Bible Predictions

Originally posted by rockoperawriter

...

are you all blind? don't you see that this bible this entire belief system is nothing more than the largest social control and excuse for war and bigotry? i don't need a bunch of hymns and prayers telling me that i'm going to heaven or hell!

Ah... finally some sense in this conversation...

Thanks rock...


Peace

# christ..... he doesnt exist, never will...

whats the difference between scientology and the catholic church?

nothing.. they both are incredibly wealthy from exploiting idiots....


according to christians the world is like 4,000 years old, and dinosaurs are the lizards of satan....

CRACKPOTS.

I cant wait till this LHC project is done to prove god doesnt exist....
I mean seriously, the church said the earth was flat... false, they said the earth was the center of the universe, false, they said heaven was in the clouds, false, I mean how much more #ING proof do you need?

Originally posted by Sator
mmariebored, and your point is....??

If Jesus did not wanted people to worship him, he should have not gone by making all the miracles and stating he was "the truth", "the light", he should not have allowed the romans to KILL him and them RESURRECT after that, and all that nonsense.

Friend, you have to agree with me on this: if Jesus did not wanted us to worship him, he did a TERRIBLE job avoiding this craziness!!

Peace

I DO agree, he DID do a terrible job, from our point of view. But who am I to judge him? I truly believe he only came down here to tell people who were being robbed and rejected by religions that they don't have to be in those religions to get to God. That God is right inside of us and was all along.

Originally posted by rockoperawriter
he performed all these "miracles" because he was a magician just like Houdini. he was "the light" probably because of these supposed miracles. i am not going to be a sheep. the planet isn't going to explode because of the act of an intangible father figure calling his "children" to him. we are already in the aftermath of the end of the world for "a certain people" i'm not quoting the bible because i see that other folks do it just fine without independence. are you all blind? don't you see that this bible this entire belief system is nothing more than the largest social control and excuse for war and bigotry? i don't need a bunch of hymns and prayers telling me that i'm going to heaven or hell!

You're right! Christianity and every other religion is nothing more than a means of crowd control. Beliefs have never had anything to do with access to God. Maybe behaving yourself and treating others as you want them to treat you might have an effect on your relationship with God, but not which, if any, religion you believe in.

Originally posted by Sator

Originally posted by rockoperawriter

...

are you all blind? don't you see that this bible this entire belief system is nothing more than the largest social control and excuse for war and bigotry? i don't need a bunch of hymns and prayers telling me that i'm going to heaven or hell!

Ah... finally some sense in this conversation...

Thanks rock...

Peace

Sator and rockoperawriter,

Hi! I'm OT...

How are you all doing?? Great I hope....

I've seen this "social control, war and bigotry" comment about a dozen times on ATS, in the last few months...

I've ignored it, approx 11 times....because for the longest I felt, this statement came from the ill-informed or perhaps very young....

But OT will not ignore it any more...please let me know what you mean by this...??

OT has known Jesus Christ for over 35 years, lived in 7 states in Amercia, attended a few dozen churches....and I'm not seeing what you are saying....

Really, 99 % of all followers of Jesus are morale, good and giving people...is OT 'out to lunch' here? Please enlighten...


I don't want to control anyone....

I've never killed anyone...don't own a gun...

I'm not a racist...I have very close freiends who are of alternative persuasions....


Where do you find evidence on a large scale to support these inflammatory statements...and why do you seem to find solice in partnering in this myth?

OT want's to know....

Jesus Christ is about..."the wisdom from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, reasonable, full of mercy and good fruits, unwavering, without hypocrisy." James 3:17

pure...

peaceable...

gentle...

reasonable...

full of mercy...

good...

unwavering...without hypocrisy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Not control, war and bigotry.....

OT respectfully asks you both to..............RE-EVALUATE! OK?

OT...

first of all, why the hell do you talk about yourself in the third person? Is it a difficulty in knowing YOURSELF related issue?

