Is not voting worse than voting?

I had a long arguement with these guys about this.

I feel that no matter who is in office, that they are on the same side and none of the real issues will be addressed.

If someone good gets into office and starts making change, hes assassinated.

If you vote one president in, they rig the election and the other guy gets in.

So It seems that if you vote or not, your screwed.

THey feel that you have to step up to the plate and make your vote count, and try to chip away at the system. They feel that they still have power, with thier votes somehow, and if all the liberals just got out and voted we could really make a change, but weve been tricked into thinking we have no power to change it becuase the system is so corrupt.


Whats your take?

Issues are addressed, but inadequately. Inadequately because the special interests won't allow any issue to be dealt with until theirs is, and thus causes all effort to rectify problems to be spread to thinly to be effective, especially in the length of a 4 year cycle.

Assasinations don't happen that often to be a factor.

Election rigging doesn't happen often enough to be considered a factor, and when it does happen, it seems that the other guy would have been just as miserable a failure as the cheater.

Vote, don't vote, you're right - it doesn't matter. So rather than feeling so 'screwed' about the current situation, you can leave and go to one of those 'better' countries who have a more 'representative' government. And where your standard of living will be 'higher' than it is here.

There is a reason America is the way it is, and to many people's surprise, it is not because we are crooked and take all the freedom away from the rest of the world to horde it for ourselves. It is because this system works better than any other has to this point.

The reason why it isn't working so famously right now is because people are beginning to NOT VOTE! You always see the Republicans lining up to vote from age 18 to 80.

But these damn liberal, progressive, tree huggers with the 'free spirit' mentality of "I don't need to be led by oil swilling, money grubbing, cowboy hat wearing, election loaders, and for that matter, I don't need to be led by anyone because I am a 'free spirit' and that means I don't have to vote", or "the government is screwing everything up so I'm not going to identify myself with it and drop out of the system and I'm not going to vote" is exactly what will lead this country to internal corruption.

If you don't make your voice heard, no one is going to come knock on your door and ask your opinion. If you think something is screwed up, do something about it. Don't say, "well, I'm screwed either way" (which is probably an accurate statement, if you make it of yourself), or "that's why I don't vote, because it doesn't matter". If YOU don't vote YOU don't matter, and no one is going to listen to you when you complain about how 'screwed up' things are.

Shut up and vote, or don't vote and shut up!

DeltaChaos

[Edited on 27-3-2004 by DeltaChaos]

This is just a bump, but I want some feedback on this subject.

This one is different from the other 842 I've seen.

DC

The less people that vote, means the decision is based on 'segments' of the voting public only.

If the poor and low-middle wage americans are complacent due to not caring, frustrations, lack of sight in the power of the individual vote, the feeling that the vote doesnt count, or the feeling of their being manipulated in a decision,...


Then the segment is cast out of the power group, and the lesser-numbered upper-middle class on up, make all the decisions.


The feeling that you cant make an educated decision or not following candidates close enough ??

Doesnt matter to me,...I vote my mind, and I vote.

It is always interesting to me that the age groups represented are predictable.

The young,...rarely vote.
What a shame, it is their future they are letting a bunch of ol fogies decide. The future lies in the young minds, yet they are too busy partying to care.

The middle age/young families, vote in average numbers.
Their thoughts are for their childrens future, and will have a different frame of mind.

The older/old. The vote. Their votes are more insightful, and yet more party affiliated.


I just say,....

VOTE !

Young People ...UNITE & VOTE !!

..

Originally posted by smirkley
The young,...rarely vote.
What a shame, it is their future they are letting a bunch of ol fogies decide. The future lies in the young minds, yet they are too busy partying to care.

And yet they are the most vocal proponents of the proposition that 'Old White Men run the country"!




Thanks for the input, Smirk. This is an important subject that needs to be addressed in this manner as much as possible, especially right now.

DC

The problem is, is that the distraction (i.e. entertainment/sports) has taken up such a huge portion of people's lives that they could care less about what is happening.

Most people take the media on face value, yet another problem.

Young people are of the mentality (since they have never had to fight for anything really) that nothing can change and so they don't bother.

If even 80% of people voted things would change in this country.

I also wanted to add that any woman or minority who does not vote shames the honor of those who fought to give them the right to.

It's a shame that they take what was given in blood for granted and do not use it.

[Edited on 27-3-2004 by KrazyJethro]

Originally posted by KrazyJethro
The problem is, is that the distraction (i.e. entertainment/sports) has taken up such a huge portion of people's lives that they could care less about what is happening.

I agree 100% with this. Television creates apathy to all issues of import. Unless, of course, you're addicted to C-SPAN, like me.

DC

If you chose not to vote then you have voluntarily given up your voting priviledge, which I beleive should be a crime.

IF YOU DO NOT VOTE YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO COMPLAIN OR GLOAT!!!!

We discussed this in another thread but I beleive strongly that every eligible American should vote!!!

All our votes matter regardless of where you chose to place that vote, it has an affect and it does matter!!!

If the conservatives had thier way they'd reserve the vote for only the rich-land-owning-white-males, just as it once was.

According the last cencus if all eligible American were registered to vote (citizens over 18 yrs old) the republicans would never win another election.

Per the cencus 0ver 73% of Americans consider themselves to be democrat/progressives and would vote accordingly.

Register!!!

VOTE!!!!!

Make a difference for all Americans!!!!!!

Take back America for Americans!!!!!!

Stop the bushonian corporate piracy of America!!!!!

Originally posted by Scolecite
If you vote one president in, they rig the election and the other guy gets in.

tell me about it.

do you know why we still have the electoral college? i don't understand it at all/

Not voting is obviously worse than voting, because for every vote, regardless of who the vote is for, the less votes there are, the more powerful each other vote becomes.

in the uk at the moment, there are regularly about 30 labour MPs who 'abstain' from votes because they do not believe in blairite policy but refuse to vote against their own policy.

so when my elected representatives neglect their democratic duty it is a 'matter of conscience', but when the public do likewise, it is due to 'voter apathy'. why is that?

but to answer your question, i think everyone should process a voting slip in some from. by that i mean either vote for your favoured candidate or scribble all over the sheet. there is a potent moral difference between doing that and doing nothing at all.

I firmly belive the reason there is such a problem is because people tend not to vote in large numbers except for a presidential election. Our senators and our representatives on the federal and state level are the ones who pass and make most of the laws and bills in this country.

The majority of people will vote for president and no one else. Each level of government is important to vote for even your city elections because these people will eventually be your govenors and and senators and presidential cantidates.

The problem is not voting on the small level and up. People expect the president to fix everything. I dislike bush greatly, and definatly will be voting against him. But I will also dislike a person in a local election just as much and speak out for who I like. These non presidental cantidates are the ones who make the laws that most effect your life. So go vote in every election you possibly can if you want to make a difference.