Police brutality, and how I need your help.

Hello everyone.
First off, I just want to say a few things. Joined up on this wonderful site fairly recent, and was a "lurker" for quite some time before.

This is a true story of police brutality against someone I know, which has angered me to the point of coming up with an idea on how to get stories like this heard.

My friend was downtown (I live in a small town in California, about two hours away from Los Angeles) and was with his girlfriend, and a couple other friends outside a fairly popular bar. I will call my friend "Adam."

A drunken man approached Adam's girlfriend, and said some inappropriate things. Adam walked up to the drunken man, and the drunken gentlemen punched him; laid him out, and busted his nose wide open.

Cops are always around the downtown area, and one of them happened to be at the scene. Adam thought this was wonderful, because they would most certainly take care of the man who punched him. Right?

They talked to Adam's girlfriend, and were quite rough when handling her.
(Guy cops aren't supposed to do that, are they?)

The decided to talk to Adam. But then, things get worse.

More police arrived, adding up to the total amount of TWELVE officers.
They insisted he "stopped resisting", and slammed his face into a planter -- multiple times, until demanding that he stood up.
Once he stood, an officer forcefully stepped on his foot, causing him to fall.
At this time, the police ordered any bystanders to leave.
Once they were gone, the officers literally BEAT Adam.

But, it's not over yet.

The police took Adam to the hospital. His girlfriend was also there.
The police took him to an empty room, put a bag over his head, and beat him some more.
(A bag?! WHAT!)
His girlfriend could hear Adam, crying out in pain.

He was later ARRESTED for being "drunk in public" (although the cops never issued a field sobriety test, used a breathalizer, etc...)
and had to spend 16 hours in prison.
The kicker? He was manhandled by the same officers before they locked him up, too.

This is not a joke, or a story I made up. This happened last night.
His face is swollen, he's got a black eye, and open wounds all across his face. I'd show all of you the picture, but I will have to ask for his permission before doing so.

Now, this is why I need YOUR help.
I am planning to do a massive project about the true accounts of people who are experiencing police brutality.
Pictures, video, documents, first-hand accounts for people to read...
The purpose? To let people know that we do NOT accept this kind of behavior. To expose the reality of what is slowly becoming "normal", and opening others eyes to realize that the time to take action is NOW.

It has happened in the past, and it will keep happening as the years continue.
But we cannot let it continue... we must stand up, and let our voices be heard in unison.

Would anyone here like to help me with this project? I am dead serious about it.
And no, for you cynical people out there, I'm not going to post links for my website or try to recruit others to do anything -- other than help me by posting their accounts of similar experiences.

Sorry about the lengthy post...

-Alex
(No, I didn't change my name to "Adam.")

Also, I'd also like to note that:

Adam is a white male, 23 years old, with no previous criminal records.

AND, although I said I wanted accounts of police brutality... stories of cops abusing their powers in any way is very important, and will be used also.

Unfortunately, no one seems to want to respond to this topic. lol.

I have posted a lot on this subject here at ATS, with mixed response as you might expect. Here is one of my own stories in two parts...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by bvproductions


Tell your friend to get a GOOD lawyer right now. The fresher the details the better, you'll remember witnesses better. Take pictures of everything. And remember, the best defense for the cops is offense. They will try to throw the book at him and indict him for everything. A good take no crap lawyer that knows the system can nip a lot of things in the bud. The cops and DA will also try to move quickly. Remember their careers and pensions are at steak and the city could be sued for millions. This is no joke, they are coming at your friend with everything they have. Get off this board, call him and get the ball rolling right now. Remember they are expecting you not to know the system and take it slow while they are right NOW in a meeting deciding how to bury your friend. Please, I know what I'm talking about. DO IT NOW! and good luck, you can update us later. GO.

EDIT: This is important, you need a great criminal lawyer. He need to defend himself first. You can deal with civil further down the road.




[edit on 9/23/2008 by schrodingers dog]

Thank you for your response.
Just so happens that I was notified that he's got a lawyer right now, and they are currently working together to make this into a case.
He's got photo evidence to back up his claim, but it's going to be his word... versus twelve cops.

My friend, Adam, literally thought he was DYING when he was being beaten in the hospital with the bag over his head.
He couldn't breathe, he was hyperventilating, and he told me that he believed he was going to die by the hands of the police.
It sickens me greatly.

Also, jackinthebox, thank you for your reply as well. I am going to check those topics out right now!

Originally posted by bvproductions
He's got photo evidence to back up his claim, but it's going to be his word... versus twelve cops.

