Why not give the 700billion$ BailOut to the people?

reply to post by alienesque


oh but giving 700bn $ to the cartel that LOST 700BN in the first place? is going to solve a problem?

Sure, and giving a heroin addict just 1 more high will solve their addiction problem too wont it?

"Why not give the 700billion$ BailOut to the people?"


so your suggesting you take money out of peoples pockets and give it back to them as some sort of reward or help?
wow.


that's like borrowing money from your self to pay bills...

man, what's going on with this place?

Originally posted by elysiumfire
why not force an adjustment of the mortgage down to a non-inflated and realistic price...which means a reduction down to affordable payments? Why should homeowners suffer due to someone's greed and avarice?

You mean the greed and avarice of people who bought homes they couldn't afford? The greed and avarice of people who thought they were entitled to a home with no money down? These people are every bit as responsible for this financial debacle as the greedy lenders who lent the money just to get their own bonuses. If the lenders had renegotiated these mortgages down to non-usurious prices themselves there would be no mess, just as if people didn't believe that they could not live without owning a home at any cost there would be no mess.

Both parties' unbridled greed caused this problem and none of them deserves one penny to help them solve it.

I could not care less if financially irresponsible people or entities find themselves homeless or out of business. The bottom line is the country doesn't have the money to spend 700bn on anything important, let alone this BS.

[edit on 9/24/2008 by sc2099]

Because it isn’t the economy that we are saving it is George Bush ass on the line. George bush had the backing of the big business which is the banks when he went to war in Iraq because he just new by now he would have won the war and American big business would have owned Iraq and the gas lines. however his plan failed and now his investors want there money back so there holding the economy hostage. Its ironic that we spent 700 billion dollars fighting a war in Iraq and now just before he leaves office the economy is short 700billion dollars. the housing market is not the cause of thisBush-gutted economy. war and greed is the cause. I say let it crash and give the people the 700billion we are Americans we can rebuild. This way the inflated price of everything will have no choice but to go down gas,food everything. this will create opportunity's for me, you and our kids to become rich and live the American dream.. out with the old and in with the new. I never understood why Americans invest so much outside of America anyway you don’t see Luxemburg investing in America and there the richest country in the world average income is 60,000 and here in America its 19,000. If congress is really for the people congress will let the economy crash and help Americans rebuild or let china buy the debt we send all our money over there anyway. im sure if the republicans had a guarantee that they would win this would not be an issue.

reply to post by Buck Division


to buck division:

No. I'm not sure where you got that idea from, but you're missing a very important part of the situation.

The lenders didn't "loose" $700,000,000,000.00. The people proposing this "bail out" aren't simply proposing that we just pay the banks back what they have lost.

The largest of the investment banks purchase packages of debt (including mortgages) from the smaller banks, whom may or may not be the bank that financed the original bank to begin with. The original lending bank never expected to wait the full 30 years or whatever the terms of the loan were, to collect their money. They planned on selling it soon after completion and they did. Now the larger investment banks, who have purcahsed the debt don't expect to wait for the full course of the loans in their purchase packets to expire either. They intend to and they do sell them to other banks, and governments. Every "owner" of the debt along the line will add their own fees to the pot, change the terms of the original loan as much as they legally can to maximize profit. The changing terms of those loans often -not always, but often- turn out to be too much for your average struggling family, just trying to keep their heads above water.

The executive committees in these large investment banks don't "create" any new product or service. They literally just buy and sell debt. And they make unholy profits doing this.

Now that more and more people cannot afford to keep the new terms of the loans -the terms that they never expected in the first place-, for the first time in modern American history, these large packets of debts are hard to sell to other investment banks. They can still sell, just not as easily as before.

That's it! That's the big mystery that they expect the public to fund for them. They expect the public to pay for them to continue to earn outrageous profits and bonuses.

Put it in another context. California, the largest state, the state with more than one eighth of the population of the entire country, finally just passed a $145,000,000,000.00 budget. That's the budget for ALL of the social programs, ALL of the schools, ALL of the prisons, ALL of the police, ALL of the state programs in the most populous, and most progressive state. For a YEAR!

