4th Dimension film

reply to post by ElectroMagnetic Multivers


I don't know the exact post, but I recall reading, in amongst others of LOVE's rantings and ravings, that (in summary), no, other dimensions do not exist, and that to believe otherwise is flagrant disregard for his obviously superior intellect. (sarcasm intended)

Originally posted by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal
reply to post by buds84

 

No such thing as 4d.

That's all I have to say.

Everything you see and touch is in 4D. Otherwise time would be standing still for you. Your world exists in three spacial dimensions and one of time. In reality, there is no such thing as 2D and 3D.

[edit on 25/9/08 by Myrdyn]

I challenge every single one of you to go create an object that has only width and height.

Having a play on the 3 dimensions and attempting to bend them into others is really making an illusional parody of physics and material reality.

[edit on 25-9-2008 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

1 dimensional forms exist, but we can't percieve them, 2 dimensional forms exist, but we can't percieve them, 3 dimensional forms exist and they can be percieved, as we are 3 dimensional in form. WE CANNOT CREATE A 2 DIMENSIONAL FORM IN A 3 DIMENSIONAL PLANE (just been corrected, as someone further down points out, a shadow is a 2D object, in a 3D plane.), he understands this and is using it as 'proof' for his theory.

From current physics, M theory, Brane theory etc, it's 12 dimensions, if memory serves me correctly.

This is pointless I'm on ignore, but hey.

EMM

[edit on 25-9-2008 by ElectroMagnetic Multivers]

[edit on 25-9-2008 by ElectroMagnetic Multivers]

That one guy you call rude is right, but for you 4th dimensioners out there I think I know why you believe he is wrong. These additional dimensions only "exist" as thoughts, ideas and secrets and have not manifested themselves in "reality", but you still think you have hope.

Even if the events occur that you are expecting you won't be in a different reality, but the same reality experienced differently.

I'd been troubled by the reports of Gog/Magog and Planet X until I realized that these aren't extradimensional beings or a Planet on a 3600 years orbit around the Sun on a crash course with Earth, but concepts connected to events that occur in this world when the subjective reality of a liar is successfully imposed on the Earth.

Gog/Magog are just all of these people gone on murderous rampages and Planet X is the alternate reality they operate in, but as it is now, it is only a thought/idea; which doesn't meet the definition of "existing" by mathematical or physical standards.

And since the conditions that require them to appear cannot be achieved in the time constraints, it will never be. So the rude guy is just trying to help you, so that you avoid the mental health facilities. These additional dimensions have been destroyed, by this I mean that the idea has been destroyed; thus they don't exist and never can.

For the 4th dimensioners you are not crazy for believing in alternate realities, but a fool for believing in alternate realities.

reply to post by PontiacWarrior


i like the way you 'see'.

anyway, light itself is not strictly 2D(although it could be said that it is has a (2D) magnetic wave traveling perpendicular to an (2D) electric wave) BUT the IMAGE itself only has two planes. they may be 'recorded' on a 3D piece of paper with 3D particles changing colour, but the IMAGE itself is strictly two dimensional. the light that strikes the plate has only two dimensions.

Originally posted by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal
An axis on which an object rotates, thus moves, ergo giving the perception of "time" is not another "dimension", it's more accurately a point of reference.

But that's really a very elementary way of looking at it. That's only mathematical and doesn't deal with the physical reality of why the plane is actually moving (it only gives an axis that has no attributes), which is because of forces, either a combustion engine or a contracting of muscles, which exerts and consumes energy.

Don't confuse the word dimension (height, width, depth) with point of reference.

nothing stands still.
when an object "rotates", it is already submerged in a matrix of space/time. there is no "center" to rotate around, because the center itself is rotating around something else, and that center around yet another thing, ad infinitum. and, the "perception of time" is NOT "time". there is no proof that time flows in only one direction. the past still exists. when we see the light from a star, it can be thousands of years old. so, in "our time" the star is plain to see, yet, in "real time" the star no longer exists, so because information is energy, and energy can neither be created nor destroyed, the object is existing in two places at once.
(infinite really, but for observer and observed, two points at once)
non-locality shows that space's effects can be negated, and time can be "bypassed".

you WANT to believe in absolutes, but the only absolute is nothing and, frankly, it doesn't exist.

a photographic image has only width and height. the MATERIAL that it has been projected onto has depth, too, but the image itself is only 2D.

anyway, that is not the point.

thinking LOWER dimensions are not "possible", or "do not exist" does not 'prove' that three dimensions is not the "planck length" of dimensions, ie. the smallest "particle", the "base unit" of dimensions.

once again, point of reference is YOUR point of reference, and the only point of reference you have besides your THOUGHTS which can explore beyond perception. if you let them, that is.

