why unifying people for good ultimately fails

the strategy of the entities that embody our worst traits has typically always been a step ahead of our conscious strategies to combat them

unifying people for good and positive change fails

this is because the strategy of the entities is to attack the individual...to make the individual's "interface" with the group flawed in such a way that as a group, our worst traits are more exploitable than our best traits

this fundamental flawing comes from the very survival drive that has ensured our perceived dominance over most natural forces on this planet, and is therefore seemingly inescapable

the solution, however, is not to unify for positive change to attack the problems, but to overcome our egos and explore ourselves introspectively, with guidance, to correct those fundamental flaws, and patch with humility those flaws that we do not understand

i implore you to seek out a teacher. and if a teacher is not readily available, alter your perception so that everyone becomes a teacher by the choices they make

the change that is necessary will not and cannot come from the momentum of a collective, but from each individual acting in harmony with purity and humility

teach me, and let me teach you

[edit on 26-9-2008 by 8I756BLE]

Originally posted by 8I756BLE
the strategy of the entities that embody our worst traits has typically always been a step ahead of our conscious strategies to combat them

unifying people for good and positive change fails

this is because the strategy of the entities is to attack the individual...to make the individual's "interface" with the group flawed in such a way that as a group, our worst traits are more exploitable than our best traits

this fundamental flawing comes from the very survival drive that has ensured our perceived dominance over most natural forces on this planet, and is therefore seemingly inescapable

the solution, however, is not to unify for positive change to attack the problems, but to overcome our egos and explore ourselves introspectively, with guidance, to correct those fundamental flaws, and patch with humility those flaws that we do not understand

i implore you to seek out a teacher. and if a teacher is not readily available, alter your perception so that everyone becomes a teacher by the choices they make

the change that is necessary will not and cannot come from the momentum of a collective, but from each individual acting in harmony with purity and humility

teach me, and let me teach you

[edit on 26-9-2008 by 8I756BLE]

In order to advance this discussion at all, you have to at least define what it is you're talking about.

What is "positive change"?

You're saying group mentality destroys individual expression, and that in essence destroys the only change that is worth pursuing. Am I correct?

When applying this seemingly evolutionary mechanism for group survival (which entails the elimination of unpopular ideas) to a political system as complex as Western representative Democracy, which you believe is supposed to represent the beliefs of dedicated individuals, a dichotomy clearly emerges.

I see where you are going with this, but you can't dismiss the fact that collective policy is essential in the development of a strong group dynamic.

Honestly, I can't really say I agree with you.

The Department of Defense wages war on some foreign nation, for example. Do you believe that because every individual in the state has yet to think deeply about this issue, that it shouldn't be done in the best interest of the group as a whole? Any dissent for war in that example is a prime example of selfish individuals ruining the safety and security that the collective group has worked so hard to achieve. That's why the leadership is so often extremely brutal in their methods for putting down sedition.

That's where this whole issue of government vs. citizen comes in. Collective group dynamics work to establish safety and security, while citizens acting as individuals provide a changing and constantly evolving internal dynamic, and through this force we achieve necessary change.

New politicians keep things fresh. Old executives keep things safe.

Amendments are added as time changes in accordance to the relevance of those items on the Constitution, which serves as a guiding light for our group goals.

[edit on 26-9-2008 by cognoscente]

What he is talking about is putting the community ahead of the individual. It is in fact a failed system. All communities are made because of a group of individuals living around each other. When you put the community ahead of the individual, you erode the base of the community, and it is only a matter of time before the community crumbles.

The bigger the community, the less individualism you are allowed. And the more you base will be eroded away.

But obviously in a society you need a balance. We have national defense because it is something we all need. We come together to defend each other. But what is our problem today? We have put the "nation" in front of the citizens. Where instead of having a government that serves the people, we have become citizens who must serve the government. The government is the biggest employers in this nation and it keeps getting bigger.

In the process, rather than defending the important things this country was founded on, we have put all the importance on the flag/nation.

We have put symbolism and image worship ahead of principles, morals and values. And the principles, morals and values this country was founded on was about liberty and individual rights.

And it's not just in government that it's happened, religion has done the same thing and has for a long time. You have good principles etc in the words of Jesus, and then people of power use the symbolism to lead the people against those principles. This is to worship a false idol.

And woe to you if you should happen to try and stand up for these things. Don't even think about trying to tell people Jesus would not be in favor of these wars. Don't even think about trying to tell people the constitution doesn't allow it. But feel free to praise the images. Feel free to pass your power and worship to those images. There is no problem with that.

And of course people are deceived. Half the truth is often the biggest lie. And what do we get from the 2 party system? They both want exactly what the others don't. 1 wants economic freedom and social crimes regulated. The other wants econmics regulated, and social crimes unregulated. And what do people vote on? They vote on either the economic freedom, or they vote for the social freedom, and point out the bad government the other wants to pass.

But they all get passed. All the government the republicans want eventually gets passed, and all the government the democrats want eventually get passed. But the freedom side of the either is trampled each time. Which puts people in more dire to get the other side elected. What do you get when you combine the government each sides wants, total authoritarian government and control. Red Team, Blue team - SAME GAME.

As the OP said, to correct these flaws we have to learn what our mistakes have been. Part of being a free people is sticking up for the other guys freedom too. Rather than looking for a way to control their behavior because it's different, or they look different. That would be to let down the ego, and respect other people who are not like your ego as equals. Humility because you are not putting yourself above them.