You will be amazed how much people see. Retrace his steps you will find witnesses. Some of the most important ones are going to be in the hospital itself.
Anyway, I'm glad his on it. If his lawyer knows what he is doing and the story you told us is fact he should be, in the long term, fine.
Once again good luck.

hay man no offense to anyone this is just my view. im a regular dude and growing up where i have ...(not to nice not to to bad) but # happens...

i was 13 the first time i was arrested and dragged and pushed around for (get this..really this is funny ) rollerblading at the public library parking lot...WTF? .. then the pigs..(oooooops) the "cops" while dragging me shoeless through the rain gave me a good tossing around and told me they would straiten me out by taking me to the police station basement and giving me a old fashion talking to like they used to to the prisoners that would make men cry because i was a 13 year old who didn't follow the rules of the public parking lot....ok?..isn't that what 13 year olds do ...be wise ass little asses that don't listen? ...

my point is they were nasty calling me "# for brains" & saying "don't you have a brain boy" (by the way i had severe learning disabilities so my feelings got bruised more then my body and you better believe my mother told them i had learning problems and a hard time understanding things and then they said sorry but they shouldn't act like that to and child!) and after that they harased me for years every time they would see me (around 10) but they are the cops and i tried to go against them and they have a verry tight nit thing going on.. now that we are all out of school i have friends that became cops and when i say tight nit # im saying that if this happened then even cops that wernt there will vouch for the dick head oinkers.. (my friends must love my terminoligy...lol).. but they stand by there fellow cops through bad and good...

i notice people bitch at cops like little girls and cause problems and i never thought i would be saying something in there favor but people need to shut up and stop screaming at cops cuz that causes confusion for them and then when someone catches a tazer to the beanbag they get all mad .. but they where flipping out!! you know the whole "i know my writes !" the first attorney i had when i was younger told me "this isn't the tv show cops and they don't need to play nice for the camera or even read you your rites" .. you should know them and even then .. good luck!..

my friend who was on of those kids the bored cops picked on was following us with his car and just ball busting us about skate boarding and he mad a mistake of hitting the gas but not the brake fast enough when taunting us and hit my friend and broke his arm with the cruiser and he sued them and got a chunk of doe so i guess what im saying is f'd up # happens to allot of people and you can fight small things slowly but its not as easy as "they beat me" because they slapped my friends at the prom and on handcuffed my friend to the door railing and ruffed him up but he was say # like how if you take that badge off i'll do this and lets do this f'n pig sooooooo he and i can kinda understand the ruffing up but he should have un-handcuffed him before they tossed it up fist to fist, you know the fair young prom kid vs. older bigger cop..lol ..yeah?

i had a question.. its not col to beat people up but cops are human just like us(well kinds..lol) but did you friend do anything like dump a girl,one night stand a girl, blab about something he shouldn't have of or anything like that? because if he did it doesn't matter if your a cop ,fireman,truck driver,framer, sewer pumper or big desk job dude because if you cross people it will come back to you ... i would like to know if he thinks he could have pissed anyone off because people do it every day and then forget about it until the other person dosnt and gets his boys for a good old fashion azzwhoop'n...
people are wrong and no offense to you friend but there are about 5 sides to every story so i wouldn't say give it up but hey ...."chose your battles !"...

good luck and later !
"justuserg2"

And now you know why cops are going to be the first ones eating bullets when the revolution arrives.

If you are a good cop, one who really does try to help, I'd suggest getting out now, before TSHTF.

reply to post by bvproductions


While I agree there is way too much excessive force used by the police, there is some problems with the story. All of the people were in a bar, and all of them were most probably drunk. When they tell their side of the story, ten drinks become one, and drunk becomes "I was sober". I have been around long enough to know that when it comes to bars, there are no angels involved. I have a few questions and/or statements:
1. Were you there when it happened?
2. Your friend was in a holding cell, not a prison. There is a difference.
3. How much did they have to drink?
4. Was there any video tapes there to back your friend up?
5. Do the police have any videotapes at the station to back up your friend or their claims?

I also have known many police officers, both in civilian forces and in the military. They work 12 hour shifts for the most part, and that does not include the paperwork involved in the arrests they make. They deal with unruly (drunk) people all the time. I suggest you walk in their shoes for a few hours during the night shift.

This will probably not be popular, and I will be accused of being a fascist or whatever, but there are some lingering questions that need to be answered.

i'm absolutely no fan of cops, people join the police for only one reason, to overpower and imprison people. they don't protect, they are not allowed to be pro-active which is what protection requires, and i don't see how they serve. they're just a legalised gang from where i'm sitting.

that being said, the OP's story doesn't add up.
the cops ordered by-standers away from the scene and beat him, on a public steet? outside a bar? if they care enough to order by-standers away why didn't they care enough to take him round back to administer the beating.

they took him to a hospital, into a room, put a bag over his head and beat him again, and are we supposed to believe the hospital staff didn't mind? do you suppose they were in on it? no-one objected? no witnesses have come forward? a hospitals a busy place with a lot of "do-gooder" types wandering around. what did the medical reports say. did his girl friend sit calmly outside as her boyfriend was beaten in a room? most girls i know would scream the walls down.

then there's the classic red flags "this is a true story""this is not a joke""i haven't made this up""i have proof which i'ld post but.." and the clincher for me was "this really is a friend, it's not me", the only time anyone thinks to counter an accusation of telling a lie mid-story is if they're telling a lie, if they were telling the truth they would assume people would believe them.

reply to post by kidflash2008

They work 12 hour shifts for the most part...