Originally posted by bruxfain
That one guy you call rude is right, but for you 4th dimensioners out there I think I know why you believe he is wrong. These additional dimensions only "exist" as thoughts, ideas and secrets and have not manifested themselves in "reality", but you still think you have hope.

People have an idea about a 4th dimension, as it hasn't been proved yet, doesn't mean it won't be proven. If he is trying to help then he is doing a piss poor job. An understanding that people need to reach thei rown conclusions, is merely a basic grasp of social interaction. As I have said, he has good points, but he rams them down peoples throats and if challenged, deems them foolish, idiotic or crazy, how does this help anyone but his ego? Imagine a teacher laughing at his students for wrong answers!

Even if the events occur that you are expecting you won't be in a different reality, but the same reality experienced differently.

Very true, I see it as gaining a 'greater' overview of our reality, being able to percieve things, that until now have been concepts.

I'd been troubled by the reports of Gog/Magog and Planet X until I realized that these aren't extradimensional beings or a Planet on a 3600 years orbit around the Sun on a crash course with Earth, but concepts connected to events that occur in this world when the subjective reality of a liar is successfully imposed on the Earth.

A lie can only be judged by its truth, we don't know the truth, therefore we certainly don't know lies, any to claim to have 'absolute truth' is lying, I feel proud in saying God himself doesn't have all the answers, but he'll have some pretty good guesses.

Gog/Magog are just all of these people gone on murderous rampages and Planet X is the alternate reality they operate in, but as it is now, it is only a thought/idea; which doesn't meet the definition of "existing" by mathematical or physical standards.

As you said, it isn't an alternate reality, it is a shift in our current perception of our current reality, not a trip to another. People to believe in the existence of aliens, planet X, hollow earth etc, etc, they don't live in their own reality, they just have a different view of the one you see. Because we haven't deemed it to exist, doesn't mean it doesn't exist, to quote L.O.V.E:

"A truth is a truth, whether everyone believes it, or no one."

And since the conditions that require them to appear cannot be achieved in the time constraints, it will never be. So the rude guy is just trying to help you, so that you avoid the mental health facilities. These additional dimensions have been destroyed, by this I mean that the idea has been destroyed; thus they don't exist and never can.

What do you mean time constraints? If he was trying to help, he would be polite and patient with people, as he said, to him the non existence of 4D is 'commen knowledge', totally egocentric. I like alot of his ideas, and I agree with some of them, but he is rude, aggresive and dogmatic in his beliefs.

For the 4th dimensioners you are not crazy for believing in alternate realities, but a fool for believing in alternate realities.

Judging people by their beliefs? come on people, I thought we had moved past this years ago? or was that only applicable to 'religion'.

While we're at it, I think your a fool. I am not biased to beliefs.

EMM

[edit on 25-9-2008 by ElectroMagnetic Multivers]

Originally posted by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal
I don't attempt to explain things beyond what can be known, that's foolish.

HAHAHA LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal... thank you for explaining your close mindedness...

So I guess everything we know today is all we are going to know ever...

thank god we can rest.

no more discoveries to be made here people!

If we had more people like you the world would still be be flat and the sun would revolve around us... I miss those days.

Originally posted by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal
I challenge every single one of you to go create an object that has only width and height.

easy, although the "things" won't be "objects"(a 3D concept), but rather "images".

like, a movie or a shadow. a shadow or projected image is STRICTLY 2D, unless you have some evidence that photons are 3D. the shadow, or the movie ARE real objects, because they contain information, and information IS energy. something must "move" for the nothingness to become "something".

Originally posted by ElectroMagnetic Multivers

Originally posted by bruxfain
That one guy you call rude is right, but for you 4th dimensioners out there I think I know why you believe he is wrong. These additional dimensions only "exist" as thoughts, ideas and secrets and have not manifested themselves in "reality", but you still think you have hope.

[quotw]Even if the events occur that you are expecting you won't be in a different reality, but the same reality experienced differently.

I'd been troubled by the reports of Gog/Magog and Planet X until I realized that these aren't extradimensional beings or a Planet on a 3600 years orbit around the Sun on a crash course with Earth, but concepts connected to events that occur in this world when the subjective reality of a liar is successfully imposed on the Earth.

