The US could end it's dependence on foreign oil...why don't we?

Check this out: Untapped sources in NORTH DAKOTA and MONTANA (edit)

www.usgs.gov...

energy.usgs.gov...

We're sitting on untapped resources that could completely end the Mideast's oil stranglehold. Just this ONE area holds more than 3 TIMES the oil from the next largest "continuous" source.

We can end it, but my bet is that our reps are too heavily invested in foreign oil to ever move on it, unless we simply make it very clear we want to end dependence, and inform others that it is realistic that we can do so....



[edit on 22-7-2008 by Gazrok]

Didn't Kissinger/US do a deal the with the Saudis in the 70’s that the US would not tap into the Huge Alaskan reservoir that was discovered there (and use theirs amongst others) as long as they used the US dollar to trade in oil and buy the US national debt?

i didn't bother to read your sources so forgive me but the risks of drilling for oil aren't worth it. The environmental and ecological impact simply aren't worth it...plus if it is possible to run out of oil im sure we'd start drilling then and selling it to the world and become a richer society....with that said the fact of the matter is even if we started drilling today we wouldn't see a drop of oil for at least a decade

Well then, please read the links first....

I AM NOT TALKING ABOUT ALASKA!!!!

I'm talking about frickin' NORTH DAKOTA and MONTANA!!!

No more impact than drilling in Texas, Louisianna....

[edit on 22-7-2008 by Gazrok]

So are you saying if we drill there things will become better over night? if so then im down i love instant gratification. How about this instead of oil lets use new technologies and alternative fuels instead of gas...i honestly don't see why we're still arguing over gas its highly overrated . Im geared towards hho/browns gas as a fuel of the future....with that said i think the US economy would fall apart without oil

So what if we won't see a drop in oil for at least a decade. I want to laugh every time I hear this argument. We spend 12 years getting through school so that we can be educated. TWELVE years?? That takes too damn long, let's skip it. FOUR years of college for my degree??? Why bother if I'm not going to see any rewards for my actions for FOUR years? EIGHT years of school to be a doctor and that's not including the several years of residency?? That's going to take too long, anybody who becomes a doctor must be an idiot.

How about a combination of both?

My proposal: Release barrels from the strategic reserve in a steady enough stream to reduce per barrel prices. Continue efforts in making more hybrid technology, more effecient engines. Tapping these wells will take time, but they can certainly replenish the reserves that were released, and then some. We could easily put gas back to $2 a gallon doing this, and start clawing our way out of this Recession (yes, I frickin' said it) that we're in.

reply to post by BlueTriangle


all im trying to say is its not worth it for the time and the money involved however after a decade or so and they find oil and start building refinery's and open more jobs that help the economy then we will see a drop in prices but that wouldn't stop our dependence for foreign oil. because of that i think we need new fuels.

Again, releasing barrels from the Strategic Reserve would have an IMMEDIATE effect on the economy, and oil prices, and would buy us the needed time to actually recover those ND and Montana resources.

reply to post by Gazrok


could you go into more detail about the barrels in the Strategic Reserve i was under the impression that they didn't actually exist in barrels but were in the ground and if that is the case then expect a decade before seeing any of those barrels

This 10 years argument is ludicrous!

If we would have passed the drilling bill 10 years ago when it was proposed we wouldn't be in the mess we are in now would we? People were saying the same thing back then as they are now. And guess what? 10 years from then showed up 10 years later and we needed the oil!

Do people honestly think we won't be in worse shape in 10 years if we do nothing? They must! Do you honestly think we will have "alternative" energies available for the public at affordable prices by then that could completely wipe out our need for oil? I think not.

WHY EVEN ARGUE ABOUT THIS?

We need the energy, so we should do whatever it takes to get it. Regardless of how long it takes to reap the benefits.