Secondly, I would very much like to know how have you "known Jesus Christ for over 35 years".... Are you a time traveler? an angel? or has Jesus returned and only showed up for you?
I guess what you meant is that "you believe in the existence and teachings of the mythological figure called Jesus Christ" for over 35 years, right ?


I was born a catholic, not by choice. Soon enough I realized that there were something wrong about it, because if you do follow the supposed "teachings" that any church has ready for you, you realize that there are too many things you "cant do" and the explanations are so idiotic that seems to have been written by a child.


But now let's get to the part where you don't get it: War and Bigotry

How about the Crusades? There you have your War and Bigotry in one plate.

I have heard somewhere that around US$50bi is what is needed to end the hunger of almost a billion people in the world. Do you think, for instance, that the Vatican doesn't have this amount of money to pass around?
Can we spell hypocrisy?

See... my problem is not the regular people, who live for love, peace and honor. No sir, my problem is with the institutions that seem to distort a beautiful STORY into something they want us to believe is HISTORY.
And then try to convince us that there's a hell waiting for sinners, (and that we even are born sinners... wtf is that all about?), and that we must "be fruitful and multiple", BUT we cannot wear a condom, and we must be married (which is nothing but a contract made by two people where the judge is a priest) to get children.

Other institutions have different rules, but they have rules. And IF (and that's a big if) Jesus Really existed and really was the "son of God" I guess the last thing he would want is to see his "spokesmen" (ie. priests, churches) to be condone all bullcrap that has been done in HIS name.

pure... is good.

peaceable... is good.

gentle... is good.

reasonable... is good.

full of mercy... is good.

good... is good.

Religion is evil. Period.



Peace

EDIT: there are errors in my writing, I know, I'm too tired to fix them right now. Sorry.

[edit on 18-9-2008 by Sator]

Originally posted by mmariebored
I DO agree, he DID do a terrible job, from our point of view. But who am I to judge him? I truly believe he only came down here to tell people who were being robbed and rejected by religions that they don't have to be in those religions to get to God. That God is right inside of us and was all along.

[...]

You're right! Christianity and every other religion is nothing more than a means of crowd control. Beliefs have never had anything to do with access to God. Maybe behaving yourself and treating others as you want them to treat you might have an effect on your relationship with God, but not which, if any, religion you believe in.

Wonderful mmariebored...
Now I think we are heading towards something... though I still don't understand why people take the "jesus story" literally.

I mean, if one can believe that around 2000 years ago there was an actual person, walking around being the son (or sun?) of GOD ALMIGHTY, with super-natural powers and that he died to save us (?) from our own sins; how harder it is to believe in Odin, Achilles, Krishna, Buddha, Mithra, or ET for that matter?

And the bible... sigh... don't let me even start it...
And when I say "the bible" I mean "the story that is believed FROM the bible". Because as far as I know, it's a compilation of EDITED books made less than a thousand years in the past.
For me this is exactly like someone, a thousand years from now, looking at the Haiti Ufo hoax and going "Look! There were really aliens here in the past!!"

Time to wake up folks...

Peace

Originally posted by Sator
OT...

first of all, why the hell do you talk about yourself in the third person? Is it a difficulty in knowing YOURSELF related issue?

Secondly, I would very much like to know how have you "known Jesus Christ for over 35 years".... Are you a time traveler? an angel? or has Jesus returned and only showed up for you?
I guess what you meant is that "you believe in the existence and teachings of the mythological figure called Jesus Christ" for over 35 years, right ?


I was born a catholic, not by choice. Soon enough I realized that there were something wrong about it, because if you do follow the supposed "teachings" that any church has ready for you, you realize that there are too many things you "cant do" and the explanations are so idiotic that seems to have been written by a child.


But now let's get to the part where you don't get it: War and Bigotry

How about the Crusades? There you have your War and Bigotry in one plate.

I have heard somewhere that around US$50bi is what is needed to end the hunger of almost a billion people in the world. Do you think, for instance, that the Vatican doesn't have this amount of money to pass around?
Can we spell hypocrisy?