And they really expect the public to literally give them almost five times that number AND to codify into law that they can spend it any way they choose, and that not congress, not the courts, nor any other public body can EVER do anything to demand it be spent in any particular way... AND to also codify into law that Paulson, or the current "owner" of the new $700b bank has immunity, and cannot be prosecuted for anything done with any of that money.

And then also remember that the Federal Reserve just finished giving away "bailouts" of 240,000,000,000.00 JUST THIS MONTH!!!


There is no value in this "bailout". I know that it sounds crazy, but many people have remarked that they will do this to perpetuate American debt, and to "keep us enslaved". I know that's not the mainstream thought process. But think about it. Think about where you get your information. Think about who owns the companies that own your newspapers and television channels, and radio stations, and so on. If you owned a newspaper, would you pay your staff to write bad press about you? Really?

The Wall Street Bailout: A 700 Billion Ton Pile Of Manure On Your Lawn

Imagine that a line of trucks was coming over to your house to dump a 700 billion pound pile of manure on your lawn. Would you be upset? Of course! You would be hopping mad! So why aren't the American people upset about this bailout? Our Congress is committing us and our children and our grandchildren to a 700 billion dollar bill for this ridiculous Wall Street bailout:

shatteredparadigm.blogspot.com...

I’m against the $85,000,000,000.00 bailout of AIG.

Instead, I’m in favor of giving $85,000,000,000 to America in
a We Deserve It Dividend.

To make the math simple, let’s assume there are 200,000,000
bonafide U.S. Citizens 18+.

Our population is about 301,000,000 +/- counting every man, woman
and child. So 200,000,000 might be a fair stab at adults 18 and up..

So divide 200 million adults 18+ into $85 billon that equals $425,000.00.

My plan is to give $425,000 to every person 18+ as a
We Deserve It Dividend.

Of course, it would NOT be tax free.
So let’s assume a tax rate of 30%.

Every individual 18+ has to pay $127,500.00 in taxes.
That sends $25,500,000,000 right back to Uncle Sam.

But it means that every adult 18+ has $297,500.00 in their pocket.
A husband and wife has $595,000 .00.

What would you do with $297,500.00 to $595,000.00 in your family?
Pay off your mortgage – housing crisis solved.
Repay college loans – what a great boost to new grads
Put away money for college – it’ll be there
Save in a bank – create money to loan to entrepreneurs.
Buy a new car – create jobs
Invest in the market – capital drives growth
Pay for your parent’s medical insurance – health care improves
Enable Deadbeat Dads to come clean – or else

Remember this is for every adult U S Citizen 18+ including the folks
who lost their jobs at Lehman Brothers and every other company
that is cutting back. And of course, for those serving in our Armed Forces.

If we’re going to re-distribute wealth let’s really do it...instead of trickling out
a puny $1000.00 ( “vote buy” ) economic incentive that is being proposed by one of our candidates for President.

If we’re going to do an $85 billion bailout, let’s bail out every adult U S Citizen 18+!

As for AIG – liquidate it.
Sell off its parts.
Let American General go back to being American General.
Sell off the real estate.
Let the private sector bargain hunters cut it up and clean it up.

Here’s my rationale. We deserve it and AIG doesn’t.

Sure it’s a crazy idea that can “never work.”

But can you imagine the Coast-To-Co ast Block Party!

How do you spell Economic Boom?

I trust my fellow adult Americans to know how to use the $85 Billion
We Deserve It Dividend more than I do the geniuses at AIG or in Washington DC .

And remember, The Birk plan only really costs $59.5 Billion because $25.5 Billion is returned
instantly in taxes to Uncle Sam.

Ahhh...I feel so much better getting that off my chest.

Kindest personal regards,

Birk

T. J. Birkenmeier, A Creative Guy & Citizen of the Republic

PS: Feel free to pass this along to your pals as it’s either good for a laugh
or a tear or a very sobering thought on how to best use $85 Billion!!

the american taxpayer could then pay of some of there debts instead of ceos and poiticians putting us more in debt.Also do you know why there is a gas shortage not just weather but you have a president in the white house whos whole family is in big oil,so lets give more money to the rich and the people in the lower economic circuit can foot the bill again.