Not true. Unless there is an emergency, police departments operate on three "watches."

They deal with unruly (drunk) people all the time.

So do bartenders, bouncers, gas-station clerks and waitresses at diners.

I suggest you walk in their shoes for a few hours during the night shift.

I have.

This will probably not be popular, and I will be accused of being a fascist or whatever, but there are some lingering questions that need to be answered.

The questions are fine, but your rhetoric and bias seem clear. To be fair though, I reserve a healthy level of suspiscion myself regarding this particular series of events, and see your direct questions as to the OP as valid.

Whew. A lot of questions here!

1. I was not there, no. My friend is trust worthy, and he is not known as a "drinker." He was only there because in this town, there isn't a lot to do. Hanging out with people at a local bar is the option for "fun" sometimes.

2. Yes, holding cell. Sorry. I tend to call them the same things, mainly because I haven't experienced one or the other.

3. Not sure of the amount he drank. But, as I said, he doesn't get drunk. Ever.
He's a smart guy, and he's not the type of person to just fabricate a whole story, and beat the hell out of his face and show me pictures of it just for the fun of it.

4 and 5. I don't know the answer to that at this point.

Also, for the red flags listed by another poster:
Yes, I can see why you are suspicious.
I said that this is TRUE, and that it is a story about my FRIEND because it is just that.
I've seen enough topics to know how people respond to these kinds of stories, so I went out of my way to remind everyone that this story is not just something I made up for no reason.

As far as proof is concerned, this is a pending legal case.
Furthermore, it is not MY photo to show. I said I would ask permission before doing so.

To the other red flags about the hospital, etc... your guess is as good as mine.
That is the story of how it was told to me, by a trustworthy friend of mine.
It angered me enough to want to post a topic on it.
I'm sorry that I don't have answers for all the "loop holes", but I can't help you there. I'll let everyone know those specific details ASAP.

Once again, I'm sorry for not having answers to some valid questions!

Originally posted by pieman
i'm absolutely no fan of cops, people join the police for only one reason, to overpower and imprison people. they don't protect, they are not allowed to be pro-active which is what protection requires, and i don't see how they serve. they're just a legalised gang from where i'm sitting.

I dont know where it is youre sitting but it must be on the opposite side of town from where I am sitting.

Dont want to be a fan of the cops? Thats fine and your opinion and choice.

Joining to overpower and imprison?

I live in a blue state. To actually serve prison time, you have to have killed someone, raped someone, molested a child, or committed Arson.

Just about everything else, you walk. Even with the big 4 listed above, no guarantee that you wont be out WAY before your time.

Get hit by someone in the line of duty? The judge will tell you "thats what you are paid for, its part of your job. Charges dismissed" That happens everyday.

So for $45k a year you too can be hit, spit on, screamed at, bled on, fought with, and spend hours upon hours of paperwork to enforce the laws of the land only have the perp out on the streets before you are even done doing that paperwork.

Oh, and if you want to "overpower" someone, you had better have some sympathetic witnesses on your side or you will find yourself on the witness stand defending your own actions. Better yet, video evidence is needed in this day since the word of the civilian is believed over that of the police.

Are there jerk cops? YES! Are there Cops that need to be removed from service...YES! Just like there are jerks at your job, there are jerk cops.

Blanket statements that condemn ALL cops or even the general consensus are not fair. I feel bad that the police you have dealt with have left such a sour taste in your mouth. Believe it or not, there are good guys out there who give a crap and joined for NONE of the reasons you listed.

Now, as far as the OP, you brought up some interesting red flags and I would like to read the police report and witness statements before I could offer any opinion.

Your comments about the hospital staff are big. What do they have to say?

When folks drink they get quite self righteous and are never in the wrong in their own opinion. From what you have written, I would guess that your friend instigated the fight by approaching the drunk fellow to defend his girlfriend. A proper way to handle that situation is to inform the staff of the bar, or to leave and go somewhere else. When the officers decided to arrest him for assault, battery, public intoxication, or engaging in a brawl, I'll bet all my ATS points that your friend refused because it was “the other guys fault” in his opinion. Refusing to allow an officer to effect an arrest is resisting arrest, even if you never lay a hand on the officer, and generally results in getting your butt beaten until you comply. I suggest you look at a “use of force matrix” and understand exactly what “resisting arrest” consists of. All people should read one of these so they know their rights, and the rights of the officers if they are ever in such a situation. If you notice, “passive resistance” (refusal without touching an officer) is already up to the “Tactical level of force”, meaning that the officers are allowed to start manhandling you at that point.