See... my problem is not the regular people, who live for love, peace and honor. No sir, my problem is with the institutions that seem to distort a beautiful STORY into something they want us to believe is HISTORY.
And then try to convince us that there's a hell waiting for sinners, (and that we even are born sinners... wtf is that all about?), and that we must "be fruitful and multiple", BUT we cannot wear a condom, and we must be married (which is nothing but a contract made by two people where the judge is a priest) to get children.

Other institutions have different rules, but they have rules. And IF (and that's a big if) Jesus Really existed and really was the "son of God" I guess the last thing he would want is to see his "spokesmen" (ie. priests, churches) to be condone all bullcrap that has been done in HIS name.

pure... is good.

peaceable... is good.

gentle... is good.

reasonable... is good.

full of mercy... is good.

good... is good.

Religion is evil. Period.



Peace

EDIT: there are errors in my writing, I know, I'm too tired to fix them right now. Sorry.

[edit on 18-9-2008 by Sator]

*applauds*

Originally posted by Sator

Originally posted by mmariebored
I DO agree, he DID do a terrible job, from our point of view. But who am I to judge him? I truly believe he only came down here to tell people who were being robbed and rejected by religions that they don't have to be in those religions to get to God. That God is right inside of us and was all along.

[...]

You're right! Christianity and every other religion is nothing more than a means of crowd control. Beliefs have never had anything to do with access to God. Maybe behaving yourself and treating others as you want them to treat you might have an effect on your relationship with God, but not which, if any, religion you believe in.

Wonderful mmariebored...
Now I think we are heading towards something... though I still don't understand why people take the "jesus story" literally.

I mean, if one can believe that around 2000 years ago there was an actual person, walking around being the son (or sun?) of GOD ALMIGHTY, with super-natural powers and that he died to save us (?) from our own sins; how harder it is to believe in Odin, Achilles, Krishna, Buddha, Mithra, or ET for that matter?

And the bible... sigh... don't let me even start it...
And when I say "the bible" I mean "the story that is believed FROM the bible". Because as far as I know, it's a compilation of EDITED books made less than a thousand years in the past.
For me this is exactly like someone, a thousand years from now, looking at the Haiti Ufo hoax and going "Look! There were really aliens here in the past!!"

Time to wake up folks...

Peace

I don't take anything literally.

Who cares if Jesus was a myth or real. My belief, for a while now, has been that if he wanted people to worship him, believe he existed in history, is as powerful as Christians claim, he would both show himself and would have left a LOT of solid evidence. The FACT that he didn't leave evidence about himself tells me his message was never about himself. The message was that we don't need to be controlled to access God and live a happy life on this planet.

Originally posted by Sator
And when I say "the bible" I mean "the story that is believed FROM the bible". Because as far as I know, it's a compilation of EDITED books made less than a thousand years in the past.
For me this is exactly like someone, a thousand years from now, looking at the Haiti Ufo hoax and going "Look! There were really aliens here in the past!!"

"Look, there were really aliens in the past!"? You missed the point of the entire OP if you came to this conclusion. I'm talking about things that were written in a book that had no knowledge of today's technology yet made predictions and said things that are understandable TODAY. Don't let your dislike for the Bible cloud your vision and try not to come to such quick conclusions.

A better example would be if I were to say that the people who made old James Bond movies somehow had knowledge of today's GPS.

[edit on 18-9-2008 by mmariebored]

reply to post by mmariebored



Perhaps... but have you ever stopped to think that those can be "prophecies" that we managed to "make them happen"?

For example: it's written that we are going to have a big war, so everybody starts pilling up ammo and guns, until, eventually someone fires the first shot and all hell breaks loose.

I think we go after the prophecies more then they come after us.