Gog/Magog are just all of these people gone on murderous rampages and Planet X is the alternate reality they operate in, but as it is now, it is only a thought/idea; which doesn't meet the definition of "existing" by mathematical or physical standards.

And since the conditions that require them to appear cannot be achieved in the time constraints, it will never be. So the rude guy is just trying to help you, so that you avoid the mental health facilities. These additional dimensions have been destroyed, by this I mean that the idea has been destroyed; thus they don't exist and never can.

For the 4th dimensioners you are not crazy for believing in alternate realities, but a fool for believing in alternate realities.

EMM

From reading ancient stories and hearsay, I would say that the most interesting event to allegedly occur in human history was the Sun rising in the West. I'd read about it years ago, but didn't begin to understand it until recently and still haven't come to a hard conclusion regarding the event confirmed as occuring in multiple traditions across the ancient world.

When I say idea, I mean that in your mind you may have a belief which contradicts objective reality. For example you may have a fantasy of being married to your best friends wife, living in his house and working at his job. This fantasy is an alternate reality, which doesn't exist, except in your mind.

With a few well placed lies, a murder and a cover-up, you could "prove" that it is real and true. Tada, your alternate reality exists. In the real world, not academia, this is often how things are "proven".

On this alternate timeline you may even prepare a contrived history, complete with photographs and videos for evidence.

Alternate realities are subjective and only really exist and best kept within the mind, that's probably why they are generally called lies, as they don't hold up to objective analysis and eventually your subjective reality will be destroyed and possibly you with it.

Your assertions regarding forth dimensions are analogous to my example.

The sun rising in the west, happened as a result of the biggest, most successful lie ever told, which was the product of the greatest liar ever born. The mind of humanity was pulled inside out and the world was destroyed. This person wanted to be God and concocted a plan to achieve her objective. Her plot hatched and Gog/Magog were released. The belief in alternate realities was born. But I assure you, its a lie.

So I don't call you a fool to hurt your feelings, but to prevent you from ending up like so many lone gunmen and other self destructive souls that have drank the from her cup of madness.

As far as time constraints, once your alternate reality is exposed and people begin to work against it, the countdown begins, as it will expire. The falsehood in this world will expire on 10/13/2008 according to my calculations, that's why everyone who knows is trying to find a way out.

I may have left the topic of conversation, but I enjoy taking every opportunity to taunt the people who believe in alternate realities because of the sorrow they bring into the world.

[edit on 25-9-2008 by bruxfain]

[edit on 25-9-2008 by bruxfain]

We are really playing in LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal's game. In this reality ( and that's why is called THIS reality) 3 CANNOT BE WITHOUT 1 OR 2, therefor 1 must exist for 3 to exist. But since we live in a 3D reality we can't understand a 4d reality.

Is air 3d? or the wave of a broadcasting 3d? Is sound 3d? and we all know they all exist. In order to view a reality you have to tune to that reality, that's why you can't tune to 4 different channels at the same time; even when you are having interference in the TV or radio, 1 wave take over the other for a split second.

Does 2d exist? yes. Is it observable? yes. Is it mensurable? Yes. But since we live in a 3d world, we need 3d perspective as point of reference. So you ask show me a 2d object? Then I tell you, a 2d object wouldn't be an object anymore. A 2d object would be a drawing or painting, but we need a 3d point of reference.

A deaf person can't hear anything but that doesn't mean that sound doesn't exist; and the same goes for a blind person.
5 people in a room. One of them sees something that the other 4 don't, so we call that person schizophrenic or hallucinating. But what if it was the other way around, where the 4 people see something in the room but one doesn't?

NOTHING is absolute in life, not even what I am saying. If LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal would say that according to his studies he believes 99.99% that other dimension don't exist, I would respect his opinion. but there is always that 1% that one could be wrong.

It's like me saying that I don't believe in God because, for whatever reason, it doesn't make any sense and I'm positive that he doesn't exist BUT I could be wrong. There could be 1% of a possibility that he could exist. That is being open minded. after all, what are the possibilities of some one being struck by lighting twice, let along 7?

This reality is a perception of our senses tuned to this reality.
How do you think that a color blind person would perceive a colorful painting?

Does other realities/dimensions exist? maybe. Can I prove them? maybe, but we have to keep in mind that something that exist in a 4d doesn't have to look like anything in a 3d. A 4d could be staring us right at the face but we can't perceive it.