A couple other things strike me in your story. First, they do not call in twelve officers unless there is a serious problem, as officers have plenty of other things to be doing then just beat up some innocent person. They would only call in that many personnel if the situation was such that they feared it was going to escalate out of control and endanger themselves or bystanders. Second is that they hood someone when that person is spitting or biting at the officers, they certainly don't do that for the fun of it or because they want to beat someone up. As to why this would continue in the hospital, I'll also bet that they needed to place restraints on your friend, and he similarly resisted that as well. Restraints are frequently used in hospitals when someone is angry, drunk, or crazy enough to hurt themselves, or the staff.

You can try and fight the rap, but I will again bet you that you wont win. Incidents of officer abuse are more likely to be when its a lone officer who has you somewhere secluded, certainly not when they have 12 other officers, civilians, and hospital personnel in attendance. I am sorry if you don't like what I am writing here, and I don't intend it as a flame of any type. Its based on my experience with my law enforcement friends, and I'll be interested in hearing how your friends case turns out.

Originally posted by justuserg2
hay man no offense to anyone this is just my view. im a regular dude and growing up where i have ...(not to nice not to to bad) but # happens...

i was 13 the first time i was arrested and dragged and pushed around for (get this..really this is funny ) rollerblading at the public library parking lot...WTF?

Parking lots are for parking cars, not roller blading, and they are also not public property they are owned by however owns that business. The owner of that business (whether it be the city, state, federal government, or a private company) has the right to enforce rules that they set on that property. If you do not comply with those rules you can be trespassed off that property by police officers.

Now they are not just doing that to be mean, but rather because of the liability involved with people rollerskating, or skateboarding on their property. So for instance, if they let you skate there and you fall and break your arm, your parents could actually sue them for that. Even more important is if you were to fall on or push someone else, and they get hurt, then they can sue the establishment as well for allowing you to pursue that activity on their premises.

If you notice, many places that are intended for such activities make you sign a liability waiver before allowing you entry. They certainly can not do that in a parking lot used by many people everyday, just so you can roller skate there.

Defcon5, I appreciate your posts. I don't take it as a flame as any type.
Once again, I am only saying what I've been told.

I understand what drinking does to people, and I'm sure there are some good reasons for some of what happened. I'm sure I probably don't know the FULL story, either.

I appreciate the input from all of you. I wish I had more details and answers for some of this, but I am lacking in that department.
All I know is that when I heard this story, and the way he described it, and saw how badly his face was wounded...I was EXTREMELY angered.

I was not in the right mind to fully think about all of the loose ends. I admit that.

Thanks for not getting on my case too badly about it.

It sounds like Adam is going to be a very rich man...


This isn't 'juggler' Adam is it?
Just thought I'd ask...

Originally posted by HugmyRek


This isn't 'juggler' Adam is it?
Just thought I'd ask...

Juggler Adam?
I'm not sure I understand.

reply to post by jackinthebox


I was speaking about the force in my area. Some do have 8 hour shifts, but with manning short and many of the force in Iraq, the force where I lived at in LA was on 12 hour shifts. I know others have to deal with drunks, but the police are called when those drunks get unruly.
I have had some bad experiences with the cops when two of my boys would get in trouble. I was powerless when one of them was handcuffed and roughly hauled to the squad car. He did not resist, and was only wearing his shorts. They did not allow him to get dressed, and I wanted to protect him. (I did bring clothes to him when I bailed him out, and the arresting officer did apologize.) I kept a cool head, since blowing up would of landed me in jail, too.
I am not going to write about what they did to warrant the arrest as that is another thread in another time. This is to show that I have been on both sides of the fence. I just read a few of the posts, and all they did was bash the police. I wanted to balance it out so we can get the whole story.

Thank you for answering the questions as best you could, byproductions. If there was any kind of mistreatment, I hope your friend gets justice and at least an apology.

reply to post by kidflash2008


While most people around here will tell you I am no fan of cops at all, I still will not bash them entirely, when they happen to be in the right on ocassion. There have been a few threads on here that I have come across where everyone jumped on the cop-hating bandwagon, but I could not in good conscience. Two of the threads in which I sided with the police were actually deadly-force issues too. Which also happens to be tough topic for me being against the death penalty. So while I am pretty clearly anti-cop most of the time, I am also anti-ignorance and pro-truth more fervently.