Green Party leader excluded from Televised debate?!

I am absolutely outraged because Stephen Harper, Canada's Prime Minister, is excluding the Green Party from the televised debate! I don't know to many details but I know it's unfair! Here's the link with the details.

canadianpress.google.com...

[edit on 8-9-2008 by cartapo]

[edit on 8-9-2008 by cartapo]

63 views and no replies? cmon

I don't think any party ever aloud the green party into the televised debates . I also believe that the NDP party is one of the strongest opponents keeping them out .
What you say is true but very loaded .

It is absolutely ridiculous. Elizabeth May should be invited to the Debate. At the very least the English one. The Greens hold about ten percent of the popular vote at the moment and at points over the last 2 1/2 years has been above the NDP in polls.

They also received 664 068 votes in the 2006 election and receive Federal funding as a full national party. They also received votes in every province. The Bloc only received votes in Quebec.

2006 results

It wasn't Harper though, at least not directly, that made this call. The networks banned her because Harper felt it was adding a second Liberal to the stage and threatened not to show if she were included. Jack Layton said the same thing, as he would have the most to lose if May were included.

Sad day really, thats the representative of a million or so Canadians that doesn't get a chance to get her message out.

This should not be surprising to any of you , do you really think any of the 3 main parties are that different then the others? It has been proven time and time again that your vote really doesn't matter at all .
I think the best Canada could hope for is another minority government . For the next time Canada does get a majority government we will see more legislation passed that strengthen the North American Union .
And that my friends you can take to the bank .

Originally posted by Max_TO
I think the best Canada could hope for is another minority government.

I disagree. Normally I really like minority governments because they require a degree of compromise in order for Parliament to function. The opposition just waits for a non-confidence vote to trigger an election so everybody mnds their Ps and Qs.

This time out? Liberals have been afraid of an election, so Harper taunts them with legislation.

As to the issue at hand, I am most disappointed in Layton's actions here. I expected better of him. This might lead me to vote Green...

I also prefer a minority government, so they cannot just shove in anything they see fit. Which is exactly why Harper is calling an election out of the blue. He is going for a majority just when the polls are good for him, just prior to whatever is going down in the States, and he is in the know so to speak. What I would prefer to a minority government is a system of proportioanal democracy which would allow for many diverse parties, and many compromises being forced, as the percentage of seats have to be filled by the percentages people vote for. If Harper gets in with a majority and goes for north american union or some other crap, I am going to perform a citizens arrest on him.

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck
As to the issue at hand, I am most disappointed in Layton's actions here. I expected better of him. This might lead me to vote Green...

Agreed.

NDP Leader Jack Layton is taking a public pounding for opposing Green Party Leader Elizabeth May’s request to participate in the leaders’ debate on Oct. 2.
Much of the anger has been directed Layton’s way, especially from people identifying themselves as long-time NDP supporters. Of all people, they say, Layton should have defended her democratic right to debate.

A trip to his Facebook site revealed a number of negative comments from people who said his threatening to pull out of the debate if May was allowed to participate may have convinced them to vote Green.

www.thestar.com...

From Prime Minister Harper, I expected to see joy at a further fracturing of the left by WANTING May's involvement. That he chose to have her excluded actually surprised me.

Layton, on the other hand, seems to want her excluded simply because he would prefer to supplant himself as the best green alternative to Dion's Liberals and tossed the Green Party into the black hole of media silence. I don't think it's going to work out for him in the end.

One thing seems quite certain in the coming election... the environment is a huge issue and, of course, May and the growing popularity of the Green Party are starting to frighten the main players.

Elizabeth May has not earned the right to be represented in a televised leaders debate. While it is true she is the leader of the Green Party, she herself has not been elected to the House of Commons and her only MP is a floor crossing Liberal who was booted from caucus pending an investigation into questionable financing of his campaign.

Ms. May has as much right to be in that debate as the average Canadian citizen
off the street! Until she has paid her dues by getting elected by the voters in her riding of Central Nova, she can have a soapbox in the park and the late night talk radio circuits at the local universities.

Sorry Elizabeth, I know you are a sincere person, but you have to earn a place in the limelight before the voters will ever take you seriously.

Originally posted by Cynic
Sorry Elizabeth, I know you are a sincere person, but you have to earn a place in the limelight before the voters will ever take you seriously.

[cough]Preston Manning[/cough]

She's also an angry person and taking this to the courts.

Elizabeth May said her party will pursue legal action against a consortium of TV networks, which decided Monday to exclude the Green leader from the televised leaders' debates on grounds that three other leaders said they would boycott the show if she were allowed to share the stage.

A defiant May accused the party leaders of preserving a tight "old-boys club" and the networks of turning their backs on democracy instead of calling the leaders' bluff on their warnings of being no-shows.

-snip-

May accused the consortium, which allowed former Reform leader Preston Manning in the televised debates when he had only one MP in the Commons, of making rules on the fly.

www.canada.com...

Whether she's involved in the debates or not, her party is 'in the fight' and she WILL be heard on the issues, whether through televised debates or not.

If her exclusion becomes a volatile issue in this election, I can see her still making the front pages as well as daily CBC national news clips.

The Globe and the Star are following this closely already.

reply to post by masqua



Without dragging partisan politics into this, how dare you compare me to that low-brow Preston Manning? He represented nothing of the true progressive conservatives, but that is not the issue here.

May is taking this to court. Yes. So what? I can fight a traffic ticket if I believe I was unjustly treated. That is not the point at all.

She has NOT earned the right to free publicity at taxpayer expense and quite frankly, she and her party are a one-trick pony. Aside from environmental issues based on questionable science, they have nothing going for them.

Canada cannot return to a blissful existence circa 1850 and remain any part of the modern world. Sorry Masqua, that green dog just don't hunt!

