Another Stabbing In London 10/07/08

Another Stabbing In London 10/07/08

news.sky.com

A 21-year-old man has been stabbed to death in east London,

Emergency services were called to reports of a man suffering from stab wounds on Downsell Road in Waltham Forest.

The young victim was treated by paramedics but was pronounced dead at the scene.

Four people have been arrested by the Metropolitan Police.

(visit the link for the full news article)

Another Stabbing in london.
a lovely city, is, by the day, turning into a right hell hole.
what has gone wrong there ?

another tragic waste of a young life.
the government must act with a law or something, anything.

could a curfew be called in parts of London if this carries on ?

news.sky.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

Why is this such a news maker on this board. A murder is tragic truely, but my gosh ANOTHER STABBING VICTIM, whoopdy do, what does it all mean Basil?
One section of one neighborhood in Memphis TN where I live reports over 400 crimes a month. 1/3 of which are violent in nature. That's 1 small part of just one section of Memphis. There are 149 registered sex offenders in that neighborhood alone. There are 1504 total sex offenders registered in Memphis alone. That's just sex offenses, not counting homicides.
I do understand that this is probably serial in nature, but hardly breaking news everytime.

reply to post by Christian Voice


Crime is common !

Don't care, dudes !

reply to post by Christian Voice


Ah, so Amero-centric news posted on this forum, like stories about gun control or some kiddy getting murdered by white trash, are ok, but when someone posts a story about a real and increasing issue in the UK, it's irrelevant?

Bottom line is knife crime is on the up, it's a real problem in the UK over the past couple of years and far too many people, both gang members and innocents alike, are getting killed by being stabbed.

Anyone who followed UK news would realise the importance of this story. So sorry it's not about America or that we don't kill each other as much as you guy's do, but over here a stabbing is big news.

Shauny get your gun!

What Brits have seem to have forgotten is that murder is much older than guns.

Originally posted by Christian Voice
Why is this such a news maker on this board. A murder is tragic truely, but my gosh ANOTHER STABBING VICTIM, whoopdy do, what does it all mean Basil?
One section of one neighborhood in Memphis TN where I live reports over 400 crimes a month. 1/3 of which are violent in nature. That's 1 small part of just one section of Memphis. There are 149 registered sex offenders in that neighborhood alone. There are 1504 total sex offenders registered in Memphis alone. That's just sex offenses, not counting homicides.
I do understand that this is probably serial in nature, but hardly breaking news everytime.

It's news because it's so unlike that area. It means there is some kind of change going on, but what change?


[edit on 10-7-2008 by Curious_Agnostic]

To be honest I didn't think that it would get to me. It's always been "something in that part of town". But now I hardly go out late at night...
It's like this tension just spawns more unnecessary tension.
Feels like the gangbangers are competing in who is toughest or coolest by who can stab most people.

In my oppinion those kids are already broken beyond repair. That of course doesn't solve the issue of what to do. I guess death penalty for murder is still out of the question?

Them there cameras in London are helping out..

GTFO of here wit those crap cameras.

Oh and why is it an issue with us.. Last time i looked at something to do with the states and guns was this..

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Ironically.. The person who did the post is trashing the states wit its guns..

We don't care about someone being stabbed like nobody cared about that shooting.. Its all really nothing decremental...

[edit on 7/10/2008 by ThichHeaded]

While each event like this is Tragic, it is indicative of a much LARGER, and widespread problem.

The actions of goverments that take the ablitly for the average citizen to defend themself.

The UK has been pretty Succseful at keeping Guns out of the UK, you can do that when you share 0 miles of Boarders with other nations... and live on an island...

The Goverment is taking away your liberties, this is just an symtom of what happens when they take away your ability to defend yourself.

reply to post by TKainZero


So your answer to increasing violent crime is to give everyone guns?

That logic is amazing! Spock would be proud....

Criminals feed on fear. Crimes are far easier to commit if the victims cannot defend themselves. I carry a SIG 40 cal everywhere I go. Ever heard the expression never bring a knife to a gun fight? Most of the time all you have to do is make the criminal aware that you have a gun and they leave. I have only had to pull my gun once, but I've shown it 5 or 6 times to deter a crime. There is nothing wrong with citizens arming themselves.

