The Second American Revolution: Turning Point

reply to post by otto2294

No. Speak your mind. The Supreme Court has ruled that there is a huge difference between a 'true threat' and 'political hyperbole'. Read up on it.

Even speech that "might have been understood as inviting an unlawful form of discipline or, at least, as intending to create a fear of violence" is Constitutionally protected, in absence of a 'true threat'. And what is a 'true threat' is not a matter of woulda/coulda opinion, it must be definitively and uniquely shown, in court.

And stating, for example, that there may come a time when the American People take their guns and go and shoot their politicians and/or powerful elite is not creating a threat. It's stating an opinion of political reality. Even saying they should do that is Protected Speech. Are we to believe that the rantings of an Internet poster are enough of a definitive solitary catalyst to create a 'true threat', by themselves? Clearly not.

So speak up, say what you feel. Besides, if that's how you really feel, 'they' probably know that and you're already on 'the list', regardless of what you say.

In my opinion, the largest enemy of free speech in America is the fear of non-conformity and negative reaction. That's the lesson we're taught with every 'news discussion' show on television -- step out of the mainstream dichotomy in expressing your opinion, and you will be mercilessly stomped on rhetorically, from all sides.

It keeps us in a box, through fear and intimidation. Don't empower fear, especially fear that others would contrive for you to have, to their benefit.

There is alot of adolescent testosterone-induced hyperbole flying around. It's good to see people fired-up but that, in and of itself, will solve nothing. My $.02 related to earlier posts:

Heroes:

No. We don't need them or want them. THEY offer up heroes so we will all fall in line behind said hero so THEY can lead us where they want us to go. No heoroes this time kids. We have to do this one on our own.


The Vote:

I know, I know... not as sexy as burning the Govenor's house but in the near term we do have a unique opportunity to make a statement that WILL be heard above the noise and political manipulation. If we can ALL get sufficiently together we can vote against EVERY incumbent. Every single one. Completely disrupt the existing alliances and special interest relationships that permeate the government. And I mean at EVRY electoral level --- local, state, federal. IF we could pull this off it would be unprecedented and unmistakeable by everyone at every level. Including the MSM. We will make a statement that we are DONE.

This isn't the complete solution. But it is a start. We need to put ALL politicians and their support networks on-notice. Make them realize that we ARE aware of what is going on and who is repsonsible and that we ARE capable and willing to organize.

Please help. Anyone could do this and it is free from any left/right, Rep/Dem aspects. This is it people. This is the real deal. Don't kid yourselves, we are in very, very serious trouble here.

An interesting thing to think about is: what is the cohesive nexus for non-Establishment approved social change in America? For activity beyond talk, such as the coordinated expression of (non-violent) opinion? MLK used the local churches.

Somehow, the Internet, for all its 'free-wheeling freedom of speech', does not act as a cohesive nexus of social change, outside of established interests. It does cause a lot of blather, however.

Possibly the best counter-examples to that would be MoveOn.org and Anonymous. Both very questionable. Anyone else have any examples?

I really don't care if I end up on some list. If I'm not already on one then the way I see it is we're all screwed anyway so might as well go down fighting. Apathy is the enemy.

All this talk of "voting in change" and all that kind of stuff has been said since America started pretty much. And it obviously hasn't worked out too well so far. The American people need to get active. A GOOD protest gets plenty of news time and the more people see our message the more will join.

The big difference between the past revolutions and today is the our country is split. It's split in thought, ideas, population and yes " as a nation." Democrats & Republicans are the main two political parties of today and as you can see, all the other parties are just minor distractions. Democrats & Republicans can't even get things done in Washington let alone the blue & red states coming together as one. There's no way America will come together and stand on the front porch in Washington and take back our government and overhaul this country. I'd like to see it happen and I would be there, but my heart tells me "no way".

Originally posted by flyingwoody
A GOOD protest gets plenty of news time

Really? No they don't. What news channels are you watching? From what I've seen, unless there's some way they can be spun or exploited to the advantage of the corporate media, they are totally ignored.

Originally posted by sir_chancealot

Originally posted by badmedia
I'm pretty sure the main reason for the revolutionary war was because of monetary policy. ...

