Humans DID NOT come from Apes????

it just seems to me that if man and ape shared a common ancestor and evolved from that, or if we evolved from apes or dogs or whatever. this would mean evolution is valid no? if the above were true? so given that, if evolution is true, then somewhere, very very far down the road, dont we all share a common ancestor? i mean over the entire span of evolution, chromosome counts must have changed as we went from the sea to land and so on and so forth from the very first single celled organism. so if we are granting that evolution is true, there has to be a mechanism for chromosome counts to change. right?

reply to post by Azrael75


Excellent questions, in my opinion. It sounds like you and I are on the same page. Let me reiterate, and see if that's true:

If we trace evolution back far enough, all species emanate from the same intial source.

If we go back far enough in primate history, there is a common ancestor between apes and humans, that is NEITHER ape NOR human, just their common predecessor.

There are a few "dead ends" in evolution, where various species diverged from the central branch, and while they were similar to surviving species, they did not survive in themselves, i.e. Australopithicus Robustus, etc.

[edit on 26-8-2008 by argentus]

reply to post by KaginD


Don't let them get too you. You asked a reasonable question. I wish I knew the answer, but wanted to let you know that we are not all that rude. Welcome to ATS. Put your thick skin on.

its the sticky "missing link " question,where is it?what is it?
maybe we have to start looking skywards for answers.
all this time on earth and still not told the whole story!
info is been held back,thats for sure!!

I'm so sick of the Evolution debate and how silly some theories get that I have decided to just belive my own theory right now because I couldn't possibly end up in any less arguments and I might as well believe what I like!

So I'm decended from a Wolf and a Platypus and Alien Dna, because Wolves are Smart and Loyal and because the platapus is wierd and quirky and that seems the most like me

I think that Aliens came and picked the interesting Platypus and the noble wolf and made my first ancestor and that hidden under the great pyramid is the video tape of the sexual exploits between those two critters and a really Horney Grey that led Man to be born on this Earth and one day it will be recovered and I will be redeemed

So there!

You have to understand that Evolution is a deformation or mutation of a species. We have genetic disorders were people have 24 chromosomes. Now if you take them people and breed them off for hundreds of thousands of years you would have a new species. Since today we don't have "Survival-of-the-fittest" of the human race, it will be interesting to see how Human Beings will look in the future.

Even if you believe an Extraterrestrial lifeform came to the Earth on an asteroid or meteorite and lead to the species of Homo Sapien Sapiens, it still doesn't mean Evolution isn't real. Evolution is a fact. The differences and Similarites between Races should be proof enough that a species can change to survive it's environment.

I love how people try to debunk things like evolution that have so much scientific evidence it's not even funny. Evolution does not explain the origin of life nor how the big bang started. It explains the diversity of life. The whole religion vs. evolution argument is completely baseless because both have nothing to do with one another. Science explains the how, while religion tries to explain the why. Personally I think aliens very well could have done genetic experimentation on early primates to create humans. It doesn't mean that evolution is false or that there is no god, however.

Religion is an intricate play on astrology, that got way out of hand. Mankind couldn't have possibly written the words of God...

Originally posted by KaginD
You guys are unbelievable!! I joined this site because I enjoy reading everyones opinions and I thought it would be a good thing to be a part of. You have made it clear that you are not welcoming of new members nor do you have any intentions on doing so. Its a shame, because I thought this was a great site, but given the fact that you have been so rude, you have totally changed my opinion of the entire site. Thanks! You know, you would think that given the fact that this is a site for ideas that get scrutinized on normal web pages, that you would be a little more understanding.. I guess not. I'm deleting my account, so you won't have to worry about any "uneducated" opinions anymore.

Well hang on, you can go anywhere in the world and proclaim that Man did not Evolve from Apes because 1+1 = 3 and you will get called out for it. Anywhere.

Why would here be any different?

The OP posts his thoughts and some of you guys dont like it. So you decided to take the immature path and belittle and demean him? Why not just click on another thread? Why not peacefully and kindly share some of your brilliant education?

KajinD, it is good that you are exploring and I'm sorry you have been discouraged. I agree with your idea that the theory of evolution should not be an automatic. Its just a theory. I personaly dont believe it.