So, what would 4d,5d,6d world look like? Here is my answer: can a man live/breath under water without any kind of equipment? Maybe, but what do we call, and how do they look, the living things that do live/breath under water?...so, stop looking for fire in water because when you find it you would call it lava.

[edit on 9/9/2008 by thegrayone]

Originally posted by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal
If it's unknown then it's absolutely unknown.

There are 3 dimensions, height width and depth.

When I studied Geology, we had to look at four-dimensional maps; the fourth dimension being time.

I haven't looked at the 'movies' yet so I can't say anything more on topic than that!

4th dimension is most closley related to what we call "time"

"time" is of course a label to something that really has no meaning in this this dimension.

Time is merely the boundry of our reality...just like the 3D boundry of 2nd dimension and so on and so forth.

If you were a being living in 2D...the idea of being able to observe or interact in 3D would be impossible...let alone control it.

reply to post by billybob


Yes, actually there are absolutes, like right now the Earth is absolutely the concept defined of and as spherical and it always will be that way until it is destroyed or collides with another object etc. But either way that's the absolute of the objective moment and it can't be argued to be otherwise, it's not a subjective debate it's an objective truth.

If nothing is absolute, then that is also one absolute. It's absolute that nothing will ever be absolute, thus it is a contradiction but simultaneously the truth nonetheless.

About the point of rotation and movement; that's exactly what I was explaining. Everything is already 3d and interacting with itself. That's why we call it a POINT OF REFERENCE, because it's a point that we are referencing, and on that point, yes it is possible for things to rotate, however, it also true that the point of reference itself is also moving.

reply to post by bruxfain


That's exactly what I'm doing. Your post is the brightest here. I wonder why some of us are inherently genius and others just want to argue about who is better.

This is not about me, it's about your reality. If you feel threatened then take it up with the 3 dimensions, physics and material reality, not me.

[edit on 25-9-2008 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

Originally posted by buds84

Originally posted by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal
reply to post by buds84

Right when you rudely started trolling the thread and ruining it for people trying to have an educated discussion.

In my opinion he/she never rudely trolled your thread as you put , they are simply putting their opinion across , this is called discussion and whether you like it or not people can always disagree with what you say...

Oh and no, time is not a dimension.

Basic physics: space and time are one and the same. Time is the measure of movement in space and space is the movement of measure in time.

I'll state it one last time and then you're on your own. And remember, it's reality, not my opinion.

Time is not a dimension, rather it is the 3 dimensions (just like space because time and space are one) interacting with each other through forces that cause one another to act and react to each other, therefore causing change and movement. What we measure of this we call time. Look at a clock, its hands tick, why? Quite simply, it's being supplied by energy (a force) causing it to move. We use this movement to measure what we call "time". Time is not a dimensions, just a measurement of the motion of 3d reality based on a system that we have created and has evolved into seconds, hours, days, etc.

Time is not something taking place outside of space. It is space taking place.

Time is not something happening outside of space; it is space happening. And it is us measuring the duration of those happenings through a system we have devised based on the duration of happen (seconds, minutes, etc.).

[edit on 25-9-2008 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

Originally posted by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal
reply to post by bruxfain

 

That's exactly what I'm doing. Your post is the brightest here. I wonder why some of us are inherently genius and others just want to argue about who is better.

What did I say about projection? First person to agree with him and he classes him as 'inherently geniius' [sigh]

This is not about me, it's about your reality. If you feel threatened then take it up with the 3 dimensions, physics and material reality, not me.

[edit on 25-9-2008 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

This is about pushing your reality on other people from what I have seen. People came for a discussion, and you give them absolutes, truths and facts, when, in all fairness, you have no ability to give anything other than your opinion. I respect your opinion and you have great ideas, but you are insanely arrogant and it pisses me off to know end.

EMM

reply to post by Odessy


Actually no. What we have today is the foundation for everything that can be made and discovered.

Like I said, and I'm still waiting. Please bring me a 1d, 2d, or 4d object, someone, anyone, and I'll gladly shut up and live the rest of my life in humility.

But, I'm so confident that you'll never do this and that nor will it ever be achieved, that I'll go ahead and place myself in the category of psychic and predict that this will never happen. I never knew I had the powers of clairvoyance. Knowledge is super! Subjectivity and faith... eh, not so much. Never comes forth with evidence, just centric speculation and eventual collapse.

[edit on 25-9-2008 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy


Yeah lucid...

YOU DREAM IN 3D

[edit on 25-9-2008 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]