scientist" is an underwater archaeologist or geologist, and quite another if they're a generic "marine scientist" or "just plain scientist of unnamed specialization."

To play the fact-checking game, run their name on Google Scholar and see what papers they've written and with whom... and if (as in the case of Schoch and Yogiuni and the Bosnian pyramids) they changed their mind after examining the evidence.

edit


[edit on 14-11-2008 by IvanZana]

reply to post by Byrd


Finally, the sort of post I've been looking for. I didn't think anyone would notice that I spent five minutes googling random links.
Where to begin...with the obvious, I suppose. Its not as though I think I'll find the answer, but it doesn't hurt to think.
I happen to be a resident of Spring, which is only a few hours south of Dallas, and am aware of the fact that we were once underwater. On a geologic scale, we're a fairly new place, and everything that rises, sinks. That, however, plays partly into one of my admittedly vague and unsupported ideas; if mankind has somehow existed in a state which is near or equal to modern times, and were to magically be set back into the stone age, it would be feasible for most, if not all, of the evidence of such a society to vanish in time. The power of oceanic erosion over several thousands of years would have reduced such a society's buildings, artifacts, etc. to sand well before our archaelogists would have a chance to find them. Sadly, this argument renders its own point moot. Had I realized this sooner, I wouldn't have bothered with the thread; I avoid religious debates for the same reason. I don't enjoy debating things which can neither be proven nor disproven.
To what else you posted, its clear that you're not an idiot. I didn't know about antelope taming, as a matter of fact; as I'm not a history major, it was a bit suprising to learn, actually. I posted this thread to try and find something I didn't know concerning the sphinx, and thus far, tame antelope are the sum of my efforts. A sort of sad statement, but I suppose its better than nothing.

All hail Hawass!!!


Ok so if this thing is only 2500 yrs old, what explains the fact of water erosion on the body of the spynx, which it is well known and documented that it has not rained on the plains of Giza for over 10,000 + years?????


All hail Hawass!!!!!


Cheers!!!!