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
I’m against the $85,000,000,000.00 bailout of AIG.

So divide 200 million adults 18+ into $85 billon that equals $425,000.00.

Birk

T. J. Birkenmeier, A Creative Guy & Citizen of the Republic

PS: Feel free to pass this along to your pals as it’s either good for a laugh or a tear or a very sobering thought on how to best use $85 Billion!!

Maths are hard, but come on. It's $425.00.

Oops, there goes a plan.

Stick with what you know, m'kay?

If any bail out is passed, I will be looking to move out of this country. Until then, I will find any possible way to cheat on my taxes and rip off the government. Why not? They have been doing this to us for years and now we are going to bail out the richest people in the world who have picked our flesh off like a bird does to a dead animal. I suggest everyone find a way to rip off the government or banks. They deserve everything bad that happens to them.

Why don't they just make more money from paper, that way it never runs out. Give everyone some money but make sure they spend the amount by force and contract which will turn the engine of the economy back on.

Feel free to correct me if I am wrong here, but I believe that the reason this would not work is that it would defuse the money too much. The money has to be used to buy up the paper on these bad loans that is preventing the banks from lending to each other. So the whole loans have to be purchased, not simply giving folks money to make a payment or two on each one, or we’ll be right back in the same boat in another month. So they either have to buy the loan from the bank, or pay for the persons house. Since it is not fair to buy a bunch of people houses on the rest of our tax dollars, they have to purchase the actual loans themselves or the paper that backs up those loans (however that works). If they spread that money out amongst us all, since most of us are not in trouble with our loans, that money would not go to the actual source of the problem.
Anyway I hope that makes sense.

Ok I get the bailout idea. But here's another idea.

1. Debt is mostly from people not being able to pay for their morgage.
2 The banks thought, hmm why not trap them with low interest rates and then take the houses back/make them pay for it when the interest goes up.

So why don't we just let the banks that did this go bankrupt and let the houses go to the people. No bank = no debt. why were doing this? So that they can loan more money?

During the course of this week we have learned that this money isn't about saving Wall Street or Main Street, it's about saving "CHOW" Mein Street.

This pile of TOXIC PAPER isn't even held by US banks, it's foreign investors who are mad that they didn't get a good deal. China and Russia being the biggest investors.

Why do we need the money? To buy back the TOXIC PAPER from these investors so they will LEND US MORE MONEY.

WTF? The government is lying to us, stealing from us and all to make sure that they can put us even further in debt???

Once they buy the TOXIC PAPER they will borrow more money from foreign investors!!!

This is a bottomless pit of malfeasance

i truly beleave that the bailout should be for the homeowers that are under forcloser an peoples that are loseing there jobs the banks are the blame for the mess .dont get me wrong it is from my heart. the truth from my heart. some of us homeowners are behind in bills credit is a reck. you all should truly look into some of these banks not pointing fingers. but it is the truth. we americans were steped all over by some banks.option one changed name to AHMSI. PLEASE LOOK INTO THISE MATTER.

I can sum up the answer in one sentence for you.
The same people giving away the 700 billion are some of the ones collecting it through back channels, therefore they don't give it to us, because then they would be taking money our of their own pockets.

I think the most interesting thing about this question is that it is not being answered. There has been no serious discussion of this question, just dismissive laughter. Or if anyone knows of a serious discussion of the question, please let us know.
I'm no economist either. Nor a politician. So, I may be missing something obvious, but if so, I Text don't understand last Spring's $600 fiasco.
Let's keep asking the question until someone gives us a serious answer that puts this significantly below the question of why we would give the auto makers $25B. Isn't it as ludicrous as that?