WE SHOULD BE DOING EVERYTHING WE CAN!

reply to post by nyk537


I guess your right but the world i wish we lived in we have free energy and don't have to work mindless 9-5 jobs, grow our own food so that we dont have to buy anything (self sustained without the government) and have more time to spiritually develop and be more aware to whats going on around us instead of us being dead tired when we get off work and only want to relax when we get home and on our off days we do nothing productive *sigh* we do need energy but we really need renewable energy. oh well lets continue destroying the rain forests and add more greenhouse gases! you can't blame me for dreaming of a better world. but i'll leave you with one prediction one day we will use hemp for everything just you watch

There are people who can really think outside of the box:

t-boone-pickens-plan-wind-energy_N.htm

There was an interview or Mr.Pickens (yesterday, I believe) by Lou Dobbs, on CNN.

Anyway, he pushes wind and solar PLUS natural gas for transport. With his experience, there must be something in it.

Basically, oil is not the only option and maybe not the best solution.
As Mr.Pickens points out, we are behind other nations in adopting non-oil energy resources.


[edit on 22-7-2008 by buddhasystem]

So you want to be a hippie bum?

Free energy, free food, no job, spiritually develop?

More power to you friend.

Here in the real world though, there is no free energy, we have to work for what we have, and we should be doing everything we can to make that energy that we work for cheaper and more accessible.

Alternative energies are great. Unfortunately there are too many gasoline powered cars & trucks out there who's owners couldn't afford to just upgrade their vehicles to alternative powered engines. For them, cheaper gas is more important at this point.

If we can tap these resources, gas would drop a little through future investors alone. That, along with the long term payoff of not relying on the middle east for oil should buy us time to develop alternative energies. Then we can FAZE OUT oil dependence.

We can't just snap our fingers and have alternatives. Whatever we develop next will have to be fazed in so that people can adapt at their own economic pace. Our biggest problem, IMO, is if our oil gets plentiful and cheap again, we fail to develop any alternatives and learn nothing from the recent price hike.

Step 1: Tap these resources, prices drop some through investment futures...

Step 2: Stabilize prices & make alternative energies development paramount. When oil gets cheap enough, and gas prices drop, increase gas taxes for R&D.

Step 3: Faze out oil / Faze in new energies.

Now this is assuming the government won't forget alternative energies when gas gets cheap, and when it does get cheap that they wouldn't "borrow" from alternative R&D budgets for other things like they love to do.

Originally posted by KingIchigo
i didn't bother to read your sources so forgive me but the risks of drilling for oil aren't worth it.

Risks to whom? Those who are starving for lack of the food industrialized agriculture could provide them with?

The environmental and ecological impact simply aren't worth it...

Again your presuming that the 5 billion human beings on this planet who do not live like western Europeans gives a damn about the ecological impact of survival? Sure the environmental impact resulting from unrestrained exploitation for profit is terribly but do you realise that most pollution could be dealt with given sufficient enforcement of current regulations and standards?

plus if it is possible to run out of oil im sure we'd start drilling then and selling it to the world and become a richer society....

Oil barons and capitalist might get richer but for the most part the middle class would gain more wealth and assets trough solar/wind/tidal/hydro ( NOT BIOFUELS) than we ever could trough taking part in the oil economy. That being said while they wont allow us alternatives we should exploit oil for all it's worth to invest in the developments of our various countries.

with that said the fact of the matter is even if we started drilling today we wouldn't see a drop of oil for at least a decade

And such comments will just allow other more fair minded people to ignore whatever else you have said. There are plenty of known easily exploitable reserves of oil everywhere on the globe but since the last slump in global oil prices in 1998 ( when oil fell to 8 $/bp, and it was going down) big players have stepped into absorb excess oil on the market while destroying and disrupting production and expansion of production wherever they could.

Originally posted by KingIchigo
So are you saying if we drill there things will become better over night?