Peace

reply to post by Sator


that also supports the theory of karma. if you wish everybody well then it happens. but if your paranoia gets to you and you say "the end is at hand" then this is the end my only friend! so if you read about events that happened many years after the death of jesus and say that we're all damned, then we are. we are repeating history because of the warping of any understanding of the good in human nature hence its exploitation. jesus told his friends to be good to people, he healed people when he was alive, neither of those things happen today because in 70 a.d. god left us on this planet to put ourselves in our hands and not his. we need to have faith in our selves, our friends and out loved ones instead of an imaginary friend for grownups. i mean christians might as well worship b'all

Originally posted by rockoperawriter
reply to post by Sator

 

that also supports the theory of karma. if you wish everybody well then it happens. but if your paranoia gets to you and you say "the end is at hand" then this is the end my only friend! so if you read about events that happened many years after the death of jesus and say that we're all damned, then we are. we are repeating history because of the warping of any understanding of the good in human nature hence its exploitation. jesus told his friends to be good to people, he healed people when he was alive, neither of those things happen today because in 70 a.d. god left us on this planet to put ourselves in our hands and not his. we need to have faith in our selves, our friends and out loved ones instead of an imaginary friend for grownups. i mean christians might as well worship b'all

Sator and rockoperawriter....

Hey! thank you for the reply...OT appreciates your input!

Karma, huh? I guess that's a good thing...

But GRACE is better....God Riches @ Christ's Expense! G-R-A-C-E

Bono agrees...

See...www.christianitytoday.com...

Details here...Assayas: I think I am beginning to understand religion because I have started acting and thinking like a father. What do you make of that?

Bono: Yes, I think that's normal. It's a mind-blowing concept that the God who created the universe might be looking for company, a real relationship with people, but the thing that keeps me on my knees is the difference between Grace and Karma.

Assayas: I haven't heard you talk about that.

Bono: I really believe we've moved out of the realm of Karma into one of Grace.

Assayas: Well, that doesn't make it clearer for me.

Bono: You see, at the center of all religions is the idea of Karma. You know, what you put out comes back to you: an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, or in physics—in physical laws—every action is met by an equal or an opposite one. It's clear to me that Karma is at the very heart of the universe. I'm absolutely sure of it. And yet, along comes this idea called Grace to upend all that "as you reap, so you will sow" stuff. Grace defies reason and logic. Love interrupts, if you like, the consequences of your actions, which in my case is very good news indeed, because I've done a lot of stupid stuff.

Assayas: I'd be interested to hear that.

Bono: That's between me and God. But I'd be in big trouble if Karma was going to finally be my judge. I'd be in deep s---. It doesn't excuse my mistakes, but I'm holding out for Grace. I'm holding out that Jesus took my sins onto the Cross, because I know who I am, and I hope I don't have to depend on my own religiosity.

Assayas: The Son of God who takes away the sins of the world. I wish I could believe in that.

Bono: But I love the idea of the Sacrificial Lamb. I love the idea that God says: Look, you cretins, there are certain results to the way we are, to selfishness, and there's a mortality as part of your very sinful nature, and, let's face it, you're not living a very good life, are you? There are consequences to actions. The point of the death of Christ is that Christ took on the sins of the world, so that what we put out did not come back to us, and that our sinful nature does not reap the obvious death. That's the point. It should keep us humbled… . It's not our own good works that get us through the gates of heaven.

Assayas: That's a great idea, no denying it. Such great hope is wonderful, even though it's close to lunacy, in my view. Christ has his rank among the world's great thinkers. But Son of God, isn't that farfetched?

Bono: No, it's not farfetched to me. Look, the secular response to the Christ story always goes like this: he was a great prophet, obviously a very interesting guy, had a lot to say along the lines of other great prophets, be they Elijah, Muhammad, Buddha, or Confucius. But actually Christ doesn't allow you that. He doesn't let you off that hook. Christ says: No. I'm not saying I'm a teacher, don't call me teacher. I'm not saying I'm a prophet. I'm saying: "I'm the Messiah." I'm saying: "I am God incarnate." And people say: No, no, please, just be a prophet. A prophet, we can take. You're a bit eccentric. We've had John the Baptist eating locusts and wild honey, we can handle that. But don't mention the "M" word! Because, you know, we're gonna have to crucify you. And he goes: No, no. I know you're expecting me to come back with an army, and set you free from these creeps, but actually I am the Messiah. At this point, everyone starts staring at their shoes, and says: Oh, my God, he's gonna keep saying this. So what you're left with is: either Christ was who He said He was—the Messiah—or a complete nutcase. I mean, we're talking nutcase on the level of Charles Manson. This man was like some of the people we've been talking about earlier. This man was strapping himself to a bomb, and had "King of the Jews" on his head, and, as they were putting him up on the Cross, was going: OK, martyrdom, here we go. Bring on the pain! I can take it. I'm not joking here. The idea that the entire course of civilization for over half of the globe could have its fate changed and turned upside-down by a nutcase, for me, that's farfetched …