Keep searching.

reply to post by yeti101


yeti, I have to risk a one-line post slap on the wrist here, but I'm glad you brought that video into this discussion, I have seen it before, and it absolutely refutes 'intelligent design' very powerfully.

Theres another one on YouTube, it's one of those ten-minute long ones....wish I could remember....keep searching, it'll pop up.

Usually, YT is a vast wasteland of inanity and profanity, but occasionally, gems rise out of the muck!

reply to post by yeti101


I wish to second that LOL

reply to post by KaginD


are you #ing retarded if they combined then it would be 23 when you put two together you still have one and whats 24-1 dumb ass

Apes devolved from us.

I'll prove evovlution by creating a new species with midgets.

reply to post by Phage


Yes that theory is wrong, but if not properly explained some people might be confused.

We have vestigal traits and some embryonic structures that develop and then either vanish or change in later development. These include tails, nictating membranes, and gill pouches.



[edit on 27/8/08 by MikeboydUS]

hmm am i still on the right thread here..
creation, evolution and gibberlution to you all too..

anyway op wanted to get back to you on that ape business again..
and rem the dna and chromosomes too..
i found a slide show from pye..
it gives an at a glance look that the chromosomes issue..

right a quik jist of what he is sayin..

body contains a 100 trillion cells

there is a nucleas inside every cell

each nucleas contains 46 chromosomes arranged in 23 pairs..

one chormosome of each pair is from each parent

the chromosomes are filled with dna strands

genes are segments of dna which contain instructions on how to make protiens the building blocks of life..


later in the slide show he states human have 46 chromosomes and other primates carry 48.

he also explains how the missing chromosome is not really missing afterall..

you should have a look at this..
it's also just a short slide show so it wont tax too much
anyway please click here for the rest..

daz__

ps excuse my typos please..

I'd highly recommend a video I just saw on the History Channel...it is a part of a series they offer called 'Evolve'

This particular episode focused on how skin evolved, over the last 500 million years (or so).

Fascinating stuff....near the end, the gist was....well, something I'd never known before, so I actually learned a lot from the program. It has to do with the way OUR skin perspires.....and the fact that that was an advantage, for early homonid ancestors, as hunters.

Perspiration is a cooling mechanism, as we all know. Most mammals pant....using their tongue, and the inner mouth, to cool the blood, to prevent heat exhaustion in extreme temperatures.

Part of OUR evolution was to develop the ability to sweat, and thus run for longer than a prey animal could....since other mammals who cool their blood by panting cannot 'pant' at full gallop, only while trotting.

Thus, you tire out your prey....so to speak.

Humans perspire far more than any other homonid, even the Chimps.

Plus, and you may like this....another adaptation for humans was the Gluteus Maximus muscles....to enable us to run. Chimps, and most other apes than can stand, even for a limited time, on two feet, have very small butts.

That video for the fused chromosomes is extremely misguided. Here is the Intelligent Design answer. The real one, and not the one he made up in his video.

A Tale of Two Chromosomes

I think that science can only show proof to a certain point, then it is an educated guess at best. The reason much of science takes so long to go further is human ego. Too many on top wish to think they know it all in their chosen field. Sad really, I like to think that I only know my bit. Science also forgets that unless you have a want to know that is fed, and encouraged it becomes like a book of the bible. Whomever has the last name for the editor wins.

[edit on 27-8-2008 by frivolouschick]

reply to post by KaginD


without being rude , or meaning to pry

what is your age and level of education ?

because i would seriously like to know how you have reached the level of doing a " genetics class " while some how remaining so ignorant of basic evolutionary theory

The whole aliens made people theory is starting to look like a good theory to me.

how the blue blazes have you lept from " we didnt come from monkies " to "aliens did it " blithely ignoring all other therories

as you clearly do not even know what evolutionary theory claims are the origns of hominids , how have you been able to dismiss them and leap to the ` aliens did it ` ?????

oh - and as a last ` challenge ` try this question :

if you discount the posibility of hominid eveolution by naturalistic eans - please explain the origins of the alien intercessor you now wish to credit as the ` creators ` of modern hominids ?

PS - to help you google " infinite regression "

[edit on 27-8-2008 by ignorant_ape]