Yes, I'm sure it had NOTHING to do with the reasons THEY OUTLINED IN THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE.

Do people even think before they post?

[edit on 23-9-2008 by sir_chancealot]

Get off your high horse. Benjamin Franklin listed the reason I gave as the main reason for the war in his autobiography. As I said in my previous post, this is what got the people who understand fired up. And then the British government took it even further by coming down on them with taxation, which combined with the central bank made for hard economic times.

Maybe you should think before you post. I know what I am talking about.

[edit on 24-9-2008 by badmedia]

Originally posted by Solarskye
The big difference between the past revolutions and today is the our country is split. It's split in thought, ideas, population and yes " as a nation." Democrats & Republicans are the main two political parties of today and as you can see, all the other parties are just minor distractions. Democrats & Republicans can't even get things done in Washington let alone the blue & red states coming together as one. There's no way America will come together and stand on the front porch in Washington and take back our government and overhaul this country. I'd like to see it happen and I would be there, but my heart tells me "no way".

I read somewhere that only like 4% of the population fought in the revolutionary war. And many people were still loyalists to the British Empire.

The majority of people just stay out of such things, myself included. I have no desire to fight any war. I sincerely believe that a revolution would be useless at this point, and I fear more than anything that we would lose the constitution in the process. I prefer to fight by trying to show people what freedom and liberty is about, and the scams that are going on.

reply to post by badmedia


You can have a revolution without guns. I guarantee you if we had 500,000 and "I don't really know how many it would take" Americans protested in Washington DC then our voices will be heard. I don't want war either just justice. These politicians involved with Fanny Mae, Freddy Mac, AID etc... need to be held accountable for fraud and criminal activities. Call your congressman, senators and let them know how disgusted you are about it. But if Americans don't show up in Washington DC then I'm afraid emails, phone calls & letters just go in the waste basket.

No "heroes" or "leaders" please. Those are bad things. They take the focus of an act such as revolt off of the individuals participating and place it on one figurehead. That equates to easier control and less getting done.

The simplest way to spark something is for enough people to disobey a perceived unjust law such as a tax, ban or travel constraint. Then when faced with the governments guns and jails they have to resist. It's pretty simple really.

The problem is getting a nation this divided despise the same tax, law or ban. This could be overcome by creating a regional focus for an issue. The entire nation doesn't need to despise the income tax to incite revolt but if just one town in one state did that would be enough. Get one town to refuse to pay into or accept money from the state in which it is located and you start something huge. Likewise if just one town in one state refused to comply with Clintons AWB would the state and fed come in and arrest or destroy the town? The state currently who have decriminalized marijuana and are experiencing federal crackdowns need to tell their start expelling and or arresting federal personnel who enter their state. But money and farmed dependence keep them docile and compliant.

reply to post by truth_seeker3


Against who? Ourselves.......Because we have not a snowballs chance in hell of fighting the US governemnet. If you go to war, all bets are off the table. Suppose you get 1 million armed troops moving in on DC. Then poof a few nukes and you are a side note in American History. We have given them all the power. Made it impossible to take it back, and we have to live with that. Which sucks. But thanks to the 1950s- 1980s generation that is what we are left with.

Originally posted by otto2294

Originally posted by flyingwoody
I, personally, think that before it's all over we're going to have to resort to violence. The PTB aren't going to give up their power so easily. I think we should start peaceful for awhile but if still nothing changes we should use our powers of citizen's arrest and administer justice.

I would gladly be a martyr for the cause but unfortunately I don't know enough about all the important topics just yet. That, and people tend to not look up to someone who is younger than they are.

i hear guantanamo bay is lovely at this time of year. seriously the way youve worded this could easily been seen as a terrorist making a threat and we all know the US governments attitude when it comes to suspected terrorists. shoot first ask questions never. so yeah id probably just watch how you word your posts

This really caught my eye. Americans now really think the anti-terrorism laws may affect them personally in a worst-case scenario (no longer fears about losing freedom, but being an actual "inmate" - or whatever you can call it - in camps like Guantanamo Bay).