This is more proof that banning self-defense results in a crime-free utopia.

reply to post by EnlightenUp


Where has self-defence been banned then?

Originally posted by stumason
reply to post by EnlightenUp

 

Where has self-defence been banned then?

Well, my understanding has been that is the case in your country. Not only use of firearms but frankly any attempt to stop an assault on your person or properly could either land you in jail or sued by the perpetrator for inflicting harm/assault. This, in effect, I see as basically a ban on self-defense - written into law or not - which gives criminal behavior a free pass and empowers the state and its agents at the expense of the citizen.

If any point there is utterly false please tell since I really wish to learn something and separate propaganda from truth. I normally form specific opinions or views very slowly but will put a strong statement out there since it more readily gets challenged.

Do forgive me if I'm not being extensive or thorough in my reply as it's almost my bedtime here and I'm thoroughly exhausted.

reply to post by EnlightenUp


Firearms may be mostly banned, but self-defence is most certainly not!

You can use "reasonable" force, which is usually interpreted as equal force to that being used against you. Someone comes at you swinging their fists, you can hit them back. Someone comes at you with a knife, then you could expect to get away with giving them a stab too.

There is a grey line in that example though, because if you were also carrying a knife when attacked by a knife wielding nutter on the street, you could be done for carrying an offensive weapon. In the home where you reached for one though is different and you would probably get away with it.

It has been brought up many times in Parliament about the definition of "reasonable" force and basically it's still up in the air. As I said though, it is generally using the same level of force as your met with.

As far as I am aware, no one has successfully sued anyone for defending themselves, unless that person committed a criminal act in doing so. Wanton litigation is not as popular here as in the US and the law wouldn't support it.

reply to post by Curious_Agnostic

It's news because it's so unlike that area. It means there is some kind of change going on, but what change?

There is a lot of emphasis being made on "street crime" in the uk lately, and the "problem" is just rising.
Its funny how, since all them community cops started, its getting worse.
Its my belief that this whole palava will be "allowed" to rise further, to the point where curfew will be put into place.
Maybe not for a while but its coming...

To me "equal force" or "reasonable force" sounds like negotiating my rights to my own life and liberty with my attacker.

[edit on 10-7-2008 by EnlightenUp]

reply to post by EnlightenUp


Not at all. If your attacked, you can defend yourself. Just don't carry on kicking the crap out of someone after you best them. That's where you cross the line between defence and offence.

If your life is in danger, then you have every right to do what you see fit in order to protect yourself. Just as long as you don't go beating someones brains in with an iron bar when all they did was punch you in the nose.

See what I mean?

I once got bottled by a gang of nobheads who outnumbered me 5 to 1. I proceeded to smash one of their faces completely in on a wall, and gave the other four such a hiding they all ran off. The Police did nothing to me, despite me having made one chap ugly for life, because I was defending myself. They just chose the wrong bloke to bottle!

Originally posted by stumason
reply to post by EnlightenUp

 

Not at all. If your attacked, you can defend yourself. Just don't carry on kicking the crap out of someone after you best them. That's where you cross the line between defence and offence.

....

Quite honestly I'd in reality probably use more restraint than I should since I really, really don't want to inflict any sort of harm on anyone and I do my best behave in accordance with the idea of preventing its nescessity.

My main issue is one of my own right of choice where the initiator of force has essentially given me the right to decide how to procede in the remedy by their initiating of said force. If I initiate it, then I certainly deserve an approprate response. It is true that issuing a slug of the lead variety in response to a slug of the fist variety is likely overkill. A slug of the lead variety in reponse to being threatened by a knife, not really. Brandishing a firearm in response to a knife would likely get the attacker or noone killed/injured but knife fighting could mess both up pretty badly.

Personally I despise prohibitions as they are an effront to my natural rights and liberty. You probably can surmise though that I believe that there should be sanctions in society for those that would initiate harm on another. Yes, I realize there's alot of "edge cases" in that set that can be hotly debated but it a rule of thumb.

Now it's really bed time!