Originally posted by Cynic

Without dragging partisan politics into this, how dare you compare me to that low-brow Preston Manning?

Try reading the complete external quote before accusing me of comparing you to Preston Manning.

It was Elizabeth May who was comparing HER predicament to Preston Manning when he was allowed (to) be involved in televised debate while he had only 1 MP sitting.

As to the Greens, like it or not, they are gaining in popularity, but I wonder if it has more to do with the public disatisfaction to the Conservatives, Liberals, Bloc and the NDP than anything else. Voters sometimes do strange things when all the normal options are hard to swallow.

Harpers Conservatives have done their share of flip flops.
The Liberals still smell of corruption.
Ontario will NEVER forget the provincial NDP ala Bob Rae.

So, who's left?



syntax/spelling edit

[edit on 9/9/08 by masqua]

reply to post by masqua



If I took your quote out of context, I apologize,you started to remind me of a leftist stooge and I have no time for those.

The question masqua is not who's left. That would be the Fiberals, Greenies and the New Dumbocrats.

It's who's RIGHT.

That would be the Conservatives.

They are the only ones that can fix the mess that 13 years of Liberal pandering has left our great country in.

Originally posted by Cynic
reply to post by masqua

 

If I took your quote out of context, I apologize,

NP

Back on topic...

The snub of the Greens by the, granted, 'more established' parties has already caused damage in public opinion.

If the Greens were in ANY way fit to become a viable polical force, then allowing them to take part in the debates would show that quickly.

They would rise and fall on their own 'petard' .

As it stands now, they seem the martyr and that always gets votes. Canadians love underdogs and, when faced with previous dubious governments, will vote for anyone BUT them.

[imo] Canadians rarely vote FOR a party, they vote against a party. [/imo]



Edit to add external text;

“I'm grateful for the outpouring of outrage that we're seeing across the country,” Ms. May said in response to one of the many calls of support on a CBC Maritimes call-in show.

It's a sentiment that is backed by polling. A survey by Angus Reid Strategies found that 66 per cent of respondents agreed Ms. May should take part, with high support across the country.

The Greens argue they meet the broadcasting consortium's criterion of having at least one MP because Independent MP Blair Wilson – a former Liberal – recently joined their party.

www.theglobeandmail.com...

[edit on 10/9/08 by masqua]

reply to post by masqua


It appears as though we will have to agree to disagree. May and her merry band of wannabes are going to get sacrificed at the alter of economics. I have been in the financial industry my entire working life and I can tell you this.
Bread, butter and a paycheck trump fanciful ideology any day.

May is going to get her green butt handed to her in Central Nova because the voters in Eastern Canada ARE smarter than she and her bedmate Dion are giving them credit for.

She is nothing more than a green liberal with her head in the clouds.
Reality is going to bite!

Originally posted by masqua [imo] Canadians rarely vote FOR a party, they vote against a party. [/imo]

Sadly true. Trouble is, we need real leaders. Say what you want about Trudeau, but he made people sit up and take notice.

"Just watch me"
www.youtube.com...

I am a dyed-in-the-wool NDP, who bought a Liberal party membership to support Dan McTeague, who has the biggest cojones on Parliament Hill, (imho). Now I'm in a Tory riding, and disenchanted with the Libs, as I don't feel Dion is a leader, though he is a good man...Iggy is an academic/fascist...sorry pal, but the Hill ain't Simcoe Hall, and you're right about Rae...unfortunately.

Harper is creepy/fascist...and Layton just showed his mettle by boycotting May.

That leaves May...no BQ in my riding.

Sorry, Jack...and the line forms...(wait for it)

...on the left.

[edit on 10-9-2008 by JohnnyCanuck]

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck

Originally posted by masqua [imo] Canadians rarely vote FOR a party, they vote against a party. [/imo]

Sadly true. Trouble is, we need real leaders. Say what you want about Trudeau, but he made people sit up and take notice.

"Just watch me"
www.youtube.com...


Oh c'mon, Trudeau was a small "c" communist bent on turning our great nation into Cuba North.

The only reason I ever stood up for that jerk was to change the channel. (Remotes weren't around then but I digress.)

His leadership d*mn near bankrupted us and the truth of the matter is we are still paying for his useless social engineering experiments.

Originally posted by Cynic
Oh c'mon, Trudeau was a small "c" communist bent on turning our great nation into Cuba North.

That is an entirely debatable stance, but what is clear is that he had the qualities of a leader, and he was a genuine presence upon both the national and the world stages.

I'm not asking you to vote for him.

reply to post by JohnnyCanuck



JohnnyCanuck: I couldn't vote for him even if I wanted to. Thankfully he has left the building forever and I am not sorry he has. The leadership qualities you refer to our not dissimilar to those of Steven Harper. Liberals loathe him because he does what he wants, as PET once did. ("just watch me...") But he goes Trudeau one further in that he consistently DOES what he SAYS his is going to do. Trudeau can only lay claim to one occasion of having done so....putting troops in our streets during the October crisis with the FLQ

The rest of his time at the plate was spent trying to bully Quebec into signing the still unfinished Constitution and spending us so far into the red that we have yet to pay it back.

Real leadership there.....

NOT!

Originally posted by Cynic
reply to post by JohnnyCanuck

 

JohnnyCanuck: I couldn't vote for him even if I wanted to. Thankfully he has left the building forever and I am not sorry he has....

Be that as it may, May is likely the only one likely to hold Harper's feet to the fire, and he makes it quite plain that he does not like to be held accountable. He is simply following in the grand tradition of his American chicken-hawk neo-con compatriots...he is a cowardly bully. Like, no surprise with Harper.

It's Layton that should be ashamed of himself...trading his oft-touted democratic principals for political expediency. I guess Ottawa does corrupt.