Bono later says it all comes down to how we regard Jesus:

Bono: … [I]f only we could be a bit more like Him, the world would be transformed. …When I look at the Cross of Christ, what I see up there is all my s--- and everybody else's. So I ask myself a question a lot of people have asked: Who is this man? And was He who He said He was, or was He just a religious nut? And there it is, and that's the question. And no one can talk you into it or out of it.

Originally posted by Sator
reply to post by mmariebored

 

Perhaps... but have you ever stopped to think that those can be "prophecies" that we managed to "make them happen"?

That was the first conclusion I ever came to when I began to think outside of all religious beliefs.

If you read the OP, you'll see I left out such distracting garbage as the predictions of wars and future kings, etc...

reply to post by OldThinker

I feel bad for Bono. One day he'll realize he fell prey to the workings of "demons". They attack the hardest the people in positions of influence. They magnify the smallest of "sins" with unrealistic guilt and make their victims think they've done little to no real good in the world. They make them think they're surrounded by "demons" when, in fact, the "evil" is in their own mind.

Originally posted by mmariebored
reply to post by OldThinker

 

I feel bad for Bono. One day he'll realize he fell prey to the workings of "demons". They attack the hardest the people in positions of influence. They magnify the smallest of "sins" with unrealistic guilt and make their victims think they've done little to no real good in the world. They make them think they're surrounded by "demons" when, in fact, the "evil" is in their own mind.

OK, I'm totally confused????????????

How has Bono..."fell prey" to demons?

OT needs an explanation.....

Originally posted by OldThinker

Originally posted by mmariebored
reply to post by OldThinker

 

I feel bad for Bono. One day he'll realize he fell prey to the workings of "demons". They attack the hardest the people in positions of influence. They magnify the smallest of "sins" with unrealistic guilt and make their victims think they've done little to no real good in the world. They make them think they're surrounded by "demons" when, in fact, the "evil" is in their own mind.

OK, I'm totally confused????????????

How has Bono..."fell prey" to demons?

OT needs an explanation.....

I used the term "demons" in metaphor and, nice try, I'll let you play with that thought all by yourselves.
(you suddenly sound familiar)

[edit on 19-9-2008 by mmariebored]

reply to post by mmariebored


wouldn't the demons you are metaphorically speaking of be none other than wealth and fame? many people have fall prey to those demons

Originally posted by rockoperawriter
reply to post by mmariebored

 

wouldn't the demons you are metaphorically speaking of be none other than wealth and fame? many people have fall prey to those demons

I'm only making an observation based on that interview. I recognize some patterns, is all. It's not the money and fame...
Anyway, that's way off topic.

I think the problem is too many people add things from the bible and things get misconstrued,I don't remember any prediction's in the bible,plus the fact things have been added and others left out,I think the bible was went to be a book on how people should live with one another ,and some history of the world in those times

Originally posted by Oldtimer2
I don't remember any prediction's in the bible

There are so many prophesies in the Bible, you must not read it very much.
Daniel is the most revealing and relevant even today(for historic purposes). He was clearly favored and "gifted". I believe he was copied by other "predictors" which is how you can tell what part of what they say is real or fake. The future changes, when you predict something, that's why you cannot continue on someone else's path. You have to make up your own.

I think the bible was went to be a book on how people should live with one another ,and some history of the world in those times

How we should live is written on our "hearts", it's called a conscience.