I dont think the general public should get the money, I think what should happen is if you have bad debt and a house loan, you should get a portion of it to pay down and only pay down then be forced to refinance to a lower payment. Not necessarily get a check cut to the people. If that ever happens (Oh wait it already did with the stimuls check What a joke that was, thats there way to keep us from bitching that we didnt get anything!!).
And besides, theres 700 million people in the united states, about 300 million working, about 150 million worth giving money to thats below the poverty line. They need to draw the line at 102,000 a year and you dont get nothing. Somewheres around there they dont pay taxes on income so they can bite the big one. If your just working with no backing of a union or any kind of a good incentive you dont get anything. Enough is enough.

You defanitly have a valid point. But it may need a bit of tweeking.

When this whole 700 billioin buck bailout (700bbb) was first mentioned, I just shook my head, because I knew that 'we the people' wouldnt see a dime of it.

So I said to my wife-- why not help out these failing mortgages for a fraction of the cost.

Look at these very loosly based numbers.

Over 1 million in forclosure.

Take an estimated 10k - 20k owed per home to get it out of forclosure.

Now multiply.

Answer-- 10-20 billion.... far cry better than 700billion.

Now, how would this help?? Well first, people need to STOP blaming homeowners for this mortgage crisis. I had my own company (new home construction). I made plenty of money. Gas prices went up. The cost of EVERYTHING went up. People couldnt afford there mortgages living off the same income, but spending double on everything. So people quit spending as much. Economy felt it. Housing market felt it. I fell out of a job, and that sent my mortgage into forclosure. Most of the forclosures are NOT a result of lazy bums getting a morgage they couldnt afford. They in fact could when they got it. Anyhow, there are a slew of reasons for the mortgage crisis.

So, instead of just giving people a check, and HOPE that they pay back there mortgage debt, write the check to the mortgage company for the amount needed to bring the mortgage current, plus one month. Give others who are NOT behind, but need an extra buck, a tax break.

Heres what would happen-- The banks holding these failing mortgage notes would get there money. It would ease the pocket book for those who need it. Then they can pay off other debt, and maybe buy a few extra presents for there kids at christmas/birthdays. Now you have more money being injected into the 'system'. The economy would respond on a very positive note. Prices on everyday items would drop back down, saving EVERYONE money.

I know this wouldnt fix EVERYTHING, but it sure would put things back in the right direction.

I dont recall what channel I was watching yesterday, but someone actually brought this up on some news station. I was refreshed to here I wasnt the only one thinking this way.

I think all the points here are very valid and most seem to make a lot of sense, "common sense". But everyone seems to be pointing fingers at the housing market and the big 3 and a few other "small" problems in the economy, how about the fact that our social programs are rigged and being taken advantage of severely? or the health system? I mean there seems to be a lot of attention to just a fraction of the entire system! This country is in desperate need of reform and needs to be brought back to the basic fundamentals of the taxpayers! Without the average "WORKING" American, there would be no big banks, no big three, no anything. So why is no one in Washington seeing this? This situation seems all to familiar to the crash in 1929.....will history repeat itself? Will it be worse since there is far more people involved? Will there be a recovery from this one? Something needs to be done about this, and it needs to be national. It needs to spark from people like you and me; making these posts on the web is great, but its not organized, its to wide spread and weak. We need to unite, form one group, make a list of demands and take them to washington. Why cant the average American such as us make the difference? We didn't become this great nation by sitting on the side lines and letting some bullies steer us in a direction we didn't want to go? Why are we letting it happen now? The politicians in this country are our employees, we are not their slaves! The more we admit to being their slaves the easier it will become for them to do as they will! This country needs REAL CHANGE not this fake change that the latest presidential candidates were feeding us, but I mean genuine SINCERE change. Enough of this! I know I have said what many of you think and also have felt, but we need to do something because no one will do it for us. Please don't disregard this as another post but pass it along to your neighbors and friends! If you have any ideas or suggestions as to how we should connect and unite ourselves as well as other groups feeling the same way please post a comment.

I HOPE THIS HAS REACHED THE HEARTS AND MINDS OF MANY OF YOU SO WE MAY MEET SOON AND BEGIN THIS UPRISING!

THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME

Ryan "ACE" Nyer