No it probably wont as there is enough oil on the world market. What might happen is that investors will have to take bigger risks as they struggle to absorb the excess oil to keep prices high and supply relatively tighly constrained. I have the source somewhere but basically OECD countries currently have the highest reserves of stockpiled oil in twenty years. There is no shortage of oil.

if so then im down i love instant gratification. How about this instead of oil lets use new technologies and alternative fuels instead of gas...

Absolutely. There are few alternatives that are not wonderfully clean and efficient as compared to oil hence the suppression of the technologies and the general state subsidies for oil related industries and taxations on alternatives.

i honestly don't see why we're still arguing over gas its highly overrated .

Not when it keeps you from freezing in winter times or when it gets you wherever you need to go, grows your food and generally makes modern life in the absence of implemented alternatives possible.

Im geared towards hho/browns gas as a fuel of the future....

Why that? With a fraction of the Pentagon budget the US could swith to a renewable energy economy in a decade or less creating millions of good paying jobs in the process.

with that said i think the US economy would fall apart without oil

Your not helping your case by taking government propaganda at face value. Why not inspect the alternatives and the vast majority would lead to the type of market economies we would ALL benefit by?

Stellar

[edit on 22-7-2008 by StellarX]

could you go into more detail about the barrels in the Strategic Reserve i was under the impression that they didn't actually exist in barrels but were in the ground and if that is the case then expect a decade before seeing any of those barrels

Try 13 days before entering the marketplace. Is that fast enough for you?

Access to the reserve is determined by the conditions written into the 1975 Energy Policy and Conservation Act (EPCA), primarily to counter a severe supply interruption. The maximum removal rate, by physical constraints, is 4.4 million barrels per day (700,000 m³/d). Oil could begin entering the marketplace 13 days after a Presidential order.

en.wikipedia.org...

Well you see...

When the DEMS tried to FORCE DRILLING IN ALASKA AND OFF SHORE THE GRAND OIL PARTY BLOCKED IT!

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Read it and weep. The GOP BLOCKED DRILLING!

Any politicians who are standing in the way and preventing us from going after our own resources need to be REMOVED FROM OFFICE IMMEDIATLY!!!

We need to drill now if we are ever going to become energy independent. Any further delay at this point will have serious negative effects on our economy as the dollar continues to fall.

Imagine a future where energy is so costly that it has to be rationed to the point where it has very negative effects on the everyday activites of the population. It has already gotten to that point in Spain.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Read the article linked to in the OP and then tell me if that is the kind of future that you want.

I don't buy into the rhetoric that says "we can't drill our way out of this crisis". Sorry but that just sounds like bumper sticker politics. And I call BS.

We can fix these problems here and now. Just drill. We cannot afford to delay any longer.

At least if we drilled, it would be doing SOMETHING.

Right now, we aren't doing anything.

Nancy Pelosi (Mrs. I am trying to save the planet and I have the gavel and am not handing it over) and Harry Reid have shut down the Congress for a 5 week recess (vacation) and won't even allow a vote on offshore drilling. Pelosi has said that there might be a vote if drilling was included in a comprehensive energy plan, but didn't say she would allow it. The "Gang of 10", 5 Republicans and 5 Democrats, have proposed an "All of the Above" plan that includes renewable energy, nuclear, drilling, etc,. but neither Pelosi nor Reid will allow a vote.

We need to do something, NOW. And, we can conserve, we can inflate our tires , we can work towards all the alternative energy, but right now, this is a nation that runs on petroleum products.

We have our own reserves of fossil fuels, and we need to be able to get to them....not watch China drill 60 miles off our coast.

As for the SPR, that should be saved for a real national emergency, like it was meant for. What if Israel attacks Iran next month, the middle east is thrown into turmoil, and our oil supplies are cut off or dramatically reduced? That's when we can tap into the SPR. We would need it then, and we wouldn't want to have released some of it, a lot of it to lower gas prices today. Then, folks would be griping about why we didn't save it for a national emergency instead of releasing some of it, a lot of it, to lower fuel costs $.25 per gallon.

[edit on 3-8-2008 by skeptic1]