Does Obama know the definition of "small business?"

ive watched all of the debates now and one of mccains main points against the obama tax plan is that he is going to be raising taxes on small businesses. obama says that this is not the case because most small businesses dont make 250,000/yr. The definition varies per industry but it is generally accepted that it is a business with 100 or few employees. Now, I dont have any facts to back this up, but common sense will tell you that millions of businesses have less than 100 employees in the USA. If you own a company with 100 employees, Im pretty sure your company earns 250.000/yr. If your company only has 25 employees, there is still a good chance that you earn over 250,000/yr. It seems to me that McCains concerns over this tax plan are legit. I dont really like either candidate so im not just hating on obama, mccain taxing healthplans scares me too. if taxes are raised on small businesses, it means less jobs, or those higher prices are passed on to the customer.

Is there something im missing about obamas plan or something that im not understanding?

Please explain what the "earnings" are, according to you.

(I mean it seriously, my accounting skills are a little rusty)

Originally posted by buddhasystem
Please explain what the "earnings" are, according to you.

(I mean it seriously, my accounting skills are a little rusty)

Good point...

I belive Obama when saying 250k is refering to total INCOME.
Not profits.
So, as a head of a buisness, if your compay makes over 250k, BEFORE buisness expenses, then you are going to be subject to the uber-Tax..

i could be wroung...

to be honest with you, i dont know the answer. that is something that obama has not enlightened us with.

Simple..

Obama's tax plan will increase taxes on business with gross profits in excess of 250K..

Think of it this way..

If you own a small business, have 10 employees and pay them almost poverty wages of 25K each per year...

If you make less than 250K you wont be in business long now will you?

His tax plan will impact business with as few as 2 or 3 employees...

It will also increase the base personal tax of a single individual making 42K or more per year...

Think before you vote

Semper

Originally posted by semperfortis


It will also increase the base personal tax of a single individual making 42K or more per year...

Think before you vote

Semper

do you have any links to this info. i would love to read up on this and find out just how bad his plan is.

also if the above poster is correct, how many businesses in the nation have a range of 10 to 100 employees? if you think his plan wont effect small businesses your wrong. (in my opinion that is!)

My business produces about $500,000.00 in income annually. It is also an SP (Sole Proprietorship). I employ around 5 to 7 people.

Being an SP means that my pay is what's left after expenses. Any and all improvements or expansion are paid for out of my personal income. His tax plan will cause me to reduce my workers by one or two individuals. The remaining workers will have to do more in a normal day to take up the slack and I will have to at my advanced age work more hours myself, as will my Wife.

Businesses like mine employ more people than corporations do. We create most of the new jobs. Any new taxes will reduce the number of new jobs and hurt people like me.

He wants to take the fruits of my lifetime of hard work and give it to people who dropped out of school or partied their butts off while I worked. Since he released details, I have turned completely against him.

Originally posted by semperfortis
Simple..

Obama's tax plan will increase taxes on business with gross profits in excess of 250K..

So its only on profit?

Would this law not then give incentive for Small business to lie/cheat/steal to get under the limit of 250K profit...

Say a small buisnes made 300k... couldnt the business owner just give himself or another family member a rasie, and lower his profit under the threshhold...

Wont this create more and more problems???

Here is a good run down..

Politico

Google will yield many results as well, just read as many as you can to get a clear picture...

Most will "lean" either right or left as you may imagine, so read several to get to the truth...

The one above simplifies it a lot, but is pretty concise..

Semper

reply to post by TKainZero


Remember that "Gross" profits is all the money made prior to operating expenses...

"Net" profit is what the owner may expect to recoup at the end of the cycle..

Semper

this is what scares me about america these days. nobody bothers to do any research anymore for themselves (except us on ats). all people here is " im going to lower taxes for 95% of americans," and they believe it.

just look at how high food prices have gone up because of the higher expenses companies had to pay due to rising fuel or corn (due to ethonal production) prices. its the exact same as taxes. it will just be another expense passed on to the consumer.

reply to post by Blaine91555


Dear Blaine,

for all my disagreement with you in the past, I'm thankful for your comments.

Pray tell what is defined as income? Is this before you pay salaries?

regards,
Buddha

Originally posted by TKainZero

So its only on profit?

Remember, for SP's that means no money to expand or hire new people because they want to give it to other people who did not earn it.