Maybe the cause to introduce terrorists as the next "Evil American Enemy" after the Russians was to use the resulting anti-terrorism laws to choke off a starting revolution against the regime.

I don't want to hijack this thread, so I started an own one here: Why terrorists? To choke off a possible 2nd American Revolution...

Okay after reading this topic I have to say this.

I've thought about this "Second Revolution" and I couldn't agree more about the NECESSITY of it. The only way for someone to attack the government and get people to realize they (the Attacker) are correct is if they attacked a "sensitive installation" like Area 51 for example, and got some documents to show THE MASS POPULATION that they are being lied to.

Or maybe a FEMA camp...

Just shooting the President will make you look like a terrorist, the Second Revolution is gonna need the Biggest "spark" in the history of Revolutions no doubt. And the Patriots of this "Second Revolution" will need to come up with some incriminating proof they are right to spark the American people to fight.
Me wishes there was a Militia in Massachusetts, maybe there is but I couldn't find one...

I honestly wonder if such a man/women will ever come to be. If the "Second Revolution" were to happen, I would give my life to be a part of it.

EDIT: People say Voting will make a difference HA! The NEW WORLD ORDER DOESN'T #ING CARE about your opinion AT ALL! I will vote ANYWAYS, but it ISN'T gonna make the smallest difference.

[edit on 24-9-2008 by NeverSurrender]

You say you want a revolution
Well you know
We'd all want to change the world
You tell me that it's evolution
Well you know
We'd all want to change the world
But when you talk about destruction
Don't you know that you can count me out
Don't you know it's gonna be alright

You say you got a real solution
Well you know
We'd all want to see the plan
You ask me for a contribution
Well you know
We're all doing what we can
But if you want money for people with minds that hate
All I can tell you is brother you'll have to wait
Don't you know it's gonna be alright

You say you'll change the constitution
Well you know
We'd all love to change your head
You tell me it's the institution
Well you know
You better free your mind instead
But if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao
You ain't going to make it with anyone anyhow
Don't you know it's gonna be alright
Alright

[edit on 24-9-2008 by jvm222]

reply to post by truth_seeker3


Truth_seeker3,

I agree with a lot of your views - just wanted to clarify something in the starting post. Are you suggesting the deleted threads are a "conspiracy" of some kind ? I've noticed the same, but attribute it to multiple threads on the same topics already covered.

Hell yeah...im definitely down for a revolution.


"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." - Thomas Jefferson


"All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent. " - Thomas Jefferson


He's speaking to us. The next four years in American history are going to change the face of America and maybe even the world.

Originally posted by flyingwoody
I really don't care if I end up on some list. If I'm not already on one then the way I see it is we're all screwed anyway so might as well go down fighting. Apathy is the enemy.

All this talk of "voting in change" and all that kind of stuff has been said since America started pretty much. And it obviously hasn't worked out too well so far. The American people need to get active. A GOOD protest gets plenty of news time and the more people see our message the more will join.

Very well said! I completly agree. The feds can take all the time in the world watching my every move, but dang it, I dont care. I am an american citizen, and therefore should have a say in what goes on in MY country. I shouldnt have to bow down to the higher ups, just so I can live my life.

Star for you and a flag for the thread! ^_^

the way things are going right now, they are making it harder and harder, with the intent to make it impossible, for us, being citizens and Americans, to come together, much as the founding fathers did, to unite and fight for our unalienable rights.

just think what would happen if a group of people, high or low class, started to meet up to discuss what is wrong with the country, and what needs to be done about it, and recruiting members.

those people would be branded as "terrorists" or "enemy combatants" or any of the other terms they have in some legislature somewhere. THEN rounded up, raided, assets taken, and most likely thrown in some jail or prison camp without rights to trial.

think i'm a paranoid CTer? well maybe I am, but I sincerely believe this would be the outcome of a founding father style group.

We need to get behind Ron Paul and his principles and ideals and try to work the system to our advantage (although I dont think that's possible anymore).

It's either hello 1984 or hello 1776. I know which side I'll be on.

great thread and keep your eyes and ears open.

reply to post by PieKeeper

youtube link comes up with (not available in this country).never seen that before in uk.