Next year out of that profit, I have to replace all my computers and update software and its time for carpeting and new furniture. I'll be lucky to realize an income over the poverty line if they taxes go through. I will make less than my lowest paid employee who gets $38,000. On top of that he wants to mandate Health Insurance which would bankrupt me and then everyone gets laid off permanently.

It's almost 8:30 PM here and I've been at it since 9 AM, a normal day for a small business owner, so I'm heading home if the phone quits ringing. My Wife is looking a little tired also. We have been working like slaves for 20 years on this business and any day a politician will take it away. So much for the American Dream and hello Socialism and money for the lazy asses who party all day. Hurrah!

Originally posted by Blaine91555
It's almost 8:30 PM here and I've been at it since 9 AM, a normal day for a small business owner, so I'm heading home if the phone quits ringing

Blaine, from the timestamp you would appear stationed outside of the 48 US states, care to comment on that? Is that Hawaii?

They have mis-defined "rich" by confusing a flow (income) with a stock (real net assets), and thus come to the wrong conclusion. They want to tax those (who make more than $250,000 a year) who are trying to become rich, while preserving the status for those who already have wealth.

source


Very interesting article.

Obama could give people reason not to be doctors, lawyers, and engineers. Why spend all that money, time, and effort to become successful only to be punished for it.

McCain wants to create a brand new tax to hurt an already screwed up health care system. We're not going to get lower taxes overall. There will be new or higher taxes for someone, somewhere, somehow. If it isn't businesses, then it's health insurance or something else.

Its pretty clear that it will only affect a small number of small businesses and is only repealing a Bush tax cut that was probably unwarrented in the first place. Furthermore they get a $500 Tax credit. Finally, its a climbing scale where increases are the greatest for the very rich a 5-13% jump in taxes. It sucks to may more taxes but we need to jump start the economy by reviving our infrastructure a la FDR's New Deal. No nead to panic.

Obama says he would hike several taxes on people making more than $250,000, including the amount they pay on capital gains. Currently, the top income tax rate is 35 percent. Under Obama, that would go back up to 39 percent. Obama's staff told the Urban-Brookings Tax Policy Center he would raise the rates for people in the top two brackets -- about 2.5 million filers out of 100 million-plus. People in those high tax brackets would see the tax rate on their capital gains hiked from the current 15 percent to 20-28 percent.

Chicago Sun Times 6/30/2008

That tax increase — or repeal of Bush tax cuts, depending upon one's perspective — would affect a portion of small businesses because many small business owners pay their taxes through personal income tax. The Bush tax cuts are scheduled to expire by 2011. Obama has said he would let them run out for people in the top two brackets, while giving new tax cuts to people making less.

politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...

TexProvide Tax Relief for Small Businesses and Start Up Companies: Barack Obama and Joe Biden will eliminate all capital gains taxes on start-up and small businesses to encourage innovation and job creation. Obama and Biden will also support small business owners by providing a $500 “Making Work Pay” tax credit to almost every worker in America. Self-employed small business owners pay both the employee and the employer side of the payroll tax, and this measure will reduce the burdens of this double taxation

www.barackobama.com...

reply to post by Blaine91555

OK, first, you are taxed on PROFITS, not income. PROFITS are what's left over after expenses -- including payroll. Second, if your business is clearing more than a quarter of a million dollars after payroll, expenses, and other deductions, then you should incorporate anyhow -- and then you won't be susceptible to changes in individual tax rates, because you'll be paying at the corporate rate.

Originally posted by tdubz
ive watched all of the debates now and one of mccains main points against the obama tax plan is that he is going to be raising taxes on small businesses. obama says that this is not the case because most small businesses dont make 250,000/yr. The definition varies per industry but it is generally accepted that it is a business with 100 or few employees. Now, I dont have any facts to back this up, but common sense will tell you that millions of businesses have less than 100 employees in the USA. If you own a company with 100 employees, I'm pretty sure your company earns 250.000/yr. If your company only has 25 employees, there is still a good chance that you earn over 250,000/yr.

Interesting I'd love to see some links to definitions and statistics!

Also here in Santa Fe New Mexico we instituted a Living Wage. SMALL BUSINESSES were exempt from having to pay it if they so choose. By definition a small business was any business UNDER 25 employees.

That is the only FACT I can share but I wait eagerly for you to show us that a small business can have up to 100 employees.

snip!

[edit on 16-10-2008 by Animal]